Typical Apple

Welcome to two weeks ago. Someone already got flyover running on the 4 in the iOS 6 beta using a hack but it's very sluggish. It appears to be optimized for the stronger GPU in the 4S and the iPad. It's definitely the most GPU-intensive 1st party software for iOS. Kinda sucks that turn-by-turn navigation is completely built-in to flyover, but I don't think it's really that surprising that it doesn't run on the iPhone 4. When iOS 6 is jailbroken, it might be possible to enable flyover on the iPhone 4 as long as the poor performance isn't a deal-breaker.
 
MrCrispy said:
http://pocketnow.com/2012/06/11/ios...ps-flyover-nor-turn-by-turn-nav-for-iphone-4/

This is just like Apple, announce the feature at your press event and hype it up, and conveniently lie (by omission) about the details.

I bought my brother a used iPhone 4, and this kind of thing makes me mad, since there's no excuse for it.
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as CEpeep pointed out, you can enable it but it's really slow. I assume it's the reason the iPhone 4 didn't make the cut.


I have no doubt in my mind that it will be made avalible to jailbroken iOS6 devices, but not completely sure you'd want to (they might improve it by then though)
 
Typical. I think Samsung has apple running for its money when it comes to anything.

Time of Iphone is short lived.
 
I haven't been following this closely. Can I just keep google maps if I want?
 
Sorry I don't usually keep up with Apple news, so I'm late to the party. With iOS 6, will it be possible to use Google Maps as the default maps app? I'm pretty sure the answer is no.

Why is turn by turn linked to flyover? You certainly don't need any flyover or fancy graphics to do it. Sounds more like a reason Apple can exclude older devices.
 
bigddybn said:
I haven't been following this closely. Can I just keep google maps if I want?
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The "Maps" functionality is completely Apple-provided in iOS 6. You would have to use a 3rd party app if you wanted someone else's maps.
 
MrCrispy said:
Sorry I don't usually keep up with Apple news, so I'm late to the party. With iOS 6, will it be possible to use Google Maps as the default maps app? I'm pretty sure the answer is no.

Why is turn by turn linked to flyover? You certainly don't need any flyover or fancy graphics to do it. Sounds more like a reason Apple can exclude older devices.
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Google is said to be releasing a stand-alone maps app for iOS soon, so yes... you can use google maps at that point (or use the web based google maps)

As for turn-by-turn using flyover, I think almost every GPS unit (and application) I've ever used had a flyover setup. Think about it... you want to be able to see the road/turns/mergers/landmarks/etc that's coming up in front of you. If the view was a complete top-down '2D' type of setup, it would limit your ability to see that type of stuff. (think of the original GTA games compared to GTA3+)

Besides... while I haven't yet used TBT for iOS6, I have a feeling that you're probably better sticking with the 3rd party solutions anyway (TomTom et al) if anything, for it's local map cache. I don't like the idea of maps getting streamed to me in the event that I lose my cell signal (or for fear of data overages)
 
Providing a birds eye view of the map, which most apps use for navigation, doesn't need fancy graphics. Ancient Android phones with no hardware acceleration and gps units can do it, and I'm sure the iPhone 4 can as well. They could easily have implemented a less graphics intensive mode if needed. I'm not buying it - this sounds exactly like a reason to force people to upgrade.
 
MrCrispy said:
Providing a birds eye view of the map, which most apps use for navigation, doesn't need fancy graphics. Ancient Android phones with no hardware acceleration and gps units can do it, and I'm sure the iPhone 4 can as well. They could easily have implemented a less graphics intensive mode if needed. I'm not buying it - this sounds exactly like a reason to force people to upgrade.
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and that's exactly how the current maps navigation works (and, I assume, will continue to work on both old and new devices).

It's a basic, top-down, 2D navigation system

77f5ffad81b9b9a3c88cd07c_4.jpg


It just wont be getting the 3D style (like most 3rd party GPS units/apps use)
r
 
MrCrispy said:
I'm not buying it - this sounds exactly like a reason to force people to upgrade.
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I'm sorry, "force"? Apple isn't going to brick your brother's phone when iOS 6 is released. In fact, your brother's phone is going to continue to receive updates for a much longer period of time than what you'd find from most other smartphone providers. Even the 3GS is getting iOS 6 in a trimmed-down form, and that phone's over three years old now.
 
Alright so apparently pointing out that the original iPhone 4's hardware really isn't that great, and that the 4s is a LOT better - finally getting the RAM and processing power it deserves - is a thread crap /rant

I didn't put it quite that eloquently. Unfortunately this is a reality with iPhones. The 3S has a tough time with iOS 5, IMO. I guess the 4 is going by the wayside with 6? I guess just don't use Apple's map app?
 
Google is making an announcement about Google Maps tomorrow @ IO. Willing to bet they'll do Turn by Turn in their version, not to mention there's several free ways you can get it already like Mapquest and Waze.
 
