What is a good Sound Card for HTPC?

I

isai95

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 9, 2005
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I have tried at lease 3 Sound Cards in the range of $30.00 ~ $70.00 and none of these sound good. The sound is very thin and very bright. I tried both with Coaxial and Optical digital outputs and none sounds decent to me.

Do you guys know or point me to the right direction where I can find one for my HTPC?
 
It would help if you told us which three sound cards you tried.
 
I am running an Audigy 2 ZS in my HTPC hooked up to my Pioneer Receiver via a stereo pair and letting the receiver decode it to dolby pro logic.
Sounds great to me.
 
Um, if you're using a digital connection to your receiver then you are bypassing the sound card's DAC... issues with sound being "thin" could be driver related or a problem with your source audio (or settings on your receiver).

What cards have you tried? My HTPC is using onboard audio with a digital audio output and the sound is just fine (though if I connect it via analog it sounds absolutely miserable, high pitched, hollow, tinny... just bad).
 
Danny Bui said:
It would help if you told us which three sound cards you tried.
Click to expand...
Sorry about that!
Well I bought these two:
1-) Turtle Beach Montego 7.1 surround sound, Dolby Digital Live, 24/96 bit, Optical Digital O/I for ($60.00)
2-) Diamond Xtreme Sound 7.1 surround sound, 24/96 bit, coaxial O/I ($29.00) $10.00 rebate.

The Turtle Beach sounded horrible with broken scratched noises within voices and the Diamond sounded high pitched, hollow, tinny, etc.

Both are going back to the store. I want something to the caliber of a real highend audio gear.
 
deruberhanyok said:
Um, if you're using a digital connection to your receiver then you are bypassing the sound card's DAC... issues with sound being "thin" could be driver related or a problem with your source audio (or settings on your receiver).

What cards have you tried? My HTPC is using onboard audio with a digital audio output and the sound is just fine (though if I connect it via analog it sounds absolutely miserable, high pitched, hollow, tinny... just bad).
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My receiver's settings are fine. It plays just fine from other sources like PS3, my highend DAC and CD transport.
 
isai95 said:
My receiver's settings are fine. It plays just fine from other sources like PS3, my highend DAC and CD transport.
Click to expand...

Then, clearly, it's because both cards you bought are cheap and have terrible drivers (the Turtle beach card is known for that). If you had done some research before hand you would have found that out.

Anyways, Asus's DX and Creative's cheap Xfi Gamer are both good choices but, honestly, you're going digital out to a receiver so the onboard audio is more then enough. There really isn't any need to go with a seperate sound card in that situating.
 
CrimandEvil said:
Anyways, Asus's DX and Creative's cheap Xfi Gamer are both good choices but, honestly, you're going digital out to a receiver so the onboard audio is more then enough. There really isn't any need to go with a seperate sound card in that situating.
Click to expand...
Not to mention that a good soundcard often costs almost as much as a good htpc motherboard (one that has good onboard sound to boot) :)

Upgrading your HTPC sound is often a good excuse to upgrade the entire motherboard...imho.
 
deruberhanyok said:
Um, if you're using a digital connection to your receiver then you are bypassing the sound card's DAC... issues with sound being "thin" could be driver related or a problem with your source audio (or settings on your receiver).
Click to expand...

I must ask something please,
If i'm using and HDMI for sound also (via GeCube HD3450 card), then the sound is not being decoded at all ?
cuz i was afraid the sound card there will be horrible, but according to you it doesnt matter, right ?
 
you can't get 5.1 over hdmi from a pc atm. That's why most audiophiles buy sound cards or motherboards that support digital output from either coax or optical which does dts connect or Dobly Digital
 
isai95 said:
I tried both with Coaxial and Optical digital outputs and none sounds decent to me.
Click to expand...

When using a digital connection you are just passing the sound through to the receiver for processing. So it makes no difference what sound card you use. I would just use onboard in this case. Which is exactly what I do on mine.

