Transferring existing OS hard drive into new mobo

Discussion in 'Operating Systems' started by morkboy_wonder, May 17, 2010.

  1. morkboy_wonder

    morkboy_wonder Limp Gawd

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    I am thinking of getting a new X58 mobo to replace my 780i. I was wondering is it possible to uninstall chipset drivers and such like, then transfer the whole hard drive into the new mobo. Whereupon I can install the new chipset drivers and be on my way. I expect that this will count as a significant change in hardware but as I have a retail copy of windows surely this should be no problem (I would still only have the OS installed on one computer).
     
  2. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    You left out a key detail. What version of Windows are you running? It can be done, but Windows 7 is the most flxible in terms of detecting the new hardware without issue, especially considering you are going to an Intel chipset.

    It should go without saying, but a fresh install is always the best way, and regardless of the usual arguments against, it doesn't take that long to do.
     
  3. morkboy_wonder

    morkboy_wonder Limp Gawd

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    I am using Vista x64 Ultimate.
     
  4. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Vista is right up there with Windows 7, so you should be just fine.
     
  5. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    First, uninstall all drivers related to your old hardware. Second, you must remember to Sysprep Windows just before shutting it down on the old motherboard for the last time.

    Sysprep will reset Windows hardware ID bindings so it can be moved. The next time it boots (on the new motherboard) it will re-run the last few steps of Windows Setup so it can re-detect your hardware ID's.
     
  6. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I thought that Sysprep was discontinued after XP.

    EDIT: The process is still there, but it is MUCH more complicated than it was with XP. Don't bother with it, OP. You won't need to do this with an Intel board. Uninstall the Nvidia drivers, and make sure your new setup uses the same SATA controller setting as your old board, such as AHCI, Legacy, etc.
     
  7. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Sysprep is still included with Windows Vista and Windows 7. It's still used for deployment purposes.

    It's located in C:\Windows\System32\Sysprep\sysprep.exe

    What are you talking about? After you've uninstalled all your old hardware drivers, just start Sysprep, use these settings, and click OK:

    [​IMG]

    Windows will make the requested changes and shut itself down. Plug the hard disk into the new motherboard, then boot Windows back up. It'll re-bind itself to the new hardware. This is no more complex than Windows XP's sysprep process.

    You'll most likely end up booting to a BSoD if you don't sysprep Windows before swapping motherboards. It's such a simple thing, might as well play it safe and run it.
     
  8. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    With XP yes. It's been well known for a few years now that Vista can take hardware swaps much much better. The OP is also going to an Intel chipset, which has the best native support. I'm a big believer in the K.I.S.S. principle, so if it works without extra steps, even better. In this particular example, Sysprep won't be needed. Sysprep is a great tool, but it was designed for rollouts and imaging. It would be overkill for a simple mobo swap.

    The entire point of NOT doing a fresh install in this case is to have as little work to do as possible after the install. There's no need to rerun to OOBE. All that would be needed, was to boot the new hardware, install the Intel Chipset drivers, and then probably click to reactivate the license. XP would usually throw up a BSoD here, but not Vista or 7.
     
  9. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Vista and Windows 7 are better about it, but a motherboard swap still has a pretty large chance of causing a BSoD unless you take special precautions.

    You want to keep it simple? Lets assume you didn't sysprep, but it was actually needed to boot successfully with the new motherboard:
    1. Shut down.
    2. Build new PC.
    3. Boot, get BSoD.
    4. Tear apart new computer.
    5. Rebuild old computer.
    6. Run sysprep (shuts down the PC when done).
    7. Build new PC again.
    8. Boot successfully.

    Now lets see what happens if you sysprep, whether it was needed or not, as a precaution:
    1. Run Sysprep (shuts down the PC when done)
    2. Build new PC
    3. Boot Successfully.

    Better safe than sorry. Run sysprep so you wont waste time later if the swap doesn't work correctly. It wont hurt anything, and there's a significant chance it will save you time and effort, so why not run it?
     
