The Official Prescott discussion Thread

Originally posted by Tedinde
As noted in the review, wait till some people get some retail cpu's to see if they run cooler. If your planning on overclocking you better be able to cool it.

There will be people with retails Monday, They are in the Back @ Fry's they will be put out tomorrow. Till then just wait, since you waited months to see about prescott, couple more days wont kill you.

What im most anxious to see, is how all the prescotts Overclock. I do buy around 100 CPU's per year. AMD and intel. I see duds, just as much as wonder chips, but no pattern.

if the prescotts OC more on the average, you have a better chance at getting the MHZ you want and of course if you can cool it.
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Don't shoot me or anything but as a non scientific guess what kinda speeds do you think i could hit with a retail 2.8-3.0 prescott with this ram http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProdu...144-126&catalog=147&manufactory=BROWSE&depa=1 a ABIT Max3 and an antec case/psu 400w

This is what i got picked out:
ANTEC SOHO File Server Tower ATX Case with 400W Power Supply

Western Digital Raptor 36.7GB 10,000RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD360GD, OEM

SAPPHIRE RADEON 9800PRO Video Card, 128MB DDR, 256-bit, DVI/TV-Out, 8X AGP -BULK

ABIT 875P Chipset Motherboard for Intel Socket 478 CPU, Model "IC7-Max3" -RETAIL

the ram i listed above and a 2.8-3.0ghz cpu. Any suggestions? I am not really wanting to spend the money on water cooling at this time plus i am pushing my budget to the limit as is. Mainly i am worried about the ram. Should i get PC3700 4000? I was told that this ram could do 1:1 and 2.2.2.6? I am fairly new to this part of the market with ram as i have base all of my purches on PC XX00 ram. Was it this ram that could do 300FSB at loose timings? :confused: Educate me :D
 
Originally posted by kur1j
Don't shoot me or anything but as a non scientific guess what kinda speeds do you think i could hit with a retail 2.8-3.0 prescott with this ram http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProdu...144-126&catalog=147&manufactory=BROWSE&depa=1 a ABIT Max3 and an antec case/psu 400w

This is what i got picked out:
ANTEC SOHO File Server Tower ATX Case with 400W Power Supply

Western Digital Raptor 36.7GB 10,000RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD360GD, OEM

SAPPHIRE RADEON 9800PRO Video Card, 128MB DDR, 256-bit, DVI/TV-Out, 8X AGP -BULK

ABIT 875P Chipset Motherboard for Intel Socket 478 CPU, Model "IC7-Max3" -RETAIL

the ram i listed above and a 2.8-3.0ghz cpu. Any suggestions? I am not really wanting to spend the money on water cooling at this time plus i am pushing my budget to the limit as is. Mainly i am worried about the ram. Should i get PC3700 4000? I was told that this ram could do 1:1 and 2.2.2.6? I am fairly new to this part of the market with ram as i have base all of my purches on PC XX00 ram. Was it this ram that could do 300FSB at loose timings? :confused: Educate me :D
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Man the first Prescott Noob "how high can i get post"!!!! Just kidding of course!!! Take no offense please.

That ram is out of stock, and they will be getting no more.

If you looking for BH-5 ram which that is, They do have PC3000 in stock that will clock as high. I ordered 10 sticks of it Friday @$59 per stick. And i have 6 sticks here now. 262fsb 1:1 is the highest i've had it. 3.55volts though.


This ram will not do 300fsb 1:1 no matter what the timings. I have geil and OCZ PC4200 that will do 300FSB 1:1 with a cpu that will do it.

But get the BH-5 sticks, your 2.8 or 3.0 chip will run out of steam way before 300mhz. And if you have to drop to 5:4, the tight timings of BH-5 stick will make up for it.

Just look for the 2-2-2-6-1 timings on what your looking for, Dual packs of 256x2 are $109 shipped.