If you want analog then it's a different story.
 
Archer75 said:
When using a digital connection you are just passing the sound through to the receiver for processing. So it makes no difference what sound card you use. I would just use onboard in this case. Which is exactly what I do on mine.

If you want analog then it's a different story.
Click to expand...

The Audio Codec doing nothing as long as i'll user Optical or HDMI for the sound ?!
 
Chura said:
The Audio Codec doing nothing as long as i'll user Optical or HDMI for the sound ?!
Click to expand...

But what kind of connection/cable does one use to get the digital out put stream from the 1/8 sound card's mini jack to the receiver's coaxial in put? or do I have to get a sound card that has the coaxial out put already to avoid cable conversions?
 
Chura, that is correct. The DAC is bypassed since digital audio is being sent directly to a receiver, the audio codec isn't doing anything for pre-encoded audio but passing it along.

To answer your question, yes, the Radeon HD series supports 5.1 audio over HDMI via an onboard audio controller. It can pass Dolby Digital and DTS along the HDMI cable to your receiver, which ought to be able to decode it just fine. However, sources that do not have a pre-encoded 5.1 audio track (such as a game or MP3 file) will only output in 2 channel stereo.

1. since when an DVI connector knows to work with sound ? (Sapphire)
2. The best movie sound track, will be 5.1 dts ? so incase i watch only movies this will be enough ?
Click to expand...

1. My understanding of it is that the DVI outputs on the Radeon HD cards are keyed to pass audio when used with one of their included adapters (or a built-in HDMI output). If you were to use a different DVI -> HDMI adapter or a DVI -> HDMI cable it would not send audio, only video.

Someone fact-check me on that? I can't find where I read that now but I'm about 90% sure that's how it works. I don't know what kind of weird signal rerouting magic they're doing with the DVI ports to make it work, though. I mean technically it just sends a digital signal that is interpreted by the device at the end of it, I can't figure any reason that it wouldn't be able to send audio as long as the receiver recognizes the signal on the other end.

2. Yes and yes. Unless you're using blu-ray for playback and want to use the Dolby HD or DTS HD audio soundtrack on one of those discs; these aren't support for pass-through by the current cards.

I saw a slide capture on the chinese version of tom's hardware that, if correct, lists 7.1 audio capabilities (perhaps Dolby/DTS HD pass-through) in the HD 4000 series cards. We'll know for sure about that in a few weeks I guess.
 
isai95 said:
But what kind of connection/cable does one use to get the digital out put stream from the 1/4 sound card's jack to the receiver's coaxial in put? or do I have to get a sound card that has the coaxial out put already to avoid cable conversions?
Click to expand...

This depends on the card you are talking about, however, for Creative Labs cards, which have a digital output that uses a 1/8" minijack connection, a standard mono minijack to RCA cable will work. In fact I'm using a 1/8" stereo minijack cable plugged into that connection right now and the digital audio is passed through the left channel RCA output to my speakers (I was too lazy to go to radio shack and buy a separate cable).

The same thing should work with a Xonar DX, afaik.

If you're talking about using such a cable with something normally used for analog output, it won't work. The jack on the sound card or motherboard has to at least be able to function as a digital output.
 
deruberhanyok said:
This depends on the card you are talking about, however, for Creative Labs cards, which have a digital output that uses a 1/8" minijack connection, a standard mono minijack to RCA cable will work. In fact I'm using a 1/8" stereo minijack cable plugged into that connection right now and the digital audio is passed through the left channel RCA output to my speakers (I was too lazy to go to radio shack and buy a separate cable).
I tried this, using a 1/8 mini jack to a regular left rca cable, also I tried a video cable 75ohms and a regular rca digital cable and did not work. The receiver got only the right channel working but very thin. How in the world you pull the stream from the 1/8 mini jack so the receiver decorders would work into 7 channes or even 5 channels?
Click to expand...


The same thing should work with a Xonar DX, afaik.

