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What. The. Heck.

S

shadowfax

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 12, 2005
Messages
313
OK so after reading some news story about a guy that's suing the Second Life company because someone stole his virtual money I decided I had to check it out. People are actually spending real money for fake goods. Coldwell Banker is selling virtual property. You can rent pretend apartments for your pretend character, only you pay real money for it. Some dude tried to sell me "virtual popcorn" for $10, because obviously the best way to enjoy an online game is to pretend to eat popcorn. And that's not even going into the fact that there are "prostitutes" on there who will charge you real money for virtual sex.

Is this becoming the new normality? I can understand getting immersed in games. Just ask me about Deus Ex some time. But paying real money for drawings of fake imaginary stuff? Is it weird that I just don't get it?
 
welcome to everquest last decade. People have been selling digital items in online games since the inception of the MMO.
 
Technoob said:
welcome to everquest last decade. People have been selling digital items in online games since the inception of the MMO.
Click to expand...


Yeah, but at least you could DO stuff with the everquest goods. buy a better sword, your game play is enhanced because you can kill better.

But buying virtual popcorn? A drawing of a couch?
 
I find it sad that people are trying to sell things like this, but I feel even sadder because people buy them.
 
Where have you been? :p People pay real money for in-game gold. Diablo players e-bayed rare items. Didn't somebody in EVE Online pay six figures for a space station or something ridiculous like that? Real money is exchanging hands all the time. Just wait til the gov't decides to start taxing it.
 
the sims + mmo = this

people have been paying money for years for the 500th expansion to that game, just to get new curtains.
 
this is really amusing :D

$10 for virtual popcorn ROFL
I can see why some would pay for virtual sex, just to see wth its like lol.
 
These people should be locked into a institute of mental health for life with daily shock therapy in the genitals.

If WoW is crack, Second Life is a whole drug cocktail. I honestly don't understand what is the point of a real life simulator (if at least it was a Holodeck I would take it). In WoW or other similar games at least you buy stuff to accomplish stuff in that game, like being th3 uB3r pvper or power gaming to show off to noobs, this is good for the ego of some guys. But come on......... I would classify second life as a multiplayer version of Oblivion as far as freedom to do whatever you want but with the following changes:

1) Graphics suck;
2) No monsters;
3) No quests;
4) No plot;
5) No point;

It's a game made for losers if you ask me. You failed at life, lets try a second life.

Heck, next step we will be getting people life sentenced for murdering in a game.
 
In some ways I agree with you while it is getting up to speed but I can see value in second life.
Theres a chance for people to be creative, not only in designing the look of property but also defining a new environment to exist in.
Budding designers could throw things into the virtual environment to see how people respond.
Some ideas can be sold as well so your time developing an idea might not be a total loss.

There are new challenges to make things that players will find entertaining.
And then being a player, there will be a lot to see and laid on entertainment.
A bit like visiting a foreign country, theres a whole lot going on and some of its wild and whacky to a Westerner.

It depends what delights you :)
 
I personally like the sims 2 myself. Quite a few modders out there who can make as good or sometimes even better items, skins, ect; than the game designers for that game . Not an mmo i know, but i wouldn't pay real life cash for online items anyhow that can be earned with time and patience.
 
Second Life is an entirely different model than other MMO's. The company provides the end-user tools, and the end-users basically create the "game." Much better idea to play Blockland and just build stuff with Lego blocks with friend online for free. :)
 
TheNuker said:
It's a game made for losers if you ask me. You failed at life, lets try a second life.
Click to expand...

haha well said.. yea there is no way in hell I am paying real cash for any type of in-game virtual items or money... I draw the line at spending on tangible hardware and the games themselves.. if you need to spend any $ on gold for your epic-mount or to get a virtual house, you've lost touch with reality
 
still though, if these people are dumb enough to pay real money for fake shit, maybe I should figure out how to make fake shit and sell it to 'em ;)

there was a book written back in the heyday of the cyber punks called Trouble and her Friends. Had a whole virtual world on the internet that they roamed around in - even had a sheriff to enforce the laws of the virtual world. I remember reading it and thinking yeah right. . .now someone's actually gone and done it.
 
