We're Paying For Broken Games, And It's Unacceptable

Quix said:
This is just my experience working with Indian outsourced programmers, feel free to add yours if you've got any first-hand experience yourself.
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I agree. Especially since the idiots you end up working with can barely speak English. Makes teleconferencing on a critical issue, when you're pressed for time, oh so enjoyable. :rolleyes:
 
Parja said:
Worst idea ever.
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Maybe, but it would certainly be effective!!

Remember back in the early days of gaming, when you had cartridges and NO PATCHES!! You launched a game breaking bug with an Atari 2600 game, you're dead in the water and your product and reputation dies then an there. Recall the ET Landfill anyone? ;)

These days with the availability of broadband, with the ability to shovel out the door now and patch later, have made development company management lazy, greedy with a tendency to set tight deadlines to rake in the day 1 box sales.
 
bigdaveberg said:
So many people going off about pirates...
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Shitty, bug infested AAA games is WHY there is so much piracy. Why spend money on what accounts to a slim chance gamble on a good game, when you can download an ISO and install a ripped game at ZERO risk. Only costing you the time it took to download the ISO image, and to make sure what you got is virus/Trojan free.

bigdaveberg said:
Or another case, BF4 when it was free for a bit. Downloaded it to try it, hated it so I deleted it. Would have been PISSED if I spent all that money on it and it be the same case.
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There needs to be a return to the Shareware days, when you could demo a game before you paid for it. This dropping $60 in the promise of a good game, pumped up by the hype train is just BUILL$HIT!
 
It's also lazy to buy buggy games and then complain about it. Exercise a bit of patience. It'll reduce your stress, increase immersion, and help the industry out as a whole as well. Stop playing the victim. We are not powerless.
 
webdev511 said:
I almost NEVER buy games on launch day or even launch month/quarter. I'll let someone else pay the $60 premium price and do all the beta testing before I think about jumping in at $5 or less.
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FTFY - That is what i do...
 
Quartz-1 said:
If it doesn't work, you get a refund. Don't other countries have similar laws?
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Not in USA. Typically you cannot get a refund for software purchases.

How you define "broken" is also important. Most people here seem to think if the game hiccups once in a while it is broken and the developers deserve to pay them child support.
 
Parja said:
Is a day one patch really that big of a deal? Would you guys rather not have it and be stuck with the game as-launched?

It would be great if games worked perfectly out of the box, but that's just not going to happen. You're either going to have to get over it or wait a couple weeks before buying the game. Speak with your wallet. It's literally the only thing that makes a difference.

I remember buying plenty of PC games in the early '90s that had terrible, game-breaking bugs. And there were no patches. You either found a workaround or you were fucked. At least these days we have patches.

Worst idea ever.
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I bought plenty of games in the 90s that weren't broken, maybe yours were more genre specific.

The point is as someone pointed out, that the goalpost has moved. If you have a day one patch, that says loud and clear you rushed your product to release and it wasn't ready to be shipped. You are literally buying a late beta. Otherwise, there wouldn't be a patch ALREADY as the game would be as finished as the developers could reasonably expect it to be and patches would be only for things that got missed during testing. It's a shift of power moving away from the players and towards the bean counters. It's not a good thing at all.
 
EODetroit said:
Sometimes it is correct to blame the "victim". Like in this case.
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... and in this instance I have to agree. Case in point...

69c05d3aef6aa58977e6061e714dc90c.jpg
 
Ripperjack said:
... and in this instance I have to agree. Case in point...

<snip image>
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Pretty much proved by Cards Against Humanity selling boxes of bullshit for $6 and people buying them out in record time hoping there might be something hidden in it.

As long as idiots are willing to part with their money, developers will keep fucking them over again and again.

Its funny though how so many people will complain, yet say "I guess its got to be that way" and open their wallets to get fucked yet again with every, single, new release.
 
Ripperjack said:
Shitty, bug infested AAA games is WHY there is so much piracy. Why spend money on what accounts to a slim chance gamble on a good game, when you can download an ISO and install a ripped game at ZERO risk. Only costing you the time it took to download the ISO image, and to make sure what you got is virus/Trojan free.


There needs to be a return to the Shareware days, when you could demo a game before you paid for it. This dropping $60 in the promise of a good game, pumped up by the hype train is just BUILL$HIT!
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People always look to justify their actions, that doesn't mean it's true.