If you're talking about using such a cable with something normally used for analog output, it won't work. The jack on the sound card or motherboard has to at least be able to function as a digital output.
Click to expand...
I did not use it as a regular analog input into the receiver. I used the coaxial input on the receiver.
 
The Auzentech Prelude can do 5.1 DTS/AC3 realtime via optical or wired digital.
However for best quality use the Preludes analogue out, its truly amazing!
 
isai - I'm confused. Are you trying to pass digital audio to your receiver? What I'm talking about only works if the plug on the sound card /motherboard can output digital audio. If it can then you're going to get PCM 2.0 digital stereo audio for all sources except pre-encoded audio. You would need a card or onboard solution on motherboard capable of Dolby Digital Live or DTS Connect to get 5.1 audio from all sources.

The connection should go like this:

Sound card digital output -> mono 1/8" minijack to RCA cable -> coax digital audio input on receiver

I'm honestly not sure how that would give you just the right channel of audio, unless the sound card doesn't have a digital output and it's trying to send analog data.

Again, this ONLY applies to sound cards which have the digital audio connection onboard as a 1/8" minijack connection. To the best of my knowledge this is mainly cards by Creative Labs (pretty much all of the sound blasters since the Live! 5.1 digital iirc).

If you are using onboard audio then what I'm talking about does not work - onboard audio solutions will have separate coax/optical digital outputs that need to be used and their minijack connections are only for analog audio. If your onboard audio only has minijack outputs then you are limited to analog and can't send a digital 5.1 stream in any form to your receiver.

What is your current sound card? Knowing that would help me explain this better.

[edit]

I just need to get a good digital stream to my receiver's decoder to reproduce the sound into 7.1 channels.
Click to expand...

Just FYI you won't be able to send 7.1 digitally to your receiver. It's going to be 5.1; if you want 7.1 with any current setup you're going to need to use analog outputs to multichannel analog inputs on your receiver.
 
Nenu said:
The Auzentech Prelude can do 5.1 DTS/AC3 realtime via optical or wired digital.
However for best quality use the Preludes analogue out, its truly amazing!
Click to expand...
Where can I get the preludes and what is a good price?
 
isai95 said:
Where can I get the preludes and what is a good price?
Click to expand...

Soz, you'll need to find out for where you live (unless you are in the UK).
I have seen people quoting prices around $170 but that might be offers, not sure.

Most retailers will stock them.
 
deruberhanyok said:
isai - I'm confused. Are you trying to pass digital audio to your receiver?
Yes.
Click to expand...
What I'm talking about only works if the plug on the sound card /motherboard can output digital audio. If it can then you're going to get PCM 2.0 digital stereo audio for all sources except pre-encoded audio. You would need a card or onboard solution on motherboard capable of Dolby Digital Live or DTS Connect to get 5.1 audio from all sources.

The connection should go like this:

Sound card digital output -> mono 1/8" minijack to RCA cable -> coax digital audio input on receiver

I'm honestly not sure how that would give you just the right channel of audio, unless the sound card doesn't have a digital output and it's trying to send analog data.
Yes, I was surprised too.
Click to expand...

Again, this ONLY applies to sound cards which have the digital audio connection onboard as a 1/8" minijack connection. To the best of my knowledge this is mainly cards by Creative Labs (pretty much all of the sound blasters since the Live! 5.1 digital iirc).
Yes I want to try the Creative labs cards.
Click to expand...

If you are using onboard audio then what I'm talking about does not work - onboard audio solutions will have separate coax/optical digital outputs that need to be used and their minijack connections are only for analog audio. If your onboard audio only has minijack outputs then you are limited to analog and can't send a digital 5.1 stream in any form to your receiver.

