To build or Not to build?

M

mensaphone

Weaksauce
Joined
Feb 17, 2008
Messages
119
That is the question.

So, I started out intending to build my next rig...had it pretty much figured out; came out a bit more then I was expecting :eek:.
Figured I outta check out the big boys/boutique builders. So basically I realized building yourself saves you....nada (or close enough :D).
(Yes I'm aware of the other "benefits" of buliding, but honestly my times at a bit of a premium)

Anyhow, long story short - I don't particularily have any questions yet. Just chronicling my adventures :p

So I started building my rig via the standard newegg. Just like everyone else.

I then proceeded to check out the commercial big boys:
Dell
HP
Gateway

and now currently looking at the boutique builders: (in no particular order)
Velocity Micro
Maingear
avadirect
Hypersonic
ABS
Puget
vigorgaming - know nothing
Polywell
Alienware
Falcon Northwest


Ones that didn't make the cut:
(mostly for inconsistent reviews..mostly QA and Customer Service)
cyberpower
Monarch - website broken :/
Solaris PC - horrible website
cyberpower - Highly customizable, Excellent (perhaps best) prices, HOWEVER, Questionable CSR/Tech/Warranty support
Voodoo (Too Expensive :eek:)
ibuypower


I'm leaning torwards a VM or maingear. They seem to have the best ratio of price/value. (which brought me to this site)
..but unlike most, the fact that VM sells in BestBuy actually kinda turns me off :/

The Alienware suprisingly prices out fairly well...but I'm not 18 anymore
I like the Falcon NW and the hypersonic systems alot...but a bit pricey.

I started out at the 1.5k range but have creeped upto 2k (+ a little bit) range. (Post #6 for desired Specs)
 
Feel free to add any input

I'll be editing the first post mostly................. and doing some judicious bumping ;)
 
hands down, building is the option at that price range. what are your computer's purpose? gaming? if so, what games? what monitor resolution? overclock? upgradability? any other stuff you want us to know?
 
crhscoog said:
hands down, building is the option at that price range. what are your computer's purpose? gaming? if so, what games? what monitor resolution? overclock? upgradability? any other stuff you want us to know?
Click to expand...

Good point lol...I suppose the info ON the computer may be helpful :rolleyes:

I'm looking (for my 2k) to be a competent gaming machine (not it's primary purpose), autocad, image/video processing. I really really really like to be able to multitask...

Some general specs I'm shooting for is
Originally wanted an intel brand MB but have found alot/most of the boutique builders seem to like nVidia (obviously for the SLI)
Quad core
8800series..haven't decided if having the ability to future SLI is worthwhile (vs. just upgrading to a better gpu down the road) (8800 GT 512)
24" lcd (WUXGA)

Being able to OC and Upgrade are very important if not one of the primary concerns. I tend to keep my PC's a bit longer then I'd like...but tweak tweak tweak whenever I find my PC "lacking". Oh and HTPC qualities would be a huge plus, actually is somewhat what prompted this endeavour. (OEMs and cablecards)
 
these are just off the top of my head and their approximate pricings:
$270 Q6600 G0 SLACR (clubit.com; could easily oc to +3.0ghz with proper cooling)
$450 HD3870x2 Video card (best card out there right now)
$90 4gb (2x2gb) @ 800mhz (dont need higher mhz)
$100 500gb Harddrive
$30 CD-R/DVD-R w/ Lightscribe
$100 OS (Vista 64bit or XP 64bit)
$130 Corsair HX620 Modular Power Supply

Motherboard depends...
theres the new X38 chipset motherboards that has pci express 2.0 which is faster than the previous ones, but it hasnt been taken fully advantage of yet
theres the new 780i motherboards for tri sli that i find utterly worthless and a waste of good money
theres the P35 chipset mobo thats cheaper than previous two and can oc really well

Case is up to you really. each person have their likes and dislikes so its all on you.

Cooling..
at that budget you could get water cooling if you want

You don't necessarily need to have SLI but at 1920x1200 resolution, SLI can be considered (3870x2 is two 3870 in one card)
 
For $2000, you could build a decent rig. Depending on what you get, you could even fit in the costs of a 24 inch monitor. The catch is that, outside of the Acer models (which are designed mainly for gaming), there are very few "quality" 24" monitors that cost under $600.

