Solving Problems that Don't Need to be Solved

nutzo

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Suppose this would conflict with the data privacy plan that is proposed three headlines down?
No, because these "Privacy" law are only meant for private companies. The always exempt the government (and any companies working for the government)
 

nutzo

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This would be an extremely regressive tax - the middle class tend to live much further from their jobs than the wealthy. It's already a tough state to live in, this would crush those in rural areas and people who commute into the large cities.
You actually think the Ca dems actually care about that? (other than saying they care when election time comes around)
 

griffinhart

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You guys are acting like they are going to force people to use these plates.
READ THE DAMN ARTICLE!
"Motorists who choose to buy the plate can register their vehicles electronically and eliminate the need to physically stick tags on their plates each year. They also may be able to display personal messages — if the DMV decides to allow that."
See the word "CHOOSE" ... god damn you people are getting in an uproar over nothing...

if you don't want it, you don't have to get it.

Why do you kids always bringing politics into situations that are not political. This is not a tax, this is for people who want to be on the cutting edge of technology.
I realize this isn't forced. I read the article. But, come on, you can't seriously think that this is worth California tax payers spending any money on this test program. Cutting edge technology is cool, but a digital license plate is just silly, and crazy resource wasteful in comparison to the existing solution.
 

Lifelite

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You guys are acting like they are going to force people to use these plates.
READ THE DAMN ARTICLE!
"Motorists who choose to buy the plate can register their vehicles electronically and eliminate the need to physically stick tags on their plates each year. They also may be able to display personal messages — if the DMV decides to allow that."
See the word "CHOOSE" ... god damn you people are getting in an uproar over nothing...

if you don't want it, you don't have to get it.

Why do you kids always bringing politics into situations that are not political. This is not a tax, this is for people who want to be on the cutting edge of technology.
Oye, you stop that, you're ruining the anti-democrat/california circle jerk. :p
 

nutzo

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Because at the same time they push fuel efficiency. That means people burn less gas (a good thing) and therefore less taxes to support the infrastructure. Electrics completely avoid it. Many states are considering a mileage based system to offset reducing revenues with gas taxes. That said, They don't need a GPS tracking system to do this. If they are anything like most states, annual inspections record vehicle mileage. They already have this data.
California already push through a large increased the gas tax and registration fees.
They don't want to switch to a per mile fee, they want to add a per mile fee, along with the high taxes and registration fees.

There is no need for a per mile tax and all the privacy issues connected with it. Leave the gas tax in place and simply increase the registration fees for electric and plugin hybrids based on their battery size.
 

PhaseNoise

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Maybe I'm missing some point, but isn't the entire use case of the license plate to display a fixed value?

CA gets a lot of crap over marginal things, but boy, I am confuzzled on this one.
 

Ur_Mom

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IDIDURMOM

Well, I'm staying out of California....

I grew up reading those "Big Brother" books and watching those shows and such. No way do I trust this to be completely helpful to the consumer. Besides the high costs padding someone's pocket, you KNOW it'll be used for other purposes. Time and time again, it's been proven the three letter agencies can't stop themselves.

But, it is the "Future". I guess you take the good with the bad. I'll be a good citizen and just take the "IGOTDIDBYKJU1" plate...
 
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nutzo

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There you go again.... this is not a tax.
Like so many other things out here in California, it's starts out with an idea, then it's an option, then it becomes mandatory for new purchases, finally they mandate it for existing.

Solar panels used to be something you could add to your house, then they pushed new home builders to have them as an option. Not enough people choose solar panels (only around 15%), so now they have passed a law making them REQUIRE for all new homes build after 2020. Guess they figure most people won't mind a $30k increase on a $700k home.

Give them a few more years and they will start requiring panels be installed when you add on or remodel a home.

Try adding a room to your house in California and just see all the additional requirements to upgrade heating/cooling/etc to the current standards.
One of the reasons housing is so expensive.
 

snowcrash

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My wish is that we do more of these annoying things so that it will cause more people to leave CA. There are just too many people living here in socal. So many of them talk about leaving but never do.
 