What is your current sound card? Knowing that would help me explain this better.
Onboard card with minijacks mic, line out and line in (pink, green and blue)
I bought these two:
1-) Turtle Beach Montego 7.1 surround sound, Dolby Digital Live, 24/96 bit, Optical Digital O/I for ($60.00)
2-) Diamond Xtreme Sound 7.1 surround sound, 24/96 bit, coaxial O/I ($29.00) $10.00 rebate.
The Turtle Beach sounded horrible with broken scratched noises within voices and the Diamond sounded high pitched, hollow, tinny, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

[edit]


Just FYI you won't be able to send 7.1 digitally to your receiver. It's going to be 5.1; if you want 7.1 with any current setup you're going to need to use analog outputs to multichannel analog inputs on your receiver.
Click to expand...

You are right. I need to use lots of 1/8 mini jack cables to rca cables.
 
Well your onboard audio definitely won't send digital audio with those connections.

Neither of those sound cards worked with optical or coax digital cables? That's very strange. I hesitate to suggest trying another card given this information.

Either one of the cards you tried should have been fully capable of sending the digital audio over its respective output - optical or coax - so I'm not sure what else to suggest.

Do other devices sound okay connected to your receiver?
 
deruberhanyok said:
Well your onboard audio definitely won't send digital audio with those connections.

Neither of those sound cards worked with optical or coax digital cables?
They worked but the sound was horrible
Click to expand...

That's very strange. I hesitate to suggest trying another card given this information.

Either one of the cards you tried should have been fully capable of sending the digital audio over its respective output - optical or coax - so I'm not sure what else to suggest.

Do other devices sound okay connected to your receiver?
Click to expand...
Yes.
Click to expand...
Do you know if the Creative labs highend sound cards, the AuzenTech AZT-XPCINE or Prelude sound as good or better than the PS3 optical digital output thru a receiver?
If the AuzenTech Prelude sound at least as good as the PS3 then I just buy this one and use monster cable 1/8 mini jacks to RCA to the analog 7.1 channel inputs of the receiver.
 
Nenu said:
The Auzentech Prelude can do 5.1 DTS/AC3 realtime via optical or wired digital.
However for best quality use the Preludes analogue out, its truly amazing!
Click to expand...

Nenu:
May you please elaborate/explain more about your setup?
What 1/8 mini jack to RCA cables are you using?
What receiver are you using?
What speakers are you using?
Are you using the 7.1 setup?
Do all 1/8 mini jacks fit well into the sound card outputs?
I understand that for the Center channel you connect a stereo cable. One end for the subwoofer and one for the center input in the receiver.

Thanks for you info.
 
I know of the leads as Stereo 3.5mm jack to RCA (Phono).
I am using generic oxygen free copper cables which I had to strip down to fit in the sound card. Luckily the outers are just cosmetic and the connections are still shielded.

The centre channel is tied together with the LFE (sub) channel on the output from the soundcard.
Route the other end of the wires to wherever you want them to go.
I dont use the LFE channel at all though, I pump LFE to the front speakers which also feed the sub. It sounds better and I dont get issues with the LFE channel not working properly. See below.

My Receiver is the Sony STR DB930 5.1, 8yrs old and still so good I dont want to replace it :)
Speakers:
Front pair: Mission 754 Bi-wired (large floorstander, Flagship speaker 11yrs ago, very powerful)
Centre and Rears: Acoustic Energy Aegis (shelf speakers, handle high power well and sound really sweet)
Subwoofer: Rel Strata II (big floorstander, awesome 20Hz sub) self powered, fed from the front speakers amplified terminals (not the LFE channel) to match the timing with the front speakers.
LFE channel is turned off so that low frequencies are redirected to both the front speakers and Subwoofer.
All speakers have softdome tweeters (except the sub ;)).

In all, extremely cheap kit to buy now and gives a very detailed, sweet/pleasant, very deep and truly massive sound !
Coupled with the Auzentech Prelude, its everything I want.
I have a quality Marantz CD player but it never gets used now cos the Auzentech soundcard is so good.
 
Nenu said:
I know of the leads as Stereo 3.5mm jack to RCA (Phono).
I am using generic oxygen free copper cables which I had to strip down to fit in the sound card. Luckily the outers are just cosmetic and the connections are still shielded.

