Philips BDM4065UC - 40" 4K 60Hz monitor thread

[rinaldo00]

The Seiki is supposedly going to use the same panel as the Philips, so hopefully will have similar QC. Crappy part is that they are going to be releasing an updated version, whether through firmware or a completely new unit, that will have HDMI 2.0 and DP 1.3, in Q2. Those updates won't have much affect on current hardware, but future wise they may be beneficial, i.e. 4k@120hz+ Just seems silly to do this if it can't be done via firmware update.

What model? The 40" 4K Seiki model seen at CES has a 6 bit panel from the review I read here
http://www.pcgamer.com/philips-bdm4065uc-monitor-review/

Key line
In terms of colour, the Philips panel is rocking a true 8-bit screen, but looks to be using some sort of frame rate control (FRC) to mimic the effects of a 10-bit panel. Philips are quoting a full 1.07 billion colours with the BDM4065UC as opposed to the 16.7 million you'd expect from a standard 8-bit monitor. That puts it well ahead of the Seiko we saw at CES in that context.

 

[Happy Hopping]

I carried out PWM tests on all screens for comparison. This is the black line test with shutter set at 1/25

From XPS L521x laptop - not sure what panel it is.

From DELL IPS 30" - You can see the less dramatic PWM effect of the CFL backlight

This is the Philips with the backlight dimmed. It's interesting to see how sharp the light goes on-off compared the other screens

The Philips shown here is dimmed with the colours set at about 30% and backlight 100%. So PWM is not a problem if you tackle it this way. The only thing I found however is that once the colours are reduced like this, changing the contrast doesn't seem to have much effect in the calibration area. But this doesn't matter as the contrast seems to be best left at 50%


You can save several presets. To help control circadian rhythm I have it bright in the morning and dim at night.

This is the Philips screen showing mor red or yellow on the left and blue on the right

.

I have read the above twice. The "black line" test, what should it look like? What is the reference object look like? Because you have some B/W photo, then you have some color photo, then some blue photo

Also, the photo of the red/orange on the font. What is the size of the text when you take that photo? Or is that some sort of zoom in?

 

[wirk]

Barry1972 n00bie, 19 Days, yours is gr8 review despite your baby forum age .

The colour bleed effectively reduces resolution of this display though visually this may not be a problem. But I wonder how a close-up of one pixel wide vertical/horizontal white lines on black background would look, any coloration effects?

 

[pipould]

I received the monitor a few days ago from AmazonUK and so have had some time to play with it and share my first impressions. It was to replace a 3008wfp (30" Dell IPS panel). I've been waiting a year for this as all the previous 4k models were too small. It came well padded with some sort of stiff sponge, so for people who were receiving these with broken screens then they must have really been thrown about or pierced. For size you can see below the 15" laptop 30" and 40".

There were no dead pixels though I did notice a slight horizontal unevenness in the backlight and I can make out the position of the LEDs but normally you would not notice this. It is just noticeable on some plain colours like grey. Below is a photo with WordPad.

I did notice it slightly dimmer in the corners due the VA cone effect people were discussing so a curved screen would have helped.
When first using it I thought this is going to be a pain in the neck being so high, but just like when I went from 15" to 21" and 21" to 30" they all initially seemed too large, but like those you get used to it and then can't go back.
I thought one advantage of a 4K screen would be I could get two windows side by side but now I seem to be more comfortable with three windows focusing mainly on the middle window and the width of one of these windows is 6 pixels wider than the 30" with 2 windows (3860/3 Vs 2560/2)

One of the big topics here was PWM. But Philips supplies this with software called SmartControl. It does seem to operate a bit slow but I think it may have to do with it communicating with screen. Anyway, what I found is you can keep the screen on max brightness and reduce the brightness by the colour calibration which is very effective.

I carried out PWM tests on all screens for comparison. This is the black line test with shutter set at 1/25

From XPS L521x laptop - not sure what panel it is.

