Unacceptable HD packaging - opinions needed

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lawrence131

Gawd
Joined
Feb 23, 2005
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"the packageing should have been more then serfice for a single harddrive," a quote from a recent seller I purchased this Raptor from. "You should take it up with them." (USPS)

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I'm keeping his name anonymous since I'm awaiting resolution but wanted your opinions on whether or not this is acceptable packaging and whether USPS is responsible for the damage. I obviously think it is negligent packaging so it is not ethical to claim it through the USPS. I have asked for either a full refund or small fee ($15) refunded to cover the hassle and cost should I decide to RMA the drive, but I'm not sure it's ethical to do that either as the drive was damaged due to poor seller packaging. The damage is not the fault of the US government or the manufacturer IMO.

As you can see the box is barely bigger than the drive (a bit over 1.5" thick) and you can't even fit a foam peanut between the drive and the cardboard. It was flimsily wrapped with a thin layer of tiny bubble wrap, not even the standard drive bubble wrap.

As I am not reporting a troll, this is more of a technical question so I posted here instead of TTT assuming he will take some small responsibility for the negligence.
 
What would the government ever have to do with this problem? The USPS is (unlike popular belief) NOT a government agency - it's a for-profit corporation run (at least in part) with taxpayer dollars (inefficiently I might add thus popularity of e-mail and 3rd party shippers).

Drives aren't supposed to be packed with form "peanuts" under any circumstances. Using a "thin" layer of bubble wrap, to me is suspect - but from reading WD's packing recommendations using it in and of itself (?) is acceptable. However, looking @ the pic, I doubt adequate protection was given the drive, and it's the fault of the seller, not the shipper (unless USPS does packaging these days (?). The pciture seems a bit vague in details though - better detail of the overall packaging maybe? Where's the bubble wrap? Am I right is saying that the drive is on top of the anti-static bag? (at least it was put in one then ;)

Anywooo, I didn't quite get it - is the drive DOA, or somehow defective?

WD terms: http://support.wdc.com/warranty/rmapacking.asp?custtype=end

[note the bold part in particular]
Place the drive in the original ESD (electro-static discharge) protective bag prior to shipment. If the ESD bag is not available, please use an equivalent anti-static bag. Use an outer carton that is made of corrugated paper. Do not use chipboard as it is not strong enough to withstand the rigors of transit. Please make sure the corrugated carton is free from defects and is structurally sound.

The disk drive is a sensitive precision instrument. To protect the drive from shock, you will need to use a cushioning material. Foam may also be used as long as the drive cannot move when box is jolted and foam is covering all sides of the drive. To ensure the drive does not move inside the corrugated carton, make sure that you have secured the drive snugly with the same amount of cushioning on all sides due to the fact the carton could be dropped on any side during shipping.

When shipping more than one drive in a single carton, ensure that the drives do not touch and they are both cushioned individually. If utilizing foam, a minimum of 2" in all directions should be used. DO NOT USE peanuts or flowables as they will not support the drive in all directions during shipping. Seal the corrugated carton firmly using adhesive backed tape. Make sure all carton edges are sealed also to prevent any tearing. Please utilize Western Digital original packaging when available.
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This drive was NOT purchased NEW from a retailer, right ([H] FS/T sale?)? If I'm right assuming it's a WD drive (although I imagine all the other majors will have similar policies) - you're screwed and can't do an RMA if the drive is bad. They require a purchase receipt now to have a valid RMA. Your only recourse in this situation if the drive is bad is either through the seller (request refund polite but firm, 2nd the shipper -- but USPS might DENY your claim if they saw/heard how it was shipped to you. If this happens your only recourse is take action against the retailer (assuming they try denying a refund), depending on how you paid, reverse the charge with your CC company (if possible), or a threat of a lawsuit (or something else?).

With the new extended warranty policy effective July 18, 2005, End Users are required to include a copy of the original purchase receipt/invoice inside the return box to receive replacement product under warranty.
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Yes the drive arrived DOA as expected (instant LOUD clicking noises, unable to even spin up) with basically no impact support, and would have been dead no matter which company shipped it IMO with a few millimeters of padding on each side (good info about USPS btw, I always thought it was fully government run). The box in the picture is the box it came in. I took the picture with the HD on top of the box to show how small the box is compared to the drive. It was shipped in an antistatic bag as shown, which is the only positive thing I can think of about the packaging job.

If utilizing foam, a minimum of 2" in all directions should be used.

