Opinion of some Barrow LC parts

Discussion in 'Water Cooling' started by cyberguyz, Oct 8, 2018.

  1. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

    Messages:
    672
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2014
    I am looking over some Barrow DDC pump + tube-style integrated reservoir parts along with a heatsink/cover and some 90 degree swivels fittings from them.

    The pump seems to be knockoff of the the liang 3.25 (the one with higher pressure and just short of 1000 lph). The fittings seem to be a decent quality powder coated (black) brass ones. I'm also considering an aluminum "armor" aluminum heatsink & cover.

    Anyone here have any experience with these guys to pass on?
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2018
  2. hititnquitit

    hititnquitit Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    272
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2018
    their ddc and d5 pumps are laing/xylem built pumps. the name signifies which region it was made in. barrow generally are built by xylem in europe. youll have to check the label when you get yours. the best way to assure your getting a real laing/xylem pump is to buy from a reliable source like ppcs/amazon/newegg/modmymods etc where copyright is respected and enforced. knockoffs generally come from chinese websites (that get away with copyright infringement) and sell for far less than a genuine laing pump. if your familiar with ddc and d5 pumps you can tell the fake ones right off by the plastic housings.
    they make solid fittings from my experience. ive only used their painted fittings. the quality is very good in that the entire fitting is painted unlike some(alphacool) that leave brass showing inside the fitting tube. as with any rotary 90 make sure they twist hard. easy turning 90s will end up leaking. not a very scientific approach to ensure a leak free part but it works.
    their pump heatsinks are among the best ive seen. very well made and sturdy aluminum that looks great inside a well lit case. i would rank them right there with bitspower pump heatsinks. im not sure they should even be called heatsinks but thats what they are marketed as.
    i have no experience with their tube reservoirs.
     
    cyberguyz likes this.
  3. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

    Messages:
    672
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2014
    Thanks for the feedback. Most of my experience with the liang pumps goes back about 15 years to the swiftech mcp650 pumps. I have zero experience with the smaller DDC-style pumps. I am mostly looking at the DDC pumps for their high head pressure ratings which is almost double of the D5s.

    One of the reasons for this thread is that I know Barrow is a Chinese company and like many others in the region would be selling mostly knockoffs - you don't get genuine parts for the price of these things. I am not expecting any of their components to be genuine liang/xylem parts. I am mostly curious to find out if anybody here has experienced any red flags with their DDC pump, res, fittings or heatsinks before I pull the trigger on them.I have seen reviews that go both ways out in the wild wide web.

    I really appreciate the response. It has a good bit of info there to watch for. Thanks again!
     
  4. DWolvin

    DWolvin [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,854
    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2002
    I'll second that their fittings seem fine, I picked up a bunch of soft tube compression fittings- quality is good, but not up to some of the nicer euro stuff. But no leaks and almost a quarter of the price (and they were the only I could find that fit the look I wanted).
     
    cyberguyz likes this.
  5. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,472
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2016
    Haven't bought any Barrow pumps, but have used plenty of their fittings, and a pump top/reservoir of theirs. The price is apparent in the product, which is not to say that it's low quality stuff, it's just... no-frills. I'll happily buy more of their fittings and probably wouldn't balk at trying some of their other product lines.

    China's definitely got a rap for knockoffs, but I think Barrow is a "real" company. They've been innovating with their own products lately.
     
    cyberguyz likes this.
  6. DWolvin

    DWolvin [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,854
    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2002
    Yeah, any company willing to make decent video card waterblocks (that are not knockoffs) seems to be actually trying to be good.
     
  7. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

    Messages:
    672
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2014
    OK, an update.

    I finally got my Barrow pump/res & pump heatsink from Barrow. The quality looks decent and feels solid.The first thing I did when I got them was try and put that pretty heatsink onto the Barrow ddc pump.

    No love. It does not fit. Seems the Barrow pump, while compatible with Liang/Xylem tops are not compatible with the aluminum case and heatsink. The wiring to the pump goes into the electronics via a small, flat removable plug in the lower side near the bottom plate of the pump case while the true Laing/Xylum pumps have their wiring coming in thru a notch at the upper part of the case side near the pump top edge. As well the Laing internals are a bit smaller in height & width than those of the barrow pump.