From DELL IPS 30" - You can see the less dramatic PWM effect of the CFL backlight

This is the Philips with the backlight dimmed. It's interesting to see how sharp the light goes on-off compared the other screens

The Philips shown here is dimmed with the colours set at about 30% and backlight 100%. So PWM is not a problem if you tackle it this way. The only thing I found however is that once the colours are reduced like this, changing the contrast doesn't seem to have much effect in the calibration area. But this doesn't matter as the contrast seems to be best left at 50%


You can save several presets. To help control circadian rhythm I have it bright in the morning and dim at night.

You can then switch between the presets from the desktop which is a lot easier than trying to navigate with the joystick behind the screen.

SmartControl also allows splitting the screen in various ways like DisplayFusion though I haven't tried DisplayFusion on this so don't know how it compares. But the way this works is it highlights areas to snap into as you move your window around. Strangely it works for all browsers but not Firefox.

You can also calibrate as shown below, by making the square blend in but this depends on the vertical angle it is viewed at, so not sure how helpful it is.

It also came with a factory calibration results sheet below.

SmartControl doesn't seem to control everything. Sharpness for example is not included so you have to use the rear joystick. But I found it not worth changing the sharpness from 50% as it just got very blurry setting it any lower.
Regarding reflectivity of the screen I have the 3 screens below with the Philips in the middle all reflecting the same object. Though the object may appear slightly more blurry than it is, due to the bokeh effect as I forgot to change aperture setting.

I thought the reflections were going to be a problem as when I switched it on the first time, the setting sun blasted through the window off the back wall and then I couldn't see a third of the screen. So you may have to close the curtains or put the blinds down in that situation. But generally it's not been a problem, and even with the 3008wfp matt screen, there would still be a glow from reflections that made it harder to see anyway.

Some unexpected things occur with such a high resolution screen such as I noticed when playing HD quality video that it looked a bit grainy on this screen compared to the normal HD screen I suppose just because it is so much sharper. I also need to upgrade the mouse(1000dpi) to a higher dpi but have got used to using the existing one anyway until the new one arrives. Also finding the pointer on the screen is a bit harder.

Depending on which country supplies it, you get a different set of cables. None of which were useful as mine, from Italy, didn't come with USB 3.0 cable or Mini DP to DP cable.
One thing I was a bit bothered about, is the test seems a bit like it has a halo around the sides. Maybe it's a characteristic of VA panels, but I'm not sure its normal. I think I have got used to it or my calibrating has reduced it.

This is the Philips screen showing mor red or yellow on the left and blue on the right

This is the laptop screen L521x showing much less colour bleed.

This is a close up of the Philips showing the pixels



What do you think? Is this normal for VA panels? Maybe the only way to avoid this is to get an 8K screen with windows scaling in future.

One other question. Does anyone know if it is possible to use the headphone output of this to drive subwoofer and centre speakers only, and use the screens built in speakers for the left and right? I would like to get rid of the other surround speakers floating around the desktop.

Love ya ! That's exactly the kind of feedback I was looking for, perfect

 

[Happy Hopping]

To fix the cursor problem, all you (among others) need to do is to download the bigger cursor and replace it under your theme. That way, it's easier to find your cursor. I have been using that since I am using the 30" at 2560x1600

 

[Barry1972]

I have read the above twice. The "black line" test, what should it look like? What is the reference object look like? Because you have some B/W photo, then you have some color photo, then some blue photo

Also, the photo of the red/orange on the font. What is the size of the text when you take that photo? Or is that some sort of zoom in?

The PWM black line test is described further down on the linked page below.
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/pulse_width_modulation.htm

The text was about 3mm high on the 40" screen. It was the bold black looking text, more of which can be seen on this website. http://www.rte.ie/

 

[Barry1972]

Barry1972 n00bie, 19 Days, yours is gr8 review despite your baby forum age .

The colour bleed effectively reduces resolution of this display though visually this may not be a problem. But I wonder how a close-up of one pixel wide vertical/horizontal white lines on black background would look, any coloration effects?