Just accept that there are suckers out there willing to pay for virtual items, and reap the rewards for yourself. As an example, you could join one of these games (Second Life, There, etc) and start designing and selling virtual items (at no cost to you other than a little time). Most of these games give you the ability to exchange between in-game currency and real-life currency, so if you're good enough, you can actually start pulling in a tidy profit off of those "suckers" whom you scorn so much ;)

I've talked to some of the designers that submit large amounts of user-created content to the virtual world There, and they make bank (I've heard reports of over $50 real-world dollars a day). I've been thinking about getting in on this market myself...as long as there are other players willing to pay for your stuff, you could practically make a living out of selling virtual content in a video game :D
 
Just because something is "virtual" doesn't mean its "fake" or lack value for that matter.

Plenty of virtual things have value, you don't call people silly for buying games, yet they're just virtual experiences built out of "fake" props much like you find in MMO's games like Second Life (and I use the term "games" quite losely here)

Users take time to make them which means they have some real world value, in most traditional MMO games trading virtual goods for real money is discouraged because the developers don't want users abusing their system and making money from it, not to mention possible legal implications. The difference is second life encourages it and has a real conversion rate from in game wealth to $ USD.

It's nothing I wan't a part of really, but I'm not going to dis others just because they want something different from me, if it makes people happy to spend money in game then they should go for it.
 
Look up a game called Project Entropia, a few years ago an australian business man payed several hundred thousand dollars to buy virtual land that he planned on building a virtual nightclub and casino on. Last I heard he was almost starting to turn a profit on it. The entire game is based on real money and is linked to a checking or credit account.

beanman101283 said:
Didn't somebody in EVE Online pay six figures for a space station or something ridiculous like that?
Click to expand...

Thats what I am talking about, that was in Project Entropia, a long time before EVE even existed.
 
I was never into MMOs, nor will I be, because the purpose of a game IMHO, is to entertain me in some free time I have, and not to replace my life completely, which seems to be exactly what MMOs do.

Buying virtual content with real money seems to be yet another level of this MMO "madness". I think everyone is entitled to do what they want with their money, but to me this is nothing short of addiction coupled with too much free time (and money) in these people's hands.
 
Silus said:
Buying virtual content with real money seems to be yet another level of this MMO "madness". I think everyone is entitled to do what they want with their money, but to me this is nothing short of addiction coupled with too much free time (and money) in these people's hands.
Click to expand...

You mention addiction, too much free time and too much money.... I don't think all three can exist at the same time, can they?

I know of at least two people who make six-figure salaries and have almost no free time to devote to a game. For them it's far easier to work as often as needed, then purchase whatever they want. For one guy he purchased a Level 60 character on WoW (a few years ago) for about $900.... which was almost nothing for him. The time it would have taken him to level to 60 far exceeded the cost of the character, and he could begin enjoying the game with friends immediately... not 3-4 months (which is easily how long it would have taken him to get there.)

Blurring the lines between addiction and a good cost-benefit analysis is the modern-day forum troll's ammunition.

:)

202276
 
Silus said:
I was never into MMOs, nor will I be, because the purpose of a game IMHO, is to entertain me in some free time I have, and not to replace my life completely, which seems to be exactly what MMOs do.
Click to expand...

Because MMOs are the only type of games that do this. No one has ever been obsessed (to the point of death) with StarCraft, for instance. :rolleyes:

Second Life is an MMO-S (Simulator), which I think needs to be defined as separate from an MMORPG or MMOFPS (a game you just have fun in).

The old "MMOs are bad because they take too much time" argument is complete bullshit. You can play for 5 minutes a week or 20 hours a day and still have fun. It's about community and friendship. The people who badmouth MMOs generally either don't have friends, don't have fun because they can't be the best, or just haven't played one that they've been able to enjoy yet (which is fine).

An MMO, in the end, is just like any other game. The only difference is the amount of people per server. That's it.
 
Tytalus said:
Blurring the lines between addiction and a good cost-benefit analysis is the modern-day forum troll's ammunition.
Click to expand...

Well said. Or, one man's nickel is another mans quarter.

Symon14 said:
Because MMOs are the only type of games that do this. No one has ever been obsessed (to the point of death) with StarCraft, for instance.

Second Life is an MMO-S (Simulator), which I think needs to be defined as separate from an MMORPG or MMOFPS (a game you just have fun in).

The old "MMOs are bad because they take too much time" argument is complete bullshit. You can play for 5 minutes a week or 20 hours a day and still have fun. It's about community and friendship. The people who badmouth MMOs generally either don't have friends, don't have fun because they can't be the best, or just haven't played one that they've been able to enjoy yet (which is fine).