1920 x 1200 is where having SLI or CrossFire starts to become a benefit. The (G92) 8800GTS, the HD3870x2, and the 8800GTX/Ultra can all perform well (as single-card options) at a 1920 x 1200 resolution. (The G92 8800GTS and the HD3870x2 also have onboard video decoding, for HTPC purposes.) Keep in mind that NVIDIA will be releasing its new cards shortly, and there may be a few that, assuming they're released right away (and that's no guarantee), are better than the 8800GTS/GTX. If you are considering CrossFire, think about getting an X38 board... its main advantage is its native CrossFire support. However, only consider SLI/CrossFire if you're planning on buying both cards right away.

Do you have a sample setup, from one of these vendors you're considering, as a comparison base?
 
mensaphone said:
Ones that didn't make the cut:
(mostly for inconsistent reviews..mostly QA and Customer Service)
cyberpower
Monarch - website broken :/
Solaris PC - horrible website
cyberpower - Highly customizable, Excellent (perhaps best) prices, HOWEVER, Questionable CSR/Tech/Warranty support
Voodoo (Too Expensive :eek:)
ibuypower


I'm leaning torwards a VM or maingear. They seem to have the best ratio of price/value. (which brought me to this site)
..but unlike most, the fact that VM sells in BestBuy actually kinda turns me off :/
Click to expand...

Monarch is not around any more. They kind of "disappeared" some time ago, and we've taken over attempting to help support their old customers so that no one is completely left hanging over warranty issues.

Either VM or Maingear are worthy picks. Both Randy from VM and Peter from Maingear hang out on these forums, and I'm sure you'll get a fast response from either of them. I don't think you'd be disappointed with either.
 
And since Heather didn't mention a shameless plug, I'd recommend Puget if you decide to have it built for you. :p (hm... so less customers, less work for heather... i get it now ;)... j/k)

Though, cost differences could be substantial, but thats a subjective matter (depending on your financial situation). So yes, a comparison between what you planned on building yourself and what you plan to get from one of the boutiques would help us give a better opinion.
 
enginurd said:
And since Heather didn't mention a shameless plug, I'd recommend Puget if you decide to have it built for you. :p (hm... so less customers, less work for heather... i get it now ;)... j/k)

Though, cost differences could be substantial, but thats a subjective matter (depending on your financial situation). So yes, a comparison between what you planned on building yourself and what you plan to get from one of the boutiques would help us give a better opinion.
Click to expand...

Heheh. I try to stay away from commenting on Puget unless a question is asked, because as I've said before...I'm no salesperson. :eek:

What I will say, though, is if you truly want to go the boutique route, keep doing your homework. Find two or three companies you really like, come up with a config you're happy with, and ask them to price it out for you.

Look for a good reputation for support and high customer satisfaction, and make your decision based on price and company rep. I would also suggest calling in and speaking with a company's salespeople, too--it's a great way to get a feel for the company's way of dealing with customers, and can really indicate whether the experience is going to be a good one...or a GREAT one.
 
tiraides said:
Do you have a sample setup, from one of these vendors you're considering, as a comparison base?
Click to expand...

Maingear F131 SLI:
PSU 750W Maingear or 1000W Silverstone (Have'nt done enough research to know which one to pick)
NVIDIA nForce 780i SLI Motherboard
Intel Q6600 Core 2 Quad (2.4GHz x 4)
Intel Quiet CPU Cooler or Zalman Ultra Quiet CNPS9500 LED 92mm CPU Cooler w/ Copper Base (again don't know enough about either)
2GB Corsair XMS2 PC2 6400 (haven't researched, but getting cheapest with intent to upgrade)
Western Digital Caviar SE16 250GB 7200RPM 16MB Cache - SATA II (However am considering getting 2 Raptor X 74gigs in Raid0...could be a waste, again need more research). Then adding a huge 3rd drive for storage later.
All-in-One Internal USB 2.0 Flash Card Reader & Writer
20X Dual Layer DVD±RW Drive w/ LightScribe Technology - black
Will add a Blu-Ray later (300$ish)
NVIDIA® GeForce™ 8800GT 512MB DDR3 (upgrade to GTS for 135?)
Integrated Soundcard (will upgrade to Xfi something or another later...cheaper)
Integrated Gigabit Network Card
Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium (32-Bit)
TOTAL $1,824.79
*However this does not include the cost of adding RAM, Blu-Ray, 2x Raptors, Sound Card, TV Card - all of which I think I can find cheaper online and upgrading.

