U.S. Based Companies Sued For Heat Pipe CPU Coolers

NeghVar

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I'd personally vote for much harsher penalties for frivolous lawsuits, but damn that "cruel and unusual punishment" clause!

Unfortunately, that does not seem to apply to civil litigation. Only criminal. look at the RIAA and MPAA $150,000 for one copyright violation!!!!! They originally sued Napster demanding over a trillion dollars.
 

computer

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"The jury awarded Liebeck $200,000 in compensatory damages. This amount
was reduced to $160,000 because the jury found Liebeck 20 percent at
fault in the spill. The jury also awarded Liebeck $2.7 million in
punitive damages"

"
The amount of $2.7 million was
arrived at based on evidence the jury heard that McDonald’s
daily coffee revenues amounted to approximately $1.34
million.59 These exemplary damages represented about two
days worth of McDonald’s coffee revenues.60 However, a
fact that rarely ever makes headlines (in this case, or in any
allegedly “fraudulent” lawsuit) is that the punitive damages
were reduced by the trial court to $480,000 (three times the
compensatory damages) for a total award of $640,000.61
.......
Judge Scott ordered the parties to engage in a postverdict
settlement conference which resulted in a settlement
of the case for an undisclosed amount (less than $600,000)
which remains confidential.
"

source: (pdf) http://www.jtexconsumerlaw.com/V11N1/Coffee.pdf
 

Angry

Limp Gawd
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Here comes the coffee thing again. McDonald's was serving the coffee hot enough to give people 3rd degree burns, it was not consumable and flat out dangerous. The lady had 3rd degree burns over 6% of her body and had to stay in hospital for days to undergo skin grafting. She deserved every penny. If you're going to pick a stupid court case pick one you actually know something about.



Still a retarded case... just like this one...
When it comes to selling a major product/service, of any sort, 50-60% of your average customer is going to be retarded. Seriously need a virus that wipes out the lazyness in society. Then shit would get done, and not done for them by everyone else..
 

HalifaxPete

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Why is American Technology Incorporated filing a patent infringement when Delta Engineers of Huntington Beach, CA owns the patent. http://www.braindex.com/mousepad-for-us-patent-6411512-owned-by-delta-engineers-huntington-beach-ca-086412746
Who the hell would buy mousepads and coffee mugs with this on it?

If an employee invents a product or process and the company is listed as the Assignee, doesn't the company own the patent?

Attention Affected Retailers: In court, kick the living hell out of this company and its lawyers, big time!
 

BiGx5MurF

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This is disgusting, really just a group looking to make a quick buck through legal extortion. Although, local governments tend to use the same tactics to extort property owners, and meet their exponentially growing budgets.

I hope the retailers band together and fight this. Then I hope they counter-sue, and win.
 

Rob94hawk

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Anyone can make a drawing on paper. Show me a working demonstration model to make your "patent" legit.
 

BallerX

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We need Death penalty for patent trolls.

Not sure why but here in EU we have much much less of these patent lawsuits. Maybe its because our courts dont give people millions for their stupidity (hot cofee etc.).


You know, I hear all the time too that the lady deserved to win that judgment against Mc Donalds because the coffee was like 155F. I honestly don't give a damn if they handed her molten lava! They didn't dump the shit in her lap!

I have seen crazier things but this seems like a prior art situation. I wouldn't be surprised if this goes no where. Frozen CPU guys are probably a bit worried but, to me, it sounds like when Monster cable tried to sue Bluejeans. They will probably get a similar response too.
 

ir0nw0lf

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Sounds like they are purposely targeting the smaller companies that might not be able to afford to defend themselves, as a first step to something bigger. If they can a lawsuit against the smaller companies, they can use that as ammo to go after the larger companies. Just a educated guess, IANAL. (no, that wasn't iAnal, as this isn't a Apple crack)
 

nilepez

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Still a retarded case... just like this one...
When it comes to selling a major product/service, of any sort, 50-60% of your average customer is going to be retarded. Seriously need a virus that wipes out the lazyness in society. Then shit would get done, and not done for them by everyone else..

Care to explain how she was lazy and retarded?
 