DJ Big T said:
I guess the 4 is going by the wayside with 6? I guess just don't use Apple's map app?
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No to the first, yes to the second.

The iPhone 4 will just replace the 3GS as the entry level iPhone. The 3GS is still raking in huge money for Apple, especially in developing markets like Brazil. People here will complain about what they see as artificial limitations—someone mind telling me how to do a visual turn by turn service just like a real GPS WITHOUT Flyover?—but Apple will laugh all the way to the bank, and the people who buy the phone will be happy.

For a forum that grew up around the concept of buying the latest and greatest, there sure is a lot of background noise about doing so in the mobile space.
 
If iPhone 4 doesn't have the processing power to handle maps turn by turn, then I have no problems with the approach Apple is taking. But this is not clear, to me and to many others like in the article I linked. Apple does have a history with stuff like this, e.g not allowing Siri on the the 4 or the iPad 2, which by all accounts had sufficient specs.

Again, I don't mind telling my brother to use GMaps, but it will lack all the integration with the OS which is a major plus point in iOS.
 
Ryokurin said:
Google is making an announcement about Google Maps tomorrow @ IO. Willing to bet they'll do Turn by Turn in their version, not to mention there's several free ways you can get it already like Mapquest and Waze.
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Google Maps on Android already supports turn by turn, no? That's like the primary reason I switched to an Android phone...
 
Zinn said:
Google Maps on Android already supports turn by turn, no? That's like the primary reason I switched to an Android phone...
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And their API rules were the reason that Apple could never add it to maps. The point is, people act like GPS does not exist on iPhone when it does and for free. Hell I have a Android device and I prefer CoPilot because Maps is horribly inaccurate in several areas. It was starting to be a job reporting them all and having to prove them wrong.
 
bigddybn said:
I haven't been following this closely. Can I just keep google maps if I want?
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This was the Apple of yesterday....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMcRRWyJE3w

Today, its another story.

Sure, you can get other apps for mapping. However, no way to change the default option of the OS makes this a partial solution at best. For example, if I select an address from the contacts - iOS will use the Apple maps iOS 6. There is no way for the user to give preference to another app, such as a Google Maps app.

I would not mind if I could designate an app for mapping, that would be fair.
 
While yes - Apple's mapping is the 'default' map software - there is still nothing stopping you from using something else. I've used Navigon for several years now and Waze as well for the past few months and rarely open the maps app. While you can't make them default it's not as if there are no options for turn by turn.
 
It's a callback circa 2008 with the iPhone not having cut and paste, or apps not having access to the contact list, that people keep bring up today as still valid. when I had a iPhone, I used GPS Drive and it pulled names from the address book just fine. CoPilot did as well. Even with a galaxy nexus now, I don't go to the address book and long press a name and choose to send it to navigation, I open the app and choose the address from the contact list there. It's just something blown way out of proportion.
 
Bacillus said:
This was the Apple of yesterday....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMcRRWyJE3w

Today, its another story.

Sure, you can get other apps for mapping. However, no way to change the default option of the OS makes this a partial solution at best. For example, if I select an address from the contacts - iOS will use the Apple maps iOS 6. There is no way for the user to give preference to another app, such as a Google Maps app.
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actually, I think you probably can. If you hold down on a link or contact (or any other type of data/file), a sub-menu should pop up (assuming you have another map app installed, or something else that can handle GPS type of data) and pick which app you'd like to use it in. iOS allows this nativly with other functions so I don't see why it wouldn't work for maps as well. I don't have access to the beta nor do I have another maps app installed, so can't test it :\
 
Ryokurin said:
It's a callback circa 2008 with the iPhone not having cut and paste, or apps not having access to the contact list, that people keep bring up today as still valid. when I had a iPhone, I used GPS Drive and it pulled names from the address book just fine. CoPilot did as well.
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that's true. I believe TomTom also gives you that ability.
 
dr.stevil said:
actually, I think you probably can. If you hold down on a link or contact (or any other type of data/file), a sub-menu should pop up (assuming you have another map app installed, or something else that can handle GPS type of data) and pick which app you'd like to use it in. iOS allows this nativly with other functions so I don't see why it wouldn't work for maps as well. I don't have access to the beta nor do I have another maps app installed, so can't test it :\
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Not as its implemented now. A long hold on an address in contacts just brings up the copy button.
Only other gps app I have is waze though.
 
MrCrispy said:
I bought my brother a used iPhone 4, and this kind of thing makes me mad, since there's no excuse for it.
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No excuse, except that the iPhone 4 would have to defy the laws of physics to support flyover mode.

Or are you upset that in bringing everyone an update that improves nearly every aspect of the phone, and giving you this update for free, you feel somehow entitled to a feature that you were never guaranteed in the first place?
 
ScottSwing said:
No excuse, except that the iPhone 4 would have to defy the laws of physics to support flyover mode.