Here are more test photos.

This is produced in Autocad with a 1 pixel wide line and black and grey text.

This is produced in MS Word with black and grey text.

The text and line are definitely better in Autocad. I'm beginning to think its the antialiasing that is causing the problem.

 

[Happy Hopping]

The PWM black line test is described further down on the linked page below.
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/pulse_width_modulation.htm

The text was about 3mm high on the 40" screen. It was the bold black looking text, more of which can be seen on this website. http://www.rte.ie/

w/ a 3 mm high text, can you actually see the red line w/o zoom in? If so, at what distance is your eyes looking at the screen?

and for those who want large cursor do a search for these 2 files:

Ecliz_Cursors_by_Mefhisto.zip

iStyle_Cursor.zip

I have been using them since 2012

 

[jphughan]

One of the big topics here was PWM. But Philips supplies this with software called SmartControl. It does seem to operate a bit slow but I think it may have to do with it communicating with screen. Anyway, what I found is you can keep the screen on max brightness and reduce the brightness by the colour calibration which is very effective.

So PWM is not a problem if you tackle it this way. The only thing I found however is that once the colours are reduced like this, changing the contrast doesn't seem to have much effect in the calibration area. But this doesn't matter as the contrast seems to be best left at 50%

SmartControl also allows splitting the screen in various ways like DisplayFusion though I haven't tried DisplayFusion on this so don't know how it compares. But the way this works is it highlights areas to snap into as you move your window around. Strangely it works for all browsers but not Firefox.

Fyi, according to TFT Central, adjusting brightness using calibration tools will adversely affect your contrast ratio, so you may want to start with simply lowering the brightness on the panel itself to see whether PWM is a problem for you before you take that approach. Nobody here has yet reported having a problem with PWM, so it's probably worth a shot. It's also of course much less effort to set up, though I suppose you've already expended the effort.

As for window management, I posed a while back about an app called Gridy that I used while I had this display. Its default configuration is designed to allow you to nudge windows in tiny pixel increments around the display, but some creative tweaking allows you to define large regions (I created a 4x2 grid to mimic 8 halves of 4 1080p displays) and from there you can use keyboard hotkeys or mouse dragging to size windows to fill a target grid area, move them from one grid to another, size them to span multiple adjacent grids, etc. It was pretty cool and definitely helped me make better use of the real estate, seemed a lot more flexible and faster to use than SmartControl, and unlike DisplayFusion is free.

PM me if you're interested in Gridy but need some help setting it up. If you describe what you want, I can probably throw together an appropriate INI file to achieve it.

 

[wirk]

Here are more test photos.

This is produced in Autocad with a 1 pixel wide line and black and grey text.

This is produced in MS Word with black and grey text.
The text and line are definitely better in Autocad. I'm beginning to think its the antialiasing that is causing the problem.

Indeed, this looks like filtering applied in MS Word which uses it for nice looking letters. Autocad is perfect so no worry about this monitor ability to display with full genuine 4K resolution.

 

[Lateralus]

^ Regarding that MS Word pic, I would be interested in seeing a comparison between ClearType on and off.

 

[wirk]

^indeed, this would be a good test to see what MS Word is doing though Autocad shows the monitor is fine.

BTW, a different but relevant test would be for grey level reproduction. Simply generate stripes of grey levels from 0-255 across the screen to see if there is any banding and what is the least noticeable grey level difference. Also what is the lowest level which can be differentiated from black. Barry, can you do it?

 

[Barry1972]

^ Regarding that MS Word pic, I would be interested in seeing a comparison between ClearType on and off.

Im travelling at the moment and unfortunately won't be back for 2 weeks or so, but before I left I did a quick test with clear-type off. It came out clean if a little less clear.

But then I put cleatype back on and this time I didnt bother go through the tuner option just clicked next to what ever was already selected, and it came out better than before. So Im thinking maybe the cleartype tuning process didnt work so well for me.