SnowBeast

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Seems first off you have to get a cease and desist order from a judge on the patent to the manufactures because of said patent. Then its the manufactures responsiblility to send out a copy of the order to all retailers or etailers as it is to stop selling said products with quoted patent. If the retailers fail at following the manufactures order after a cease and desist has been presented, then they can be held responsible. Basically, this case has no clout and was drawn up by a 1st year law student with no clue how to go about a patent case.
:mad:
 

Zoomer

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Messages
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You know, I hear all the time too that the lady deserved to win that judgment against Mc Donalds because the coffee was like 155F. I honestly don't give a damn if they handed her molten lava! They didn't dump the shit in her lap!

I have seen crazier things but this seems like a prior art situation. I wouldn't be surprised if this goes no where. Frozen CPU guys are probably a bit worried but, to me, it sounds like when Monster cable tried to sue Bluejeans. They will probably get a similar response too.

155 F is too cold. It should be more like 200 F. Does that explain why McD's coffee taste like horse ****?
 

Elios

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That's BS. One of the requirements for a patent to be able to be filed is that it has to be novel. And in 2002, Shuttle SFF PCs were already using heatpipes for their CPU coolers!

Someone beat American technologies to it in 1944. US Patent 2,350,348

some one mail this to FrozenCPU!:cool:
 

DeFex

[H]ard|DCer of the Month - June 2011
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We need Death penalty for patent trolls.

Not sure why but here in EU we have much much less of these patent lawsuits. Maybe its because our courts dont give people millions for their stupidity (hot cofee etc.).


Thats because the parasitic lawyer plague has not spread over there yet. we are totally infested over here in North America, some of them become politicians, who make laws which are mainly designed to make more jobs and money for lawyers. they are worse than the magog!
 

Libast

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Its a Nevada Corporation, which is a corporate haven state much like Delaware.

One of the 2 inventors appears to be the sole officer of "ATI" based in Carson City. This person is the President, Secretary, Treasurer, Director of the company.

For what its worth, their Nevada business ID is NV20001252920 and you can grab the address. I don't think Kyle & Crew want personal info posted, but this is all public domain and I am sure that the defendant's attorneys already have this info, but you never know.
 

lowteckh

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This is not the least bit surprising. I'm about to get sued by my neighbor for not waving to him in the morning, and I'm about to sue the that damn bird for waking me up in the morning.
 

EvilWays

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You do realize there IS liquid in heatpipes on the CPU coolers, right?

Its a liquid with a real low boiling point. Those pipes don't work off of magic.

To be more sepcific, it's either refrigerant (e.g., R-22) or distilled water (since the heatpipe is under a vacuum, this will work since the boiling point is lowered). In the case of PC heatpipe coolers, it'd most likely be distilled water since refrigerant would be expensive to use.

And I believe that the 1944 patent linked before would trump American Technologies "patent". While the patent couldn't foresee computers as they are now, it still covers the basic premise of the workings of a PC heatpipe heatsink.
 

Brantoc

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From the outside it looks legit, but the more you dig on this, the more it looks like a repeat of RAMBUS patent crap that got tossed after lawyers made millions.

Only one who wins in this is lawyers.
 

Hallis

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What a completely DICKLESS way to try to make some money. That's like shaking down a 12 year old kid for his lunch money instead of robbing a bank because you know the bank can and will defend itself.

I may have missed it but is there somewhere we can make a contribution to towards FrozenCPU's defense?
 

stiltner

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I've known and worked with Mark for years. He's a wonderful guy. A shrewd and dedicated businessman. I find it laughable that the sellers of the products are being sued. This is the equivalent of suing a gun owner because the manufacturer makes bullets.

Our legal system is a joke, sadly enough, and the fact that this person (its not a company apparently its 2 guys sitting around with dicks in hand looking for some free money) is allowed to bottle up our legal system not suing people that can fight, but abusing small businesses in order to work up a cash fund to sue someone else is absolutely pathetic. I hope they rot in hell, but not just any hell, a hell that is kept warm with heatpipes, so that their soul-less bodies can stay at a constant temperature in relation to the ambient temperatures of hell.

