Tesla To Charge Model 3 Owners For Using Supercharging Stations?

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I can totally see this happening. You by an expensive car, you get the free charging. Buy a budget car, you have to pay for charging.

“Free Supercharging fundamentally has a cost,” Musk said during Tesla’s annual shareholders meeting, as reported by Bloomberg. “The obvious thing to do is decouple that from the cost of the Model 3. So it will still be very cheap, and far cheaper than gasoline, to drive long-distance with the Model 3, but it will not be free long distance for life unless you purchase that package.”
 

Sonicks

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I figured they'd have to start charging for those stations. Once they have enough cars on the road there's no way they can keep it free forever. The Model 3 just brings that many more cars on the road.

I'd love to get my hands on a Model 3 sometime but living in Texas and driving around the state as much as I do....it might not be the best car for travel.
 

NeonFlak

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The free charging was a major part of the decision to reserve a couple Model 3s.
 

collegeboy69us

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Free or pay -- if you dump 500K Tesla's on the road... mark my words there *will* be an instance of "charge rage" if you suddenly have 10 people trying to use 4 chargers... all 100% stuck where they are at till they get some juice.

Love the fast charging tech they have... very impressive to get 100 or 200 miles in that short of time, but it would be kind of sucky during a family road trip or something to wind up having to sit for 2 hours waiting for a charger to open up, the another hour getting a charge.

Icing on the cake -- did anyone expect Tesla to float the cost for a few hundred million kilowatt hours? (say 500K cars X 75kwh) times however many times each person hits one up for juice.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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The free charging was a major part of the decision to reserve a couple Model 3s.

Looks like it still will be an option though.

To me - depending on how the pricing pans out - I actually don't mind this approach. I'd probably only use supercharging stations once or twice a year when I drive further distances. Otherwise, the longest drive I take on a regular basis is to my parents place ~100 miles away.

I like the fact that I can get a cheaper Model 3 as a result and only pay for the Supercharging when I need it, rather than have it lumped in with the cost of the car, whether I need it or not.
 

Snowdog

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This was expected.

I wouldn't want the price buried in the price of the car, since I would almost never use it, even if it were included. It just makes the car more expensive for everyone.
 

Prod1702

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If and when I get my Model 3 or S which ever I can afford when the 3 comes out. My main plain was to use these chargers for charging, and my home charger if I need it. There is one of these chargers on my normal daily drive from home to work. I have no problem sitting there charging and playing on my phone or tablet while the charger is doing its thing. I also have no problem paying for a package that lets me use them if the cost is right.
 

B00nie

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If they break the gas monopoly, everyone will pay. A lot.
 

LatexRat

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Sounds like a fair deal to me. I currently pay $30 a month for unlimited fast charging. That's still half the price I used to pay for gas with my relatively fuel efficient old car.
 

twonunpackmule

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I figured they'd have to start charging for those stations. Once they have enough cars on the road there's no way they can keep it free forever. The Model 3 just brings that many more cars on the road.

I'd love to get my hands on a Model 3 sometime but living in Texas and driving around the state as much as I do....it might not be the best car for travel.

No. I want one for my commute for DC/Baltimore area. However, for longer trips, I would have my truck.
 
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i was driving a 2013 GMC Sierra crew cab Z92 (american luxury coach modified z71 with 6" lift and 35's, chrome and exhaust mods) and costing me $650/m in gas @ 19mpg.
I drive 65 miles one way to work.
I dreaded it as I an afford to drive the truck and waste that kinda money on gas but I sat back and did what was good for the family. Bought a prius (handed man card in too)
Now I spend $260/m payment + $80m gas plus bit insurance (forget off hand)... think it comes out to $400/m so I am essentially putting $250 in my pocket a month and keep the truck for the weekends.

now my oldest is going to dive soon and he maybe getting that car.. I wanted a Tesla but I think im gonna hold out for the Chevy Bolt....

still free charge stations will go away soon as all vendors are trying to make a 200 mile-ish traveling car... time will tell
 

Sufu

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If and when I get my Model 3 or S which ever I can afford when the 3 comes out. My main plain was to use these chargers for charging, and my home charger if I need it. There is one of these chargers on my normal daily drive from home to work. I have no problem sitting there charging and playing on my phone or tablet while the charger is doing its thing. I also have no problem paying for a package that lets me use them if the cost is right.