^indeed, this would be a good test to see what MS Word is doing though Autocad shows the monitor is fine.

BTW, a different but relevant test would be for grey level reproduction. Simply generate stripes of grey levels from 0-255 across the screen to see if there is any banding and what is the least noticeable grey level difference. Also what is the lowest level which can be differentiated from black. Barry, can you do it?

I didn't have time to do lots of lines in autocad in different greys and anyway that would probably involve using Autolisp which I haven't done for years. So I did a few lines in the standard grey options. They all looked clean in Autocad.

However, I am now noticing the colour bleed on the laptop screen when it is disconnected from the monitor so maybe the cleartype setting works for one but needs different calibration for another screen. But I cant do any more testing for a while.

 

[Happy Hopping]

On my other 30", I also have problem with clear type. In the end, my decision is if the text looks okay, don't touch it.

 

[wirk]

OK guys, we may stop here. This montor reproduces details perfectly as the single pixel line tests show.

 

[Seyumi]

My screen is annoying it pops back into 30HZ at least 50% of the time the monitor goes on standby and the only way to fix it is a computer restart. I'm about to just turn that off the screen going into sleep but I'm worried about the "image burn in" the monitor warns you about (seriously I thought that type of BS ended back in the Plasma days). Can anyone confirm who leaves their monitors on all the time that they don't have any burn-in issues? Thanks.

 

[shadow85]

Can this monitor be used as a TV? If so how is the quality as a TV and for gaming. I was going to get a 4K IPS TV soon.

 

[General Lee]

Can this monitor be used as a TV? If so how is the quality as a TV and for gaming. I was going to get a 4K IPS TV soon.

It doesn't have a TV tuner in it if that's what you're asking. There's a Philips TV that uses the same panel and is actually cheaper I believe, but it of course doesn't have the same monitor capabilities.

 

[shadow85]

It doesn't have a TV tuner in it if that's what you're asking. There's a Philips TV that uses the same panel and is actually cheaper I believe, but it of course doesn't have the same monitor capabilities.

Well I do already own a LG 31MU97 monitor, so I may aswell just get a 4K IPS TV rather than another 4K IPS monitor.

 

[richardsim7]

Dropped to £598.78 on Amazon UK: http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00OO9YWR0/

 

[Happy Hopping]

My screen is annoying it pops back into 30HZ at least 50% of the time the monitor goes on standby and the only way to fix it is a computer restart. I'm about to just turn that off the screen going into sleep but I'm worried about the "image burn in" the monitor warns you about (seriously I thought that type of BS ended back in the Plasma days). Can anyone confirm who leaves their monitors on all the time that they don't have any burn-in issues? Thanks.

I'm also interest in hearing the input of others on this issue as well. How many people have this problem?

Martha Stewart? What's your take on this?

P.S. those Martha Stewart Collection Plush Robe at Macy's really sucks

 

[DarkStar02]

I'm also interest in hearing the input of others on this issue as well. How many people have this problem?

Martha Stewart? What's your take on this?

P.S. those Martha Stewart Collection Plush Robe at Macy's really sucks

This might be a stupid answer but... how about just using a screen saver?

 

[Stonyer]

I'm also interest in hearing the input of others on this issue as well. How many people have this problem?

Martha Stewart? What's your take on this?

P.S. those Martha Stewart Collection Plush Robe at Macy's really sucks

Hi, I had this same problem when I got my monitor. The only solution it seems is to power cycle the monitor and keep checking your resolution settings until it is back at 60 Hz. I have the same problem and solution in both hackintosh and windows.
On the sleep mode, I dont think you can turn it off, if you know how to let me know.

 

[Martha Stewart]

I'm also interest in hearing the input of others on this issue as well. How many people have this problem?

Martha Stewart? What's your take on this?

P.S. those Martha Stewart Collection Plush Robe at Macy's really sucks

This does happen every once in a while. I believe this is more of a driver issue than an issue with the monitor its self. But it doesn't happen often so its not really an issue for me.