I would suggest a public burning in the center of town, but this isn't the 1800's, and they aren't witches, so sadly my request will fall on deaf ears.

Regardless, I wish all the defenders in this case the utmost success and good will. These are all companies that I have seen help move this business forward for end builders and enthusiasts alike. Its disgusting that this nameless, faceless pile of trash company can be allowed to spit on hard working individuals for their next paycheck.

tl;dr version: Fuck this company thats suing, and do it sideways with a jagged, rusty rake.
 

puttersonsale

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You'd think that they would issue a cease and desist on selling per se coolers. However, I do agree they are shaking down the little guys, I mean what the hell is a "hall pass" this isn't high school or grade school for that matter. Looks like the big dogs don't want the competition. Sounds like some peeps are trying to monopolize the industry. Regardless if or if not the patent is infringed it definitely seems like something is a bit off....leery here. People who have more money than brains who wanna push others out of the game, I mean isn't this the USA? I thought competition was something that was supposed to be a part of our country? Well I hope FrozenCPU persevere and win this one and i wonder if there is a way they can get their lawyers fees out of this. Probably not. Sheesh!
 

Climber

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Hope FrozenCPU and the others get some support and defeat this. I also hope that this American Technologies group gets counter sued and patent trolling gets some reform soon. These cases are getting stupid.
 

Psi*

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So don't shoot me!!:eek: Personally I think there might be a case. I did not bother drilling into references cited to see what else may have been referenced. But the Detailed Description of the Invention section does a very good job of describing how heat pipes work, the typical construction of heat sinks with heat pipes, and even list several fluids that could be used.

This is a US patent. Are there any US manufacturers of this design? It takes both ... Noctua for instance is in Australia (or someplace down under) so they are safe as a manufacturer. But if they do not have a licensing agreement then the distributors in the US may be liable!? Never heard of distributors being held for infringement, but *I* not hearing of it doesn't mean too much. OEMs as Dell may have an agreement in place with the patent holders.

The patent from 1942 does not address the whole construction of our typical heat sinks with heat pipes or their construction. But, I do wonder about some of the newer designs that have the exposed heat pipes in the base. Sometimes the coverage of a patent can be too specific and leave open opportunity.

I am not a patent attorney or a patent engineer. I have read many patents (yawn!), written several (snore!), and hold a few for pretty obscure "inventions" (yay!). I suspect that Magda & Nagui Mankaruse just might be the fathers/parents of heatsinks with heat pipes as used in electronics. Kudos to them. Unfortunately for them filing was not made in other countries ... unusual.
 

wildarchy

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This is a US patent. Are there any US manufacturers of this design? It takes both ... Noctua for instance is in Australia (or someplace down under) so they are safe as a manufacturer. But if they do not have a licensing agreement then the distributors in the US may be liable!? Never heard of distributors being held for infringement, but *I* not hearing of it doesn't mean too much. OEMs as Dell may have an agreement in place with the patent holders.


Noctua are actually made in Austria. Your right Australia is 'Down Under', Austria however is in Europe.
Do they teach Geography in US? :rolleyes:
 

Gimpy04

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Sounds like a shake-down to me. Why go after just the little guys and leave out the huge companies like Intel, AMD, Newegg and even Amazon? Because they have massive legal teams that would fight this.
 

krotch

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Makes you wonder if these massive legal teams will come out to help the little guy. I know if I was running Intel, I'd send over my legal team, just cause I'm sick of these patent trolls.
 

Psi*

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Noctua are actually made in Austria. Your right Australia is 'Down Under', Austria however is in Europe.
Do they teach Geography in US? :rolleyes:
Excu-u-use me you smart a$$ that I did not interpret ".at" in www.noctua.at correctly. Their web site does not indicate a company geographical location.

And your point would otherwise be relative to this thread HOW .. .. .. ?????? Excellent to portray your country as the village idiot.
 

Psi*

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Makes you wonder if these massive legal teams will come out to help the little guy. I know if I was running Intel, I'd send over my legal team, just cause I'm sick of these patent trolls.
What if you were the inventor? There are more one kind of little guy ... not saying that I know these people, but really ... ..
 

krotch

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What if you were the inventor? There are more one kind of little guy ... not saying that I know these people, but really ... ..

