Why Can’t Silicon Valley Solve Its Diversity Problem?

[HardOCP News]

Why can't Silicon Valley solve its diversity problem? Maybe it's the same reason the coal mining industry can't solve its 99.9% male problem and why nine out of ten registered nurses are female. I think we need to just start forcing people into careers they don't want to satisfy the pie chart people.

“The brogrammer culture, the hoodies, the flip-flops, the ‘Revenge of the Nerds’ type of vibe,” Stephanie Lampkin, the C.E.O. and founder of Blendoor, a “blind recruiting” app, said over the phone earlier this month, “I think is a significant contribution to why a lot of women and minorities have been pushed out.”

 

[raz-0]

Hmm. My department is currently interviewing for a position. 94 applicants. 4 female. Advertised by the same HR department in the same way as every other job listing here, and those don't seem to be having issues getting women to apply.

But I'm some bullshit woman hating sexist ignoring the "REAL" problem if I say that something needs fixing up the supply chain.

 

[cageymaru]

Do like I do. I suggest tech toys for my great nieces. If their parents follow through with my diabolical plan, then I will have a bunch of coders, engineers, and doctors that can cook around me when I am 70 without me having to raise a single child. Muhahaha!

 

[cageymaru]

But seriously just expose your children to as many life experiences as possible growing up and they will choose fields that they like. I think a lot of the problem is a lack of exposure to different patterns of thought, and being able to actually see the world. It is hard to be inspired to challenge yourself when you see the same thing everyday. Same old, same old doesn't produce innovation; it stifles it.

 

[Tiburon1186]

There is no 'diversity' problem. There is a perception problem. You can't expect to get equal amounts of male/female and every race from an unequal pool of graduates with needed degrees. Look at the people graduating with the majors needed by these companies (Engineering, software developers, etc). The classes are mostly filled with white men. Well conversely look at a social science graduating class like sociology, psychology, where the graduates are mostly WOMEN. There isn't a diversity problem in those fields are there? This whole 'diversity problem' is just liberal garbage to take jobs away from qualified white men.

 

[thejokker]

Why can't Silicon Valley solve it's diversity problem? Because no problem exists. Women and minorities are free to seek employment without discrimination however those seeking employment are not yet up to the competition presented by asians and whites.

Milo says: women just suck at interviewing....

"it appeared that men who were modulated to sound like women did a bit better than unmodulated men and that women who were modulated to sound like men did a bit worse than unmodulated women.”

That’s right. Their test, designed to provide empirical ballast to a feminist agenda, ended up completely torpedoing it. Worse, it suggested that employers actually discriminate in favor of women, choosing them in favor of men when they believe them to be competent enough.

http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/07/01/not-sexism-women-just-suck-interviews/

 

[Ducman69]

Equal opportunity should be all that is promised, not equal outcome through inequality in the hiring/firing practice to ensure quotas are met.

 

[ruffbytes]

I have tried to argue this: Women are scientifically proven to be more social and therefore, most women aren't interested in sitting by themselves and pounding keys on a computer for hours on end.

It never works.

I used to be more satisfied sitting in front of a computer punching keys for hours on end until I got married. I realized I feel more fulfilled in my life spending time with my family and friends. I don't sit and punch keys nearly as long as I used to.

I am not sure it's the women who are on the losing end of this job war. It's a lot more fun to get out and do something fun and meaningful with your time than flip bits inside some dumb machine. It does pay well though.

 

[cageymaru]

There is no 'diversity' problem. There is a perception problem. You can't expect to get equal amounts of male/female and every race from an unequal pool of graduates with needed degrees. Look at the people graduating with the majors needed by these companies (Engineering, software developers, etc). The classes are mostly filled with white men. Well conversely look at a social science graduating class like sociology, psychology, where the graduates are mostly WOMEN. There isn't a diversity problem in those fields are there? This whole 'diversity problem' is just liberal garbage to take jobs away from qualified white men.

It's not even that. It's a lack of parents showing their children new things. Girls are expected to do X and boys are expected to do Y.