This is highly frowned upon and will result in warnings sent by Tesla. Superchargers are intended for travel use, not as your personal charging station.
 

Quix

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I think it's fine if the price is reasonable, people with $35,000 to spend on a new car aren't going to care if a supercharge costs $5-$10.
 

jcollett69

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This is highly frowned upon and will result in warnings sent by Tesla. Superchargers are intended for travel use, not as your personal charging station.
Maybe I'm not reading your comment correctly, but from how I read TeleFragger's comment, it is EXACTLY how quick DC chargers are to be used since it only takes a few minutes to get a vehicle charged back up. He is sitting in his vehicle the whole time. Now, leaving your vehicle on the charger for over an hour while you go shopping or eat would be frowned upon as your car is occupying the slot even after charging is complete.
 

Sonicks

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Maybe I'm not reading your comment correctly, but from how I read TeleFragger's comment, it is EXACTLY how quick DC chargers are to be used since it only takes a few minutes to get a vehicle charged back up. He is sitting in his vehicle the whole time. Now, leaving your vehicle on the charger for over an hour while you go shopping or eat would be frowned upon as your car is occupying the slot even after charging is complete.

I don't know how Tesla would (or does) enforce this but it is true that the super chargers were really only meant for long distance travel...meaning your car would likely get flagged if it's charging at a super charge station on a daily basis. It's was never intended to be 'the' charging station for your Tesla, it's simply supposed to give you enough juice to get to your next stop if you're running low.

I'd be curious to know what, if anything, happens to the battery if it's being super charged on a daily basis over a long period of time.

This 'charge' to use the super chargers should not a real deal breaker for any one. As Musk himself said, you should be charging your car anywhere you normally charge your phone. (AKA somewhere where Tesla doesn't pay for electricity)
 
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sfsuphysics

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Free or pay -- if you dump 500K Tesla's on the road... mark my words there *will* be an instance of "charge rage" if you suddenly have 10 people trying to use 4 chargers... all 100% stuck where they are at till they get some juice.

Love the fast charging tech they have... very impressive to get 100 or 200 miles in that short of time, but it would be kind of sucky during a family road trip or something to wind up having to sit for 2 hours waiting for a charger to open up, the another hour getting a charge.
Fast chargers are 30 minute, so the second group of 4 people would wait anywhere between 0-30 minutes depending upon how much charge they got, and the next 2 cars would wait between 30-60 minutes.

Now the real "charge rage" is going to be when someone plugs in, then walks off to get a bite to eat for an hour or something.
 

Wierdo

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Well yeah, that was obvious, common sense. When I reserved my Tesla 3, this was the expectation.

I can see a small fleet of cars using the chargers for free, heck they can serve as test cases, but once they get into true mass production then from a pragmatic standpoint it didn't make sense.

A great deal regardless imho, I'll be charging from home. For long trips I always rented, don't like putting allot of miles on my personal vehicle, and that's not gonna change with this car or the next.
 
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M76

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The free charging was a major part of the decision to reserve a couple Model 3s.
Anyone who expected them to freely charge 500k cars were doing it in blissful ignorance. Reality check here we go.
 

EODetroit

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Most people on the Tesla reddit actually want them to charge per minute hooked up to a SuperCharger, or something along those lines. Its more important to have a place to quick-charge when you need it than to have it for free but unavailable because some asshole decided to use it for a shopping mall parking spot way longer than was needed for a full charge.

I have to agree with that, too (I've reserved a Model 3).
 

Snowdog

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Maybe I'm not reading your comment correctly, but from how I read TeleFragger's comment, it is EXACTLY how quick DC chargers are to be used since it only takes a few minutes to get a vehicle charged back up. He is sitting in his vehicle the whole time. Now, leaving your vehicle on the charger for over an hour while you go shopping or eat would be frowned upon as your car is occupying the slot even after charging is complete.

It's not how Superchargers are intended to be used. They are intended for long distance travel, not as a replacement for home charging.

Where possible, Tesla tried to place them outside of towns on the freeway to discourage in town cheapskates, from charging at them to save a few dollars. They have sent letters to people who live close enough to a station to use it as a personal charger. I expect the fine print on future Supercharger usage agreements to make this more abundantly clear, possibly specifying cutting people off for abuse.
 

