Samsung new PVA screens

[psyside]

Kinda funny; look at his sig "Samsung T240(Nec 2490 soon) "

NEC = over priced

That's why it is comming soon. He has to save up for it.

HeHeHe

Dave

Yes i have Samsung T240 ?? and know how "GOOD" it is ?? for that price there are many better monitors,about Nec is the only expensive, monitor wich actually worth the money.
Its not about having the best its about enjoying what you get i cant watch movies on the T240 the picture totaly fade away at dark parts of the movie,even games look bad
so i tought i have bad unit? but its not the first samsung monitor having similar issues to bad i was stupid enough to make the same mistake again.

 

[albovin]

Omerta, people participate in technical forums because they ARE picky about monitors.

 

[nomu]

Those reviews are targeted at people who aren't picky about everything in their monitor. Those reviews are MORE than enough for the average person. Obviously, for someone like you, you'd want something more technical, but most people do not care...

Uhh, I've got nothing against the 305T, but who wouldn't be picky about everything in a $1500 monitor? Most of your links were like a review of a power supply that said "We plugged all our stuff into it, and it all worked fine. Highly recommended." The bit-tech article even reviewed a monitor that came with a hardware calibrator, and they didn't report any calibration results

In fact, they didn't include any pictures of the monitor turned on, and they put up the example images from lagom but not the results of the tests on the actual monitor!

Okay, the 305T reviews are standard (mostly useless), but the bit-tech XL30 review might be the worst review of anything I've ever seen. I wonder if that guy works for Eurogamer now..

 

[solaris54]

Omerta, people participate in technical forums because they ARE picky about monitors.

Im picky about monitors but there is a limit on how much I will pay for one.
Sometimes common sense has to prevail.

 

[Omerta]

Omerta, people participate in technical forums because they ARE picky about monitors.

I am picky about monitors, too. For example, no way will you find me with a shitty TN monitor or even crappy VA/IPS monitors.

But there is a limit when it comes to it. Do I care if colors shift when I move my head 10 feet to the right? No. It's a monitor...I view it head on. Do I care about the way pixels are structured? No...I don't as long as the monitor looks good. Do I care if color accuracy is good? A little, but I mainly care how GOOD the colors look. I think you'll find most people on this forum are less picky when it comes to their monitors than you...

Also, can I ask you an honest question...Do you really view your monitors all over the place and require great viewing angles? Do you actually like the aggressive coating on most IPS panels that look like dirt?

Uhh, I've got nothing against the 305T, but who wouldn't be picky about everything in a $1500 monitor? Most of your links were like a review of a power supply that said "We plugged all our stuff into it, and it all worked fine. Highly recommended." The bit-tech article even reviewed a monitor that came with a hardware calibrator, and they didn't report any calibration results

In fact, they didn't include any pictures of the monitor turned on, and they put up the example images from lagom but not the results of the tests on the actual monitor!

Okay, the 305T reviews are standard (mostly useless), but the bit-tech XL30 review might be the worst review of anything I've ever seen. I wonder if that guy works for Eurogamer now..

I didn't say anything about not being picky. I meant being picky to the point of wanting to see stuff like this

Second of all, pictures taken with a camera are not an accurate representation of how the panel looks in real life. I'd be much more interested in people's impressions and what they see with their own eyes.

 

[nomu]

I didn't say anything about not being picky. I meant being picky to the point of wanting to see stuff like this

Second of all, pictures taken with a camera are not an accurate representation of how the panel looks in real life. I'd be much more interested in people's impressions and what they see with their own eyes.

From a $1500 monitor you don't want to see measurements and calibration results? Not even a $3000 one?

The magazine "reviews" (more like blurbs) you posted are slightly less useful than newegg reviews. They are less useful because at least newegg gives an idea of how likely it is to receive a defective monitor, while the magazines get review samples that are likely cherry-picked by the manufacturer.

The hardwarecanucks review is about as good as a user testimonial on a forum like this one (minus hardware measurements.) Glad to have it, I guess. But I would hope there is a better review from a more in-depth site out there, and fortunately there is (digitalversus).

 

[albovin]

Omerta, I don't know how often and what words should I use to explain to you that good viewing anlgles are important for viewing head on.