I have a myriad of preteen females in my family. Guess what color they all say they like? Pink. I quizzed (aka military questioned ) some and asked them exactly why do you like pink. They told me because someone on a cartoon or TV wears pink. Oh and their toys are pink. Asked their dads why they buy all the pink crap in the store? Because it's what I'm programmed to do. /facepalm

The teenage girls in my family are few, but they still carry the "pink" gene. They are literally embarrassed to say anything other than pink because everything else is the "wrong" answer. Found out one likes electronics. Would have NEVER known that going by the regiment of cooking and cleaning that her family puts her through. She has a 2% chance of doing something that she actually likes when she goes to college. I'm expecting that she's going to be a straight A student that becomes a housewife based on the way she is shoved into a box at home. I guess she will have some really smart boys since she is the top of her class if intelligence is hereditary.

 

[canontk]

It's pointless to argue facts. Women aren't interested in STEM fields. That fact doesn't matter; it's the patriarchy keeping women out of those fields.

 

[Ur_Mom]

That's why.

Seriously, though - there isn't a problem. We welcome everyone. IT is a very open place. The women I know in IT are great. The trans folk I know in IT are great. The people of color in IT are great. It's just the nature of the industry, though. We are open to anyone, but the industry attracts certain people. Look at the computer science courses. There isn't a lot of women in there. Look at nursing classes. There aren't a lot of men in there.

Would I like to see more diversity? Sure. But, it's not going to happen if it's forced. The people that succeed and are great at IT are those that truly have that passion. They love their jobs. They have that natural curiosity. Don't force people into the industry. But, if they have that interest in technology - run with it. Introduce them to new technology. Get them a Raspberry Pi and a laptop. Get them into those computer classes. Nurture that passion and curiosity. Male, female, white, black, brown... Just do it. The industry is welcoming. It's just not the attractive industry like lawyers, doctors, etc. are. It's still that "nerd" industry. I love it, though.

 

[cageymaru]

Also I want to add that the "White men" who feel that their tech jobs are being taken away by minorities and females in America, should stop drinking the Kool Aid. Your overseer / CEO is OUTSOURCING your tech jobs to India and other countries to save money.

That is all.

 

[DukenukemX]

I say we force some men to have sex changes to fix this problem. Then we force some of them to have a tan, so they look kinda like dark skinned people. There you go, problem solved.

 

[andrewaggb]

It can't change overnight. I honestly don't get why companies are stressing over it or getting bad reports. Focus on getting girls and women interested in these fields. Then getting graduates. Then getting the qualified ones entry level jobs in the fields. Then getting those are qualified into management and CEO fields. You can't do that right now because the current job market doesn't have enough women and minorities in it. I think an honest best case is 20-40 years before we might see near equal numbers. You'll need older men to retire and a generation or two of near equal numbers of women and minorities entering the workforce. And as others have said, what if women don't want to be programmers in equal numbers to men? Anyways, I'm all for breaking stereotypes, I just wish it was done by encouraging interest in youth instead of trying to apply unrealistic quotas to an existing workforce.

 

[thejokker]

It's not even that. It's a lack of parents showing their children new things. Girls are expected to do X and boys are expected to do Y.

I have a myriad of preteen females in my family. Guess what color they all say they like? Pink. I quizzed (aka military questioned ) some and asked them exactly why do you like pink. They told me because someone on a cartoon or TV wears pink. Oh and their toys are pink. Asked their dads why they buy all the pink crap in the store? Because it's what I'm programmed to do. /facepalm

The teenage girls in my family are few, but they still carry the "pink" gene. They are literally embarrassed to say anything other than pink because everything else is the "wrong" answer. Found out one likes electronics. Would have NEVER known that going by the regiment of cooking and cleaning that her family puts her through. She has a 2% chance of doing something that she actually likes when she goes to college. I'm expecting that she's going to be a straight A student that becomes a housewife based on the way she is shoved into a box at home. I guess she will have some really smart boys since she is the top of her class if intelligence is hereditary.