 

[Lasorous]

Hey guys I currently have the asus rog swift (2560x1440p), it's fantastic for gaming, but I just feel the picture quality seems substandard for the price paid (£700). I was looking at this Philips monitor and reading through this discussion, do you guys think it would be worth selling the Asus rog swift and getting this 4k Philips monitor or stick with what I have. All I would do is be gaming on it but picture quality is what matters to me!

 

[Lateralus]

Hey guys I currently have the asus rog swift (2560x1440p), it's fantastic for gaming, but I just feel the picture quality seems substandard for the price paid (£700). I was looking at this Philips monitor and reading through this discussion, do you guys think it would be worth selling the Asus rog swift and getting this 4k Philips monitor or stick with what I have. All I would do is be gaming on it but picture quality is what matters to me!

There's no question that the Philips would be an improvement as far as image quality. There will be more blur of course, since this monitor is nowhere near as fast as the ROG Swift, but colors and black levels will be hugely improved and the consensus is that it's fast enough for all but hardcore gamers (like competitive FPS players).

Of course, since the Swift and other TNs aren't known for having great image quality, you could move to just about any decent VA or IPS panel and see an improvement in that area. If image quality is truly what matters to you then you'd be well served by just about any monitor that's not a TN.

 

[pipould]

Could we have confirmation that the screws at the back are well M4 screws ?

 

[richardsim7]

I've seen the word M4 screws get thrown around this thread a fair bit, if you search back you should find it

 

[pipould]

So did I, but I would like a confirmation from someone who has a proper stand

 

[Martha Stewart]

Hey guys I currently have the asus rog swift (2560x1440p), it's fantastic for gaming, but I just feel the picture quality seems substandard for the price paid (£700). I was looking at this Philips monitor and reading through this discussion, do you guys think it would be worth selling the Asus rog swift and getting this 4k Philips monitor or stick with what I have. All I would do is be gaming on it but picture quality is what matters to me!

yes

out side of motion clarity, the Philips destroys the Asus


Philips > Every other monitor(until the Acer Predator XR341CK 34" Curved 3440 x 1440 144Hz comes out )

 

[Barry1972]

My screen is annoying it pops back into 30HZ at least 50% of the time the monitor goes on standby and the only way to fix it is a computer restart. I'm about to just turn that off the screen going into sleep but I'm worried about the "image burn in" the monitor warns you about (seriously I thought that type of BS ended back in the Plasma days). Can anyone confirm who leaves their monitors on all the time that they don't have any burn-in issues? Thanks.

I noticed this happening early on, even while using it occasionally it jumped to 30Hz so I enabled the resolution warning, and if it did happen just unplugged and plugged the Display Port cable back into the laptop. Though it didn't happen much later on maybe due to driver or software changes.

 

[Lasorous]

Thank you very much for the response my friend!! To be honest I do not play any games competitively, apart from Starcraft 2, most games I enjoy are the immersive solo rpg games, eg The Witcher I went with Asus ROG swift as I believed if would have a better panel than it has due to what they stated about it being a "special TN", unfortunately after previously owning a ips display, the rog swift just looks so bland in comparison, and the black levels are atrocious! ! so would you recommend this Philips monitor then over it ?

 

[myst4ry]

Does the Ergotron MX come with the correct standard/screws to fit this monitor?

 

[jphughan]

I've seen the word M4 screws get thrown around this thread a fair bit, if you search back you should find it

Yes, the VESA mounting holes on the back are M4-sized, which is apparently odd since typically 200x200 patterns use M6 holes, but there you have it.

Does the Ergotron MX come with the correct standard/screws to fit this monitor?

Yes, the MX comes with M4 bolts that are long enough to support the display. However:

- The MX won't by itself support a 200x200 display such as this one, so you'll need an adapter plate. That plate will need to come with mounting hardware (bolts and nuts) to allow you to attach the plate to the Ergotron, or you'll need to get appropriately sized bolts and nuts from a hardware store. I used the Mount World 1056 adapter plate available on Amazon, which comes with countersunk screws that sit flush with the plate to provide a flat surface on which to mount the display.