Do you really view your monitors all over the place and require great viewing angles?

As I said, I view my monitor straight on. That's why I require great viewing angles because I don't want to look "all over" to see what I cannot see straight on on PVA.

Do you actually like the aggressive coating on most IPS panels that look like dirt?

You are funny.
Do I like Eiffel Tower that stands in London?
Shall I say "yes" or "no"?
Look at modern IPS.
Apple and Hazro utilize glossy 24" IPS.
NEC 21-24-26" have "regular" AG coating.
24-26" HP and Planar do the same.
Only 30" panels have more pronounced AG coating effect.
" Can I ask you an honest question": since when has 30" been the "most" numerous in the world of monitors?

You can see mistakes in "professional" reviews too.
For example, prad.de often makes mistakes in their Video/DVD section.
The latest review of the NEC P221W (PVA):
"In addition, for video playback of HD content via the PS3, the strengths of the s-PVA panel shine through, especially in scenes which are rich in contrast. Both in 1080p and in 720p, small and dark details are retained and the monitor uses its good contrast ratio to the full extent.
Very strong contrasts on the right beside the centre of the scene and at the same time, the finest dark colour gradients in the shadow of the content in the left of the image. These are no problem for the P221W."
For this juicy comment they attach the photo of the movie scene that actually represents the opposite:
1. Distorted geometry
2. Loss of details

Upper: the photo from prad.de (the NEC P221W - PVA)
Lower: same scene on the NEC 2490WUXi

 

[daveswantek]

^^^ The funny thing is that I can see the differences in the pics above on my lousy S-PVA screen. Now how can that be???

Yes i have Samsung T240 ?? and know how "GOOD" it is ?? for that price there are many better monitors,about Nec is the only expensive, monitor wich actually worth the money.
Its not about having the best its about enjoying what you get i cant watch movies on the T240 the picture totaly fade away at dark parts of the movie,even games look bad
so i tought i have bad unit? but its not the first samsung monitor having similar issues to bad i was stupid enough to make the same mistake again.

The Samsung T240 is a TV masquerading as a do it all monitor that sells for $300. The NEC sells for about 4 times that, so it is in a totally different class. The problem with your post is that you are judging Samsung's entire product line and Company for that matter based on one of their low end displays. Samsung as a whole is not over rated, they are just another competitor in the market place. Some of their stuff is good and some is bad. The same is true for NEC. The 24" uxi is actually worth the price, but their 30 inch version sucks at like $2200.00. No one company gets it right all of the time.

My advice is do more research before you buy, and buy from a place like amazon, costco, or Dell that has a liberial return policy.

Enjoy what ever you choose

Dave

 

[Omerta]

From a $1500 monitor you don't want to see measurements and calibration results? Not even a $3000 one?

The magazine "reviews" (more like blurbs) you posted are slightly less useful than newegg reviews. They are less useful because at least newegg gives an idea of how likely it is to receive a defective monitor, while the magazines get review samples that are likely cherry-picked by the manufacturer.

The hardwarecanucks review is about as good as a user testimonial on a forum like this one (minus hardware measurements.) Glad to have it, I guess. But I would hope there is a better review from a more in-depth site out there, and fortunately there is (digitalversus).

The 305t is already factory calibrated, and for the most part, I don't care about calibration results. I'm more interested in what looks good. Again, we just look for different things when it comes to whether or not we like a monitor...

Omerta, I don't know how often and what words should I use to explain to you that good viewing anlgles are important for viewing head on.


As I said, I view my monitor straight on. That's why I require great viewing angles because I don't want to look "all over" to see what I cannot see straight on on PVA.

You are funny.
Do I like Eiffel Tower that stands in London?
Shall I say "yes" or "no"?
Look at modern IPS.
Apple and Hazro utilize glossy 24" IPS.
NEC 21-24-26" have "regular" AG coating.
24-26" HP and Planar do the same.
Only 30" panels have more pronounced AG coating effect.
" Can I ask you an honest question": since when has 30" been the "most" numerous in the world of monitors?