The centre channel is tied together with the LFE (sub) channel on the output from the soundcard.
Route the other end of the wires to wherever you want them to go.
I dont use the LFE channel at all though, I pump LFE to the front speakers which also feed the sub. It sounds better and I dont get issues with the LFE channel not working properly. See below.

My Receiver is the Sony STR DB930 5.1, 8yrs old and still so good I dont want to replace it :)
Speakers:
Front pair: Mission 754 Bi-wired (large floorstander, Flagship speaker 11yrs ago, very powerful)
Centre and Rears: Acoustic Energy Aegis (shelf speakers, handle high power well and sound really sweet)
Subwoofer: Rel Strata II (big floorstander, awesome 20Hz sub) self powered, fed from the front speakers amplified terminals (not the LFE channel) to match the timing with the front speakers.
LFE channel is turned off so that low frequencies are redirected to both the front speakers and Subwoofer.
All speakers have softdome tweeters (except the sub ;)).

In all, extremely cheap kit to buy now and gives a very detailed, sweet/pleasant, very deep and truly massive sound !
Coupled with the Auzentech Prelude, its everything I want.
I have a quality Marantz CD player but it never gets used now cos the Auzentech soundcard is so good.
Click to expand...
Great! Thanks for your info. I'm going to order the Prelude sound card today. It seems to me that you have a great system. I have tube gear so my ears do not like too much solid state gear and I have been afraid of sound cards, but I'll give it a try.:D After all is surround sound only.;) Thanks again for your help. I'll report my findings when I get and install the Prelude card.
 
I am currently using 4 stereo mini to Left and Right Stereo adapters and going from my xfi card direclty to the analog mulitchannel inputs on my onkyo reciever. These inputs are typically used for DVD audio but they work the same way a 5.1 speaker setup works on a pc. This is the only way I can get digital 5.1/7.1 from power dvd when watching bluray in my living room. I tried using the onboard spidif but couldnt get 5.1 even when using AC3 Filter. I am now thinking about getting this soundcard I stumbled upon while browsing newegg today.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829102017

I'm hoping I can get 5.1/7.1 out of the optical out on these and do away with the 8 rca cables coming out of my sound card right now. Looks like a good card for an htpc and its kinda cheap.

*edit: just noticed that you originally linked this very same card but from fry's. I'm going to look into that auzentech one as well.
 
I got the Prelude sound card today. I installed it but did not sound very well with the 7.1 analog cables. I used the digital coaxial output and it seems that works better. My Onkyo receiver manages to send the sound to the 7.1 channels using the THX CINEMA setting. I'm using the drivers that came with the retail sound card CD. I'll try their new drivers to see if the 7.1 channels sound gets better.
PowerDVD 7.3 is set to send the sound to 8 speakers which was the optimal setting to get the sound in all channels. For some reason, the sound of this card still is inferior to the one that comes out of the PS3 machine thru the Onkyo receiver.
 
isai95 said:
I got the Prelude sound card today. I installed it but did not sound very well with the 7.1 analog cables. I used the digital coaxial output and it seems that works better. My Onkyo receiver manages to send the sound to the 7.1 channels using the THX CINEMA setting. I'm using the drivers that came with the retail sound card CD. I'll try their new drivers to see if the 7.1 channels sound gets better.
PowerDVD 7.3 is set to send the sound to 8 speakers which was the optimal setting to get the sound in all channels. For some reason, the sound of this card still is inferior to the one that comes out of the PS3 machine thru the Onkyo receiver.
Click to expand...

FYI, you can't get 7.1 sound over coax or optical. Only analog or HDMI. And since with a digital connection it only passes the sound out the sound card you use makes no difference.
 
Archer75 said:
FYI, you can't get 7.1 sound over coax or optical. Only analog or HDMI. And since with a digital connection it only passes the sound out the sound card you use makes no difference.
Click to expand...