First off, saying a game is to shitty to buy so we pirate it is moronic at best, if it's so shitty than why bother with it, even if you can pirate it for free?

Also, if it's the buggy games then why do survey after survey show that piracy of a a bug ridden title jumups drastically once the bugs are fixed?

An alternative to dropping $60 on the promise of a good game is to wait until it comes out and is reviewed by some inpartial reviewers that you trust, but of course this requires people to be reasonable and expects them to be responsible for their own choices.
 
Ripperjack said:
There needs to be a return to the Shareware days, when you could demo a game before you paid for it. This dropping $60 in the promise of a good game, pumped up by the hype train is just BUILL$HIT!
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Dead-on. Demos could make all this go away.
 
DarkStar_WNY said:
First off, saying a game is to shitty to buy so we pirate it is moronic at best, if it's so shitty than why bother with it, even if you can pirate it for free?
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Agreed 100%. As someone who absolutely thinks there are some legitimate cases for piracy (mostly for abandoned games), this reason I find completely idiotic. Pirating as a form of "protest" is just retarded, the end. If you object to a game for whatever reason, don't buy it. Pirating it sends the message that they made a good game, but they need to tighten the noose some more.
 
wabbitseason said:
Dead-on. Demos could make all this go away.
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Except that shitty demo's would hurt sales and keep them from taking our money and fucking us over....... the main reason demo's rarely show up anymore I'd wager despite claims that they take up valuable resource time from the main game. I'd call bullshit on that though.
 
DarkStar_WNY said:
People always look to justify their actions, that doesn't mean it's true.

First off, saying a game is to shitty to buy so we pirate it is moronic at best, if it's so shitty than why bother with it, even if you can pirate it for free?
.
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http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0052077/

People play shitty games just to find out whether it is as bad as people say, or to have more ammo to talk shit about it


I really don't understand how people are so closely sided to these poor, unfortunate, billion dollar companies.
 
In the last 6 years I have only prepurchased 3 games: Duke Nukem Forever (lol), Skyrim, and Fallout 3.
EVERY other game purchase has been several months after the release, most have been purchased via a Steam sale.

I also refuse to buy DLCs, I find it appalling that game vendors can offer DLCs on launch day, for the love of god give us the WHOLE goddamn game.
 
bigdaveberg said:
So many people going off about pirates..
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No kidding...no one gives a fuck about your anti-piracy white-knighting, guys. It really doesn't have any bearing on this discussion anyway...publishers are gonna blame pirates regardless, and them making a shitty, buggy game has absolutely nothing to do with piracy. In fact, people who pirate often end up having a superior experience because they can, you know, actually play the games when some mandatory patch fucks it up and makes it unplayable for legit buyers.
 
lilbabycat said:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0052077/

People play shitty games just to find out whether it is as bad as people say, or to have more ammo to talk shit about it


I really don't understand how people are so closely sided to these poor, unfortunate, billion dollar companies.
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Sorry but calling people on their bullshit is different than walking lockstep with devs.

As for the whole they do it to see "...if it's as bad as everyone says..." garbage, that's simply people trying to justuify their actions. As for your link, I'm willingly watched many movies I knew to be bad, because even a bad movie can be entertaining. But I don't download and play games to see how often I can crash to the desktop in 30 minutees, give me a break.

If you want to pirate games, that's fine, just don't expect the rest of us to believe your justifications.
 
DarkStar_WNY said:
Sorry but calling people on their bullshit is different than walking lockstep with devs.

As for the whole they do it to see "...if it's as bad as everyone says..." garbage, that's simply people trying to justuify their actions. As for your link, I'm willingly watched many movies I knew to be bad, because even a bad movie can be entertaining. But I don't download and play games to see how often I can crash to the desktop in 30 minutees, give me a break.

If you want to pirate games, that's fine, just don't expect the rest of us to believe your justifications.
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Yeah I mean this argument really doesn't really hold much weight now seeing as how you can get unlimited previews of a game on Youtube along with opinions that haven't been bought. Yes, that's not the same thing as playing, but you can get a real idea of what you're getting. It's not like the old days where all you had was a couple screenshots and a description of the game written by the publisher.
 