Velocity Micro Edge Z55:
LXe Case (I want extended....no idea why, not even sure how much more I can shove in there, but I want it :D)
850W vs 1200W both VM branded
EVGA nForce 780i SLI, Socket 775, PCI-E, DDR2
Q6600
Arctic Cooling® Freezer 7 Pro Heatsink
3072MB Corsair™ XMS2 DDR2-800
512MB eVGA GeForce 8800GT DDR3 PCI-E w/HDCP
Integrated Audio
500GB Hitachi 7200rpm
Optical Drives...no idea - can only pick dvdrw/cdrw on SECOND bay, not first...lame.
TOTAL $2165
*As Priced is with dvdrw. Again will upgrade RAM, Bluray, HD's Sound Card and TV card



Price difference seems excessive...did I miss something?
"better case" is +60
More ram is +25
 
Oh and as far as upgradeability (VERY important)..I have no idea what these MB's can handle.
ie adding TV Cards, how many HD's I can add ie the 2x raptors plus an additional for storage...another words everything I may want to add for HTPC purposes. Also if for some random reason if I want to add a physix card later.
 
mensaphone said:
Oh and as far as upgradeability (VERY important)..I have no idea what these MB's can handle.
ie adding TV Cards, how many HD's I can add ie the 2x raptors plus an additional for storage...another words everything I may want to add for HTPC purposes. Also if for some random reason if I want to add a physix card later.
Click to expand...


I have built a few computers (5) and I will tell you that you plan on upgrading it BUT it never happens bro.

You just want something better anyways that your MOBO can't do anyways.

Don't plan to upgrade, it will save you a ton of headache.
 
Elijah said:
I have built a few computers (5) and I will tell you that you plan on upgrading it BUT it never happens bro.

You just want something better anyways that your MOBO can't do anyways.

Don't plan to upgrade, it will save you a ton of headache.
Click to expand...

For the above, it wouldn't be "down the road", it'd be immediate; I just think I can buy them for a better deal then what they offer it for
 
Hey mensaphone,

Both Builds look great. You say that you think you can get it for a better deal? That is very true, however, it comes down to what you find is your added Value. Many companies, some which I will not mention, might be able to offer you a better price comparison then VM and ourselves, however, they may lack on the support and quality control in which VM and MAINGEAR are known for.

What ever you go for I'm sure you will be very happy. If you need any specific questions answered let me know. Enjoy and happy hunting!
 
Peter_Moeller said:
Hey mensaphone,

Both Builds look great. You say that you think you can get it for a better deal?
Click to expand...

No, No I meant some of the components...ie bigger HD, RAM etc. Which is why I spec'd it out with some of the lowest end stuff. (with the intention of upgrading those parts later).

I think as a whole, its quiete a reasonable price...I'm just aware how companies make money ;)
 
Peter_Moeller said:
If you need any specific questions answered let me know. Enjoy and happy hunting!
Click to expand...

If you have any thoughts on my musings in the parenths (in my specs, post #13) I'd certainly appreciate any info
(btw, I responded to a comment of yours on the previous page)
 
mensaphone said:
No, No I meant some of the components...ie bigger HD, RAM etc. Which is why I spec'd it out with some of the lowest end stuff. (with the intention of upgrading those parts later).

I think as a whole, its quiete a reasonable price...I'm just aware how companies make money ;)
Click to expand...


Ahh Got ya.
 
mensaphone said:
If you have any thoughts on my musings in the parenths (in my specs, post #13) I'd certainly appreciate any info
(btw, I responded to a comment of yours on the previous page)
Click to expand...