You can see mistakes in "professional" reviews too.
For example, prad.de often makes mistakes in their Video/DVD section.
The latest review of the NEC P221W (PVA):
"In addition, for video playback of HD content via the PS3, the strengths of the s-PVA panel shine through, especially in scenes which are rich in contrast. Both in 1080p and in 720p, small and dark details are retained and the monitor uses its good contrast ratio to the full extent.
Very strong contrasts on the right beside the centre of the scene and at the same time, the finest dark colour gradients in the shadow of the content in the left of the image. These are no problem for the P221W."
For this juicy comment they attach the photo of the movie scene that actually represents the opposite:
1. Distorted geometry
2. Loss of details

Upper: the photo from prad.de (the NEC P221W - PVA)
Lower: same scene on the NEC 2490WUXi

I've had the Planar H-IPS monitor, and I've noticed NOTHING like that in those photos. I think coming from an H-IPS to a 305T, i would've noticed the loss of detail. And I view my 305T straight on. Give me a photo to check for black crush, and I will tell you whether or not I notice any. Those photos don't prove anything, especially considering the fact I can see the IPS picture with full detail and notice the black crush on the PVA panel straight from my own PVA panel. Second of all, how do you know prad.de is wrong? Maybe what they see with their eyes look different than the pictures their camera took.

I know of Apple's glossy 24" screen. I've seen it and it looks great. But it is 24" and is a no go..


I mainly care about 30" screens...and none of the 30" IPS screens are perfect either...But have fun being limited to 24" monitors...

In fact, take a look at these photos:
S-IPS on the left with the 305T(s-pva) on the right

Again here:
Samsung 305T:

LG 30"

 

[albovin]

The funny thing is that I can see the differences in the pics above on my lousy S-PVA screen. Now how can that be???

Think.

 

[daveswantek]

The 305t is already factory calibrated, and for the most part, I don't care about calibration results. I'm more interested in what looks good. Again, we just look for different things when it comes to whether or not we like a monitor...

I've had the Planar H-IPS monitor, and I've noticed NOTHING like that in those photos. I think coming from an H-IPS to a 305T, i would've noticed the loss of detail. And I view my 305T straight on. Give me a photo to check for black crush, and I will tell you whether or not I notice any. Those photos don't prove anything, especially considering the fact I can see the IPS picture with full detail and notice the black crush on the PVA panel straight from my own PVA panel. Second of all, how do you know prad.de is wrong? Maybe what they see with their eyes look different than the pictures their camera took.

I know of Apple's glossy 24" screen. I've seen it and it looks great. But it is 24" and is a no go..

I mainly care about 30" screens...and none of the 30" IPS screens are perfect either...But have fun being limited to 24" monitors...

Ooops! You just uncovered the problem with IPS snobs. They only have IPS panals, so they do not know that S-PVA panals have improved dramatically over the past 2 years. Seriously can these boys show pics of displays that they have sitting next to each other. Not; just outdated pics from prad.de. Then we hear that prad.de is wrong when they praise PVA improvements.

Here is a good test for black crush: http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php

I can see every square as compared to the background on my Dell 2709W. Post a pic of it on your 305T next to your LG so we can hear albovin cry.

Black-crush was a problem on my 2407WFP, but not on my new 2709W.

Dave

 

[psyside]

^^^ The funny thing is that I can see the differences in the pics above on my lousy S-PVA screen. Now how can that be???




The Samsung T240 is a TV masquerading as a do it all monitor that sells for $300. The NEC sells for about 4 times that, so it is in a totally different class. The problem with your post is that you are judging Samsung's entire product line and Company for that matter based on one of their low end displays. Samsung as a whole is not over rated, they are just another competitor in the market place. Some of their stuff is good and some is bad. The same is true for NEC. The 24" uxi is actually worth the price, but their 30 inch version sucks at like $2200.00. No one company gets it right all of the time.

My advice is do more research before you buy, and buy from a place like amazon, costco, or Dell that has a liberial return policy.

Enjoy what ever you choose

Dave

And what panels are mid end if T240 is low end ?? imho T240 is overrated in w/e
class it belongs.. and about other samsung monitors name one good if we don't
count 275T and 305T ?

 

[vick1000]

Interesting how the close-up photos of the 305T are a vibrant image with no uniform dark areas, we need more evidence I would say. PVA have no issue if you sit far enough back, unless you are viewing grayscale images anyway, that's why they make good TVs.