- Unlike the LX, the MX does not have a depth adjustment arm. This means that to bring the display forward or push it back, you'll also be moving it from side to side, which may be frustrating and will definitely limit the exact mount location for the Ergotron on your desk.

- The MX's vertical travel seems very limited. Looking at the Dimensional Illustration, it appears that at its max height, the center of the mount plate will be 10" off the deck. This display's center is just about 10" from the bottom, so the MX will either barely not work at all or you'll ONLY be able to have it resting on the deck, not suspended a few inches higher in case you want to squeeze anything under it (small speakers, USB hub, whatever). The LX, particularly the Tall Pole version, would be a better match for this display.

 

[Micael]

Amazon.co.uk must have received some monitors since my order delivery date just got changed to "Delivery estimate: Wednesday, 18 February 2015 - Thursday, 19 February 2015"

 

[Happy Hopping]

This does happen every once in a while. I believe this is more of a driver issue than an issue with the monitor its self. But it doesn't happen often so its not really an issue for me.

What's the ver. of your driver? Perhaps it's a function of different people using different ver. of the driver. I assume you're using Nvidia?

anyhoo, why don't you people set the monitor to NEVER turn off? Leave it on. And if you do go elsewhere for 20 min. say, you can turn off the monitor by yourself and turn it back on afterward instead of waiting for the standby?

I have a similar problem w/ my display port on my HP ZR30 2560x1600.

It won't come out of the sleep mode if I move the mouse sometimes. So I turn off the monitor and back on again, and it works.

But obviously still at 60Hz

but at DVI port, never have any problem

 

[Lasorous]

There's no question that the Philips would be an improvement as far as image quality. There will be more blur of course, since this monitor is nowhere near as fast as the ROG Swift, but colors and black levels will be hugely improved and the consensus is that it's fast enough for all but hardcore gamers (like competitive FPS players).

Of course, since the Swift and other TNs aren't known for having great image quality, you could move to just about any decent VA or IPS panel and see an improvement in that area. If image quality is truly what matters to you then you'd be well served by just about any monitor that's not a TN.

Thank you very much for the response my friend!! To be honest I do not play any games competitively, apart from Starcraft 2, most games I enjoy are the immersive solo rpg games, eg The Witcher I went with Asus ROG swift as I believed if would have a better panel than it has due to what they stated about it being a "special TN", unfortunately after previously owning a ips display, the rog swift just looks so bland in comparison, and the black levels are atrocious! ! so would you recommend this Philips monitor then over it ?

 

[jphughan]

Thank you very much for the response my friend!! To be honest I do not play any games competitively, apart from Starcraft 2, most games I enjoy are the immersive solo rpg games, eg The Witcher I went with Asus ROG swift as I believed if would have a better panel than it has due to what they stated about it being a "special TN", unfortunately after previously owning a ips display, the rog swift just looks so bland in comparison, and the black levels are atrocious! ! so would you recommend this Philips monitor then over it ?

If you can't give up 144 Hz, there's always this coming out: http://www.pcgamer.com/acer-unveil-super-quick-144hz-g-sync-ips-monitor/

 

[Micael]

Thank you very much for the response my friend!! To be honest I do not play any games competitively, apart from Starcraft 2, most games I enjoy are the immersive solo rpg games, eg The Witcher I went with Asus ROG swift as I believed if would have a better panel than it has due to what they stated about it being a "special TN", unfortunately after previously owning a ips display, the rog swift just looks so bland in comparison, and the black levels are atrocious! ! so would you recommend this Philips monitor then over it ?

If you value black levels then it's a no brainer, this monitor black levels are probably the best that you can get in monitors (far far above any IPS).

 

[croc_]

$930 shipped to the USA on ebay now.

Philips 4065UC - $930 shipped
BenQ BL3201PH - $950 shipped
LG 34UM95 - $870 shipped