  10. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Special precautions? The OP already said they would remove the Nvidia drivers. That's all you need to do.
    Yes, it won't hurt anything, but let's at least stick to giving accurate advice. There's no significant chance here. This isn't XP, as I said many times over. Have you done a swap with Vista or Win7 without running Sysprep? I would totally agree with you on the significant chance if we were talking about an XP system...but we aren't.

    Given that the OP should have their data backed up either way, regardless of which method is to be used, the time argument goes out the window. You're trying to scare the OP into your way, though, instead of just sticking to factual information. If the OP wants to take those extra steps to do it your way, that's fine...but Sysprep isn't needed for a Vista or Windows 7 system that's just doing a simple mobo swap, going to an Intel chipset. The OP even mentioned that it is a retail license, so the activation issues aren't even present.

    So, in short, either way is fine...just stick to the facts, so the OP can choose, rather than be scared into another method. It will work just fine without Sysprep, if that's the method the OP chooses. If you don't believe me, try it out yourself!
     
  11. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    That's all you need to do if you get lucky. I'd rather sysprep and be safe, rather than run into a situation where I'll have to waste time rebuilding the old system just to run sysprep.

    Good, so there's no reason not to do it.

    Yes, it failed so often I've started running sysprep on every motherboard swap rather than deal with a lot of wasted time building system twice.

    Better safe than sorry. It's a couple clicks that could save you a lot of time later.

    Wait, what? You'd rather have to do a total reinstall and then restore everything from a backup if it doesn't work without a sysyprep, rather than...just running sysprep before the swap?

    What, exactly, isn't factual? I'm not trying to scare the OP into anything, just running the numbers.

    - Fact: There's a chance Windows won't boot correctly after a motherboard swap.
    - Fact: That chance is reduced if you Sysprep Windows before the swap.
    - Fact: Sysprep is simple to run and there's no harm in running it.
     
  12. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    If it was my system, I'd do a fresh install anyway, as that can be done in less than an hour total, including apps, drivers, etc. So, yes, I'd rather do it that way.

    But, my only point was, you need to get the old way of thinking out of your head, that this is a dangerous process, likely to fail without Sysprep. The OP is not using XP, and is going TO an Intel chipset. There won't be any problems doing so, without Sysprep. That's the factual part I'm talking about. You are presenting the options to the OP as this: Use Sysprep, or you are very likely to crash and burn...and that is simply not true. I could keep saying, but I've already said it enough...Vista and Win 7 are not XP and shouldn't be treated as such. I'm sure the process would work with Sysprep...but it isn't any MORE likely to work than what the OP suggested from the beginning.

    If it was me, like I said, I'd do a fresh install. Using a flash drive, that entire process is done in under an hour, and guarantees me a smooth, no issue process. That being said, swapping the mobo in this situation to an Intel chipset is safe, easy, and won't result in a BSoD.

    By the way, I've had Sysprep fail on me plenty of times in the XP days, so you can't play the "failsafe card" on that either. Neither of our methods are any more or less likely to work than the other, and to steal your words, that's a fact.
     
  13. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    And you need to stop assuming that this is a perfect world...

    Why would you want to skip A VERY SIMPLE STEP that could save you a lot of time an hassle later on? You've already said there's no harm in running it, so what's the problem?
     
  14. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    There is no perfect world, but I also said above I am a big fan of the K.I.S.S. way of thinking. Why take an extra step if it doesn't add any level of assurance? That's my point of contention that you seem to gloss over because it doesn't jive with your opinion. This is not XP...I can say it a hundred more times if that would help. Vista and Win 7 do NOT suffer from the same panic BSoDs if the motherboard changes. They are not XP, and shouldn't be treated as such.

    If the extra step makes YOU feel warm and fuzzy inside about a mobo swap, by all means go for it. If the OP wishes to go that route for a learning experience, wonderful. But given the OS in question, your method doesn't provide any more or less likliehood of a successful swap. With XP, sysprep was pretty much required. Times have changed, so have ways of thinking.