An MMO, in the end, is just like any other game. The only difference is the amount of people per server. That's it.
Click to expand...

Also well said. These two posts should end this thread.
 
l3ender said:
I find it sad that people are trying to sell things like this, but I feel even sadder because people buy them.
Click to expand...
no shit eh? the absolute epitome of a loser: buying stuff to outfit a character instead of earning it yourself, THUS PLAYING THE FUCKING GAME!

if you buy that shit, regardless of rebuttal, you are a fucking loser!

...goes to show you why services are around like one that will talk to you on your cell phone just so you look like you're talking to someone. fucking loser society, loser world!

living virtually might be the answer. rid the world of the aspects one does not like :cool:
 
Tytalus said:
You mention addiction, too much free time and too much money.... I don't think all three can exist at the same time, can they?
Click to expand...

Actually, they can. Just because you don't know any, doesn't mean they don't exist. I know a few, that play nothing but WoW and even though they work, they spend the rest of their time playing it and their talk only about WoW. I don't know if they bought anything "virtual" with real money, but if they didn't yet, that's the only thing missing from their "addiction" at this point, since they too don't have problems with money.

Tytalus said:
I know of at least two people who make six-figure salaries and have almost no free time to devote to a game. For them it's far easier to work as often as needed, then purchase whatever they want. For one guy he purchased a Level 60 character on WoW (a few years ago) for about $900.... which was almost nothing for him. The time it would have taken him to level to 60 far exceeded the cost of the character, and he could begin enjoying the game with friends immediately... not 3-4 months (which is easily how long it would have taken him to get there.)
Click to expand...

That's great. More power for them.

Tytalus said:
Blurring the lines between addiction and a good cost-benefit analysis is the modern-day forum troll's ammunition.
Click to expand...

There's no blurring, only your narrow-minded interpretation of what I said. It's great you think it's a "good cost-benefit". I can't disagree more, but as I said, people are entitled to spend their money as they see fit. That doesn't mean I understand the reasons, which is exactly the case.
 
Symon14 said:
Because MMOs are the only type of games that do this. No one has ever been obsessed (to the point of death) with StarCraft, for instance. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

What exactly is your point really ? Aren't we talking about MMOs ?
Of course there are other type of games, that are (or can be) truly addictive and some people will take it too far IMHO, but this thread is about MMOs, so I like to stick with the topic.
 
shadowfax said:
But paying real money for drawings of fake imaginary stuff? Is it weird that I just don't get it?
Click to expand...

The pot calls the kettle black ? ;)

You just lumped in all games,as to me they all fall in to that description. :D

If you have paid for or played any game on any platform you too are part of this insanity.
Are those of us who buy expensive video cards even worse ? Have we fallen even farther
down the rabbit hole ?
 
l3ender said:
I find it sad that people are trying to sell things like this, but I feel even sadder because people buy them.
Click to expand...

Exactly. Although I don't feel sad, in the sense that, as I mentioned before, anyone does what he/she wants with their money, I do feel that the modern gaming society, is paying more attention to games or any virtual content, than to real life. I know a few "WoW addicts" that instead of socializing with people, live, prefer to use the in-game chat system for hours. I don't understand that..To me, a game is just something to entertain me, for the 30 minutes/day I usually play.
I know that some people have trouble making friends or actually socializing with others and sometimes, the virtual world is their only escape. But still, buying virtual content, seems too much for me.
 
Manny Calavera said:
The pot calls the kettle black ? ;)

You just lumped in all games,as to me they all fall in to that description. :D

If youhave paid for or played any game on any platform you too are part of this insanity.
Are those of us who buy expensive video cards even worse ? Have we fallen even farther
down the rabbit hole ?
Click to expand...

How exactly is a video card, something imaginary or virtual ?
And unless you're a Steam afficionado, buying a game also gives you something physical and palpable, in the form of CDs/DVDs + case.
 
The card isnt,but we spend crazy amounts of money on them to 'enhance' these virtual worlds and the expiriences we take part in within them.
 
Manny Calavera said:
The card isnt,but we spend crazy amounts of money on them to 'enhance' these virtual worlds and the expiriences we take part in within them.
Click to expand...