From the WD packaging instructions, assuming the 2" applies to other types of cushioning material, the entire box is barely 1.5" thick so this is in direct violation already as there can be no more than a fraction of an inch on the top and bottom of padding.

Thanks for the input, I will stick with my initial instinct and request a refund again since I don't feel USPS should be responsible for this negligence and sloppiness. If there's any resistance I'll take it out of this forum as it will no longer be a technical issue. Just wanted confirmation that I wasn't just being paranoid about the tiny box that can barely even fit the drive.
 
You need better pictures. From the best I can tell, this drive is laid on top of a box. That doesn't show exactly how it was packaged. Provided that the bubblewrap provided cushioning on all sides I don't see what the issue is, but I can't exactly see the packaging.
 
I'd like to see better pictures, but yes, this is probably seller's fault. Get money back and/or leave negative Heat (or whatever rating system).
 
USPS does not package your shipment. You package your shipment for USPS.

This is seller's fault, plain and simple. And the drive is dead and out of warranty - SMART shock is guaranteed tripped.
 
all I can say, and I dont sell drives or ship them, in fact I drive in my truck from western NC to Raleigh ( 6 hours one way) to deliver computers because i will not ship them. But I have bought a ton of HDs from several suppliers and never had a problem so have seen several variations and quality of HD shipping methods.

That is definatley sub standard, the worst I ever got was OEM drives wrapped in at least an inch and a half of bubble wrap, 3 layers of the big bubbles completely around the drive secured with tape and tossed in a box of peanuts with a lot of room for the peanuts, I had to dig for them. Best was foam complete surround, so nice I saved several for personal storage of dirves, that was fitted into a very rigid formed paper product almost like cardbord but much much stiffer that acted as a carrier and packed in a large box of peanuts.

I would never consider shipping a drive in that box, there is just not enough room around the drive for enough material to absorb shock, and even with more bubble wrap, packing it tightly into the box would only transmit the shock. Just not enough room for absorbsion,
and no insurance aparently :eek:
 
You do not trust someone who can't spell 'suffice,' or at least puts an R in it. :p

Even OEM drives are wrapped in big-bubble bubble wrap. I take it the drive was just put into that box? That's the seller's fault. Get a refund or get aggressive.
 
general said:
You need better pictures. From the best I can tell, this drive is laid on top of a box. That doesn't show exactly how it was packaged. Provided that the bubblewrap provided cushioning on all sides I don't see what the issue is, but I can't exactly see the packaging.
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I think the size of the box can be appreciated pretty easily even if the pic isn't optimal. It is physically impossible to fit enough cushion considering the box is barely 1.5" thick most of which is taken up by the drive itself. A fraction of an inch above and below the drive is not sufficient packaging to me, but then again that's why I made this post, to get other opinions.

Here is a couple more pics with a CD for standard size comparison. Unfortunately I threw away the bubble wrap but you can tell by the size of the box, only the very tiny bubble wrap would even fit in here around the drive. It's the tiny bubble wrap you sometimes see a stick of RAM wrapped in, but never a drive.

I'm trying to be a nice guy to see if WD would accept it back, but considering it is making a very loud clicking noise and refuses to spin up, perhaps they can tell it has been physically damaged and void the warranty?

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You can tell from the second pic that you can stack 3 of these boxes on top of each other to reach the height of a CD when a single HD box should already be higher than a CD IMO. The serial passed the WD warranty check so I may give it a try to help out a fellow [H] member who hopefully was just slacking on this one occasion as he seems to have fine refs otherwise.
 
lawrence131 said:
The serial passed the WD warranty check so I may give it a try to help out a fellow [H] member who hopefully was just slacking on this one occasion as he seems to have fine refs otherwise.
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You're doing everyone else a disservice if you don't at least mention this to him or on Heatware. Like Newegg, he may do okay with other things but an unacceptably bad job with hard drives.
 
unhappy_mage said:
You're doing everyone else a disservice if you don't at least mention this to him or on Heatware. Like Newegg, he may do okay with other things but an unacceptably bad job with hard drives.
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You're right on this. I just sent him a final notice with only two options - full refund or take full responsibility if WD states the warranty is void from physical damage. If WD is able to repair the drive and make it serviceable again then no one was really harmed by the transaction. I also asked nicely that he just be an upright guy and stop insisting that the packaging was fine. If he would at least acknowledge that he made a mistake I'll try to be accommodating and give him chances to make amends prior to any troll reporting or negative feedback. If he tells me for the third time that he did nothing wrong and to take it up with the USPS (which I think is insurance fraud in an indirect way) and refuses to work out any other solution, I'll do the best thing for other forum members to at least do the proper feedback.