Experiments for decades have shown girls prefer girl toys and boys prefer boy toys EVEN ACROSS SPECIES":
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...ldren-toy-preferences-hormones_n_1827727.html

While undoubtedly there is some learned behavior here "much" of this behavior is instinctual. Similarly kids engaged in "play" are not taught to do so. It is an instinctual behavior and is not specific to Homo Sapien. Girls strongly prefer to play in girlish ways and boys strongly prefer to play in boyish ways. Efforts to teach them to play otherwise will be frustrated by the child's instinctual preferences.

A good rule of thumb: What ever a feminist says presume the opposite...

 

[ccmfreak2]

1) "Are you kidding me? There’s no talent? Who am I? Am I invisible?" No, you're STILL COMPLETELY YOUR STINKIN' DEGREE! Therefore, YOU'RE NOT QUALIFIED! Just because your have a particular anatomy or a particular skin tone doesn't make you qualified - or unqualified - for a certain role, ESPECIALLY in tech.

2) They make up 18% of computer science graduates? I'm not saying these are false numbers, but I do question HOW LONG this has been the case. I went to a relatively large state school with a pretty standard diversity makeup on campus. In our program we had a few Asian men, about 4 Middle Easterners - one of which was a woman - one or two Blacks, no Latinos, and everyone else was white - about 5 of which were women. Granted, the school isn't in the Deep South or West where Latinos are more represented, but the point still remains, our program didn't have anywhere NEAR this 18% rate being reported. I'm less than a decade removed from graduation, as well, so it's not like a "back in my day" situation either.

My point: Assuming this figure is true, it hasn't been true for very long - certainly not long enough to make a difference in the reported figures. I truly hope this figure is accurate, but it doesn't seem to reflect my area or school.

3) Do people actually graduate and START in Silicon Valley? I thought this was the top-of-the-top; I thought this is the most EXPERIENCED people and Mark Zuckerberg. No doubt there's always the rare exception prodigies that get snatched by Google and others, but I didn't think people STARTED here.

4) Yeah, networking is important but it's not everything. I didn't get my current job in this field through networking, or my previous one. But that's also where internships/co-ops come into play. And didn't you intern for Intuit and Apple? But you didn't build your network at either of these two giants?

5) Yeah, brain teasers and whiteboard interviews suck. We all know that. But the point of these things is not to directly assess your coding knowledge as much as it is to determine how you think and solve problems. Do you give up easily? Or do you continually look for a solution? HOW you think is more important than WHAT you know in many situations. What we know can be replaced or corrected with pure information. How we think? Well, that's harder to change, and thus weighted much more heavily.

6) Hmm, so Silcon Valley - which apparently represents the ENTIRE tech industry - is racist, sexist, and biased, yet even these startup hiring platforms can't seem to get over the fact they only seem to have white men using them. And no doubt the attrition is a problem, but what do those numbers look like in OTHER industries? What about in the Nursing field? Or Teaching field? Or any of the dozens upon dozens of other industries out there? I'm not saying it isn't a problem, but context to these kinds of figures is important to recognize if this is an ethnic cultural issue or an industry issue or both, thus helping to correctly pinpoint where and how to change this.


It's so frustrating to hear the Tech Industry get bashed as racist and sexist when the women I work with admit there just aren't many women out there to be hired. I have worked with - and under - people of other ethnicities as well. Sure they exist, but they definitely don't appear to be 20% of applicants.

 

[Ur_Mom]

Also I want to add that the "White men" who feel that their tech jobs are being taken away by minorities and females in America, should stop drinking the Kool Aid. Your overseer / CEO is OUTSOURCING your tech jobs to India and other countries to save money.

I think most people in IT understand that. It's the outsourcing/offshoring of jobs that people are upset about. We welcome minorities and females in the industry. We really don't care. As long as they can do the job, we're all for it. The problem with a lot of outsourcing is it looks great on the books for a couple years, but they generally CAN'T do their job.

Cutting corners in the name of saving money is the downfall. Not the inclusion of minorities or women.