The technology has come a long way for sure, the Smasung 40" LED TV was on display at Best Buy the other day, and I was checking for gamma shift. It is much less pronounced than before, but of course this is on a $2K LED HDTV, not a monitor.

IPS have a problem as well, with the glow or haze (all LCD types have this to an extent except the 2490wuxi), but just as gamma shift on VA, it is less pronounced the further you move back from the display. I can deal with the glow much easier than the gamma shift though, for computer use (especially movies). Nothing looks worse than a dark horizontal panning image in a movie, where the gamma is shifting as you track the image.

But this discussion should really have it's own thread, not high jack this one in which we are speculating on Samsungs possible new panels.

 

[Omerta]

Ooops! You just uncovered the problem with IPS snobs. They only have IPS panals, so they do not know that S-PVA panals have improved dramatically over the past 2 years. Seriously can these boys show pics of displays that they have sitting next to each other. Not; just outdated pics from prad.de. Then we hear that prad.de is wrong when they praise PVA improvements.

Here is a good test for black crush: http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php

I can see every square as compared to the background on my Dell 2709W. Post a pic of it on your 305T next to your LG so we can hear albovin cry.

Black-crush was a problem on my 2407WFP, but not on my new 2709W.

Dave

I can see every square, too.

And I would, but those aren't my pics.

 

[nomu]

The 305t is already factory calibrated, and for the most part, I don't care about calibration results. I'm more interested in what looks good. Again, we just look for different things when it comes to whether or not we like a monitor...

/smack How would you know without buying it first if no reviewer included those measurements?

Hey, reviewers who know the first thing about monitors. Amazing.

Again, would a review like the pc mag ones help you buy a power supply? Unless they said it caught fire and gave it 0 stars, their reviews are useless no matter what product they feature. If they can't compete with the quality of sites like tftcentral/jonnyguru, they are just helping credulous people make uninformed decisions.

 

[Omerta]

/smack How would you know without buying it first if no reviewer included those measurements?

Hey, reviewers who know the first thing about monitors. Amazing.

Again, would a review like the pc mag ones help you buy a power supply? Unless they said it caught fire and gave it 0 stars, their reviews are useless no matter what product they feature. If they can't compete with the quality of sites like tftcentral/jonnyguru, they are just helping credulous people make uninformed decisions.

How would I know what? If the picture looks good? I have eyes you know? That combined with amazon's return policy is good enough for me.

Also, good picture quality is quite subjective and measurements mean nothing to me till I see something with my own eyes...not that I even understand what those graphs and measurements mean. Power supplies are totally different than monitors, and I only read HardOCP for PSU reviews...

But anyway, you keep looking at numbers and graphs, and I'll continue looking at my display...

 

[solaris54]

/smack How would you know without buying it first if no reviewer included those measurements?

Hey, reviewers who know the first thing about monitors. Amazing.

Again, would a review like the pc mag ones help you buy a power supply? Unless they said it caught fire and gave it 0 stars, their reviews are useless no matter what product they feature. If they can't compete with the quality of sites like tftcentral/jonnyguru, they are just helping credulous people make uninformed decisions.

Geez who the hell cares about graphs and measurements............sheep?
Use your brain and eyes and make the final decision on how it looks to you whether it be TN, PVA or IPS doesnt really matter...........it doesnt matter!!!

 

[nomu]

Geez who the hell cares about graphs and measurements............sheep?
Use your brain and eyes and make the final decision on how it looks to you whether it be TN, PVA or IPS doesnt really matter...........it doesnt matter!!!

/smack How would you know without buying it first

/smack

 

[solaris54]

/smack

Well I have bought and sold a few monitors looking for the right one.

 

[nomu]

How would I know what? If the picture looks good? I have eyes you know? That combined with amazon's return policy is good enough for me.

Also, good picture quality is quite subjective and measurements mean nothing to me till I see something with my own eyes...not that I even understand what those graphs and measurements mean. Power supplies are totally different than monitors, and I only read HardOCP for PSU reviews...

But anyway, you keep looking at numbers and graphs, and I'll continue looking at my display...