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=property&DEPA=1
 
Originally posted by Vagrant Zero
Slightly dissapointed at stock speeds, but impressed with what Anandtech dubbed 'Prescott's Little Secret'. I'll wait until xtremesystems gets its review up before passing any real judgement though.
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This "little secret" is nothing more than the effect of the larger L2 cache becoming noticable. Check out andreal and my comments in the anandtech forum thread on anand's review. http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=27&threadid=1239735 Here's what I posted there:
"The narrowing of the performance difference between Northwood and Prescott as the multiplier increases is clearly due to the larger L2 cache in Prescott. There's most likely no other magic in Prescott that's involved. Think about the performance impact of increasing the processor core frequency (larger multiplier) while holding the bus frequency (and memory speed) constant. As an example, a 20% increase in processor core frequency won't give you a 20% processor performance improvement, due to the fixed bus frequency (200mhz in this case). As the cache size increases the performance dependence on the fixed bus and memory speed will be reduced, getting you closer to that ideal 20% (lower cache miss rate resulting in fewer accesses to memory)."
 
Hey anandtech is more than just a "Hot deals" forum!! i've browsed there before. Lost an account since 99 from a glitch. but never seen to much interesting in there.

going lurking now!!!
 
Originally posted by bmg
This "little secret" is nothing more than the effect of the larger L2 cache becoming noticable. Check out andreal and my comments in the anandtech forum thread on anand's review. http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=27&threadid=1239735 Here's what I posted there:
"The narrowing of the performance difference between Northwood and Prescott as the multiplier increases is clearly due to the larger L2 cache in Prescott. There's most likely no other magic in Prescott that's involved. Think about the performance impact of increasing the processor core frequency (larger multiplier) while holding the bus frequency (and memory speed) constant. As an example, a 20% increase in processor core frequency won't give you a 20% processor performance improvement, due to the fixed bus frequency (200mhz in this case). As the cache size increases the performance dependence on the fixed bus and memory speed will be reduced, getting you closer to that ideal 20% (lower cache miss rate resulting in fewer accesses to memory)."
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Ok. *nods head*

But how does any of that affect...anything? Last I checked there aren't any Northwoods with a 1mb cache so this still technically falls under the 'woo for Prescott' catagory. Does it really matter how or why?
 
1.5v is the highest damn voltage I have seen for prescott so far. No wonder it is running hot. I would have tried to vid pin it to lower voltages. That is about SPDS(sudden prescott death syndrome) voltages it would seem.
 
Only good thing i can see for me with the prescotts I have this Expensive MB that was way more than this 3 months ago when i got it. $230 then

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=13-128-185&catalog=280&depa=1

Max cpu volts is 1.6 on the board an it undervolts bad anyway. So 1.55 was the max i could get out of it.

prescott needs no mega volts.

Might be able to do something with this finally. More HD hookups than you can use. 4 SATA raid, 4 IDE raid, 4 standard IDE. Plus an IDE card for 4 more SATA channels.

I wish i knew what the 6phase power card was for?? doesnt seem to make a difference with it in or out.
 
Wow, the game looked so crappy in the first half, all but the last three minutes.

And then they pull out some great football in the second half at the end.

Oh yeah *yawn* on hot, slow prescott.
 
ARGHHH DAMN PATRIOTS!!!! If CAR stupid kicker wouldn't have botched that kickoff we'd be in overtime now.

Any news on 64-bit extensions in prescott as was previously rumored?
 
As stated in the review we posted, we will be buying retail CPUs to test with.

And nope, not getting hot here, just wanting to see people back their statements up. When people make broad sweeping statements that our data is incorrect, I like to see specifics is all.

As for tweaking voltages and other things, this was a review of a stock processor and there was plenty enough data to be covered with the comparisons without throwing a bunch of variables into the mix. We will play more when we have retail CPUs.
 
I wish my Asus P4P800 Deluxe would let me go under 1.55 volts for a regular P4 3.2 not overclocked, nevermind for a prescott. The Antec True 330 I'm using is a little voltage happy and it tends to run closer to a measured 1.6V.

I get the feeling a lot of mobo's aren't designed to go down to 1.25V at any stable amperage that the prescott can use. But only time will tell.
 
Originally posted by Vagrant Zero
Ok. *nods head*

But how does any of that affect...anything? Last I checked there aren't any Northwoods with a 1mb cache so this still technically falls under the 'woo for Prescott' catagory. Does it really matter how or why?
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I'll agree it doesn't matter all that much. I got the impression that some folks were reading anand's "Prescott's Little Secret" section and thinking that Intel had discovered some amazing technology that really boosted performance as frequency increased. There's really nothing to it other than the effect of the bigger L2 cache becoming more noticable as the processor frequency increases (with constant bus and memory frequency). This is definitely a plus for Prescott as frequency increases, compared to a Northwood with 512mb of L2. At lower frequencies Prescott's 1mb L2 cache can't offset the negative effects of the longer pipeline, so the performance relative to Northwood is typically worse. As processor core frequency increases, Northwood's performance improvement will probably increase at a slower rate than Prescott's. All these things are very dependent on the specific benchmark that's run. Based on anand's numbers one could speculate that at 3.6ghz Prescott could be beating or at least even with Northwood on most benchmarks (of course we'll never see a 3.6ghz Northwood).