 

[Dan_D]

Why can't Silicon Valley solve its diversity problem? Maybe it's the same reason the coal mining industry can't solve its 99.9% male problem and why nine out of ten registered nurses are female. I think we need to just start forcing people into careers they don't want to satisfy the pie chart people.

“The brogrammer culture, the hoodies, the flip-flops, the ‘Revenge of the Nerds’ type of vibe,” Stephanie Lampkin, the C.E.O. and founder of Blendoor, a “blind recruiting” app, said over the phone earlier this month, “I think is a significant contribution to why a lot of women and minorities have been pushed out.”

No one wants to address the fact that males and females often have different interests. That leads to predispositions to certain specific skill sets. Coding in particular requires a specific mindset and it just so happens that the people with the mentality for it fit tend to fit a certain stereotype. People don't want to accept that many stereotypes exist because they are valid. I don't think its right to automatically judge someone or assume that they are a programmer because they look like one, or they are a criminal based on the color of their skin alone. I think that's where people tend to really go wrong. Aside from that, I think people should accept that its mostly guys that want to write code or do construction work as an example. People need to get over it and accept that is simply how it is. You can't force people into a career path they have no interest in and expect them to succeed in it. By the same token, if a woman applies to be a computer programmer then she needs to be evaluated on the basis of her skills and experience alone. I think in this modern age that people are generally better about this than we generally give them credit for. I've seen a lot more women and minorities in the tech industry in the last 10 years than I ever did in the preceding 10 year period.

The real problem is diversity mandates or directives. Diversity being forced on companies without the root of the problem getting addressed is itself another problem. If a company hires someone to meet some diversity initiative or racial quota then you won't necessarily get the best candidate for the job in that position. The company may suffer financially by doing that so they aren't going to be motivated to hire someone on that basis alone. Nor should they feel the need to. Ideally, people would be hired on the basis of their qualifications rather than their gender or ethnic background. Outside of public relations concerns, companies have no incentive to hire someone beyond their qualifications, salary requirements and skillset. Frankly, that's all they should need to do in the first place. Unfortunately for all these champions of diversity, those candidates are seldom anything other than white American males with few exceptions depending on the industry. In the tech industry you can add Asian's and Indians into that mix with the vast majority of them being males as well.

You won't solve diversity issues until the root cause of the qualification gap is addressed. Unfortunately, some of those issues are strictly social ones. There have been programs for helping minorities get an education for decades but those programs often go under utilized. In some other cases those programs simply lack the funding to make a significant impact which is something that can be addressed. In the case of not hiring women, companies may be reluctant to hire a worker who could become pregnant and have to go on maternity leave on their dime. Therefore they have no incentive to hire women either. Thus, they pay less for the same skillset or discourage hiring females entirely. The only solution I can think of to that is to make it a blanket policy where men and women can take the same leave for the same amount of time. In that case you solve the gender gap but it doesn't address the fact that non-whites are much more likely to need maternity leave due to the higher birth rates of those groups.

In my opinion, aside from offering men and women the same maternity / paternity leave options the problem should be ignored on a company level. If you really want to increase work force diversity then the root of the problem needs to be addressed. Minorities need more opportunities for education. If those groups don't take advantage of the opportunity as they haven't in the past, then that's on them. At that point you've done all you can do. The unfortunate truth is this: We will never get past race or gender issues so long as we keep catering to specific groups and treating people differently from the rest.

 

[rgMekanic]

Why can't I get a bunch of female college graduates to come do roofing for me instead of a bunch of Mexicans and Hondurans? Is it because the Roofing and HVAC industries are sexist?!

NO, it's because no woman wants to crawl around in a 160* attic filled with insulation.

 

[Dead Parrot]

Wonder how much of this is setup by biases in the K-12 school system? When I went through grade school, Home Ec was for girls and shop/science was for guys. Sure it is better today but how many of the guidance counselors still have that bias from their education? They may not even realize they are doing it. They just suggest homemaker type courses for girls and money maker type courses for guys. Only when one of the kids expresses a real desire is the bias overridden. If the counselor meetings today are anything like when I went through, it is a short meeting where you pick college prep vs shop vs general degree with neither participant being very motivated to make it anything more than a means to check boxes on a form. If you skip the math/science classes in high school, it is much harder to switch to a major that needs math/science once you are in college.