MavericK96 said:
No kidding...no one gives a fuck about your anti-piracy white-knighting, guys. It really doesn't have any bearing on this discussion anyway...publishers are gonna blame pirates regardless, and them making a shitty, buggy game has absolutely nothing to do with piracy. In fact, people who pirate often end up having a superior experience because they can, you know, actually play the games when some mandatory patch fucks it up and makes it unplayable for legit buyers.
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Then don't be stupid enough to bring it up...it was started because someone posted I pirated becaues "Fuck You"whatever reason, that's why.
 
I get it that video games are a big deal for the companies that make them because of the money they spend and the income it generates, but for the average person it seems like it's a lot of fussing and being worried about something you do for fun. Why worry about it? It's just a game.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
I get it that video games are a big deal for the companies that make them because of the money they spend and the income it generates, but for the average person it seems like it's a lot of fussing and being worried about something you do for fun. Why worry about it? It's just a game.
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Because it's a depressing trend seeing rights eroded pretty much everywhere. Games are a form of escapism from the real world, and it's invading that. So even when you don't want to think about issues like this, the industry is making you.
 
DarkStar_WNY said:
As for your link, I'm willingly watched many movies I knew to be bad, because even a bad movie can be entertaining.

If you want to pirate games, that's fine, just don't expect the rest of us to believe your justifications.
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And I'm going to go out on a limb and say that you didn't willingly pay full price / go to the theater for that movie. Because you value it less than a "good" movie. I value bad games within a range of $0.00-$5.00. Many ones that I end up liking I buy on Steam, months later.

But no, that couldn't possibly be a true statement or valid justification at all. I'm a horrible thief of digital goods and I'm hurting the industry.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Why worry about it? It's just a game.
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People are passionate about stuff. Were car enthusiasts not pissed off at the bitch-mode muscle cars in the 70's? If there was an internet in '72, you bet your ass there would be a shit ton of guys mad at that 275hp Mustang de-tune.

We love gaming, we support gaming, and we want it to grow. Right now we're watching "gaming" eat its 5th double whopper while some kid steals its lunchbox.
 
DarkStar_WNY said:
People always look to justify their actions, that doesn't mean it's true.

First off, saying a game is to shitty to buy so we pirate it is moronic at best, if it's so shitty than why bother with it, even if you can pirate it for free?

Also, if it's the buggy games then why do survey after survey show that piracy of a a bug ridden title jumups drastically once the bugs are fixed?

An alternative to dropping $60 on the promise of a good game is to wait until it comes out and is reviewed by some inpartial reviewers that you trust, but of course this requires people to be reasonable and expects them to be responsible for their own choices.
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You completely missed the point. Noone says people should pirate shitty games. The fact is we don't know if a game is good or bad, when we buy it, since demos are no longer released and reviewers are silenced, or paid off. But if we're exited for a game we wish to have it ASAP, and not wait around until the less prominent reviewers and relaible user reviews start popping up.

So if I'm faced with a game that might be good, but I'm just not sure I'll download and try it. If I trust the developer then I buy it right away, but I have burnt myself like that before. Most notably with Watchdogs, which turned out to be an absolute turd.

This year I pirated Alien: Isolation, 24 hours later I was a legitimate owner of the game. Then I pirated FarCry4, 24 hours later I deleted it and forgot it even existed, it was so disappointing.
 
lilbabycat said:
People are passionate about stuff. Were car enthusiasts not pissed off at the bitch-mode muscle cars in the 70's? If there was an internet in '72, you bet your ass there would be a shit ton of guys mad at that 275hp Mustang de-tune.

We love gaming, we support gaming, and we want it to grow. Right now we're watching "gaming" eat its 5th double whopper while some kid steals its lunchbox.
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Yeah, the car thing is a little weird too. *shrug* I just wondered why people were freaking out when they could just think a little bit, buy a game later, play something else, do anything else, or just put it into perspective, but I guess for some people, none of those things are like within reach and that prolly leaves just getting angry.
 
The very last game I pre-ordered was CoD:Black Ops.

That game ran like refried crap on my OC'd SLi'd i7 rig. I couldn't even get over 15 fps. I was so disgusted with Activision, and the CoD franchise I vowed to never buy another CoD title any where close to the release date. I still haven't.

As far as broken games go. I believe the games are shipped in their late beta form to please the devs publishers (EA, Activision, and the like). BF4 was/is a great example of this. Personally, I didn't have as severe problems with the title as some did. But, it was pretty much busted as we installed it on our rigs. I think there might even had been talk of a class action law suite.