    EDIT: Maybe this explanation would work. If it guaranteed a higher level of success in the mobo swap, I'd be first in line holding the Sysprep flag. Given the OS in question, it doesn't make the process any more or less reliable, so again, I'm not a big fan of doing extra steps for the sake of doing extra steps. I do enough of that during the day to keep "corporate process nazi's" happy.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2010
  15. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    And I'm a big fan of "better safe than sorry." Why risk a greater chance of failure when you don't have to?

    Because Sysprep takes all of 5 second to run, and it DOES add an additional level of assurance.

    Because it's wrong. Sysprep is designed to make Windows ready for mass imaging onto different hardware sets. It generalizes the OS and resets hardware ID's, putting it in the same state as it was on the installation DVD (so it has about the same chance of success as a fresh install).

    It's not about feeling warm and fuzzy, it's about reducing the chance of failure.

    Sysprep will make a motherboard swap less likely to go wrong. Sysprep is easy to run. Sysprep wont have any negative side effects.

    There's no reason not to run it as a precaution, keep screaming "THIS ISN'T XP, IT SHOULD WORK FINE" all you want. This isn't a perfect world, it might not work fine, and there's no reason not to take such a simple step as runnign Sysprep before you shut Windows down for the last time on your old motherboard.

    Then get in line, because it does. Sysprep is what was used to make the actual Windows Vista and Windows 7 installation media. As long as you've pulled off any hardware specific drivers from the old system, a Syspreped Windows install is just as likely to work on a new motherboard as a clean install from the original Windows installation DVD.

    Sounds like damn good odds to me.

    Except this isn't just for the sake of doing an extra step, it involves almost no effort at all, and increases the odds of a successful motherboard swap.
     
  16. Met-AL

    Met-AL [H]ardness Supreme

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    These people are over complicating things.

    Just stick it in the new PC and start it up.... that's what I have been doing for the past 8 yrs with multitudes of motherboards... everything from single cores on VIA KT133a chipsets.. NF2... dual cores on ULI chipsets.. to Intel G35 chipsets.. with Windows XP and Vista.

    Just plug it in and hit the power button.. works like a charm.
     
  17. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    It isn't a greater chance of failure in this particular situation.
    Except it doesn't increase the odds of a successful swap in this situation. That's the point. If it did, you wouldn't have heard a peep from me. If we were going from an AMD proc and chipset to Intel, I'd be right there with you, or I'd be heavily suggesting a clean install. In this particular instance, there is no greater chance of failure. It's as simple as that. Anytime you have Vista or Windows 7, and you are going to an Intel chipset from another Intel compatible chipset....you don't need any aadditional steps. We could even argue if removing the Nvidia drivers first is necessary, or if you could do that once the system boots on the new board, but that's for another day. The key here is that the new, target system is an Intel chipset. No other hardware chipset has the level of stability and compatibility from a native Vista or Win 7 install as an Intel one. If it was any other chipset involved as the target, I'd be right there with you.
     
  18. GreenMonkey

    GreenMonkey 2[H]4U

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    My experience so far was pretty good. I went from an Intel 965 to an AMD Phenom II with no problems. Just a load of reboots and devices installing. No special effort taken. I had never heard of sysprep before this thread, actually. Even under XP the most I ever did was remove device drivers before shutting down the final time.

    I'd have to google sysprep since I don't know anything about it. Never used it. But I can say, win7 is very tolerant for this kinda thing. Probably due to the extensive driver base on the disc & via Windows update.
     
  19. Stoly

    Stoly [H]ardness Supreme

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    Running sysprep is no longer absolutely necessary (but still recommended) if the old and new mobos share the same chipset manufacturer. For example intel 915 to a P35

    In my experience swapping mobos without sysprep in windows 7 is guaranteed to BSOD when

    -Using chipset from different manufacturers
    -Using RAID
    -Going from AHCI to SATA or viceversa
    -Sometimes going from IDE to SATA

    Since the OP is going from nvidia to intel, I'd sysprep first

    I'd also remove any drivers that have installers, for example nforce and soundcard drivers.
     