I'm just going to try and fill in some of the blanks on some of the component questions you have with the MG system you set up.


Maingear F131 SLI:
PSU 750W Maingear or 1000W Silverstone (Have'nt done enough research to know which one to pick)
The choice to choose between these two PSU, come down to what you are planning to have in the system. Looking down in the config, you have chosen 8800GT. The 750w PSU is more than enough power to have a pair of those in SLI. Even if you considered doing a pair of the GTS you still would be in the clear. The only suggestion I would have to move to the 1000W PSU is if you were planning on including some GTX's or Ultras to your mix. These are obvious resource hogs and deserve the power they consume.


Intel Quiet CPU Cooler or Zalman Ultra Quiet CNPS9500 LED 92mm CPU Cooler w/ Copper Base (again don't know enough about either)

On our systems I would say go with what you feel comfortable with. If you are not overclocking and want to keep it simple for later days, the stock CPU cooler does its job and does it well. However, if you were going to OC I would highly recommend going with the Zalman cooler. Two reasons, it is very efficient and wonderful and cooling the Overclocked CPU and two, when on a full load it is quieter than the stock CPU.
 
Peter_Moeller said:
I'm just going to try and fill in some of the blanks on some of the component questions you have with the MG system you set up.


Maingear F131 SLI:
PSU 750W Maingear or 1000W Silverstone (Have'nt done enough research to know which one to pick)
The choice to choose between these two PSU, come down to what you are planning to have in the system. Looking down in the config, you have chosen 8800GT. The 750w PSU is more than enough power to have a pair of those in SLI. Even if you considered doing a pair of the GTS you still would be in the clear. The only suggestion I would have to move to the 1000W PSU is if you were planning on including some GTX's or Ultras to your mix. These are obvious resource hogs and deserve the power they consume.


Intel Quiet CPU Cooler or Zalman Ultra Quiet CNPS9500 LED 92mm CPU Cooler w/ Copper Base (again don't know enough about either)

On our systems I would say go with what you feel comfortable with. If you are not overclocking and want to keep it simple for later days, the stock CPU cooler does its job and does it well. However, if you were going to OC I would highly recommend going with the Zalman cooler. Two reasons, it is very efficient and wonderful and cooling the Overclocked CPU and two, when on a full load it is quieter than the stock CPU.
Click to expand...

Thanks, sounds like the 750W is sufficient for me.

Additional quickie, is custom paint included with the F131 or No? the Hard review said it was included (obviously an old review.)
Also on http://www.maingear.com/Products/Desktops/ it says:
- Custom Automotive Paint Standard
Click to expand...

However, when you go to price it, it says 299$ (I'm pretty much guessing it's the 299...but what the hey, might as well try :) )
 
So, mensaphone: I take it that you're no longer thinking about (possibly) building it yourself?

I'm asking because I'm a bit confused... with all of the "extras" you're planning on adding onto one of the pre-builts you're looking at, and factoring in the "inital costs" of getting one of those pre-builts, it may make more sense for you to just build the entire thing yourself.

If you make a few changes -- e.g., get a P35-based board instead of one with 780i (even though you lose SLI and a PCIe x16 slot), buy a $100+ Lian-Li case instead of a $200+ Silverstone/"custom" tower, hold off on getting a PhysiX card/Blu Ray drive/Raptor HDD/whatever -- you could get something that would fulfill your primary needs (and even fit a few of those extras in) and keep it under $2000.
 
tiraides said:
So, mensaphone: I take it that you're no longer thinking about (possibly) building it yourself?

I'm asking because I'm a bit confused... with all of the "extras" you're planning on adding onto one of the pre-builts you're looking at, and factoring in the "inital costs" of getting one of those pre-builts, it may make more sense for you to just build the entire thing yourself.

If you make a few changes -- e.g., get a P35-based board instead of one with 780i (even though you lose SLI and a PCIe x16 slot), buy a $100+ Lian-Li case instead of a $200+ Silverstone/"custom" tower, hold off on getting a PhysiX card/Blu Ray drive/Raptor HDD/whatever -- you could get something that would fulfill your primary needs (and even fit a few of those extras in) and keep it under $2000.
Click to expand...

