totally upgrading my computer, need advice

C

Chasx003

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 26, 2005
Messages
163
if this is in the wrong section, i appoligize.

it has come time to upgrade, but i'm on a budget of about 700-900 dollars. I've found these parts so far,

X850 XT PE

AMD Athlon 64 3500+

MOBO LINK IN LOWER POST

Corsair Ram


so, my question is, are these parts the best for me to choose? i don't want this system to be "cutting edge", but easily upgraded over time.

oh, and the motherboard is what i know least about, all i know is that these parts are compatible, should i get something else that is out?

thanks.
 
not sure how the 7600GT stacks up against the 850XT PE, but it's near the $200 mark
you may want to consider this x1800GTO card for $178 after $60 rebate.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814142067

and if I was going to spend $200 on a processor, I'd fork over the extra cash now for the dual-core.
I had a 3700+ san diego, thinking that it would be just great and games weren't optimized for dual-core yet... but then something just kept itching.... and I kept asking myself "what if I had dual-core?" "I want dual-core"
so I ended up selling the chip about 1 month after I got it and purchased the Opteron 165.

If you're too pressed for springing for an opteron 165 or 3800+, then I'd point you towards getting the Pentium 4 805 dual-core, which is about $130, and overclocks to 3.7Ghz easy. It's comparable (when overclocked) to the stock opteron 165...

Also, make sure to spend about $100 on a good PSU, as you'll thank yourself later.
 
thanks for the reply, i looked for a new mobo, this is what i found

Abit kn8 ultra ATX motherboard

and about the proc, i'm hoping to build this computer making upgrades in the future easy. When that proc. no longer plays games, the duel core procs should be more optimized for games, and cheaper (i hope)

again, thanks for the help, oh and one more question, will that mobo work with IDE hardrives opposed to ATA's? (i'm such a noob when it comes to mobo's/ hd's)
 
IDE: Integrated Drive Electronics this simply means that the electronics required to command the drive are actually on the drive. It's all the circuits on the green circuit board on the bottom of the drive. All IDE hard drives use the ATA connector.

ATA: Advanced Technology Attachment. This is the connector used to connect drives (cd-rom, cdrw, dvd, dvd+/-R, and hard drives) to the motherboard. The wide (usually grey) ribbon cables are used with these devices. Plug your hard drives into the one with more wires (80-pin) and plug your optical drives into a separate cable. This will insure that your hard drives will run at their optimal interface speeds. If you plug an optical drive into the same 80-pin cable, it will make the bus speed for that cable default to ATA33 speeds, and your hard drive transfer speeds will be significantly slower.

SATA & SATA2: Serial ATA. This is the new type of hard drive connectors & cables & bus system. The thin cables are used to connect these drives.

If you're looking for future compatibility, be aware that AMD is releasing the AM2 socket (the type of connector you plug the cpu into the motherboard) in just a couple months. This will bring DDR2 to the AMD camp, and make regular DDR become outdated & obsolete within ~2 years.

If you're buying for future upgrades, I would strongly recommend Intel Pentium 4 805 at this point because they already have DDR2 support. Besides the fact that it's a dual-core cpu, it is $70 cheaper than the 3500+, with arguably better performance in games. Oblivion is said to have some dual-core enhancements).

The only reason I would recommend a single core in this instance is due to the fact that you are not very experienced with hardware & troubleshooting. Some games may require some tweaks to run properly. That said, I can play all games just fine on my dual-core opteron.

From experience, whenever I have wanted to upgrade, I usually purchase a new motherboard with the new CPU. Simply put, I would say spend the money for the best hardware you can afford now, as you probably won't be able to upgrade JUST the cpu in the future, as it will require a new chipset and socket on the motherboard.
 
I simply cannot stress enough the importance of having a good quality power supply. Please, please heed this advice.
 
after reading your post j macker, it seems it would be in my best interest to go with intel. the 850 is also a lot easier on the wallet. (You said it overclocked to 3.7 easy, is that with the stock heatsink/fan, wor would i need to get some after market cooling?) the only problem is that i've always had an amd proc, so i don't exactly know the difference. i looked on tom's hardware, and the 2 duel core processors that people in this thread recommended do not clock anywhere near the 3500+. is there some advantage to duel core that i am not aware of?

and about the psu, would it be better to buy a case that comes without one, and then buy a better psu?

thanks everyone for the help.
 
First off, I am not an Tom's reader. He has the site as a pure money-making setup and I perceive him to be more influeced by manufacturers, and his reviews are not as useful. Anandtech is another good source of information for in-depth articles and forums.

I try very hard to paint a good picture, and if there is something worth correcting, I'm sure another forum member will post with an opinion. More often than not, I think I do an excellent job explaining stuff, and there is no need for others to post.

if I'm not mistaken, the typical overclocks for the 3500+ may be slightly lower than the 3700+ San Diego, which can hit about 2.6Ghz. Mind you, that these frequencies on an Athlon64 design will give better performance than a Pentium 4 at 3.0Ghz. So, you can conclude that the processor frequency is not the primary factor for performance. AMD has a different design, allowing for lower frequency, but better performance than Pentiums with the same "speed".