This whole effect is dependent on the processor bus and memory frequencies staying constant as processor core frequency is increased. If you have a 3.2ghz Prescott and a 3.2ghz Northwood and overclock by increasing the fsb and memory frequencies you aren't going to see the gap between Prescott and Northwood close (at the same core frequencies). For benchmarks that depend mostly on processor and memory performance the performance gap should stay constant.
 
Hopefully one of the guys with a Vapo/Prometeia will get a hold of one of these new stepping 3 Prescott's and run it through its' paces.

I'd be interested in seeing at what point Prescott's deficency in performance (although slight) is made up for with its branch predictor, multiplier, ALU and cache improvements.

The big surprise was the inclusion of Pentium-M technology in the Prescott to help combat the performance issues of lengthening the pipeline to 31 stages.

I wonder if 4 GHz out of a 3.00 or 3.2 GHz P4E is out of the question with Phase-Change cooling.
 
From HotHardware -

As you can see, Prescott runs about 10ºC warmer than the already spicy temps of the P4 EE processor. In actuality, while under load and installed in a closed case, the 3.2GHz Prescott CPU we tested ran at an average of 57 - 60ºC. The 3.4GHz P4EE we tested settled down at 50ºC under load. Process optimizations and the new LGA-775 package should allow these temps to fall in the future, unless of course you're running the core at 4GHz. Which brings us to overclocking. The 3.2GHz Prescott P4 we tested hit a stable speed of 3.69GHz while overclocked and the 3.4GHz P4 Extreme Edition hit 3.84GHz.

http://www.hothardware.com/hh_files/CCAM/p4prescott_p4ee34.shtml
 
Originally posted by SimGuy
Hopefully one of the guys with a Vapo/Prometeia will get a hold of one of these new stepping 3 Prescott's and run it through its' paces.

I'd be interested in seeing at what point Prescott's deficency in performance (although slight) is made up for with its branch predictor, multiplier, ALU and cache improvements.

The big surprise was the inclusion of Pentium-M technology in the Prescott to help combat the performance issues of lengthening the pipeline to 31 stages.

I wonder if 4 GHz out of a 3.00 or 3.2 GHz P4E is out of the question with Phase-Change cooling.
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I've seen 4.1ghz prescott Screenies Phase change out of a 2.8.

VrZone's screeing of 4.2 is very nice on air. I was hoping for a review from them also on the front page.
 
I'm not quite sure what to think about the Prescott. Sure I would love to get one just because it's new BUT I want to wait until I see some overclocking results for Retail CPUs.

The only real thing I personally see that the Prescott has going for it, is the price.
 
Originally posted by Tedinde
I've seen 4.1ghz prescott Screenies Phase change out of a 2.8.

VrZone's screeing of 4.2 is very nice on air. I was hoping for a review from them also on the front page.
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4.2Ghz on air cough*bullshit*cough. :D :rolleyes:
 
Originally posted by merlin704
The only real thing I personally see that the Prescott has going for it, is the price.
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Taken directly from tomshardware? lol
 
Personally I'm eager to see the prescott tested in an more enthusiast level motherboard. The AMD chips had the benefit of being in MSI and Asus rigs. I think maybe if the prescott was in a more agressive motherboard like MSI/ASUS/Abit, we would see alot better results because usually the Intel motherboards lag behind the rest in benchmark tests.

Probaly not a huge difference, but I still hope when the site gets retail Prescotts, they test them in multiple mobos :)
 
Originally posted by batotman
Any news on 64-bit extensions in prescott as was previously rumored?
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I'd buy that for a dollar!

Seriously, 64-bit would be the saving grace for anyone who doesn't get a new PC every five seconds like we do.
 
I'm beginning to think this is wishful thinking. Wait till the RETAIL they say, somehow I think its going to disappoint as well.