Sufu

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It's not how Superchargers are intended to be used. They are intended for long distance travel, not as a replacement for home charging.

Where possible, Tesla tried to place them outside of towns on the freeway to discourage in town cheapskates, from charging at them to save a few dollars. They have sent letters to people who live close enough to a station to use it as a personal charger. I expect the fine print on future Supercharger usage agreements to make this more abundantly clear, possibly specifying cutting people off for abuse.

Pretty much nailed it. Other quick charge dc chargers are generally not free, except a few in like dealerships.

Tesla supercharger are free to charge, but the costs were included in the car's price tag.
 

bertkelmer

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Cutting people off haha. That won't go over well, but then again once people buy the car, most won't go though the hassle of trading it in because they feel cheated
 

mope54

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Anyone who expected them to freely charge 500k cars were doing it in blissful ignorance. Reality check here we go.
Musk stated supercharging was going to be included in the Model 3s during the official announcement. I did expect that it would come with a price tag, but I was surprised more that he said it'd be included since the other interpretation, ("it's "included" for an optional fee") is stretching the plain-English meaning when someone says something's included as part of a purchase.
 

Snowdog

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Musk stated supercharging was going to be included in the Model 3s during the official announcement. I did expect that it would come with a price tag, but I was surprised more that he said it'd be included since the other interpretation, ("it's "included" for an optional fee") is stretching the plain-English meaning when someone says something's included as part of a purchase.

Supercharging equipment is included. Free electricity, not so much. No where did they say "free" as they did with previous models.
 

krotch

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i was driving a 2013 GMC Sierra crew cab Z92 (american luxury coach modified z71 with 6" lift and 35's, chrome and exhaust mods) and costing me $650/m in gas @ 19mpg.
I drive 65 miles one way to work.
I dreaded it as I an afford to drive the truck and waste that kinda money on gas but I sat back and did what was good for the family. Bought a prius (handed man card in too)
Now I spend $260/m payment + $80m gas plus bit insurance (forget off hand)... think it comes out to $400/m so I am essentially putting $250 in my pocket a month and keep the truck for the weekends.

now my oldest is going to dive soon and he maybe getting that car.. I wanted a Tesla but I think im gonna hold out for the Chevy Bolt....

still free charge stations will go away soon as all vendors are trying to make a 200 mile-ish traveling car... time will tell

You know what would probably be better? Live where you work
 
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You know what would probably be better? Live where you work

Took the job knowing the money was something I wasnt going to be able to pass up.. wife said... were not moving... so i do the commute. Super Pay, Super Bonus, Super 401k, Super other matches and soon Super Stock...

so as you can see I am SUPER STOKED to work up here!!!! LOL

it actually isnt that bad. leave my house at 5:15am and get to work by 7am-7:15 (set cruize on 60) or less if I do 70-80 which happens... home is not too bad... 3:30pm start home and get home bout 5:30pm
 

krotch

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Took the job knowing the money was something I wasnt going to be able to pass up.. wife said... were not moving... so i do the commute. Super Pay, Super Bonus, Super 401k, Super other matches and soon Super Stock...

so as you can see I am SUPER STOKED to work up here!!!! LOL

it actually isnt that bad. leave my house at 5:15am and get to work by 7am-7:15 (set cruize on 60) or less if I do 70-80 which happens... home is not too bad... 3:30pm start home and get home bout 5:30pm

I had to do that and when I got a job in Maryland. I was living in Largo, expecting to work in Suitland. Which was around 6-7 miles. Sadly, for the first 6 months, I had to drive to Manassas, Virginia. A 50 mile commute that could take anywhere from 1 hour to 4 hours to drive, depending on when you drive it. I left early, so it always took 1 hour 15 mins, except for one day where I had to go to do a urinalysis, where I got to experience the nice 4 hour drive. Although it was a 2 hour drive back. The company paid for mileage, so lucked out on that.

I still hated it, cause that's 3 hours 15 minutes gone each day just for boring driving. Never want to do that again, even if I got great pay incentives or good pay. Luckily, it's not too hard for me to find good paying jobs, so I can be choosy.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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Took the job knowing the money was something I wasnt going to be able to pass up.. wife said... were not moving... so i do the commute. Super Pay, Super Bonus, Super 401k, Super other matches and soon Super Stock...

so as you can see I am SUPER STOKED to work up here!!!! LOL

it actually isnt that bad. leave my house at 5:15am and get to work by 7am-7:15 (set cruize on 60) or less if I do 70-80 which happens... home is not too bad... 3:30pm start home and get home bout 5:30pm

I'm not sure I could handle a daily commute above 30 minutes each way.