The graph means exactly what you said: the 305t has good colors out of the box. Unless you make your buying decisions on the reviews on the purchasing page, you would need a (more than one, in fact) reviewer to make those measurements if you wanted to know before you bought it.

There are some things reviews can't tell you. For everything else, read a review that wasn't written in 20 minutes before lunchtime. Or hell just walk into Best Buy and buy it off the shelf like 99% of the suckers in the world, whatever you like.

 

[Lostman]

As I said, I view my monitor straight on. That's why I require great viewing angles because I don't want to look "all over" to see what I cannot see straight on on PVA.

My understanding is that gamma shift present in PVA/MVA panels reveals more when you're looking at an angle (as seen in your photo). However, if you can't see the details you want head on, maybe you should just crank up the brightness? That should help!

 

[psyside]

The brightness aint help already tried that.

 

[Omerta]

My understanding is that gamma shift present in PVA/MVA panels reveals more when you're looking at an angle (as seen in your photo). However, if you can't see the details you want head on, maybe you should just crank up the brightness? That should help!

simply not the case with the recent PVA panels

And pyside, that's not surprise. You're using a tn panel...

 

[albovin]

My understanding is that gamma shift present in PVA/MVA panels reveals more when you're looking at an angle (as seen in your photo). However, if you can't see the details you want head on, maybe you should just crank up the brightness? That should help!

That does not help.
You can get a sort of relief if you crank gamma down below standard (if monitor controls or calibration kit permits) to pull details out of darkness at the cost of less deep black and lower CR.
But that's not a remedy. Gamma change has global effect. The part of the image that needs correction will be "corrected", but the rest of the image that does not require correction will be "corrected" too...= spoiled.
As you see in this photo of 30" PVA:

the same image looks different in different parts of the screen due to PVA angle colorshiift - note how ~10 degrees difference changes the image. This intrinsic *VA problem requires local treatment specific for every bit of the panel that is technically impossible. Therefore PVAs are not able to display color wise uniform picture from any point of view.

 

[Omerta]

Albovin, care to explain why the 305T pictures I posted looked so much better than the S-IPS LG? I see you're totally ignoring it...


Also, to your post above, those pics are dumb. All my IPS panels would do the same thing from different angles. In fact, my H-IPS panel would make grays look almost purple/blue at an angle. But you probably just ignore it when it's on an IPS panel. Every single 30" IPS panel suffers from those problems...not just PVA

BTW, based on those pics, I think the XL30 looks like a terrific monitor.

But anyway...just for fun again:
S-IPS on the left with the 305T(s-pva) on the right

Again here:
Samsung 305T:

LG 30"

And let's look at some H-IPS/S-IPS pics

Address Albovin, address it..

 

[albovin]

Albovin, care to explain

There is a PVA monitor test review that can be used as a tutorial for beginners. It pretty much explains PVA specifics for practical use.

Same for the best model based on IPS technology.

Get help from PCHardwareHelp - general LCD technology info.

Tons of info.

 

[vick1000]

You can post all the pics you want, VA shift is a fact. None of the pics are showing the VA shift because they are either too far away or they don't have a uniform dark image displayed.

The turtle image is not the best way of showing it, all you need is a small image of a square at something like 100*100 pixels and make it say 10/10/10 r/g/b and tile it as your wallpaper. If you sit directly infront and center of the monitor, the outside squares will appear lighter and the center darker. Now if your gamma is way off, and brightness set really high (+250 cd/m2) the effect is reduced, but will stil be visible on a uniform gray image.

The other way of seeing it, is to make a solid background of 72/72/72 and then you get what I call the "sphere of shadow in your face effect", where the center of the screen is like a cateract on your eye.

If you do not notice this in normal use, I urge you NOT to try what I suggested, just enjoy your monitor.

 

[solaris54]

You can post all the pics you want, VA shift is a fact. None of the pics are showing the VA shift because they are either too far away or they don't have a uniform dark image displayed.

The turtle image is not the best way of showing it, all you need is a small image of a square at something like 100*100 pixels and make it say 10/10/10 r/g/b and tile it as your wallpaper. If you sit directly infront and center of the monitor, the outside squares will appear lighter and the center darker. Now if your gamma is way off, and brightness set really high (+250 cd/m2) the effect is reduced, but will stil be visible on a uniform gray image.