 

[Ur_Mom]

1) "Are you kidding me? There’s no talent? Who am I? Am I invisible?" No, you're STILL COMPLETELY YOUR STINKIN' DEGREE! Therefore, YOU'RE NOT QUALIFIED! Just because your have a particular anatomy or a particular skin tone doesn't make you qualified - or unqualified - for a certain role, ESPECIALLY in tech.

Even white male people ask this question. Too many people are passed over and the company says there is no talent, so they outsource. It's a common tactic to hire H1B's. Just no talent available....

5) Yeah, brain teasers and whiteboard interviews suck. We all know that. But the point of these things is not to directly assess your coding knowledge as much as it is to determine how you think and solve problems. Do you give up easily? Or do you continually look for a solution? HOW you think is more important than WHAT you know in many situations. What we know can be replaced or corrected with pure information. How we think? Well, that's harder to change, and thus weighted much more heavily.

In IT, I've found troubleshooting skills and thinking skills are the majority of the job. You can Google anything, but you want to be as specific as possible. Or, you'll narrow the problem down to know where and how to fix it. How you think is a huge deal. Do you think outside of the box? Fix a network problem - where do you start, where do you go from there...

6) Hmm, so Silcon Valley - which apparently represents the ENTIRE tech industry - is racist, sexist, and biased, yet even these startup hiring platforms can't seem to get over the fact they only seem to have white men using them. And no doubt the attrition is a problem, but what do those numbers look like in OTHER industries? What about in the Nursing field? Or Teaching field? Or any of the dozens upon dozens of other industries out there? I'm not saying it isn't a problem, but context to these kinds of figures is important to recognize if this is an ethnic cultural issue or an industry issue or both, thus helping to correctly pinpoint where and how to change this.

I'd love to see other industries and how balanced things are. Some weigh heavily on women, or minorities and less on white males. IT may be skewed the opposite way.

It's so frustrating to hear the Tech Industry get bashed as racist and sexist when the women I work with admit there just aren't many women out there to be hired. I have worked with - and under - people of other ethnicities as well. Sure they exist, but they definitely don't appear to be 20% of applicants.

My boss is Thai. My co-worker is hispanic. My other boss is a female. All very qualified and great to work with. Anecdotal, of course. But, over the years I've worked with other minorities and women. Most have been extremely qualified and were great at what they did.

 

[ccmfreak2]

It's pointless to argue facts. Women aren't interested in STEM fields. That fact doesn't matter; it's the patriarchy keeping women out of those fields.

I disagree. Other areas of STEM have had success in recruiting women and people of other ethnicities. But Tech can't seem to overcome it. You look at biology or chemistry related fields, and you'll find a strong representation of women and other ethnicities. You look at math majors, and once again, women tend to be present in decent numbers. You look at engineering, and the numbers are weak, but they are there. You look at tech majors and it sucks, and has apparently gotten worse over the '90s and '00s. The few women I work with seems to believe it's a cultural issue starting at a young age, as opposed to an industry issue. The also seem to recognize you can't hire what isn't there.

Sure, even my wife has pointed out that women tend to be more relational, and thus go for more relational careers. And that's fine by me - I don't even want to pull someone into a field they'll hate. But that doesn't mean all women fit that mold, or that women simply aren't interested in STEM - the numbers simply don't support that.

 

[Gigus Fire]

Random question -- not sure where to post it... but why are there big huge Watch Dogs 2 banner ads on the HardOCP main page now on each side? like mega annoying huge?

Never noticed any huge ads on the sides before, just curious.

What ads?