  20. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Actually, yes, there is a greater chance of failure if you don't Sysprep Windows first.

    Sysprep puts Windows into the same state it was in on the installation DVD. This means that the odds of Sysprepped Windows booting correctly after a motherboard swap are the same as the odds of a clean installation of Windows from the installation DVD booting correctly.

    Read that very carefully: Same odds of success with a Sysprepped install as with the original installation DVD.

    You simply can't make that claim about a an un-sysprepped swap. Just plugging an existing install into a new motherboard will NEVER, under any circumstances, have the same statistical chance of success as a clean install (or sysprepped install, same thing). Even if the hardware the OP is swapping between makes success more likely, the odds still aren't as good as a clean install (or sysprepped install, same thing).

    Summed up, you can't ever be 100% certain a non-sysprepped install will boot after a motherboard swap. Sysprepping gets you closer to 100% certain. Simple statistics.

    You're speaking in absolutes again...This isn't a perfect world. Just because it should work, doesn't mean it will. As previously explained, the chances of a sysprepped install booting correctly after such a swap are still higher than a straight swap without sysprep. Even in special cases such as going intel-to-intel.

    I've personally had intel-to-intel swaps fail with both Windows Vista and Windows 7 when the installs weren't sysprepped. I had to put the hard disk back in he old computers and sysprep them in order to get them to boot on the new hardware.

    What's really starting to bug me is that you're arguing for no real reason, except out of some weird principal. The only reason you seem to be against running sysprep is because "it shouldn't be required."
    So what? There's an undeniable chance that it might not. Why take that risk when you don' have to? Running sysprep only takes 5 seconds, it can't hurt anything, it maks your ods of success as good as a clean install.

    What's the downside? Why wouldn't you run it? You can't spare 5 seconds that could save you a lot of work and hassle if Windows doesn't boot correctly after the swap?
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2010
  21. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    You accuse me of speaking in absolutes, and then you try to play the time-honored "my personal experience trumps yours" card. I honestly thought we'd be above this.

    If we want to play this game, I've personally had Sysprep destroy systems that needed BartPE to recover their data, while I have NEVER had an issue doing a direct swap to an Intel chipset board with Vista and Windows 7. That even includes pulling a laptop drive from a Pentium M Dell laptop and sticking it into a new Core 2 Duo Dell, and having it boot right up with Vista Pro. Does that make me right and you wrong?

    It all boils down to this. You have a method that you prefer based on your past experiences. Instead of realizing that it might not be the only way, you keep trying to convince me otherwise, while downplaying another tried and true method. It is a fact that Vista and Windows 7 can handle these types of hardware changes, especially when compared to XP. You have an opinion, and in true fashion for thise subforum, can't imagine that someone else can have a differing opinion or doesn't immediately fall in line with your way of thinking. So, you proceed to mount a crusade to convert me to sysprep, rather than just read up on how Vista and Windows 7 are different, and how sysprep isn't needed for this simple swap. no where have I downplayed sysprep. I mentioned I had many issues with it in the past, but I'm also smart enough to admit my experience means very little in the grand scheme of things. My experience doesn't mean more than yours, and vice versa. I really wish people would stop trying to trump other's opinions with their own all the time.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2010
  22. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    It was personal experience offered as supporting evidence to the other information in my post (which you seemingly ignored). It was a datapoint that showed it is possible for such a swap to go wrong.

    Pick a story and stick to it. You already agreed that running sysprep would be harmless. In your own words "Yes, it won't hurt anything."

    Windows Vista and Windows 7 have recovery tools on the installation DVD that would have fixed a non-bootable system; since you resorted to BartPE to clean things up, it sounds like your little mishap occurred on Windows XP, which wouldn't really be relevant here anyway. Sysprep built into Windows Vista and Windows 7 is far more reliable than the one for Windows XP.