The other way of seeing it, is to make a solid background of 72/72/72 and then you get what I call the "sphere of shadow in your face effect", where the center of the screen is like a cateract on your eye.

If you do not notice this in normal use, I urge you NOT to try what I suggested, just enjoy your monitor.

LOL..........yes that VA shift is hard to find. You would have to be sitting at exactly the right angle and maybe with the perfect light conditions etc etc etc you might see it.

 

[vick1000]

LOL..........yes that VA shift is hard to find. You would have to be sitting at exactly the right angle and maybe with the perfect light conditions etc etc etc you might see it.

And your point is.....

 

[solaris54]

And your point is.....

My point is that you will not even see it under normal usage.

 

[Omerta]

There is a PVA monitor test review that can be used as a tutorial for beginners. It pretty much explains PVA specifics for practical use.

Same for the best model based on IPS technology.

Get help from PCHardwareHelp - general LCD technology info.

Tons of info.

Just what I thought, no where can you explain why the 305T trumps the LG S-IPS monitor in those pics. Just links to a bunch of things which do NOTHING to address the pics or my post. Typical albovin fashion. BTW, you've linked those same pics and links practically your whole tenure here at [H] as if they are some kind of holy text written by god, and they still do nothing to prove anything. Like mentioned earlier, every monitor/panel is different. Anyhow, back to the point...


Let's get down to it. Color shift affects every panel, admittedly it affects VA panels more than IPS panels. However, they still do affect IPS panels. IPS panels, as a whole, have less uniform backlighting, so you can get similar effects on IPS as color shift on VA panels. On many IPS panels, you can move a solid block of color (especially on 30") to different parts of the screen, and the color will be different shades. No one panel is perfect, and as long as that is the case, I will take the superior blacks and contrast over an IPS panel ANY day. And there is nothing you can say to make others with the same opinion as mine think otherwise.

I mean seriously, it is like your father invented the IPS panel or something. Why do you defend it so religiously? I've myself admitted the faults of VA panels numerous times, and also pointed out there are faults with EVERY panel, and no one LCD panel is perfect. However, you have been unwilling to give and take, and all you do is post pics as though this is some type of LCD museum showcase. Learn to give and take and learn to understand where others are coming from. You like IPS panels because of the better viewing angles--I'm fine with that. But don't act like they're perfect because they're not--not by a long shot.

When it comes down to it, every panel has its ups and downs, and it's up to the user to prefer what ups and downs he/she is willing to deal with. In essence, stop bashing every panel besides IPS panels just because you prefer them. And I think this thread should come to a close...

 

[albovin]

I defend nothing.
There is nothing to defend.
Read, understand, educate yourself.

 

[solaris54]

Nuff said:

Viewing Angle

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...-syncmaster-305t-30-lcd-monitor-review-6.html







Overall, the viewing angles of the Samsung 305T are excellent with very little color shift as you more off-center. There was a bit of an increase in image contrast as I went more than 150° off-center but it was almost unnoticeable. I found this to be one of the best monitors I have used to date when it comes to viewing angles and this really came in handy considering it is mounted on a wall which means that direct viewing is sometimes hard.

 

[Omerta]

Nuff said:

Viewing Angle







Overall, the viewing angles of the Samsung 305T are excellent with very little color shift as you more off-center. There was a bit of an increase in image contrast as I went more than 150° off-center but it was almost unnoticeable. I found this to be one of the best monitors I have used to date when it comes to viewing angles and this really came in handy considering it is mounted on a wall which means that direct viewing is sometimes hard.

lol, i think you forgot the pics...

 

[chrcoluk]

You can post all the pics you want, VA shift is a fact. None of the pics are showing the VA shift because they are either too far away or they don't have a uniform dark image displayed.

The turtle image is not the best way of showing it, all you need is a small image of a square at something like 100*100 pixels and make it say 10/10/10 r/g/b and tile it as your wallpaper. If you sit directly infront and center of the monitor, the outside squares will appear lighter and the center darker. Now if your gamma is way off, and brightness set really high (+250 cd/m2) the effect is reduced, but will stil be visible on a uniform gray image.