If I were the inventor? I would have talked with the big companies when they first started selling their products, not 30 years after.
 

Vercinaigh

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Excu-u-use me you smart a$$ that I did not interpret ".at" in www.noctua.at correctly. Their web site does not indicate a company geographical location.

And your point would otherwise be relative to this thread HOW .. .. .. ?????? Excellent to portray your country as the village idiot.

How about instead of just blurting shit on the forums, you take two seconds to reference your points.
 

Psi*

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If I were the inventor? I would have talked with the big companies when they first started selling their products, not 30 years after.
I am not wanting being contentious here ... but it is the burden on those producing products to ensure that they are not infringing on patents. The patent was issued in, I think 2000?, and it does take a while to understand and/or establish "damages".

Patents are really like playing poker. First off a patent makes public the invention. You completely expose yourself. Your write the most boring reading problem and have to cover all of your bases using the English language ... of course there are no ambiguities there. Specific phrases are used and differences between "will have" and "shall have" are different, as an example. But those explicit/implicit definitions change over the decades not to mention language translations.

Back to infringing, some will take the gamble and knowingly infringe, gambling that the profit will not draw enough attention to bring the nasty grams. And even if a nasty gram shows up, will the patent holder consider it worth while to pursue?

I have to really wonder how a distributor can have any liability. Is there any precedent? Lets assume that the patent is infringed for the sake of argument. But the products are not made in the US, I have to believe that this is *not* the 1st time that this issue has come up. For the liars ... er ... lawyers ...
 

Psi*

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How about instead of just blurting shit on the forums, you take two seconds to reference your points.
How does not knowing the suffix ".at" suggest that geography is not taught in the US? I took offense in the clearly disparaging comment about my country.

I apologize for being too sensitive and ignorant in the knowledge of internet urls.
 

Psi*

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@ krotch ... I only get the idea of 1 pic out of that, but you might be onto something. I see your are Asian & maybe understand the language? It doesn't matter or if it was patented or not or that i can understand it. It is prior art and in the public domain?
 

krotch

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I can read Japanese, but majority of what I'm reading, I don't understand. Pretty much translating it into romaji.

Patents last 20 years. To extend past that, requires an act of Congress.
 

stiltner

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I wanna dive into this a bit deeper after reading through it all.

Exactly WHAT products are allegedly infringing upon this patent? There has to be a specific example, I'm sure in discovery phase this will come out more. But by reading from this, its too generic. It clearly states also that the technique's needed to accomplish this design are too cost prohibitive to employ the design at that time. It describes a brazing of the tubes. If the tubes in the alleged items are not brazed, then thats one way out. (I'm sure they are, but the burden of proof lies on them to prove it does, as thats clearly a component used in their design).

I'm sure there's other issues. But generally speaking, I think this patent was issued at a time when Patents were being just thrown out the window (i.e. the dot com era) and upon further investigation and basically a challenge to it, that the patent will be ruled too general in its scope and therefore has the potential to be overturned/denied.

I still find it funny how the big dogs got a "hall pass". The only thing I can find legally mentioning anything to do with hall pass is some documents in relation to asbestos cases and how the court basically made it so that each plaintiff no longer had to prove the extent of the injuries related to asbestos and the exposure from each defendent, but that they merely had to show they had it, and that was about it.
So they gave the plaintiffs a "hall pass" in the one writers terms. This is interesting though, and I'm all for a legal defense fund for these companies.

I'll be watching this one closely, keep us updated as best as you guys can (obviously attorneys hate people that talk about their cases and some just plain forbid it as it can compromise integrity)..

(Again, reading over the patent again) are they targeting water cooling cold plates? Read Section 8, paragraph 9 of the patent. It seems to be something thats requiring an inlet
and outlet for the liquid. Not a situation where the tubes are incasing the liquid (as is common in air cooled heatsinks) If thats what their claim is, then I think they're gonna have to go
way way way far back. These have been in use in industrial means for decades, if not 1/2 a century or more.
 
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