Ahhh, the voice of reason...these forums aren't rigged ;)

Yeah, in a word...you're right.
Basically its boiled down to this - Building it myself: I don't have the time, There's an "infinite" amount of choices, I will continuely research (until the "next big thing" comes along, then I'll reconfigure ad nauseuam - resulting in no comp); never feeling like I have the "optimal" build price:value ratio.

Boutique builders, I know the potential choices I'm limited to are good components and will quiete simply work, and work well. Additionally the "support" system sure is attractive.

That being said, I plunked all my costs/"upgrades" into an excel sheet and basically realized I'll be pushing 3.5k+ (more than double what I was originally going for, blergh). HOWEVER, I can almost justify that b/c these upgrades can be done over the course of the next x time period....

Blergh, DAMN YOU ;) back to square one...
 
Here's something to consider -- a random setup (with all of the parts coming from NewEgg) that has a Raptor HDD, a TV tuner card, and 4GB of RAM, at a cost of around $1600:

$100 - Lian Li PC-G07B ATX mid tower case
$6 - MASSCOOL 120mm case fan (for case)
$130 - Corsair CMSPU-650TX 650W PSU
$125 - Gigabyte GA-EP35-DS3R P35 ATX motherboard
$270 - Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600
$46 - ZEROtherm Nirvana NV120 CPU cooler
$90 - G.Skill 4GB (2x2GB) DDR2 800 dual channel kit
$30 - Samsung SH-S203B DVD±RW SATA drive
$170 - Western Digital Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB SATA/150 HDD
$155 - Western Digital Caviar WD7500AAKS 750GB SATA/300 HDD
$290 - EVGA GeForce 8800GTS (G92) 512MB PCIe 2.0 video card
$90 - Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1600 SDTV/HDTV PCI tuner card
$110 - Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit OEM DVD
=======
$1612 - Subtotal (not including shipping, taxes, or rebates)

I couldn't find a Blu Ray drive in stock, but the price for a drive that reads Blu Ray discs is around $150. (IIRC, a drive that burns Blu Ray discs costs well over $300.) Ideally, you would be buying your parts from several places, not just from NewEgg alone; but this is just to show you that you could build something within your $2000 budget that could compete with the pre-built rigs. (However, finding a good 24" monitor isn't cheap -- and the Acer monitors that I referred to earlier aren't exactly the best -- so I focused on the tower itself.)

This setup, I believe, will give you what you want: a multi-functional machine capable of gaming on a 24" monitor, with HTPC recording and capture functions, and room for future expansion. I made a few changes to keep it under $2000 (and closer to the initial $1500 mark that you wanted): I didn't include a Blu Ray drive (I couldn't find one on NewEgg, but you'd be spending over $100 just for one that reads Blu Ray discs); I only used one Raptor HD (IMO, they're not worth the price premium over, say, a 500GB drive with 16MB-32MB of cache); the board I chose doesn't have a second PCIe slot, nor SLI/CrossFire (as I mentioned earlier, a G92 8800GTS or an HD3870x2 is enough for a 24" WS monitor); and I selected a 650W PSU instead of a 750W one (since I didn't include a second video card, which would warrant the added power, the 650W is more than enough for the above setup).

Your problem is that you wanted the whole world at a discount... if you have just focused on what you really wanted -- and did just a bit more research -- you probably would have came to the same "conclusion" as I did.

If you still want a pre-built rig, all the more power to you. I just wanted to give you a second opinion... and a cheaper option.
 
mensaphone said:
Thanks, sounds like the 750W is sufficient for me.

Additional quickie, is custom paint included with the F131 or No? the Hard review said it was included (obviously an old review.)
Also on http://www.maingear.com/Products/Desktops/ it says:


However, when you go to price it, it says 299$ (I'm pretty much guessing it's the 299...but what the hey, might as well try :) )
Click to expand...


