Oracle Installs Deceptive Software With Java Updates

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by HardOCP News, Jan 24, 2013.

  1. HardOCP News

    HardOCP News [H] News

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    Here's a tip, just treat Java and Flash updates the same as you would a suspicious file that can potentially harm your system. We all know that a week after you install them they will be compromised and require another update anyway. :D Thanks to [H] forum member jadams for the link.

     
  2. DeFex

    DeFex [H]ard|DCer of the Month - June 2011

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    How much does ask toolbar pay per install, is oracle really that desperate for money?
     
  3. WhyYouLoveMe

    WhyYouLoveMe [H]ardness Supreme

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    Java has always and will always suck. Even without the 3rd party software and sneaky foistware, the code is just clunky, heavy, slow and vulnerable.
     
  4. mzs_biteme

    mzs_biteme [H]ard|Gawd

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    Notice the same thing couple days ago. Simply unchecked the box. But was thinking the same: "WTF is Oracle doing trying to install Ask bar. The worst f@$%^ search bar at that...!!!" Somebody needs to get fired, and quick at Oracle...:rolleyes:
     
  5. Nokt

    Nokt n00b

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    Hey, Somebody has to pay for that island!
     
  6. CvP

    CvP [H]Lite

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    I learned OOP using java. Feeling ashamed.
     
  7. ballistic90

    ballistic90 2[H]4U

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    I had a similar problem when the Yahoo toolbar was somehow installed on my system. I don't know what prompted its install, but even after I uninstalled that damn thing it kept changing my default search box in Firefox. I had to manually remove it from Firefox deep within its settings to get back control of that damn box.

    I understand that these things keep software free, but it doesn't make it any less bullshit.
     
  8. Azhar

    Azhar Fixing stupid since 1972

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    It's random. Sometimes it's Bing, sometimes it's Ask.com. Never had a download with Google in it though.
     
  9. Steelgrave

    Steelgrave Limp Gawd

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    Java isn't the problem (at least in this article). Oracle buying up Sun and pulling this kind of crap is the issue. I don't recall Sun ever doing this when it was running things. (could be wrong though)
     
  10. Krazypoloc

    Krazypoloc Gawd

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    Correct - they also did a lot of other asshole things....like stopping Solaris code from being shared to the forks, like openSolaris and others.
     
  11. RogueTadhg

    RogueTadhg [H]ard|Gawd

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    Yay! Filled with holes AND installed stuff we don't want! It's a fantastic piece of software!
     
  12. az_max

    az_max Gawd

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  13. Shotglass01

    Shotglass01 [H]ard|Gawd

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    First time ever on the home computer, off a new build of 7, did I not install Java. It occured to me that the home computing habits don't need it.

    Unfortunately, some of the office computers need it. :(
     
  14. Rahh

    Rahh [H]ard|Gawd

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    I don't have it on my home computer either but unfortunately and frightening enough most business need it...
     
  15. collegeboy69us

    collegeboy69us [H]ardness Supreme

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    ahh consumer whoring at it's finest.

    We all remember programs that used to simply WORK. No frills, no razzle dazzle, that slowly sold out or whored out and became total crapware.

    WinZip, Nero, Symantec, Winamp -- just to name a few.

    Hell even the free Avira antivirus that I love has started selling out.

    Anytime a program asks to install a toolbar or some other crap -- usually means the program itself is a piece of shit in some way shape or form.
     
  16. Monkey34

    Monkey34 [H]ardness Supreme

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    Another deceptive write up. The whole thing is because the user didn't un-check the box.

    Cmon.....how hard is it to un-check the box? :rolleyes:

    Every piece of software you don't pay money for has this in some way.....for a long time now. It's nothing new except for it showing at every update instead of only at the initial install.
     
  17. dgingeri

    dgingeri 2[H]4U

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    People act like this is new. It's been happening for years, even before Oracle took over Sun.
     
  18. wonderfield

    wonderfield [H]ardness Supreme

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    Not even remotely close to being true.
     
  19. WetMacula

    WetMacula Gawd

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    It is sleazy practice to have that shit checked by default. If you do install it by accident the toolbar installer remains silently active for 10 minutes so it does not appear in the control panel immediately. They purposely made it difficult to detect. Oh and Java never scales right with Windows DPI settings. Fuck them.
     
  20. Rattle

    Rattle 2[H]4U

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    I never use searchbars or toolbars and I have told all the pc users I know to never install them.
    back in the day everything wrong that would happen with malware and virus' was always attached to one or the other somehow.
     
  21. jadams

    jadams 2[H]4U

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    Not only that but, in the article it also says that the Ask.com installer runs on a 10 minute delay. This is used so that in the event you have an "oh shit!" moment realize you didnt uncheck the box. You goto the add/remove programs and see no ask.com bar. ITs not there! You dodged a bullet. Actualy its because the installer for ask.com is slightly delayed.

    Shady, just shady.
     
  22. Webhead

    Webhead Gawd

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    Yup. Agree. The install of additional software/toolbars/etc is nothing new. People need to learn to read.

    What really grinds my gears is the bullshit of creating a desktop icon and having no option to disable this during install (Adobe Reader!).
     
  23. Budzman

    Budzman [H]ard|Gawd

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    No one reads and just clicks next till they cant.
     