I've been doing this long enough to remember the days of demo's and released beta's to the gaming public. Then as the game was eventually released. It needed only small patches (by comparison).

I agree totally with those who are holding off on buying newly released games. I won't do it anymore. I even waited on the Borderlands: Pre-sequel. Pretty much a proven platform. It was pretty stable when I finally purchased it.

The gaming industry has done this to themselves.

I wish we could go back to the days of John Carmack's "it's done when it's done" game development. I think even his steady hand was forced with Rage.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Yeah, the car thing is a little weird too. *shrug* I just wondered why people were freaking out when they could just think a little bit, buy a game later, play something else, do anything else, or just put it into perspective, but I guess for some people, none of those things are like within reach and that prolly leaves just getting angry.
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I have to applaud you for be consistent in attempting to stir up shit-talking, feigning misunderstanding of the situation, and framing the situation in a way that makes up seem like we're crazy for caring about something we enjoy.
 
If you care then please stop buying broken games.
 
lilbabycat said:
I have to applaud you for be consistent in attempting to stir up shit-talking, feigning misunderstanding of the situation, and framing the situation in a way that makes up seem like we're crazy for caring about something we enjoy.
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Wow you took a pretty huge leap from "weird" to get to thinking you're being accused of being insane. It's different and super-emotional, but I don't think you're gonna get a diagnosis or some head-shrinking pills out of it unless you start going mouth-foamy over something.
 
Mostly offtopic rant inc, ignore if you're interested in the actual thread topic:

CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Wow you took a pretty huge leap from "weird" to get to thinking you're being accused of being insane. It's different and super-emotional, but I don't think you're gonna get a diagnosis or some head-shrinking pills out of it unless you start going mouth-foamy over something.
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Again, the language you use just tries so hard to tug at people's strings, but most of us see through it. You need to either get better at it, or just stop.

There is nothing weird or strange about being passionate about something, nor do you "wonder" why people are making a big deal about it. You know absolutely why, but are saying what you say to stir up shit. Its no different than those here who pose flawed analogies or scenarios to divert attention from the conversation (which this post = you succeeded) or go all mental-gymnastics logic on us.. The thing that a lot of us wonder is, why? You're not good enough to be Andy Kaufman, and if you're just trying to be devil's advocate (which I'm always doing, tbh) you could do a better job at being clear about it.

TLDR: You know exactly why we react the way we do and you're feigning ignorance to stir up shit for no reason other than personal entertainment....
 
lilbabycat said:
Made it smaller to be scrolled past easier for those still discussing the thread topic. This is the Amazon Echo teardown thread, right? ;)
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If he truly didn't care he wouldn't even post in this thread. Thread crapping just to say what's important to some isn't at all important to him. Yeah we get it.
 
pcjunkie said:
If he truly didn't care he wouldn't even post in this thread. Thread crapping just to say what's important to some isn't at all important to him. Yeah we get it.
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Helping to put something into a little perspective is good sometimes when people get emotionally invested in something and stop looking or thinking outside their box. When getting really excited and angry about a game some people might find it kinda useful to remember they can wait for a while after a game is released or buy a different game, for example. I play lots of different games and I can understand why someone might be upset. The Sims 3 is something I really have fun with, but it wasn't a good game when it came out so I waited around for patches and some expansion stuff instead of being enraged. I also didn't get upset at other people for suggesting a couple of good books to read in the meantime. That would have been silly and overly emotional.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Helping to put something into a little perspective is good sometimes when people get emotionally invested in something and stop looking or thinking outside their box. When getting really excited and angry about a game some people might find it kinda useful to remember they can wait for a while after a game is released or buy a different game, for example. I play lots of different games and I can understand why someone might be upset. The Sims 3 is something I really have fun with, but it wasn't a good game when it came out so I waited around for patches and some expansion stuff instead of being enraged. I also didn't get upset at other people for suggesting a couple of good books to read in the meantime. That would have been silly and overly emotional.
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Or you can just let some people vent who feel strongly about a certain subject while still knowing full well what the perspective is with "real life" things. No need to point that out as most of us are well aware of those facts. Silly and over emotional about a specific topic is purely subjective to each person. You seem to be getting a little emotional over people getting emotional about something you think is silly...hence the multiple posts in this thread.
 
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