    That's beside the point. The process working properly is an obvious datapoint. Unfortunately, that wont always the case. Issues with intel-to-intel transfer can and do happen, and you must account for them when determining the probability of failure.

    No, it means you got lucky. There was still a statistical probability that it wouldn't have worked, and Sysprep would have reduced that statistical probability regardless of the actual outcome.

    Can't you wrap your head around that?

    I don't know where you got the idea from, it's not a method I prefer, it's a method that the numbers prefer. A properly sysprepped install is more likely to boot correctly after a motherboard swap, you don't seem to be able to understand that for some reason.
     
  23. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    That's your opinion, and nothing more. That is hardly a fact, in this particular example given. Why is that so hard to understand? Pot, meet kettle.
     
  24. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    It's not my opinion. *sigh* You really don't understand statistical probability at all, do you?

    The Windows installation DVD contains a sysprepped install of Windows. Running sysprep on an existing install puts Windows into the same state as it was on the installation DVD. Ergo, a properly sysprepped install is as likely to boot correctly on a new motherboard as a clean install from the original installation DVD.

    The odds of a Windows install that hasn't been sysprepped booting after a motherboard swap will never be as high as the original installation DVD (or a sysprepped install, same thing).

    It is statistical fact, I'm afraid. Even in the example given using the OP's hardware, the probability of failure exists; because sysprep is closer a clean install of Windows, it is more likely to succeed than an un-prepped swap.
     
  25. DeaconFrost

    DeaconFrost [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I'm going to say it one last time, because I'm growing weary of dealing with yet another person who has an incessant need to argue and be "right".

    In this particular case, Sysprep is NOT needed, and DOES NOT increase the chance of a successful swap. The key words are...in this situation. I've said it many times, and others have confirmed. Drop the stubborn, my opinion is better than yours game, and move on. You've said your piece, and the OP is free to choose their own steps. We've all grown tired of seeing this game being played over and over on here. As if that wasn't enough, you decided to make wild assumptions about my knowledge and understanding. How so very typical.

    I said several times over, in most situations, I'd favor Sysprep as well, if not for a full install. But I'm going to say it clearly one more time, and then I'm done. It is not needed in this situation, nor does it increase the probability of success *wait for it* in this situation.

    As a well-respected forum member used to say, Next!
     
  26. Unknown-One

    Unknown-One [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Like I keep telling you, even if sysprep isn't needed, it still increases the odds of a successful motherboard swap.

    The Windows installation DVD contains a sysprepped install of Windows. Running sysprep on an existing install puts Windows into the same state as it was on the installation DVD. Ergo, a properly sysprepped install is as likely to boot correctly on a new motherboard as a clean install from the original installation DVD.

    The odds of a Windows install that hasn't been sysprepped booting after a motherboard swap will never be as high as the original installation DVD (or a sysprepped install, same thing). This goes for the OP's hardware as well; just because it should work without sysprep, does not change the fact that it might not. In such a case, Sysprep will have saved him time and frustration.

    Sysprep takes all of 5 seconds to run, it wont harm anything, there's no reason not to run it for this hardware upgrade.

    I've already covered the context of this situation. Even in the example given using the OP's hardware, the probability of failure exists; because sysprep is closer a clean install of Windows, it is more likely to succeed than an un-prepped swap.

    Edit: You're also overlooking the fact that the OP is moving from an Nvidia chipset (nForce 780i) to an Intel chipset (Intel X58), not from an intel chipset to an intel chipset. This greatly increases the probability that Windows will not boot on the new motherboard, unless Sysprepped beforehand.

    Like I said, it's not my opinion, it's statistics.

    The odds of an un-prepped Windows install successfully booting after changing motherboards will never be as good as the odds of a sysprepped install (a "sysprepped install" would include the original Windows installation DVD, as well).
     
  27. jadams

    jadams 2[H]4U

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    I concur, sysprep the damn thing.

    If taking 30 seconds to run sysprep minimizes complications bye even 1% I'd do it.