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Solve this problem with reflow?

D

Drewcifer

n00b
Joined
Mar 28, 2011
Messages
17
Hey folks,

This is my first post on this forum, of hopefully many to come. Just happened across here when looking for a solution to this problem one of my clients recently came across.

So, the story: I had this client's laptop on my bench about a month ago and everything was working great when it left my bench and now she's getting blocky horizontal discolored lines, and [insert malfunctioning video card malady] on her screen whenever she boots up. Seems obvious that it's a video card issue and I'm just wondering if it's something that might be solved with the heat gun. I've never used the reflow technique before, but it looks like fun. She doesn't want to buy a new motherboard, and I don't want to lose her business. I might be grasping for straws here, but does anybody else think this might be a valid solution? Below is a link to video she sent me of the problem.

TL;DR: Client has apparent video card problem, should I attempt reflow in light of getting a new motherboard?

Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Rbj9cu-WCo

-/Drewcifer
 
Absolute first thing I would do is replace the stock thermal compound.

Remove the heatsink (depending upon the laptop it might be a combination CPU/video card heatsink), remove the old thermal compound, clean with rubbing alcohol, apply fresh thermal compound of your choice (I recommend Arctic Silver Ceramique) and reinstall heatsink.

If you are still getting screen corruption then it could be pointing to a malfunctioning convertor.
 
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If the simple stuff like heatsink remounting doesn't fix anything, then I'd say yeah the heatgun trick should be the next step, since once you get the point where your only other option is replacing the motherboard there's no harm in trying.
 
You're ruining my fun! I was looking forward to trying this out :)

This particular model shares the heatsink with the CPU, I don't doubt it needs new thermal paste and some copper shims. It produces this problem on a cold boot though, so its probably not that it's overheating right away. She's coming by tomorrow to drop the machine off so I'll see if it plugs into an external monitor then. Just trying to get a step ahead on this one. I wouldn't be terribly disappointed if it was an inverter issue.

-/Drewcifer
 
AceGoober said:
If you are still getting screen corruption then it could be pointing to a malfunctioning invertor.
Click to expand...

Inverters don't work that way. The only thing they do is provide power to the backlight.

Maybe check drivers, though generally they're not going to cause something like that. Reflow is probably your next best bet.
 
Inverters don't work that way. The only thing they do is provide power to the backlight.
Click to expand...

Which is obviously not lacking, so I'm gonna have to agree with you that reflow is the next best option.

Thanks for your help folks, I'll repost how it went. If it turns out well I've got a stockpile of dead cards that may need nothing more than a new fan after this.

I see myself spending too much time on this forum in the near future.

-/Drewcifer
 
Drewcifer said:
Which is obviously not lacking, so I'm gonna have to agree with you that reflow is the next best option.

Thanks for your help folks, I'll repost how it went. If it turns out well I've got a stockpile of dead cards that may need nothing more than a new fan after this.

I see myself spending too much time on this forum in the near future.

-/Drewcifer
Click to expand...

Yeah it can be addicting. Hope it works for you.
 
That looks like an Nvidia laptop chip dying. Instead of "reflowing" it and wasting your client's time and money, file a claim with http://nvidiasettlement.com/ to have it replaced if the model is listed there.

Fake edit: Actually you cannot send anymore applications for replacement/reimbursement (deadline was March 14th) so you are SOL. You may continue with your "I've never used the reflow technique before, but it looks like fun" course of action.
 
Depends if you are going to do a thorough reflow using flux in a proper reflow station or are you just gonna cowboy it with the tin-foil and heat gun method.
 
Tin-foil and a heat gun doesn't count as a proper station? :)

Well that's that, I suppose.

-/Drewcifer
 
Hehe, well you should at least have a way to get accurate temperature readings of the chip because if you overdo it, it will actually crack. I'm not saying it won't work with the tinfoil heat-gun method just take the necessary precautions. I'd also recommend making a custom copper shim for the GPU so that the fix lasts longer. Which brand/model is it btw?
 
Which brand/model is it btw?
Click to expand...
Compaq Presario F700

I intend on being quite careful. I just ordered a temperature gun, but it won't be here in time for the project. Some of the videos I watched showed practicing distance, temperature, and duration on a piece of solder first... figured I'd give that a go.

-/Drewcifer
 
Be careful with the heatgun, they get much hotter than needed and can quickly damage components.

A kitchen oven works just as well (for free!) at more accurate temperatures (or at the least, are just as accurate). The fumes aren't particularly noxious either. I've used an oven to fix my graphics card and two of my friends have fixed dieing laptops with one as well.
 
Unfortunately that model wasn't included on the class action suit, (only up to the Presario F500) so yeah your only option is reflowing it. Good luck, and let us know how it went. :cool:
 
Crispy002 said:
Be careful with the heatgun, they get much hotter than needed and can quickly damage components.

A kitchen oven works just as well (for free!) at more accurate temperatures (or at the least, are just as accurate). The fumes aren't particularly noxious either. I've used an oven to fix my graphics card and two of my friends have fixed dieing laptops with one as well.
Click to expand...

I'm terrified of lingering toxins, I try to intentionally expose myself to only one or two sources.

-/Drewcifer
 
Drewcifer said:
I'm terrified of lingering toxins, I try to intentionally expose myself to only one or two sources.

-/Drewcifer
Click to expand...

My father used to bake welding rods in the kitchen to remove moisture, I suppose my upbringing is showing through.

It's worth noting that the RoHS act removed/reduced most of the "bad stuff" allowed in electronics such as lead, mercury, and cadmium. Regardless, your concern is certainly valid.

Edit:
Also, I can confirm the above posters are correct, the inverter is not responsible for the artifacts. The GPU/vRAM are the likely culprits.
& welcome to [H].
 
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Hey folks,

Looks like the reflow worked! I have a functioning screen. I only turned it on for a brief second, as I have some copper shims coming later today and don't want to risk overheating the GPU again.

I'll post back with a video of it running furmark... Provided everything holds up :)

-/Drew
 
The laptop is a Compaq Presario F700 that means it has a Geforce 7000M in it. And yeah I already figured that it was a bumpgate chip but the model number was not included in the class action suit
 
So I got the machine back together and everything seems to be working fine. I ran Furmark in stability test mode for 20min and it stayed at an operating max of 61c without the shims.

I'm very appreciative of everybody's willingness to help throughout this process as I learned a great deal and will now have to refrain myself from going crazy on all my dead cards. Now to find a somebody with a problem with which I can help.

As promised, a link to video of Furmark on the F700:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uc9RhM9y8Cw
 
As someone working in the same field, I can give you this word of warning:
While reflowing generally works, it is at best only a temporary solution, expect the same issue to come back in the 1-3 months time. I would recommend advising your customer as much and telling them their laptop is on borrowed time and they should seek a replacement ASAP
 
well that doesn't sound like much fun =P. Are they just using crappy solder? What causes it to die again?
 
Basically, reflowing does not fix the underlying defect in gpu manufacturing and the microfractures will reappear on the video chip. You can keep on reflowing when it happens, but eventually you will end up with a non-functional motherboard. Depending on customer expectations, this may mean extra grief for you.
 
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