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- Oct 29, 2000
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An update on my model use.
I am currently using two models:
Gemma4:26b (Q8_0, 26B MoE, w. 3.8B active) is on the GPU via llama.cpp running as a server. I use it as a general chat model for answers to questions. It is very fast, and reasoning is capable enough for most topics. I do need to find a way to persuade it to more actively ingest web data to augment its responses though. It has been surprisingly resistant here, often answering with outdated internal training knowledge rather than reaching for web search and scraping which is set up and working. I have tried massaging it with ever more insistent system prompts, but they seem to have only marginal effect.
One thing I have noticed with this model is that while it is great early on in a chat when tokes are relatively low, as the context token count increases things tend to fall apart a little. I had a long technical chat last night that went up to almost 100k tokens of context, and this resulted in one in two prompts resulting in an infinite reasoning loop. I have tried experimenting by raising llama.cpp's repeat penalty to 1.1 from the default 1,0 (--repeat-penalty 1.1) to try to address this but I don't have enough time with it since this change to determine if that helped yet.
Long term I may need to choose a different model, but for now it is serving me pretty well.
Laguna S 2.1 (118B MoE (Q4_K_M, 118B MoE w. 8B active) is a secondary backup model running on the CPU on the EPYC. I tried this one due to FrgMstr speaking highly of it and I have to say I agree. I've come to really like it, and if I could fit it in the GPU VRAM, I'd probably run it more. As it is, it is a good backup model for when I need some additional reasoning the GPU model can't handle, or need some serious code review, and have the time to just stick a prompt in it and have it process in the background while I am doing other stuff. Usually running models on the CPU is extremely slow and frustrating, but the Milan EPYC and its eight channels of DDR4-3200 has almost as much total memory bandwidth as an Nvidia Spark box or a Strix 395+ box, meaning that once I tweak the model file with some CPU optimizations, I can get surprisingly OK eval speeds for a CPU (~13-14 tokens/s). Prompt pre-fill is still quite frustratingly slow though, as CPU's just can't touch the matrix math capabilities of even a low end GPU.
I'm going to continue tweaking the settings and system prompt on Gemma4:26B to see if I can improve it to the point where I am happy with it, and may even try its dense bigger brother (Gemma4:31b) to see if performance is acceptable and it performs any better. In theory the more parameters the less likely the risk of entering loops, and for this purpose the MoE approach really matters, as this is based on the 3.8B active parameters, not the total 26B, which explains why this model is more susceptible to these loops as the context size grows.
I suspect eventually I'll wind up switching away from Gemma4 all together for my main model, but I am not thrilled with the alternatives out there right now. Tests from people in this thread (thanks!) have mitigated some of my concerns about bias in the Chinese models, but I am still not quite ready to embrace them with open arms. The issue I have right now is that most better models are in the 120B class and are thus too large for my 64GB VRAM. There seems to be a big hole in the latest generation of models in the larger than 30B class but smaller than 120B class that would be ideal for my 64GB GPU, but I am hopeful we will see some launch in the not too distant future.
I am currently using two models:
Gemma4:26b (Q8_0, 26B MoE, w. 3.8B active) is on the GPU via llama.cpp running as a server. I use it as a general chat model for answers to questions. It is very fast, and reasoning is capable enough for most topics. I do need to find a way to persuade it to more actively ingest web data to augment its responses though. It has been surprisingly resistant here, often answering with outdated internal training knowledge rather than reaching for web search and scraping which is set up and working. I have tried massaging it with ever more insistent system prompts, but they seem to have only marginal effect.
One thing I have noticed with this model is that while it is great early on in a chat when tokes are relatively low, as the context token count increases things tend to fall apart a little. I had a long technical chat last night that went up to almost 100k tokens of context, and this resulted in one in two prompts resulting in an infinite reasoning loop. I have tried experimenting by raising llama.cpp's repeat penalty to 1.1 from the default 1,0 (--repeat-penalty 1.1) to try to address this but I don't have enough time with it since this change to determine if that helped yet.
Long term I may need to choose a different model, but for now it is serving me pretty well.
Laguna S 2.1 (118B MoE (Q4_K_M, 118B MoE w. 8B active) is a secondary backup model running on the CPU on the EPYC. I tried this one due to FrgMstr speaking highly of it and I have to say I agree. I've come to really like it, and if I could fit it in the GPU VRAM, I'd probably run it more. As it is, it is a good backup model for when I need some additional reasoning the GPU model can't handle, or need some serious code review, and have the time to just stick a prompt in it and have it process in the background while I am doing other stuff. Usually running models on the CPU is extremely slow and frustrating, but the Milan EPYC and its eight channels of DDR4-3200 has almost as much total memory bandwidth as an Nvidia Spark box or a Strix 395+ box, meaning that once I tweak the model file with some CPU optimizations, I can get surprisingly OK eval speeds for a CPU (~13-14 tokens/s). Prompt pre-fill is still quite frustratingly slow though, as CPU's just can't touch the matrix math capabilities of even a low end GPU.
I'm going to continue tweaking the settings and system prompt on Gemma4:26B to see if I can improve it to the point where I am happy with it, and may even try its dense bigger brother (Gemma4:31b) to see if performance is acceptable and it performs any better. In theory the more parameters the less likely the risk of entering loops, and for this purpose the MoE approach really matters, as this is based on the 3.8B active parameters, not the total 26B, which explains why this model is more susceptible to these loops as the context size grows.
I suspect eventually I'll wind up switching away from Gemma4 all together for my main model, but I am not thrilled with the alternatives out there right now. Tests from people in this thread (thanks!) have mitigated some of my concerns about bias in the Chinese models, but I am still not quite ready to embrace them with open arms. The issue I have right now is that most better models are in the 120B class and are thus too large for my 64GB VRAM. There seems to be a big hole in the latest generation of models in the larger than 30B class but smaller than 120B class that would be ideal for my 64GB GPU, but I am hopeful we will see some launch in the not too distant future.
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