The other way of seeing it, is to make a solid background of 72/72/72 and then you get what I call the "sphere of shadow in your face effect", where the center of the screen is like a cateract on your eye.

If you do not notice this in normal use, I urge you NOT to try what I suggested, just enjoy your monitor.

what you just explained I do get on TN monitors, basically when using a TN screen it is never a universal view, my head is either too low too high, or too far to one side to get no issues.

As far as VA goes (yes I know I am involved again but seems everyone is carrying this discussion on anyway) I do not get what you say. For me to see a shift (and only slight at that) I have to go to a extreme angle.

What noone has explained to me yet is why in posted pictures of VA panels at slight angles we see clear loss of colours (too bright usually) yet when I view my VA panel at much higher angles I get no such affect, something isnt right. Either people playing games with pictures or cameras are a lot more sensitive than the human eye, I expect its the latter.

The silver shimmer affect on my e-IPS is noticeable when close to the screen and only off at slight angle, this in my opinion gives my IPS screen a worse viewing angle than my VA screen because I only have to move slightly to get picture distortion on my IPS whilst on my VA I have to go to an extreme angle. The distortion only goes away on the my IPS when I am far from the screen. Although dark colours mainly stay on my IPS nowhere near as bad as blacks if I stand up now in front of my IPS basically the dark colours on this page shift, they appear a bit washed out by the silver shimmer.

I am offering a honest viewpoint here, I got no vendetta for either technology, but it seems there is a lot of IPS fanboys here.

Believe me if my VA performed like in the pictures posted I would not have used it for 2+ years, it would have been replaced like my TN's were.

 

[vick1000]

My point is that you will not even see it under normal usage.

That's where you are mistaken. The procedure I outlined is simply a way to exaggerate what is already a problem, and make it more visible in photos, etc...

The problem is there in dark movies or the gray backgrounds of this site, to some it is just not as noticable.

 

[vick1000]

what you just explained I do get on TN monitors, basically when using a TN screen it is never a universal view, my head is either too low too high, or too far to one side to get no issues.

As far as VA goes (yes I know I am involved again but seems everyone is carrying this discussion on anyway) I do not get what you say. For me to see a shift (and only slight at that) I have to go to a extreme angle.

What noone has explained to me yet is why in posted pictures of VA panels at slight angles we see clear loss of colours (too bright usually) yet when I view my VA panel at much higher angles I get no such affect, something isnt right. Either people playing games with pictures or cameras are a lot more sensitive than the human eye, I expect its the latter.

The silver shimmer affect on my e-IPS is noticeable when close to the screen and only off at slight angle, this in my opinion gives my IPS screen a worse viewing angle than my VA screen because I only have to move slightly to get picture distortion on my IPS whilst on my VA I have to go to an extreme angle. The distortion only goes away on the my IPS when I am far from the screen. Although dark colours mainly stay on my IPS nowhere near as bad as blacks if I stand up now in front of my IPS basically the dark colours on this page shift, they appear a bit washed out by the silver shimmer.

I am offering a honest viewpoint here, I got no vendetta for either technology, but it seems there is a lot of IPS fanboys here.

Believe me if my VA performed like in the pictures posted I would not have used it for 2+ years, it would have been replaced like my TN's were.

It just has to be a image with dark detail that is horizantally uniform, such as a landscape at night with a treeline, the outer portions of the treeline will have more detail, the center will be darker (from normal viewing position head on). Some people just are not bothered by it, just as some prefer the glow of IPS because it does not change the gamma of the actual image.

 

[Lostman]

vick1000: how big screen we're talking about? 30"? 24"? I guess the bigger the screen gets, the more of a visible problem gamma shift is. But I think 23" would be to small to make a difference. (I might be wrong though!)

 

[vick1000]

vick1000: how big screen we're talking about? 30"? 24"? I guess the bigger the screen gets, the more of a visible problem gamma shift is. But I think 23" would be to small to make a difference. (I might be wrong though!)

It's bad enough on a 21", but some of the newest panels have improved somewhat. It's still present and unbearable for me though.

 

[albovin]

some of the newest panels have improved somewhat. It's still present and unbearable for me though.

Please, what panels have improved and how do you know that?