Thanks for the responses.
 
If its a WD drive, you can get a cross shipment RMA, its incredibly expedient, shipping the drive back to them will cost about 6 bucks (you buy a UPS lablel from WD and print it) They do not ask for an invoice, just so long as your in the 5 year warranty (starts from manufacturing date, unless you have documentation to prove when you bought it NEW from retail) and the serial number is valid. Once you submit the advanced RMA claim, they will air mail you the replacement, and you ship your drive back in the box that it comes in. Follow there packing instructions to the letter, and remove the old shipping labels.
 
If it was an ebay thing, get on there and fire up whatever you can. If it was on these forums, make sure to post the guy as a troll. Shipper is obviously a degenerate fuckup sending a raptor in a fucking pri mail box.
 
devman said:
If its a WD drive, you can get a cross shipment RMA, its incredibly expedient, shipping the drive back to them will cost about 6 bucks (you buy a UPS lablel from WD and print it) They do not ask for an invoice, just so long as your in the 5 year warranty (starts from manufacturing date, unless you have documentation to prove when you bought it NEW from retail) and the serial number is valid. Once you submit the advanced RMA claim, they will air mail you the replacement, and you ship your drive back in the box that it comes in. Follow there packing instructions to the letter, and remove the old shipping labels.
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And then they rape you on the new drive when they get this one back and find that it's been subjected to that packaging.
Don't kid yourself; that drive has it's shock alarm tripped. The box was obviously dropped from >=3'; that's all it takes to trip the shock alarm. It's set to 60G-65G non-op, and cannot be changed. As a result, the warranty is null and void - physical abuse.
 
AreEss said:
And then they rape you on the new drive when they get this one back and find that it's been subjected to that packaging.
Don't kid yourself; that drive has it's shock alarm tripped. The box was obviously dropped from >=3'; that's all it takes to trip the shock alarm. It's set to 60G-65G non-op, and cannot be changed. As a result, the warranty is null and void - physical abuse.
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assumption is that it worked when it was shipped. it could have been in water, then dried for a week. Unlikely but, why assume it worked? If the packaging is so poor, then I wonder even if the drive worked to begin with.

On another note, Newegg shipments with OEM drives is pretty scary too.
 
Liver said:
assumption is that it worked when it was shipped. it could have been in water, then dried for a week. Unlikely but, why assume it worked? If the packaging is so poor, then I wonder even if the drive worked to begin with.
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Also a very good point, but I'm giving the seller a bit of the benefit of the doubt. Really, there's no reason why the drive wouldn't have worked previously to it's abuse in shipping. Plus, it's a moot point - it ain't working now, no way, no how.

Liver said:
On another note, Newegg shipments with OEM drives is pretty scary too.
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I refuse to buy hard drives from Newegg. I will go anywhere else. They still refuse to package them properly. I'm getting ready to give them another chance though - so, yeah, customer service managers are going to be busy if they still think bubblewrap is acceptable.
 
I just bought a used Raptor on Ebay and I verified the warranty before buying, this is the only way I'll buy a used hard drive. It still has 4 years on it, and I figured it was 50/50 that I'd need to do an RMA - and I figured this into my bidding.

So it arrives and the packaging was the original Raptor retail box with an address label attached. Inside was the drive with the formed plastic stuck on each end of the drive per original packaging but no anti-static bag. :eek:

I fired it up and it works. Downloaded WD's tools and ran all their scans on it, no errors. As a bonus the guy that sold it didn't wipe any info. I looked in the My Documents folder and there were some interesting documents with TONS of personal info - debts, credit card numbers/website logins/passwords, taxes, a bunch of music pay site logins/pw, resumes, family photos, and even all his router info in a nice document. :eek: :eek: After a couple minutes of being shocked that this info was all there I did zero the drive. I decided not to contact him about this to chide him since he'd only feel like an ass and always wonder if I did actually erase it.

Anyway, it sucks to get a dead drive. I'd try to get the seller to refund all your costs to do an RMA to WD. I think the packaging on your drive was inadequate and leave feedback something like "Insufficent packaging, hard drive arrived DOA" - neutral if the seller does everything to make up for this, or negative if they want to do it the hard way.
 
USPS requires at least a full inch of spacing from all sides of the product to the packaging box to honor insurance.
 
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