 

[Jahx]

Several others have hit the nail firmly on the head - When you look at those registered for their final semesters in obtaining a STEM degree, you aren't seeing a percentage of students that reflects the population. You are seeing a representation of individuals who have the specific mental disability to willing disassociate themselves from others, spend 12 hours daily (24,36,48 hour stretches if a deadline gets moved up, or something catastrophic occurs) staring at a screen, maniacally pounding on a keyboard. To have no physical interaction with the people you work with, indeed in many cases to have never met them in person.

As an IT professional, in my experience, myself and my associates are with rare exceptions, mentally unwell. By and large we prefer machines to humans, because humans don't make sense. And we know that this isn't healthy, but the sad truth is our mental condition allows us to function in society, and to pursue careers that pay fairly well, while catering to our condition at the same time.

If anything the overwhelming presence of white males should be a clarion call for the early recognition and availability of treatment for men with mental disorders, not a battle cry to add women and minorities to the ranks of our asylum.

 

[jtm55]

Hi All

As someone who's a physical therapist, I don't think there's a diversity problem in silicon valley. I believe that for varying reasons women & people of color look for careers in other areas. As a person of color I can only speak for myself when I say that the tech field never appealed to me. When I enlisted in the Navy I was trained to be a Hospital Corpsman. When I got out, while going to school to become a physical therapist, I was a paramedic. I've spent my entire adult life in the medical field which I've found to be very satisfying. How I got into computers was I was going to buy a computer when a buddy of mine said "buy?" " you mean build". He explained to me the benefits of building your own computer & pointed me in direction of some websites & literature that would get me up to speed. When I went to order my parts on New egg , he looked them over gave me the thumbs up. When said parts arrived, he was there for morale support. I remember pressing the power button & hearing the POST beep. I was like wow I did it. My buddy said "told you". But it's never anything I wanted to make living at.

 

[lcpiper]

It can't change overnight. I honestly don't get why companies are stressing over it or getting bad reports. Focus on getting girls and women interested in these fields..............

Why?

If they are not interested there are reasons and it's not all social engineering as some have suggested although I am sure that does apply, I just don't think it's a huge factor.

I game, my wife games. I kill tanks, orcs, and elite special operations soldiers from hostile countries.

My wife pops colored balloons and matches rare gems in threes.

I can't get my wife interested in my games and I wouldn't waste a moment of my time on hers unless I had absolutely nothing better to do with my time.

We just don't like the same things and it's really no more difficult than that.

Now this brings up a problem because smart people with crystal balls predict that in the future, the only jobs that are going to pay well are the ones having to do with developing software. They say everything else is going to start falling to the wayside, particularly in IT. That being said, anyone hoping to carve out bright futures for women will not see this as comforting news. Maybe women will put away their wants for their needs and rise to compete but I don't think so. I think they will revert to their child bearing and home keeping ways for the most part.

Oh, and they will also stay on as teachers and nurses, I'm not a nurse type, don't like needles and don't like blood as a general rule.

But I do see why these diversity bean counters see a problem and are trying to force a solution.

 

[Mugato]

Come on, really? They aren't being "pushed out", they just don't want to join in on the fun of IT!

 

[Darunion]

Why?

If they are not interested there are reasons and it's not all social engineering as some have suggested although I am sure that does apply, I just don't think it's a huge factor.

I game, my wife games. I kill tanks, orcs, and elite special operations soldiers from hostile countries.

My wife pops colored balloons and matches rare gems in threes.

I can't get my wife interested in my games and I wouldn't waste a moment of my time on hers unless I had absolutely nothing better to do with my time.

We just don't like the same things and it's really no more difficult than that.

Now this brings up a problem because smart people with crystal balls predict that in the future, the only jobs that are going to pay well are the ones having to do with developing software. They say everything else is going to start falling to the wayside, particularly in IT. That being said, anyone hoping to carve out bright futures for women will not see this as comforting news. Maybe women will put away their wants for their needs and rise to compete but I don't think so. I think they will revert to their child bearing and home keeping ways for the most part.

Oh, and they will also stay on as teachers and nurses, I'm not a nurse type, don't like needles and don't like blood as a general rule.