I used to have to drive to our other facility in the state, 45 miles away, twice a week, and it would take 1hr 15min each way, and that was enough to make me want to murder people.
 

NoNRG

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Free or pay -- if you dump 500K Tesla's on the road... mark my words there *will* be an instance of "charge rage" if you suddenly have 10 people trying to use 4 chargers... all 100% stuck where they are at till they get some juice.

Love the fast charging tech they have... very impressive to get 100 or 200 miles in that short of time, but it would be kind of sucky during a family road trip or something to wind up having to sit for 2 hours waiting for a charger to open up, the another hour getting a charge.

Some of the charging stations are close to that point right now. I did a 7 hour road trip with my Dad in his Model S last weekend and the busiest supercharger we stopped at off of I-5 in CA only had two spaces open out of seven when we pulled up. When all of the Model 3s get on the road there will easily be a wait at peak times. The other charger we had to use wasn't close to full and had more than seven stalls. If Tesla identifies which stations have higher use and adds more charging spots accordingly by the time the Model 3 hits then that would help greatly.
 

collegeboy69us

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You know what would probably be better? Live where you work

You do realize not everyone has that luxury right? Not sure what state you are in, but here in Texas at least, an hour commute is normal in dallas fort worth for most people. Personally I drive 70 miles round trip every day for work, and should be taking delivery of my 2017 Volt here soon, going to be so nice not using any gas for weeks at a time, (yay work charging)

My last job before the oil bust was MWD Specialist on oil rigs in the Bakken -- my drive 'to work" was a 15 hour road trip with an overnight stay in a hotel usually to get to these remote sites. My point is, there is money to be made and sometimes you have to drive to it. I'd rather have a good paying job with upward mobility and options than a short drive to work with flat pay and zero chance for advancement.

I'm sure people in the smaller states like RI, or NJ would just freak if they had to drive that far for work. The whole country doesn't operate on one fixed outlook of I work here, I have to live here sort of thing.
 

krotch

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You do realize not everyone has that luxury right? Not sure what state you are in, but here in Texas at least, an hour commute is normal in dallas fort worth for most people. Personally I drive 70 miles round trip every day for work, and should be taking delivery of my 2017 Volt here soon, going to be so nice not using any gas for weeks at a time, (yay work charging)

My last job before the oil bust was MWD Specialist on oil rigs in the Bakken -- my drive 'to work" was a 15 hour road trip with an overnight stay in a hotel usually to get to these remote sites. My point is, there is money to be made and sometimes you have to drive to it. I'd rather have a good paying job with upward mobility and options than a short drive to work with flat pay and zero chance for advancement.

I'm sure people in the smaller states like RI, or NJ would just freak if they had to drive that far for work. The whole country doesn't operate on one fixed outlook of I work here, I have to live here sort of thing.

Thanks for telling me how long you drive, then providing absolutely zero reason why you were unable to move. Let me guess, you probably could move and have the luxury of moving, but you didn't even look into it.

You'll find that most people do have the luxury of moving, while some simply don't. Reasons could be due to being upside down on a house, housing prices have ballooned up so badly that they can't afford to move into other houses in the area, and so forth. That or the work area simply doesn't have anything there or other reasons to keep you from wanting to live there. Like working in the oil fields, mines, park ranger in a forest, or what have you.

Moving is expensive and everyone knows it's expensive, so they simply think their stuck and never actually look at available options. As for commute times, an hour is pretty standard for heavily populated areas. Seeing as Dallas/Fort Worth is the most populated city in the south, I'm not surprised. An hour commute is the norm for the DC area, when I live around there. Even here in Stuttgart, Germany, an hour commute is normal (5th largest city in Germany). Even though they're on the road for an hour, they really aren't driving far. 5-10 miles. That's cause of traffic, not distance.

50+ miles isn't normal daily driving though. Also let me take another guess on your 15 hour road trip. You got paid while driving. In other words, as soon as you got in the car, you were at work. My brother-in-law in Idaho does that. His day starts as soon as he steps into his car. Then he drives 8-10 hours a day going from site to site fixing things. They also lease him a vehicle, pay the insurance on it, and give him gas money.
 

