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PC powering off while washing machine running

V

Varmint

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 10, 2006
Messages
1,854
I just built my Haswell build a week ago, and yesterday while the washing machine was running, the PC started powering off and rebooting every 15-30 seconds, even while on the static BIOS screen.

The PSU is a new Seasonic 650RM. Do you guys think this is a bad PSU, or is the PSU doing what it's supposed to in the event of a current fluctuation from the wall socket?
 
Get a UPS or put the PC on a different circuit. If its actually the washing machine causing fluctuations in the circuit, this would tell you pretty quick.
 
That sounds pretty f'd up.

Definitely get that computer on a circuit not shared with the washing machine ASAP.
 
Parja said:
That sounds pretty f'd up.

Definitely get that computer on a circuit not shared with the washing machine ASAP.
Click to expand...

Isn't it a good idea to have your washing machine on its own circuit anyway? (Kinda like that dryer, but thats 220, so its a bit different)
 
Parja said:
That sounds pretty f'd up.

Definitely get that computer on a circuit not shared with the washing machine ASAP.
Click to expand...

Well, my old Core 2 build ran on this outlet for 3 years without ever doing this, so not sure why the new PC is suddenly bothered by the washer.

We reran the washer and this time it didn't power off, but it did freeze for 30 seconds several times.

I can't move the PC, it's in the office. I think a UPS is my best bet.
 
Varmint said:
Well, my old Core 2 build ran on this outlet for 3 years without ever doing this, so not sure why the new PC is suddenly bothered by the washer.

We reran the washer and this time it didn't power off, but it did freeze for 30 seconds several times.

I can't move the PC, it's in the office. I think a UPS is my best bet.
Click to expand...
What about just swapping circuits for a test? Is it only the washing machine thats causing this or does it happen randomly too? If you put the PC on a different circuit and its still misbehaving, then you can eliminate the whole washing-machine connection. If it doesn't misbehave, then you'll have to address it between the PC and the outlet (i.e. UPS), but if it does then your problem is more likely related to the PSU itself
 
I highly recommend you get a multimeter (or borrow one) and monitor the amps at the socket your pc is connected to. Check for a sudden drop when the washing machine kicks on.

Even if you get an UPS, you may get constant alarms when the machine turns on (most have an option to silence it, but only after it sounds).
 
mavrocket said:
I highly recommend you get a multimeter (or borrow one) and monitor the amps at the socket your pc is connected to. Check for a sudden drop when the washing machine kicks on.
Click to expand...

You would want to be monitoring the voltage, not the current.
 
Even a small UPS like a 600VA one will do the trick nicely and even out the power supply.

But that is some serious interference you are getting. I would really consider checking out that electrical circuit to make sure that there isn't a short or that animals haven't ruined the wires.
 
You probably have either a voltage droop from bad wiring or are getting line noise from the washer's motor.

Line noise can almost always be fixed by plugging the whole computer system into a capacitor-inductor line filter, and the better surge protectors and battery backups have such filters. A real UPS will also solve this problem because it isolates the computer from the AC lines. To test a backup or surge protector for the presense of a line filter, plug the computer system into one AC socket and a noise maker (vacuum cleaner, laser printer, old-style desk fluorescent lamp that requires holding down a button for a few seconds to start the lamp) into the other AC socket of the same receptacle. Boot the computer to the BIOS screen or a memory diagnostic (don't run anything that uses the hard disk -- it's best to have it disconnected), and turn the noise maker on and off a few times. If the computer doesn't reboot or freeze, then you probably have a good line filter.

Voltage droop is serious and needs to be fixed because something is getting hot in the wiring. The easiest way to check for it is with a hair dryer plugged into a Kill-A-Watt. Turn off everything else on the circuit. When the hair dryer is running full blast, the voltage shouldn't droop by more than 2-3 volts. Try to test the last outlet on the circuit or at least both outlets where the computer plugs in. I had an outlet that drooped down to 90V when loaded because a push-in connector on an upstream AC outlet was loose.
 
