Tiburon1186
Gawd
- Joined
- Jan 17, 2007
- Messages
- 624
Don't support companies with caps if at all possible. I have fios in Pittsburgh with no caps. Typically i use about 175GB/month.
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America wouldn't know a free market if it bit in the arse.
Last Mile fibre should be a local independent regulated utility. Let ISP's and Cable compete for the backhaul.
Which would be even worse.
As it stands now, last mile is already heavily regulated, and is why most areas have little to no competition. It is one of the great examples of crony capitalism. Local government controls ROW access and often limits line installs to one or two ISPs, everyone else is just buying bandwidth from them and reselling, which is why the prices are quite static. In other cases local government is the one that sets the "reasonable" price, just like with cable. Aka, regulatory capture.
In areas this has been opened up, such as areas Google fought to have ROW access, as they are one of the few with pockets deep enough to force their way in, prices dropped over night. Markets Comcast said they couldn't reduce prices and network was saturated for speeds, same month Google went in, Comcast cut prices and upped speeds. Another example being many areas in Houston where there are little to no restrictions, I have 6 ISP choices at my place, and pay $80/mo for 1Gbps/1Gbps.
Except you are wrong. Bandwidth is significantly cheaper today than it was 5 years ago. 5 years ago putting in a 10 gig network was expensive now its cheap and standard. Moving towards 100 gig connections now which is driving prices further down.
International links have dropped on average about 40% per year over the past few years if I recall correctly. Just 4 years ago it was $15k/month for a 10 gig link between NY and Tokyo, today its $5k/month.
I don't know if it has "decreased in proportion", but the cost has dropped significantly over the years.
Years ago we switch the office from a T1 line to a 10mb connection. (business line, same up/down speeds, fiber into the building)
Every couple years we have at least doubled the connection speed for about the same price.
We are now at 200mb up/down.
This is on a dedication line. If I was willing to "Share" bandwidth with others in the building, I could get 500mb for about the same price.
That's same price, 20x increase in speed, no caps.
At the same time, my home line (same provider COX), has had "free speed increases", but then they raise the price a few months later.
Prices have almost doubled, while the speed has increase only 4x.
That's double the price, 4x increase in speed, and caps (it was uncapped years ago).
Main difference is that at home I have no other options, not even DSL. (i.e. a monopoly)
At work I now have 2 providers that have fiber in the building, and can get up to a 1gb connection (i.e. competition)
Government mandated monopolies are just plain wrong. If they were going to do that they should have FORCED comcast to produce verifiable metrics so they could do data driven decisions to set the "acceptable" price.
IMO its a real shame google shut down their fiber roll out. But then everyone did so...
i understand where you are coming from, however i think nutzo's response is more appropriate here. i'm not saying costs haven't come down, but i don't know if it is in proportion to the increase appetites.
what he describes below, in terms of iSP tactics, i have yet to experience.
we are typically paying around 100 USD a month for a 150MBit down/~20MBit up line, so we get shafted. but i don't recall them shifting prices accordingly, however they may have.
My post was focused on the cost to ISPs not consumers. Consumer prices have, at least in my personal experience, gone up while the cost to the ISP and large businesses (such as where I slave away) have gone down.
I agree data caps are bullshit but how the hell do you use 3TB a month for home use. Granted I live alone but I even have a hard time hitting 1TB. I consider myself a extremely high user.
For us, what we paid 40/mo for in 1997 (approx 10Mbit down, probably 10Mbit up, but this is cable Internet at a time where neighbours had no cap and shared a node), we current pay he same (roughly) when all things are considered; about 70 bucks/mo for 75Mbit down and 10Mbit up.
Are there any isps in particular that you find egregious in terms of the conduct you're describing?
In early 2000, one terabyte a month data caps? I think you might be misremember some things as that does not scale quite right.
What no way is this true? I love Spectrum. It's been solid for me. Hope they never have caps. TW never had caps either when I was in so Cal.For now. It was a condition of the merger that IIRC lapses in a few years.
I agree data caps are bullshit but how the hell do you use 3TB a month for home use. Granted I live alone but I even have a hard time hitting 1TB. I consider myself a extremely high user.
Yes it does; the FCC says so.
edit: if you wouldn't mind, kju1, could you pls share a link or two for the figures you're mentioning regarding cost decreases? it would help me sharpen my familiarity in this area.
now for the brunt of your post:
i understand where you are coming from, however i think nutzo's response is more appropriate here. i'm not saying costs haven't come down, but i don't know if it is in proportion to the increase appetites.
what he describes below, in terms of iSP tactics, i have yet to experience.
we are typically paying around 100 USD a month for a 150MBit down/~20MBit up line, so we get shafted. but i don't recall them shifting prices accordingly, however they may have.
I think one of the things people don’t realize [relates to] the question of capital intensity and having to keep spending to keep up with capacity. Those days are basically over, and you are seeing significant free cash flow generated from the cable operators as our capital expenditures continue to come down
What no way is this true? I love Spectrum. It's been solid for me. Hope they never have caps. TW never had caps either when I was in so Cal.
Man the content that came with this game blew away COD: Crap Ops. I'm not a fan of EA but this delivered so much more.
edit: if you wouldn't mind, kju1, could you pls share a link or two for the figures you're mentioning regarding cost decreases? it would help me sharpen my familiarity in this area.
now for the brunt of your post:
i understand where you are coming from, however i think nutzo's response is more appropriate here. i'm not saying costs haven't come down, but i don't know if it is in proportion to the increase appetites.
what he describes below, in terms of iSP tactics, i have yet to experience.
we are typically paying around 100 USD a month for a 150MBit down/~20MBit up line, so we get shafted. but i don't recall them shifting prices accordingly, however they may have.
What no way is this true? I love Spectrum. It's been solid for me. Hope they never have caps. TW never had caps either when I was in so Cal.
I can't find an old paper that showed data costs are fractional pennies per gb these days, but this basically tells a similar message:
https://broadbandnow.com/report/much-data-really-cost-isps/
View attachment 124846
In Europe it's not unusual for ISPs in many competitive areas to offer no cap service, they don't misleadingly claim traffic management as the excuse to make money in their PR - ISPs here plainly state it's simply for increasing profit margins from a captive market during their quarterly investor reports.
I assume 8k Netflix programming will take off there long before it does here.
I can’t believe Canada has better internet prices
i don't think we do. the best kind of internet available in my province is symmetric 150/150 with some sort of cap, but the availability of this connection is still scarce.
the more abundant offering is approximately 150/300 MBit down and 10/20MBit up respectively. they cost approximately 100-125 USD, which is not great when considering equivalently-priced offerings in america are symmetric.
our cable provider is not interested in providing a symmetric connection, which i can understand somewhat since many people do not upload much data ("l33ch" hahaha [dw i was one too, as a young WHIPPAHSNAPPAH]), whereas telus (once a crown corporation) does, but the availability sucks.