  24. sfsuphysics

    sfsuphysics I don't get it

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    I recall this being part of Java's SOP for a long time now, not sure why this article needs to point out what's already been known

    Deceptive techniques like not reading what the screen says and clicking next just to get through it. These social engineering novices will never know! MWUAHAHAHAHAAH.
    Ok I'll admit it is kind of a douchebag move to auto-install unless you specifically tell it not to. But still.
     
  25. Stormwalker

    Stormwalker Limp Gawd

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    Really? Crap. :(

    *throws Ubuntu box out the window*
     
  26. jadams

    jadams 2[H]4U

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    For those simply talking about the checkbox, the article goes a little further than that. Please read it.

    Furthermore this stuff is happening with their updates, not just their base install. Shady...
     
  27. jadams

    jadams 2[H]4U

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    Forget about users flying through the installer and missing the checkbox for a moment..


    Simply put... this article describes the ask.com software as borderline spyware/malware. Why would Oracle agree to this?
     
  28. -PK-

    -PK- [H]ard|Gawd

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    Yet zdnet's own background whitespace is an advertisement to do exactly the same thing!
     
  29. zkostik

    zkostik Gawd

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    Neither does Adobe software! As for Java, it's a damn shame but it happens every time when products get bought out. Screw Oracle!
     
  30. Monkey34

    Monkey34 [H]ardness Supreme

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    I've updated my SOP practices to include the recommendation to counsel on un-checking the box for toolbars/optimization/secuity scan crapware for a long time now. I will admit to being somewhat inflammatory about the statement, but not by much. I wish I had a date written down, but it's been multiple years.

    The only issue here is it popping up at every update now.

    :p You got me!
     
  31. ninjaturtle

    ninjaturtle 2[H]4U

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    QFFT!
    Worked on my coworker's PC, toolbar here, toolbar there. Trojans, ransomware, viruses...Holy cow!
     
  32. SkribbelKat

    SkribbelKat [H]ardness Supreme

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    I kinda vaguely recall being upset at Sun for bundling stupid toolbars with Java before Oracle bought them, but that was like a billion years ago back when I was a really tiny Skribbel.

    Anyhow, Java sucked before Oracle got their hands on it and it continues to suck now. It has everything to do with the fact that the whole basic design of on-the-fly code translation in a virtual machine is just insecure and stupid. We all need to go back to FORTRAN and Assembly or maybe use LISP. OOP is dumb and code that isn't hardware dependent is also dumb. Development should be super expensive and porting to another platform should be a titanic pain in the tail.
     
  33. Stiletto

    Stiletto [H]ardness Supreme

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    That's been on there for a few years, now.
     
  34. pxc

    pxc [H]ard as it Gets

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    But I still use BonziBuddy. Thanks for the updates, Oracle!

    It seems pretty lame that Oracle uses the deceptive Ask toolbar, but Ellison did promise to "monetize Java". He needs to get something out of that lulz Sun purchase and its servers aren't doing so hot. :D
     
  35. /dev/null

    /dev/null [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I saw no such thing on my x86_64 linux install of java7u11.
     
  36. evilsofa

    evilsofa [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Java SRE installers without Ask, McAfee, or other third-party installers:

    http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/java/javase/downloads/index.html

    (I don't know whether the auto-update that results from those installers have the Ask toolbar install window or not.)

    Users less experienced than most who read this forum inevitably install everything the installer wants to It's not the user's fault. Whatever they were doing that needed Java, such as applying for a job on a company website, the browser tells them that they need Java to continue. So the installer gets run, and they click "agree" and "next" on everything because they have no way of knowing that Java doesn't require the Ask toolbar to run.

    Just read the "fine print that they should have read". The window that pops up (you can see it in the article) says nothing about Java not requiring Ask to run. The big letters on top say "We recommend installing the FREE browser add-on from Ask". Just look at the window and tell me how a user is supposed to know that they don't need to install it.
     
  37. dandirk

    dandirk [H]ard|Gawd

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    Sorry but ooooohhhhh please...

    The article is written in a way that somehow the toolbar and install behavior is non-existent in the software world.

    It's been done for years, in pretty much the same fashion.

    Should Oracle be protected or commended for this? no way. I think it sucks too, these installer deals really prey on most computer users that have no clue how to manage their system.

    It really sucks that it is Java, not essential but close rather then winzip or some other crappy freeware/coupon app.

    The article was just a rant, ranting about how ask sucks etc. Well I am sorry but a malware expert and blogger do not really have the expertise to judge a search page as "sucks" like a professional. Sure they can have their opinion, just like I have one about cars... but that doesn't mean its worth anything.

    I don't really disagree that ask sucks, it was just an unprofessional article that was ranting and complaining... nothing to see move along.
     
  38. polonyc2

    polonyc2 [H]ard as it Gets

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    Java isn't the only program that tries to trick you into installing the Ask toolbar and other junk programs...Foxit Reader also does it...you have to specifially opt out of it during installation
     
  39. Dekoth-E-

    Dekoth-E- [H]ardness Supreme

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    So... because a dumb user blindly clicks through an install, we have a problem?... java had had that in their installer for years. Uncheck box, problem solved. Same for Adobe and a even ati/and catalyst drivers for a long time.