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shansoft

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My wish is that we do more of these annoying things so that it will cause more people to leave CA. There are just too many people living here in socal. So many of them talk about leaving but never do.
You haven't seen Bay Area yet.... meat wagon....
 

atarione

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couldn't they do something similar only 10x times less expensive by putting some sort of little chip /antenna on the back of the plate to update the registration to current that could then be read by a patrol car to show the vehicles tags are current?

blah blah.. seriously dumb .. but what can you do.. The weather is good, the hassle isn't really worth it (been in Socal for 13~yrs now) ..

I did pay the extra $40 /$20yr for the black retro plates for my truck.. money well spent truck looks better with these plates than them stupid white ones.

colorado_mar18.jpg

going to get the black out emblems might as well get black plates
 
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Kdawg

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at least 10x overpriced, and not enough characters.

If it were wider like european plates, you could put full scrolling messages on it
 

Nobu

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not a tax... an optional device you can buy if you want.
But not for the government fleet of up to 175,000 vehicles that they plan to test these on (with the intent of installing them on more if the test is "successful"). And CA taxpayers have to foot the bill for that. Of course, if they vote for that, more power to'em...but I wouldn't.
 

Kongar

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The thing is California seems to have a lot of vain people and their vehicles are important social status symbols. (yes I’m generalizing - shoot me). I bet this will have high adoption because then they won’t have to attach the ugly white plates on the sports car.
 

Comixbooks

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Keep it up CA between this crap, your bullet train to nowhere and a Seattle head tax, pretty soon you won't have a state left to worry about.

You are even putting the state prisoners out of business now.
I used to work at a factory that used prison for assembly just dirty tactics I wonder how these plates would work with people being pulled over in different states.
 

Wolf_Tech

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If the plate is showing advertising while parked you should be paid for it. I love when I get a new car and see the logo for the dealer on the back. I talk to the dealer and say are you going to remove the logo he says why then I say well then guess you going to pay me for advertising your dealer. Strange how fast that logo comes off after I say that.

So theres a life tip if you have any advertising on anything you own where people can see it you should be paid for it.
 

nutzo

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The thing is California seems to have a lot of vain people and their vehicles are important social status symbols. (yes I’m generalizing - shoot me). I bet this will have high adoption because then they won’t have to attach the ugly white plates on the sports car.
I'm not going to shoot the messenger since you are correct.
I live out here, and many people buy whatever car is the current popular trend. They will complain they can't afford rent, but will be driving a $50k car they leased.

When the Prius came out, it was the trendy green thing to do, so there where tons of them on the road.
Now it's electric cars, so there are more sold in California than anywhere else.

Of course large SUV's & truck have also been a popular trend, so people are buying $50k+ SUV's and trucks, then complaining about how expensive gas is.

If gas hit $5/gallon, I'm sure electric/hybrids will become trendy again, and just like last time when gas hit $4.50/gallon, people will be dumping their SUV's at a loss and buying electric/hybrids.
 

Ranulfo

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For around ten years now, the Oregon media every so often trots out that a state university has been researching a gps tracking system to tax by the mile to make sure electric cars "pay their fair share" of the road taxes. Same old story. Just like with green energy star appliances or led light bulbs. Its all about conserving power/water or whatever resource and they when they make less money on taxes of those goods/services they raise the rates anyway. But hey, you're saving the earth!
 

FlawleZ

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I'm just hoping we can cut the cord with Cali sooner than later. Give them a big shove off into the Pacific and not look back.
 
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FlawleZ

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Yeah I am staying out of California also. Last year I was offered a 250k+ job there and I turned it down without a second thought...
Yeah that's like a 100K salary in most other states.
 

xXaNaXx

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goddammit, California....taking good jobs away from all those honest, hard-working murderers, rapists, and drug dealers in the prison system! this is a fucking outrage!
 