IMO 7.1 is over rated, few DVDs support 6.1 and most BDs lack 7.1 sound.
 
Archer75 said:
FYI, you can't get 7.1 sound over coax or optical. Only analog or HDMI. And since with a digital connection it only passes the sound out the sound card you use makes no difference.
Click to expand...
I understand this, but my Onkyo receiver is 7.1 and is smart enough to send sound to the 7.1 speakers setup and I 'm able to enjoy 7.1 sound eventhough the HD DTS or whatever new format the blu-ray standard is sent over HDMI is not allowed thru digital output yet, but some people are working already to get full HD audio thru digital out puts just the way that it should be regarless of all the limitations of the HDMI standards. I'm not going to buy/spend another $2,000.00 for a receiver that has the new HDMI connector to get HD audio.
 
Stoly said:
IMO 7.1 is over rated, few DVDs support 6.1 and most BDs lack 7.1 sound.
Click to expand...
A very well recorded 7.1 channel material sounds very scary (amazing):)
But like with everything else something beautiful is very hard to achieve. I don't know what engineers have in their heads, I guess they have good brains but don't have ears.:D
 
It's not that it isn't "allowed," it's that the coax and optical SPDIF connections simply don't have enough bandwidth to send those signals. A 7.1 signal that could be sent would have to be more compressed that Dolby Digital or DTS 5.1, since it would be two more channels crammed in there.

I understand you don't want to purchase a new receiver, but if you really want that audio you need something that can receive it. A super-compressed 7.1 stream isn't going to be the same as the DTS HD or Dolby TrueHD soundtracks no matter what.

Those discs should all have a regular 5.1 sountrack on them, though, and why that track wouldn't sound the same from any digital output I couldn't say.

For some reason, the sound of this card still is inferior to the one that comes out of the PS3 machine thru the Onkyo receiver.
Click to expand...

Your PS3 is connected digitally, right? Are you testing on the exact same connection for the PS3 and HTPC? If so and you still think it doesn't sound as good then something, somewhere, is interfering with your sound. Digital connections bypass any interference from DACs on the sound card so the only reason they'd sound different would be if a different signal was being sent.

The only thing I can think of would be some sort of processing effect being applied to the audio that's causing it sound "inferior," or, possibly, some effect that isn't being applied by your system whereas it is on the PS3 that makes the console sound "better."

Perhaps something in the pipeline from Blu-ray disc -> PowerDVD -> sound card -> receiver might just not be able to handle it.

I am currently using 4 stereo mini to Left and Right Stereo adapters [...] This is the only way I can get digital 5.1/7.1 from power dvd when watching bluray in my living room.
Click to expand...

Just FYI, that's not digital if you're using the analog outputs. I see what you're saying but there's nothing digital about it at all; the surround sound is being decoded by your PC and then being output to those channels before being passed along to your receiver. The "digital" stops at those minijack to RCA adapters you are using.
 
isai95 said:
I understand this, but my Onkyo receiver is 7.1 and is smart enough to send sound to the 7.1 speakers setup and I 'm able to enjoy 7.1 sound eventhough the HD DTS or whatever new format the blu-ray standard is sent over HDMI is not allowed thru digital output yet, but some people are working already to get full HD audio thru digital out puts just the way that it should be regarless of all the limitations of the HDMI standards. I'm not going to buy/spend another $2,000.00 for a receiver that has the new HDMI connector to get HD audio.
Click to expand...

I have an Onkyo right now as well.You still don't get true 7.1 digitally.It just send the sounds reserved for the rears to the sides as well. So you really end up with 4 rear speakers.
And I do have a new receiver coming now with HDMI 1.3 connections and Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD. Cost me $359. Though you don't need a receiver that decodes these new HD audio formats or HDMI 1.3 as most of the HD audio is uncompressed on BD anyways so it doesn't matter.
As explained above, SPIDF, Coax, optical, whatever you want to call it, doesn't have the bandwidth to carry 7.1. Never will.
 
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