On the old hard review, we use to offer free custom paint on Intel based platforms. It was a promotion we had running for a long time. However, that promotion has since been discontinued.
The F131 has options for our basic colors, however, if you are considering any type of custom artwork, you would have to call in and specify it, where then pricing will be discussed.
 
tiraides said:
If you still want a pre-built rig, all the more power to you. I just wanted to give you a second opinion... and a cheaper option.
Click to expand...

Wow, that was above and beyond...
Yeah, thanks for the wake up call...if I buy a prebuilt and end up replacing all the components, bit silly eh.

You read my mind with that case. I've been checking out the P182/190.

I'm suprised you recommend the GTS vs the GT, from what everything I've read, the GT is not only a better buy, but often outperforms the GTS. Although you did mention that the GTS has the additional video encoding capability (sure about this?)

I've found so many conflicting information about the raptors...think I'll play it safe and just get a 7200. But still going to do raid0 and a 3rd hd for storage

*warning noob question ahead:
isn't basically every expansion card these days PCIe?
ie gpus, tv capture cards, physx card, Audio Cards (seems alot of people have been sold on the onboard audio these days).... If thats the case got any recommendations with a bit more upgradeability? No SLI/Crossfire is fine by me.

Not sure I can pull the trigger on 64bit version though...

Thanks again!

tiraides said:
Your problem is that you wanted the whole world at a discount... i
Click to expand...
and whats wrong with that? :p
Think it's a good "goal"; as obvious by my creep up to 2k-3k+ range, I'm flexible/realistic lol
 
mensaphone said:
I'm suprised you recommend the GTS vs the GT, from what everything I've read, the GT is not only a better buy, but often outperforms the GTS. Although someone did mention that the GTS has the additional video encoding capability (didn't think this was correct though?)
Click to expand...

I think you're a bit confused but don't worry, blame Nvidia for their stupid naming scheme. Anyway, the 8800GT outperforms the 8800GTS 320MB and 640MB. However. the GTS 512MB that tiraides recommended outperforms the 8800GT by 10%. So
 
mensaphone said:
I'm suprised you recommend the GTS vs the GT, from what everything I've read, the GT is not only a better buy, but often outperforms the GTS. Although you did mention that the GTS has the additional video encoding capability (sure about this?)
Click to expand...

mensaphone said:
errm, so the GT does have the video encoding eh?
Click to expand...

Acutally, the GT and the G92 GTS have video encoding... but I recommended the GTS because it functions on a 24 inch monitor better than the GT. In the [H] review, the GTS, but not the GT, could run Crysis at a 1920x1200 resolution -- that's the same resolution most 24 inch monitors use.

mensaphone said:
*warning noob question ahead:
isn't basically every expansion card these days PCIe?
ie gpus, tv capture cards, physx card, Audio Cards (seems alot of people have been sold on the onboard audio these days).... If thats the case got any recommendations with a bit more upgradeability? No SLI/Crossfire is fine by me.
Click to expand...

No; a lot of the "better" cards still use the PCI interface, but there are a growing number of cards designed for the PCIe x1 slot. For example, Hauppauge has WinTV HDTV tuners of both the PCI and PCIe x1 variety. However, most of Creative's better X-Fi sound cards are still PCI.

mensaphone said:
Not sure I can pull the trigger on 64bit version though...
Click to expand...

You'll need to, as 32-bit operating systems are limited to reading a total a 4GB from the system... that's the amount or RAM minus any other memory coming from add-in cards (like video cards) and other devices. Additionally, the 64-bit versions of Vista come with better driver support than Windows XP.

mensaphone said:
I've found so many conflicting information about the raptors...think I'll play it safe and just get a 7200. But still going to do raid0 and a 3rd hd for storage
Click to expand...

Raptors are no longer worth their price premiums -- in a lot of people's eyes -- because the newer generations of hard drives have caught up to the Raptors' speeds in benchmarks. (Some, like the new 32MB cache HDDs, have even beaten the Raptors in certain benchmarks.) Plus, for the price of one 150GB Raptor, you could buy two 320GB HDDs, place them in RAID 0 (like you're planning to do), and they would run faster than the Raptor.