True, but that's not the same thing we are discussing in this thread :)
 
shadowfax said:
Yeah, but at least you could DO stuff with the everquest goods. buy a better sword, your game play is enhanced because you can kill better.

But buying virtual popcorn? A drawing of a couch?
Click to expand...

Buying such an item with real money would indicate to me that you have failed at your life, you don't deserve a second change in "second life"

Game over.
 
Silus said:
What exactly is your point really ? Aren't we talking about MMOs ?
Of course there are other type of games, that are (or can be) truly addictive and some people will take it too far IMHO, but this thread is about MMOs, so I like to stick with the topic.
Click to expand...

If you had read my post, you will see I mention the word MMO many times within it. In fact, the entire post addresses MMOs. I'm sorry that my single sentence mention of a non-MMO game threw you off. I didn't know comparing the topic with something else was illegal. Oh wait, its not - and its done all the time to make a point.

Edit: My point is that MMOs are just a game. People who go on "holy crusades" to bash them have problems. People who have MMO addictions have problems. And people who make offhanded comments about MMOs and people who play MMOs also have problems. They are just games - nothing more.
 
This is nothing new and stories about the economy in Second Life have been being recycled in the mainstream media for the last 2 years. But I have very different reaction when I read stuff like this. Personally, I like the idea of different style of game catching on. Stagnation is death. But what does get me is, man if I had heard about this sooner I could have gotten in on the ground level and made some cash. Another opprotunity to fleece the foolish missed.:D
 
G'ßöö;1031146468 said:
no shit eh? the absolute epitome of a loser: buying stuff to outfit a character instead of earning it yourself, THUS PLAYING THE FUCKING GAME!

if you buy that shit, regardless of rebuttal, you are a fucking loser!
Click to expand...

In the interest of balance -- and understand that I could be wrong about this because there are a LOT of aspects of second life that I do not understand and probably never will -- I don't think you CAN "earn" this stuff in the game because there aren't any quests or missions. In other words, if you want that pimp hat with the purple feather, you have to buy it.

The difference between all the MMORPGs that everyone's talking about and SL is that SL is just a fancy chatroom. There's absolutely no difference between it and the old NUTS talkers of the mid 90's except the scale and that there are pictoral representations of the chatrooms and the chat users. At least, there's no difference at its core - but the users have gone and MADE a difference by creating this economical based system in which they buy stuff that doesn't change the core of what I hesitate to call a game.

In other words, I can still chat with you whether I have that pimp hat or that $10 virtual popcorn or not. Buying that in-game fake thing will do absolutely NOTHING to enhance my ability to have a conversation with you, which is why I don't quite see the point.

Manny Calavera said:
The pot calls the kettle black ? ;)

You just lumped in all games,as to me they all fall in to that description. :D
Click to expand...

Not really. If I want to experience a video game, I can't unless I buy or steal it. Assuming I want to stay legal, I have to pay for that experience.

If I go into SL, presumably I want to experience talking with a bunch of people on the internet. I can do that whether I buy fake crap in the game or not, so I don't think the comparison between buying the actual game and buying something that doesn't materially change the game is valid.


On another note, I did find one cool thing in SL. There's a Mystery Science Theater 3000 spot where people make fun of bad movies. I hate to admit it, but that, is cool.


And free.
 
Symon14 said:
Edit: My point is that MMOs are just a game. People who go on "holy crusades" to bash them have problems. People who have MMO addictions have problems. And people who make offhanded comments about MMOs and people who play MMOs also have problems. They are just games - nothing more.
Click to expand...

You forgot one. Those who say others have problems, because they don't share the same opinion as theirs, also have problems.

I for one didn't make any offhand comments about MMOs nor am I on a "Holy Crusade" against MMOs. I shared my opinion about the fact that I don't understand how can someone spend real money on virtual content.
Also my opinion is based on what I know of MMOs and what they do/did to some of the people I know. And it's been nothing short of addiction. Addiction being talking about nothing more than the game and playing it all the time. That's my experience and if you had a different one, that's great. Kudos to your "MMO playing friends that are not addicted".

A game IMHO, is something to entertain you for a while, not something that's supposed to be a "Second Life". To live != To game, though you can play games while you live.
Games that create this "Second Life", are surpassing that barrier between Life and Game and I don't like that and that's exactly why I don't play any MMO or game that addicts me to a point, where I do nothing else but play it.
 
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