I do enjoy games and always like to have a top-notch computer. That said, even a slight possible decrease in game performance with a slightly slower dual-core would give a noticeable increase in standard computer usage (internet, movies, encoding, etc.) That is another factor in why I wanted dual-core. I would rather have a better well-rounded processor which is still great at games, and then I wouldn't need to upgrade when dual-core optimizations started occuring. I'm basically going to sit on my current hardware until about a year after Vista comes out.

It's actually the Intel Pentium 805 which is dual core. Many have been reporting at least 3.7Ghz with the stock cooler. You may want to give this thread a read: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1046932

also, a review of different performance comparisions:
http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTAwMiwyLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==
the pertinent information would be seeing the P4 Extreme edition dual-core, the P4 D 3.2Ghz dual-core and the athlon X2 3800+ and 4800+. The higher end processors would be good references for your expected performance after the overclock. the 4800+ and the FX-60 would be the performance comparisons for my opteron 165 @ 2.53Ghz.

Most cases come with junk psus. That is why newegg sells a lot of cases which have no psu. The exceptions? Some Antecs and maybe a few others. It really is an entirely new topic, and a ton to learn about. Also, your power requirements and future expansions are something to consider. Wattage ratings are not everything, however. a 500W psu from a crappy manufacturer is worse than say, a 400W from a reputable manufacturer.

spend about 2 hours reading up here: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1045259

it's better to be informed, isn't it?

Good psu brands: (although some may have some not-so-great low-end models)
Antec Truepower
Enermax
Enhance
Fortron ( FSP )
PCP & C - pc power & cooling (really stinking expensive)
OCZ Powerstream
Silverstone
Seasonic

I would definitely purchase a separate PSU, especially since you're saving $70 on the cpu, which can be better spent on your psu. I haven't actually had an Intel system for a few years, so for the traditional AMD guys, it shows what a great value & performance the 805 is. I see in the other thread that overclocking the dual-croe P4s require a lot of current from the +12v rail, so I see that a single +12v rail is suggested. I find that extremely strange, and would much rather steer you towards a psu with multiple +12v rails.

Example? my FSP 531w unit had a single +12v rail rated at only 18A. I had my entire setup in there with a 7800GT, and 4 hard drives, and overclocked opteron 165. The +12v rail was reading 11.84 from software readings. The real nutty psu guys will tell you to get a multimeter for accurate readings, but I just went and bought a new psu, as the modular sleeved units were looking quite enticing.

the type of PSU you should purchase really depends on what you plan to do or how much upgradeability you want. SLI or crossfire configurations will need a good 550 - 600W quality psu. High-end ATI cards have been using more power than their counterpart nVidia parts recently. However, if you don't ever plan on having dual-video cards, or even a really-power hungry card, then you can get away with only spending $70-80 on a good psu.
There are many options, as you can tell by the other threads, and that is the beauty of building it yourself.

As for a case, it all depends on what you want for a case. If you want a small portable case, then go with an Aspire Qpack SFF (small-form factor) which would require a micro-ATX motherboard. My case, and my favorite by far, still allowing for upgrading & has portability is the Antec Lanboy. Then, there's the full fledged towers with all sorts of bells & whistles, priced accordingly. It's nice to have a good case & psu, as you'll probably keep them through at least 3 procesors/mobos/ video cards
 
Lol PCP&C and Seasonic are way out of his budget range. Instead of confusing him with suggestions, just ORDER him to get a Fortron (FSP) haha.
 
heh.. .alright.

Buy one of these. I'd go with the Antec or FSP, as they're just as good for cheaper than the Seasonic.
Antec:
1. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817103932

FSP:
2. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817104934
or a different FSP unit at ewiz for a little cheaper:
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?name=PS-FS550PN

Seasonic:
3. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817151023

and Seasonic has a decent $100 psu. so not too extreme. I got my 600W Enhance for $99 over at ewiz.
 
ok, i've given it some thought, and talked to some people, and now i have a question about that processor. i noticed it only has 533mhz fsb, a friend commented that that was low, and would cause bottle necking, my question is, when you oc this board does the fsb go up/ would i not expierince bottlenecking because it is a duel core?
 
Chasx003 said:
ok, i've given it some thought, and talked to some people, and now i have a question about that processor. i noticed it only has 533mhz fsb, a friend commented that that was low, and would cause bottle necking, my question is, when you oc this board does the fsb go up/ would i not expierince bottlenecking because it is a duel core?
Click to expand...

Overclocking would help reduce the bottleneck. If anything, after you get beyond 800FSB, you're doing pretty good.
 
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