Here are a series of tests that enginurd made on several drives:

enginurd said:
Avg Transfer Rate, Access Time: HDD info, Price
112MB/s, 13.2ms: RAID0 'cuda's, 600GB total, $120 (ICH9R on P35-DS3R)
78MB/s, 08.2ms: WD Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB, $160
76MB/s, 13.7ms: WD Caviar SE16 WD7500AAKS 750GB, $150
72MB/s, 15.4ms: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3250410AS 250GB, $65
68MB/s, 13.3ms: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS 320GB, $60
65MB/s, 13.7ms: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS 320GB, $80
65MB/s, 13.2ms: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3300620AS 300GB, $60
63MB/s, 13.4ms: WD Caviar SE16 WD5000AAKS 500GB, $100
62MB/s, 15.3ms: Samsung HD501LJ 500GB, $105
52MB/s, 14.0ms: WD Caviar SE16 WD2500KS 250GB, $70
Click to expand...
 
There's a post in the storage subforum by KenF who ran tests on the new WD 320GB single platter drives. While the raptor is still the fastest seeking non-scsi drive, the new 7200RPM drives are faster as far as transfer rate is concerned. Also, there's a new raptor coming out soon, using that single 320GB platter. Let me find that post for you...

KenF said:
Here's the HD Tach for the new 320GB platter version of the WD3200AAKS. The full part number is WD3200AAKS-00B3A0.

hdtachwd3200aaksni6.png


PCMark05 Results
Code: 
XP Startup:           11.114 MB/s
Application Loading:   7.991 MB/s
General Usage:         7.292 MB/s
Virus Scan:          116.577 MB/s
File Write:          101.494 MB/s

I have the drive suspended in rubber bands (Antec P150), which may affect access times slightly.
Click to expand...

KenF said:
By request, here's the HDTune results:

hdtunewd3200aakssc3.png
Click to expand...
 
^ok, so GTS it is
Still dunno about the 64bit version :p Will do a bit more research.
Thanks for all the charts...probably didn't get everything one could out of it, but I"m sold!

For the OS (2x in raid0), is this the HD you were suggesting?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136074&Tpk=WD3200AAKS
(not a 32mb cache...)
And for storage I'm thinking of getting the Samsung F1 750 GB.


For cases I was considering the Antec 900.
Another random nubbie Q, do all cases have manual controls for the fans vs. being able to control them via software? It sure is a pita to have to manually turn on/vary the speed to 4 fans under my desk :/ (What happens if I forget to crank up my fans before some hard useage....etc etc).
Seems a bit strange to me.
*Answer: depends on whether or not the fans can plug into the MB...duh. In the case of the 900, they can't/don't...couldn't you upgrade fans that could though? possible w/the ip35?


Other then the above, and using quad core, I'm thinking of using this system
http://techreport.com/articles.x/14225/6 (if anyones got a great source for any of the parts let me know :) )

OEM vs. Retail as far as processsors? ie http://clubit.com/search.cfm?keyword=q6600&cat=all
Anything I should know?
 
Currently, there are issues with the E8400 and the IP35 Pro. A BIOS update could fix it, but I don't know if the correct BIOS is posted on the Abit website. You may want to also look at the Gigabyte DS3/DS4 series or the DFI LanParty series of motherboards.

You need a 64-bit operating system to fully utilize all 4GB of RAM. 32-bit operating systems can only read a total of 4GB of system memory, and they subtract the amount of RAM you could use from other cards that use memory -- from video cards. With the 8800GTS and a 32-bit OS, you would only be able to utilize 3.2GB-3.5GB of memory (based on additional settings).

Get the retail processor, as it has a three-year warranty. OEM processors only have 90-day warranties.

As for the new 320GB Western Digital drives, the full serial number (to look for) is WD3200AAKS-00B3A0. The B3 indicator is the important part, as it indicates the drive as being the one with the single 320GB platter.

Most cases, including the Antec 900, don't have fan controllers, but you could purchase a controller for the 3.5 in or 5.25 in drive bay for a relatively low price. Check out NewEgg to find one for your needs, and then use Google Product Search, Pricewatch, Slickdeals.net, and the [H]otDeals forum here (among other shops) to comparison shop.
 