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Activate: AMD said:
What about just swapping circuits for a test? Is it only the washing machine thats causing this or does it happen randomly too? If you put the PC on a different circuit and its still misbehaving, then you can eliminate the whole washing-machine connection. If it doesn't misbehave, then you'll have to address it between the PC and the outlet (i.e. UPS), but if it does then your problem is more likely related to the PSU itself
Click to expand...

The PC's been running for 2 weeks, never an issue except when the washer was running. I did sometimes see the lights dim in the computer room when the HP printer turns on.

But seems to me a voltage drop should have affected my old PC, but it never did. So maybe something's wrong with my Haswell build?
 
Maybe your old PC has a better or more oversized PSU. I had a power problem in a condo I rented back in 2005 after some of my neighbors did AC upgrades. Lights flickered, TVs & CRTs glitched, server box rebooted, etc. My main rig stayed up though. I was running a dual Opteron box with a PC Power & Cooling Turbo-Cool 510. That was before OCZ bought them out & messed everything up. The machine with the Turbo-cool in it didn't even miss a beat. I bought a couple of UPSs. That took care of the problem.
 
When building a friend computer using parts from his old computer everytime someone turned on the tv it would shut down the computer. Ended up having to buy a new powersupply. My guess would be that.
 
zandor said:
Maybe your old PC has a better or more oversized PSU. I had a power problem in a condo I rented back in 2005 after some of my neighbors did AC upgrades. Lights flickered, TVs & CRTs glitched, server box rebooted, etc. My main rig stayed up though. I was running a dual Opteron box with a PC Power & Cooling Turbo-Cool 510. That was before OCZ bought them out & messed everything up. The machine with the Turbo-cool in it didn't even miss a beat. I bought a couple of UPSs. That took care of the problem.
Click to expand...

soulwatch5 said:
When building a friend computer using parts from his old computer everytime someone turned on the tv it would shut down the computer. Ended up having to buy a new powersupply. My guess would be that.
Click to expand...

The old PC had a Corsair 520HX, the new one is a Seasonic 650RM, they're both high quality, and both Seasonic, but yeah, it could be the Seasonic is defective.

But I'm wary of RMAing the 650RM and having Seasonic say there's nothing wrong with it.

I also suspect maybe it's the low-power Haswell that's more sensitive to voltage drops?

I do have a Corsair 400W I could try, just don't have the time with 2 little kids. :)

I think a UPS is the best route, since voltage drops aren't good even if the PC doesn't reboot.
 
Update: Seasonic wants me to RMA it. Guess I'll put my Corsair 400W in it and RMA the 650RM.
 
mavrocket said:
I highly recommend you get a multimeter (or borrow one) and monitor the amps at the socket your pc is connected to. Check for a sudden drop when the washing machine kicks on.
Click to expand...

As the other guy said, voltage, not current (don't call current "amps" as you only use "amps" when talking about an actual current measurement). Current would have to be measured in series (a bit of a pain). If you tried to measure it "at the outlet" that would cause a short, destroying the meter (at minimum) and creating electrocution and fire hazards. Sparks will fly.

Please don't give electrical advice unless you get it right. The wrong advice could literally kill someone. Even if you knew what you meant but messed up your post, that's unacceptable in the world of electrical.
 
IMHO...
The third best way to fix this is a UPS.
The second best way is to hire an electrician to fix your electrical system. That's expensive, but you'll have ongoing annoyances until you get it done.
The best way is have an electrician fix your electrical system and get a UPS.

I have no idea if your PSU should be RMA'd or not. There might not be anything wrong with it. The PSU in the server box that rebooted every time I had a brownout back in 2005 was still working in 2012 when the motherboard in that machine died. Bad caps, as usual.
 
Update: the PC is now powering off regularly, with no washing machine. And often won't power on til I press the button many times and/or switch it off for a couple minutes to reset it.

Could this be the motherboard or has to be the PSU?
 
Could be lots of things, but PSU is probably pretty likely. And it may sound stupid, but rule out the switches in your case first as it is simple to do and has been an issue for some and costs nothing to check out. Also look through event viewer to see if anything happened at that time.