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N4CR

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Smells awfully corrupt there. I guess you have to feed all those foreign invaders somehow.
 

Zion Halcyon

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You guys are acting like they are going to force people to use these plates.
READ THE DAMN ARTICLE!
"Motorists who choose to buy the plate can register their vehicles electronically and eliminate the need to physically stick tags on their plates each year. They also may be able to display personal messages — if the DMV decides to allow that."
See the word "CHOOSE" ... god damn you people are getting in an uproar over nothing...

if you don't want it, you don't have to get it.

Why do you kids always bringing politics into situations that are not political. This is not a tax, this is for people who want to be on the cutting edge of technology.
This like Obamacare where if we like our provider we can keep our provider?

You know, because politicians are so honest....
 

zkostik

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As much as I hate to say this, it's likely true.

Remember the ACA (Obamacare)? There was a rider in there that hotels and resorts had to HAVE those chairs the lift handicap people into the pools. They are known as Hoyer Lift chairs. A basic one is $800 that is all manual. The average one is a couple thousand.

They did a study and found the hoyer lifts after they were installed were used < 1x/year/hotel.

When something smells like bad spending, trace the money back to it's source.
Despite lack of use, at least these have potential to be useful and improve handicap people's stay. I'm not handicap nor have anyone in the family but I'm all for making more places handicap accessible. You have to remember that a lot of the same handicap tech also gets used by elderly and people with children/strollers. There are still tons of buildings that have medical spaces and yet they don't even have handicap accessible automatic doors. Our pediatrician office is like that and doors are super heavy, suffice to say it's almost dangerous trying to get a strolled through these to get inside the building. Comparing to these stupid spy license places, it makes these lifts sound like a great deal. Here in DC area I see them in pretty much all big pools and spa/fitness centers. Small community pools don't have them. Obamacare did far beyond this in terms of questionable spending though.
 

MixManSC

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The problem with some of the ADA regulations is they are overbearing and sometimes just too much for small businesses. The example above on the pool lift chairs is a good one - on top of the hardware costs there is also the installation cost (can be a LOT as it must be anchored in a way that is can support a lot of weight) and annual maintenance to assure the contraption remains safe to use. Would also want something that is commercial grade if you are just going to have random people using it which of course is more money for something that again, in that example is proven to be used less than once a year on average. As a small business owner, I'm sorry, I will do what I can to accommodate disabled patrons but there needs to be limits.

I have a couple of small businesses. We are finishing our space in another building to move the one business into. It will be a private commercial office - it is not open to the general public. It is am ambulance transport service. Customers do not come here, ever. NO person in a wheelchair will EVER be hired. A person in a wheelchair CANNOT EVER be an emergency vehicle driver, paramedic, etc. This business requires staff to be fit and at times very quick. Yet I am still being forced to spend literally 10+ grand making sure that someone can be fully reclined in a wheelchair can do donuts in the bathrooms, I have to install a high and low water fountain, extra ramps, specific types of doors, goofy counters and sinks, etc, etc. to accommodate someone who will NEVER be in there. It is a small private business, it is my building, the business ironically caters to the disabled yet will never ever employ someone in a wheelchair, and I'm still forced to spend close to twenty fucking grand extra. Fuck that. It pisses me off to no end. We have had to redesign major parts of the floor plan because of this bullshit.

Dont get me wrong, I realize that many of the regulations have good intentions and I have no ill will towards people in wheelchairs. However forcing undue hardship on others to accommodate them is not the answer.
 

FlawleZ

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The problem with some of the ADA regulations is they are overbearing and sometimes just too much for small businesses. The example above on the pool lift chairs is a good one - on top of the hardware costs there is also the installation cost (can be a LOT as it must be anchored in a way that is can support a lot of weight) and annual maintenance to assure the contraption remains safe to use. Would also want something that is commercial grade if you are just going to have random people using it which of course is more money for something that again, in that example is proven to be used less than once a year on average. As a small business owner, I'm sorry, I will do what I can to accommodate disabled patrons but there needs to be limits.