Yeah, sorry I meant to say I was still sticking with the Q6600. I've noticed that the E8400 doesn't play nicely with that mb.

Here's currently what the system looks like:

-ABIT IP35 Pro LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
-CORSAIR CMPSU-620HX ATX12V v2.2 and EPS12V 2.91 620W Power Supply - Retail
-Q6600 - RETAIL (clubit.com)
-ZEROtherm Nirvana NV120 CPU cooler
-EVGA 512-P3-N841-AR GeForce 8800GTS (G92) 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 -HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Retail
-mushkin 4GB(2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model 996558 - Retail
-SAMSUNG Spinpoint F1 HD753LJ 750GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
-WD3200AAKS-00B3A0 (2x raid0 for OS) - I guess newegg doesn't carry it?
-SAMSUNG 20X DVD±R DVD Burner Black SATA Model SH-S203B - OEM
 
tiraides said:
You need a 64-bit operating system to fully utilize all 4GB of RAM. 32-bit operating systems can only read a total of 4GB of system memory, and they subtract the amount of RAM you could use from other cards that use memory -- from video cards. With the 8800GTS and a 32-bit OS, you would only be able to utilize 3.2GB-3.5GB of memory (based on additional settings).
Click to expand...

Ahh, thats why that mythical 3.2 number comes from, I had no idea video card memory even came into play,

tiraides said:
Most cases, including the Antec 900, don't have fan controllers, but you could purchase a controller for the 3.5 in or 5.25 in drive bay for a relatively low price. Check out NewEgg to find one for your needs, and then use Google Product Search, Pricewatch, Slickdeals.net, and the [H]otDeals forum here (among other shops) to comparison shop.
Click to expand...

oooh, so presumably they plug into the mb - get their temp readings, then control the fans.
 
Actually, the fans get plugged into the fan controller, which allows you to control the fans' speeds from there. I don't know how accurately the temperature gets monitored... I believe that's based on whichever fan controller you decide to get.

As for the single-platter WD 320GB drive, I don't know which stores sell it. IIRC, they will be sold with the older WD 320GB drives, so it would probably be the luck of the draw.
 
Yeah, I see that KenAF guy all over the place pimping out an ebay seller for that HD...could be perfectly legit, but always makes me a bit hesitant.

btw, is that CPU cooler you recommended sufficient for some moderate oc'ing?

As far as OS, I still have a free copy of Vista Business that I got during this weird promo way back when, wonder if I can "upgrade" hmm.

In any event, think I'm just about ready :) Gotta go research 24 inchers now o_O

Thanks again!

*edit anandtech.com
KenAF said:
Back on January 22, Western Digital announced that it was shipping new, faster drives based on higher-density 320GB platters.

The first drive to use the new 320GB platter is the WD3200AAKS. However, only the new 00B3A0 version (manufactured beginning January 21) has the new 320Gb platter. All previous models used 2 * 160GB platters.

I emailed Newegg, ZipZoomFly, and Clubit last week asking if they would stock this new B3 version with 320GB platters. They all blew me off, saying they could not guarantee whether I would receive the old version or the new. I then proceeded to email every ebay seller listing the Western Digital 320Gb drive. I got one hit -- *leniustech.com*. They said they said had inventory of the new WD3200AAKS-00B3A0 version manufactured in January.

I was a bit skeptical, but I ordered two. They arrived today, and they are as described -- the 320GB platter, WD3200AAKS-00B3A0 manufactured on January 21. I don't have the means to run application benchmarks now, but HDTach reports over 90MB/s average read and 240MB/s burst. It produces noticeably less noise than my 750GB Western Digital WD7500AAKS.

If you buy one of these from leniustech, be sure to specify in the Paypal note that you want the new WD3200AAKS-00B3A0 version.

If you are looking for a higher capacity drive, the 640GB version (WD6400AAKS) is coming in about a month. This should outperform every SATA drive now on the market, aside from perhaps the Samsung F1 1TB and Raptor X. Every WD6400AAKS will use the 320GB platters, so there will be no worries when ordering that drive from Newegg, ZZF, Clubit, etc.
Click to expand...
meh, probably more legit, then not
 
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