But I do see why these diversity bean counters see a problem and are trying to force a solution.

Mine plays battlefield, gears, 7days etc and gives me a run for my money. But I do see her popping balloons on her phone during loading screens lol.

 

[lcpiper]

Hi All

As someone who's a physical therapist, I don't think there's a diversity problem in silicon valley. I believe that for varying reasons women & people of color look for careers in other areas. As a person of color I can only speak for myself when I say that the tech field never appealed to me. When I enlisted in the Navy I was trained to be a Hospital Corpsman. When I got out, while going to school to become a physical therapist, I was a paramedic. I've spent my entire adult life in the medical field which I've found to be very satisfying. How I got into computers was I was going to buy a computer when a buddy of mine said "buy?" " you mean build". He explained to me the benefits of building your own computer & pointed me in direction of some websites & literature that would get me up to speed. When I went to order my parts on New egg , he looked them over gave me the thumbs up. When said parts arrived, he was there for morale support. I remember pressing the power button & hearing the POST beep. I was like wow I did it. My buddy said "told you". But it's never anything I wanted to make living at.

I would like to add. I went down a similar path and I was a budding gamer. Years ago, a successful gamer had to learn to keep his tools of war up to speed. How to build a computer, troubleshoot a configuration problem, etc. What I learned was that like an onion, every layer of knowledge I peeled back left me with a new layer to dig into. And, like onions, there are many different types of onions. One learns how to manage applications and they discover operations systems, then BIOS and firmware, then they start learning that deep down, it's all 1s and 0s, and even deeper it's transistors that are packed hundreds of thousands deep on a postage stamp.

And one begins to realize that with rare exceptions, no one can know it all. Not really, not all of it. It's too much. So we get specialists.

I do IT Infrastructure support for software development companies, I make their work environments function and keep their data safe. Out of 9 admins, one is a woman. On the floor, the developers, most of Configuration Management and Test, are women, most of the hard core code writers are men. Many of the management types are women for our companies and for the government. I think most women are just too socially attuned to enjoy highly technical jobs that require long hours of keyboard time. Our one female administrator can't work without a movie streaming in the background on her desktop. Even she, must have something going on or she can't function and if forced to go to the server room she becomes useless.

These are my observations and thaughts on the subject.

 

[lcpiper]

Mine plays battlefield, gears, 7days etc and gives me a run for my money. But I do see her popping balloons on her phone during loading screens lol.

I wish, I actually really enjoy the women who do play the games I like. I raised two gamer chicks and I know there are two gamer dudes who are very appreciative of that fact.

 

[nutzo]

There is no 'diversity' problem. .... This whole 'diversity problem' is just liberal garbage to take jobs away from qualified white men.

And qualified Asians.

I'm still waiting for these same "diversity" supporters to sue the NBA for the lack Chinese or Japanese on the teams.

 

[Darunion]

I wish, I actually really enjoy the women who do play the games I like. I raised two gamer chicks and I know there are two gamer dudes who are very appreciative of that fact.

Well done Sir, well done!

Mine actually wasn't really into games much when we met. Convinced her to try out gears of war and it awoke something i didn't expect. I kinda thought it would be just a 'plays games to make him happy' kind of thing, but once she started yelling and calling me obscenities if I would score a couple kills more than her, i realized she was a gamer at heart haha. If/when we have kids, the training will begin as soon as we can!

 

[kac77]

It's pointless to argue facts. Women aren't interested in STEM fields. That fact doesn't matter; it's the patriarchy keeping women out of those fields.

Except this isn't a fact. Women and minority participation in STEM fields vary wildly country by country. If it were really true that genetically all men did this and all women did that then for the most part we should see the same thing country to country. But we don't... not even close. In particular women in STEM in the US it's like 24% while world wide it's much higher. Communist country or no it's higher elsewhere than here. To boil the topic down to "women aren't interested in STEM," or the mere discussion of the topic is man-hating shows a lack of inquisitiveness and binary thinking, which is troublesome.