Or are you upset that in bringing everyone an update that improves nearly every aspect of the phone, and giving you this update for free, you feel somehow entitled to a feature that you were never guaranteed in the first place?
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This x1000. All the Apple hate because they don't bring the latest and greatest to an old generation of devices. Regardless of what is technologically possible, thousands of other companies sell you services or products at various price teirs with different feature sets.

Do you get upset when your Internet connection isn't running at 100Mbps when you are paying for 30, just because the lines that it runs on are capable of that?
Just because they can, doesn't mean they have to. When the iPhone 5 (and ios6) is released, the iPhone 4 will be 2 generations old, and you still want them to add the latest and greatest features? Technology wouldn't go anywhere and software would've bloated to shit if every company was obligated to add their latest software features to their older hardware.

I was a little bummed when they announced my 4 wouldn't get flyover or gps, but then I though "big deal," flyover is eye candy, and navigation, well I have waze, or an actual GPS for that... I certainly didn't see any reason to get even a little mad, never mind mad enough to make a thread bashing apple for not adding ONE feature to a last-genertion device that you bought used (so they didn't even make any money off you)
 
ScottSwing said:
No excuse, except that the iPhone 4 would have to defy the laws of physics to support flyover mode.
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lol

I'm going to start a thread bitching about nVidia/MS not allowing DX11 tesselation on DX10 hardware. How dare they... always trying to squeeze an extra dime out of me :p
 
ScottSwing said:
No excuse, except that the iPhone 4 would have to defy the laws of physics to support flyover mode.
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It could be a raw power issue and you would be correct. However, it could be an optimization issue, where what was released in the beta was not optimized for the hardware of the iPhone 4. I'm not saying that is the case, but it is an alternative explanation.
 
dr.stevil said:
and that's exactly how the current maps navigation works (and, I assume, will continue to work on both old and new devices).

It's a basic, top-down, 2D navigation system



It just wont be getting the 3D style (like most 3rd party GPS units/apps use)
Click to expand...

Thats not fully true as the basic mode does not really "route" you at all. You have to manually step through the route. A true PITA if you are driving at the same time.
 
Once again, turn by turn navigation does not require fancy graphics or flyover. It's been done on many other devices with much less power than the iPhone 4 for ages. The fact that Apple chose to do it like this is nice, but they easily could have done it on the iPhone 4 with a reduced graphics mode, just like all the other nav apps. But of course that removes a reason to upgrade.
 
What's the bitch about here? GM doesn't have turn-by-turn on iOS. If you want that, you need to pay up one way or another.
 
Grentz said:
Thats not fully true as the basic mode does not really "route" you at all. You have to manually step through the route. A true PITA if you are driving at the same time.
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I guess. I was thinking more along the lines of traditional maps and following the beacon (not using the included 'stepping' as it is a royal PITA)
The fact that Apple chose to do it like this is nice, but they easily could have done it on the iPhone 4 with a reduced graphics mode, just like all the other nav apps
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You do realize that the iPhone 4 is two years old at this point, don't you? if 'your brother' doesn't like it, there are tons of alternatives (With TBT) that he can use. Likewise, you... I mean he.. can always upgrade to modern hardware ;)
 
Grentz said:
Thats not fully true as the basic mode does not really "route" you at all. You have to manually step through the route. A true PITA if you are driving at the same time.
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I find it of no practical use to get some place.
 
dr.stevil said:
I guess. I was thinking more along the lines of traditional maps and following the beacon (not using the included 'stepping' as it is a royal PITA)


You do realize that the iPhone 4 is two years old at this point, don't you? if 'your brother' doesn't like it, there are tons of alternatives (With TBT) that he can use. Likewise, you... I mean he.. can always upgrade to modern hardware ;)
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Navigon is a lot cheaper than new hardware.
 
MrCrispy said:
http://pocketnow.com/2012/06/11/ios...ps-flyover-nor-turn-by-turn-nav-for-iphone-4/

This is just like Apple, announce the feature at your press event and hype it up, and conveniently lie (by omission) about the details.

I bought my brother a used iPhone 4, and this kind of thing makes me mad, since there's no excuse for it.
Click to expand...


No offense, but apple doesn't get any revenue from used iPhones, so i doubt they care.


iPhone 5 coming soon anyway, my old 4s is about to be outdated in apple-land.
 
Terpfen said:
For a forum that grew up around the concept of buying the latest and greatest, there sure is a lot of background noise about doing so in the mobile space.
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In the US, mobile phones are relatively cheap, but come with very expensive service plans that have an outrageous termination fee. There's no cheaper alternative either, like most other markets have, where you buy the phone outright, and then the service is relatively cheap.

The contract you get stuck with is typically two years, so you're stuck with an iPhone for about two product cycles, meaning you'll spend at least half of that time not having the latest flashiest version. This leads to the butthurtz.

Other computer hardware - graphics cards, CPUs, motherboards, et cetera, do not impose this limitation.
 
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