Could be the motherboard as well.
 
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dandragonrage said:
Could be lots of things, but PSU is probably pretty likely. And it may sound stupid, but rule out the switches in your case first as it is simple to do and has been an issue for some and costs nothing to check out. Also look through event viewer to see if anything happened at that time.

Could be the motherboard as well.
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Thanks - I opened it up, checked the cables first, and I think maybe the CPU power cable was slightly loose.

Now it boots up fine. Damn, I feel stupid if that's all it was!!!

Edit: Nope, still powering off, not related to the washer though.
 
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Varmint said:
Edit: Nope, still powering off, not related to the washer though.
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Unplug the AC power cord from the wall outlet, and plug it and unplug it at the PSU about 10 times. Do the same with the power connectors inside the computer. That may clean off the contacts. For some reason, I've seen many brand new PSUs that didn't work right when connected for the first time.
 
dandragonrage said:
As the other guy said, voltage, not current (don't call current "amps" as you only use "amps" when talking about an actual current measurement). Current would have to be measured in series (a bit of a pain). If you tried to measure it "at the outlet" that would cause a short, destroying the meter (at minimum) and creating electrocution and fire hazards. Sparks will fly.

Please don't give electrical advice unless you get it right. The wrong advice could literally kill someone. Even if you knew what you meant but messed up your post, that's unacceptable in the world of electrical.
Click to expand...

Absolutely, voltage was meant, not amps.

Thanks to you and the other guy for the fix on the post.
 
larrymoencurly said:
Unplug the AC power cord from the wall outlet, and plug it and unplug it at the PSU about 10 times. Do the same with the power connectors inside the computer. That may clean off the contacts. For some reason, I've seen many brand new PSUs that didn't work right when connected for the first time.
Click to expand...

thanks, but the problem went away when I disabled C6 and C7 sleep modes. Another Z87 bug I'd guess?

When I get a chance I'll swap the PSU and see if I can use C6 and C7 with a different PSU.
 
Varmint said:
thanks, but the problem went away when I disabled C6 and C7 sleep modes. Another Z87 bug I'd guess?

When I get a chance I'll swap the PSU and see if I can use C6 and C7 with a different PSU.
Click to expand...

Did you try disabling only C7? Are you able to do so with your motherboard?
 
dandragonrage said:
Did you try disabling only C7? Are you able to do so with your motherboard?
Click to expand...

The Z87 Pro lets you disable C6 and C7 individually, but no, I haven't tried that, will give it a shot. Right now C6 and C7 are both disabled, and it hasn't rebooted since.
 
PC is powering off again, like its degenerating. Gonna RMA it. Wth, Seasonic is supposed to be top notch.
 
Seasonic is top notch, doesn't mean mistakes don't get made.

I'm still betting that the washermachine or some other device is dragging you down below 90ish volts, and the Power supply is tripping protection to prevent damage. Have you put a voltmeter on your socket yet?

I've also seen random shut down and such occur simply from a bad AC cable. Might wanna try that too.
 
Jorona said:
Seasonic is top notch, doesn't mean mistakes don't get made.

I'm still betting that the washermachine or some other device is dragging you down below 90ish volts, and the Power supply is tripping protection to prevent damage. Have you put a voltmeter on your socket yet?

I've also seen random shut down and such occur simply from a bad AC cable. Might wanna try that too.
Click to expand...

I swapped in an old CX400 when I couldn't even get the PC to power on. It started up right away with the CX400 in there, gonna run it a few days to see if the problem is gone, then I'll RMA the Seasonic. The washing machine might have started the problem, but the PC was going to sleep (not powering off) all the time, even with nothing in the house running.
 
Jorona said:
Since you haven't changed your sig, whats your full system specs?
Click to expand...

Sorry, here it is:

i4670k (@ stock)
Asus Z87 Pro
2x8 GB Crucial Ballistix Tactical (stock)
Seasonic 650RM PSU
2 x WD Blue 1TB, 1 x Sandisk SSD
Corsair 550D
no video card at the moment
 
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