Quix

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I live in Toronto, Canada and my 1-hour commute is 11 miles. It doesn't bother me, or I'd move, but if you live in a large city that's how it is. Weirdly I also drive past a Tesla Supercharger station every day.
 

collegeboy69us

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Thanks for telling me how long you drive, then providing absolutely zero reason why you were unable to move. Let me guess, you probably could move and have the luxury of moving, but you didn't even look into it.

You'll find that most people do have the luxury of moving, while some simply don't. Reasons could be due to being upside down on a house, housing prices have ballooned up so badly that they can't afford to move into other houses in the area, and so forth. That or the work area simply doesn't have anything there or other reasons to keep you from wanting to live there. Like working in the oil fields, mines, park ranger in a forest, or what have you.

Moving is expensive and everyone knows it's expensive, so they simply think their stuck and never actually look at available options. As for commute times, an hour is pretty standard for heavily populated areas. Seeing as Dallas/Fort Worth is the most populated city in the south, I'm not surprised. An hour commute is the norm for the DC area, when I live around there. Even here in Stuttgart, Germany, an hour commute is normal (5th largest city in Germany). Even though they're on the road for an hour, they really aren't driving far. 5-10 miles. That's cause of traffic, not distance.

50+ miles isn't normal daily driving though. Also let me take another guess on your 15 hour road trip. You got paid while driving. In other words, as soon as you got in the car, you were at work. My brother-in-law in Idaho does that. His day starts as soon as he steps into his car. Then he drives 8-10 hours a day going from site to site fixing things. They also lease him a vehicle, pay the insurance on it, and give him gas money.

I like how you made a stupid blanket statement, and then when you get called out on it, you keep making more. Some places operate completely different than other parts of the world, you have to keep that in mind when you try to define "normal". People in NY probably can't fathom that if you are in Texas, owning a car is more a necessity than a luxury. Why would I want to give up a very nice house I worked a ton on, proximity to everything important, good quiet clean neighbors. Just like I can't fathom having to go to work every morning on some piss covered, shit smelling subway filled with weirdos.

I could move if I wanted to... housing prices are such here that if I were to sell I'd make about 30K on top of what I paid. Why don't i move? I'd be stuck in a shitty area far away from friends. We get it, you hate driving, and feel the need to get on the internet and complain about it despite nobody giving a shit. People do what's best for them and in the end, it's just a job and you shouldn't tailor your life around something that's not permanent. Why would you want to uproot yourself and deal with tons of negative aftereffects all because you don't want to sit in a car for a while.
 

krotch

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I like how you made a stupid blanket statement, and then when you get called out on it, you keep making more. Some places operate completely different than other parts of the world, you have to keep that in mind when you try to define "normal". People in NY probably can't fathom that if you are in Texas, owning a car is more a necessity than a luxury. Why would I want to give up a very nice house I worked a ton on, proximity to everything important, good quiet clean neighbors. Just like I can't fathom having to go to work every morning on some piss covered, shit smelling subway filled with weirdos.

I could move if I wanted to... housing prices are such here that if I were to sell I'd make about 30K on top of what I paid. Why don't i move? I'd be stuck in a shitty area far away from friends. We get it, you hate driving, and feel the need to get on the internet and complain about it despite nobody giving a shit. People do what's best for them and in the end, it's just a job and you shouldn't tailor your life around something that's not permanent. Why would you want to uproot yourself and deal with tons of negative aftereffects all because you don't want to sit in a car for a while.

So in other words, you have the luxury to move, but you didn't. Thanks, got it.
 

flashoverride

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So in other words, you have the luxury to move, but you didn't. Thanks, got it.
Did you go to school to learn to be this much of a judgemental jerk, or was it more of a correspondence type thing? Maybe online training?
 

Sufu

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How did we go from fast DC charging to talking about commuting distance?
 

sfsuphysics

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How did we go from fast DC charging to talking about commuting distance?
It's inevitable when talking about any vehicle that does not use gasoline for a quick fill up. There's someone who says "no way this will work for me" another will say "but commuter distances should be fine" and there's always someone who lives in Texas where a 100 mile commute is normal, and around we go! :D
 
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