 

[nutzo]

As an IT professional, in my experience, myself and my associates are with rare exceptions, mentally unwell. By and large we prefer machines to humans, because humans don't make sense. And we know that this isn't healthy, but the sad truth is our mental condition allows us to function in society, and to pursue careers that pay fairly well, while catering to our condition at the same time.

If anything the overwhelming presence of white males should be a clarion call for the early recognition and availability of treatment for men with mental disorders, not a battle cry to add women and minorities to the ranks of our asylum.

Prefer machines to humans is not a mental disorder, it's just common sense

 

[lcpiper]

Except this isn't a fact. Women and minority participation in STEM fields vary wildly country by country. If it were really true that genetically all men did this and all women did that then for the most part we should see the same thing country to country. But we don't... not even close. In particular women in STEM in the US it's like 24% while world wide it's much higher. Communist country or no it's higher elsewhere than here. To boil the topic down to "women aren't interested in STEM," or the mere discussion of the topic is man-hating shows a lack of inquisitiveness and binary thinking, which is troublesome.

Many other things vary country to country as well. Survival can play an important part of determining what one does for a career. My wife doesn't like being a barber, but it's something she was willing to learn that would pay enough for her. Twenty years later she's still cutting hair even though she has made more than enough money to get started doing someone else.

What is it Americans used to always encourage people to do? Follow their dreams, to do something they want to do, etc. My two girls, one refused to do anything other than become an artist and the other gave up on civil engineering and switched to psychology. I don't think either will ever earn enough to pay off their loans. Hell, I know one won't.

 

[Ducman69]

gave up on civil engineering and switched to psychology.

My hairdresser has a degree in Psychology - Criminal Justice...

 

[thejokker]

Except this isn't a fact. Women and minority participation in STEM fields vary wildly country by country. If it were really true that genetically all men did this and all women did that then for the most part we should see the same thing country to country. But we don't... not even close. In particular women in STEM in the US it's like 24% while world wide it's much higher. Communist country or no it's higher elsewhere than here. To boil the topic down to "women aren't interested in STEM," or the mere discussion of the topic is man-hating shows a lack of inquisitiveness and binary thinking, which is troublesome.

Sorry but your argument is not persuasive. Is participation in other countries higher because feminists have legislated so called equality? You are making a broad statement without any supporting data. There are notable examples of prominent women in technology and science but they are the exceptions...

 

[jtm55]

Many other things vary country to country as well. Survival can play an important part of determining what one does for a career. My wife doesn't like being a barber, but it's something she was willing to learn that would pay enough for her. Twenty years later she's still cutting hair even though she has made more than enough money to get started doing someone else.

What is it Americans used to always encourage people to do? Follow their dreams, to do something they want to do, etc. My two girls, one refused to do anything other than become an artist and the other gave up on civil engineering and switched to psychology. I don't think either will ever earn enough to pay off their loans. Hell, I know one won't.

Hi All

My dad was a barber. Understand your concerns about your daughters ability to pay back their loans. I was fortunate in having the GI bill that payed for my schooling as I attended Stony Brook University a State school. I believe most folk go into a field more so for survival than love of said field. Few are fortunate to get paid for something that they love doing.

 

[potency]

And qualified Asians.

I'm still waiting for these same "diversity" supporters to sue the NBA for the lack Chinese or Japanese on the teams.

As a short man, I want to clarify that the NBA openly discriminates against short men, regardless of race or creed, and no one has ever stood up for us. It needs to stop now.

 

[Darunion]

I think a big problem is schools and colleges. They don't really give a damn about what might be a good career for you. I was told that electrical engineering isn't going anywhere and that I should instead go into programming. Well that field flooded with people left little work for me so I kept on the path of electrical and that has kept me working and happy.

My sister was told (by an ohio college) that her dream of marine biology would be something she could do here. What that means is you can work at sea world because we have no ocean here lol.

I have had other friends lead poorly into careers that are not stable or plentiful. I might just be ranting but I don't think this is just some simple issue that can be blamed on a company and what gender/race they have on staff. Makes a good google news headline though.