I have a couple of small businesses. We are finishing our space in another building to move the one business into. It will be a private commercial office - it is not open to the general public. It is am ambulance transport service. Customers do not come here, ever. NO person in a wheelchair will EVER be hired. A person in a wheelchair CANNOT EVER be an emergency vehicle driver, paramedic, etc. This business requires staff to be fit and at times very quick. Yet I am still being forced to spend literally 10+ grand making sure that someone can be fully reclined in a wheelchair can do donuts in the bathrooms, I have to install a high and low water fountain, extra ramps, specific types of doors, goofy counters and sinks, etc, etc. to accommodate someone who will NEVER be in there. It is a small private business, it is my building, the business ironically caters to the disabled yet will never ever employ someone in a wheelchair, and I'm still forced to spend close to twenty fucking grand extra. Fuck that. It pisses me off to no end. We have had to redesign major parts of the floor plan because of this bullshit.

Dont get me wrong, I realize that many of the regulations have good intentions and I have no ill will towards people in wheelchairs. However forcing undue hardship on others to accommodate them is not the answer.
Is this not something you can write off? I would think if you are a small business or entity there would be room for deductions that included ADA expenditures.
 
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Despite lack of use, at least these have potential to be useful and improve handicap people's stay. I'm not handicap nor have anyone in the family but I'm all for making more places handicap accessible. You have to remember that a lot of the same handicap tech also gets used by elderly and people with children/strollers. There are still tons of buildings that have medical spaces and yet they don't even have handicap accessible automatic doors. Our pediatrician office is like that and doors are super heavy, suffice to say it's almost dangerous trying to get a strolled through these to get inside the building. Comparing to these stupid spy license places, it makes these lifts sound like a great deal. Here in DC area I see them in pretty much all big pools and spa/fitness centers. Small community pools don't have them. Obamacare did far beyond this in terms of questionable spending though.
Not cost effective. In case you haven't noticed the average hotel stay price is $100/night (generous amount) Paying a couple thousand for something that is used < once per year is a burden on business.
 

MixManSC

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Is this not something you can write off? I would think if you are a small business or entity there would be room for deductions that included ADA expenditures.
To an extent, yes. That being said the overall construction costs without the added expense already offset our potential taxes already. Also that does zero for the fact that I really dont have that extra cash to piss away this year which I will never see anything for.
 

zkostik

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Not cost effective. In case you haven't noticed the average hotel stay price is $100/night (generous amount) Paying a couple thousand for something that is used < once per year is a burden on business.
I'm sure they can write it off, these things also last a very long time so it's likely a one time expense. I'm sure usage varies from place to place, some things are just necessary. Probably by the same rule these places can say their automated handicap door doesn't get used my either so why put one in. If you are in business providing service to public, you have to make it universally accessible. IMHO, companies that don't are just completely careless and their people in charge never been on the handicap end of things. I don't see this as such a big burden on business as it does have legitimate use and can make their guest stay better and safer.
 

kju1

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I'm sure they can write it off, these things also last a very long time so it's likely a one time expense. I'm sure usage varies from place to place, some things are just necessary. Probably by the same rule these places can say their automated handicap door doesn't get used my either so why put one in. If you are in business providing service to public, you have to make it universally accessible. IMHO, companies that don't are just completely careless and their people in charge never been on the handicap end of things. I don't see this as such a big burden on business as it does have legitimate use and can make their guest stay better and safer.
Writing it off does NOTHING for a business that just doesnt have the money to spend...
 

zkostik

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Writing it off does NOTHING for a business that just doesnt have the money to spend...
Sounds like they are already bankrupt or in a wrong line of business then, improving handicap access would not kill their business. If you serve public and have facilities with public access then you have to accommodate for them. Otherwise it would be same things here as it was in Russia where nobody gave a rat's ass about disabled or elderly people. Even now there's little infrastructure or accommodation for them. Of course it has be reasonable but there needs to be something for them, it is our duty as civilized society to do that.
 
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