This all takes me back to the Tbred A. "oh wait till tbred", "oh tbred is gonna be awesome" then we got the reviews....pretty much the same deal. If Intel can fix whatever problems in a new stepping, cool. But I don't think they will. They are changing sockets and when was the last time they released a killer proc as they were gearing up for a socket change?
 
Originally posted by merlin704
Umm no.:rolleyes: That's my personal take on the situation.
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I'm kidding. I read what you wrote word for word in a review I read, it wasn't toms now that I read it. Oh well, lame attempt at humor. :D
 
Originally posted by Ben-mod
Personally I'm eager to see the prescott tested in an more enthusiast level motherboard. The AMD chips had the benefit of being in MSI and Asus rigs. I think maybe if the prescott was in a more agressive motherboard like MSI/ASUS/Abit, we would see alot better results because usually the Intel motherboards lag behind the rest in benchmark tests.

Probaly not a huge difference, but I still hope when the site gets retail Prescotts, they test them in multiple mobos :)
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I'm not sure if this has been asked already, but does anyone know exactly why the Intel desktop i875 and the DFI mobo's were used to test the P4E's instead of mainstream enthusiast/overclocker boards like the P4P800/P4C800-E/IC7/IC7-MAX3?

I find it rather odd that the DFI and Intel desktop boards were the top choices for a review of such a high-profile product.
 
I'm only interested in them for the overclocking potential.

And for that I'll probably wait 6 months before I buy.

Giving Intel more time to revamp the core.

Truth is, look at the P4 when it first came out... it sucked!!!

Now... look at my [email protected]... VERY fast.

Give Intel time to fix the problems and upgrade I will do.
 
Originally posted by batotman
I'm kidding. I read what you wrote word for word in a review I read, it wasn't toms now that I read it. Oh well, lame attempt at humor. :D
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Sorry if I came off as an ass, wasn't my intention. I left out the :D.
 
Originally posted by SimGuy
I'm not sure if this has been asked already, but does anyone know exactly why the Intel desktop i875 and the DFI mobo's were used to test the P4E's instead of mainstream enthusiast/overclocker boards like the P4P800/P4C800-E/IC7/IC7-MAX3?

I find it rather odd that the DFI and Intel desktop boards were the top choices for a review of such a high-profile product.
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Toms hardware used a P4C800-E, awesome overclocker, and found the results of overclocking to be so abysmal they didn't even post speeds.

I think alot of these reviewers won't post the speeds because it will basically say THIS PRODUCT SUCKS ASS.
 
Originally posted by batotman
Toms hardware used a P4C800-E, awesome overclocker, and found the results of overclocking to be so abysmal they didn't even post speeds.
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I take everything Tom says with a grain of salt the size of a Proton.
 
Originally posted by merlin704
I take everything Tom says with a grain of salt the size of a Proton.
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All review sites are pretty much the same on this.
 
Whatever happened to toms 5ghz cpu, Would of been nice to see some followups. even a benchie @ 4.2ghz out of it??

guess they had to give it back to intel.
 
Well, the prescott does sound like it has been manufactured on a process that is a little rushed out the door.

If Intel makes a second or subsequent stepping that is a little cooler, then I'd consider it, but already the P4 is at what most people would consider "hot". By the time that stepping shows up, the LLGA 775 might be around.

I'm at the edge of refusing to put a prescott as is right now in any average customers computer... Even with the best thermal protection >80 Watts for something that is less than a square inch is scary. With the best aircooling and heatsinks, that will probably be enough to burn a finger, or melt plastic. Sure clockthrottling is supposed to turn on at 72 celsius and shutdown at 135 celsius if/when a fan breaks, but its starting to get ridiculous even for me.

For enthusiasts who water or freeze, the prescott sounds like a neat project CPU. It will probably greatly benifit from excessive cooling.

And to the schematics out there that show a BTX form factor with only one fan cooling the whole system I just have to laugh at.
 
Originally posted by merlin704
I take everything Tom says with a grain of salt the size of a Proton.
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[don's nerd hat] that's impossible! salt is composed of crystallized Na atoms!

ps: originally wrote molecules. What is the difference between a molecule and an atom? A molecule is composed of several atoms correct? I feel so foolish.
 
Originally posted by pakotlar
[don's nerd hat] that's impossible! salt is composed of crystallized Na atoms!

ps: originally wrote molecules. What is the difference between a molecule and an atom? A molecule is composed of several atoms correct? I feel so foolish.
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Thanks for pointing that out Bill Nye....
 
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