    While I am sure the pump works as advertised, I am left shaking my head that the Barrow pump is not 100% compatible with Barrow's own DDC heat sink & case parts. Leaves me wondering what other differences there are between these and the *real* Laing/Xylem pumps.
     
  8. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,472
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2016
    Can you post pictures of the fitment issues? I think I understand from your text but it's hard to visualize for sure. It'll be a real bummer if you're right. I'm betting it is still a real Liang/Xylem pump, but some manufacturers install their own control boards and that could cause the issue you're describing. Even then though, a Barrow DDC should fit a Barrow heatsink.
     
  9. hititnquitit

    hititnquitit Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    272
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2018
    it isnt a laing/xylem/lowara pump. they sell a bunch of different d5 and ddc(chinese made) knock offs on aliexpress. most of the barrow ddc knock offs have the wires coming out of the bottom unlike a laing that comes out of the top. they also sell covers and heatsinks that only fit their specific pumps. heres an example. page down to see the wires.
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Bar...lgo_pvid=55151995-0235-4482-ac2e-c84b2a89b4db
    heres one of Byskis ddc knock offs
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Byk...lgo_pvid=55151995-0235-4482-ac2e-c84b2a89b4db
    and some d5 knock offs
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Qui...lgo_pvid=55151995-0235-4482-ac2e-c84b2a89b4db
    and https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Bar...lgo_pvid=55151995-0235-4482-ac2e-c84b2a89b4db
    heres the real laing/xylem/lowara d5 and ddc they sell.
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Bar...lgo_pvid=1c03da53-fec3-472a-82e3-1e8e4842bbac
    lowara ddc 3.2
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Lai...lgo_pvid=69e11337-672e-435e-b327-957c69cede24
    its very misleading because they ALWAYS include the name of the pump they are copying in the title. so it can be very hard to differentiate if you dont know what to look for.
    pop yours open and see what the impellar and bearing are made of. maybe you got lucky and they copied the most important parts accurately.
    hopefully it will last a good long time. the good news is you can get tons of tops and heatsinks for it. the bad is youll have to wait foerever to get them :(
     
  10. VanGoghComplex

    VanGoghComplex [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,472
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2016
    That's so disappointing. I love Barrow fittings. It's a shame that they're thieves, or they at least peddle the wares of thieves.

    I wonder if the Chinese IP theft trend is because of a lack of IP protection laws, or if it's a cultural thing, or both.
     
  11. hititnquitit

    hititnquitit Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    272
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2018
    it seems as tho it almost has to fall within the copyright boundaries in china. my guess is that its A OK in China/on Chinese websites but not in the EU or USA. being that selling knock offs is rampant on aliexpress but thats really the only place i have ever seen any of that gear sold. its crooked as hell.
     
  12. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

    Messages:
    672
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2014
    Yeah that last is what I was expecting as well. But after a bit of looking at aliexpress I see one that is actually made for that Barrow knockoff I have:

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Bar...8.0&pvid=3962a12b-d5d2-4ae8-ac22-e0e518159483

    The downside is the price of that heatsink & top alone is about what I paid for pomp and res combo. Seriously??!!

    Here is a pic of the differences (click for full size)

    MBP_0364.JPG

    The Barrow pump is thicker and has wiring coming out the bottom (bottom notch in the pictures. Also the inside dimensions of the case/heatsink is a frog's hair too narrow for the pump to slide into it.

    The Barrow pump will work with pretty much any pump top or top+res out there - the only ones that might have a problem are the single & dual pump bayres setups.

    I was expecting the Barrow pump to be a knockoff. I was just hoping it would be a little closer to the original design. The stator and circuitry does look pretty good though.

    I did find a Liang DDC 3.25 pump from a german retailer (Koolance branded) and have it on the way. Not Cheap QQ
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2018
  13. hititnquitit

    hititnquitit Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    272
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2018
    have you talked to ppc or frozencpu about shipping to you? they may be able to help out. they both have really good cs. where are you located Cyber?
    you gotta give it to barrow on the designs that they have created since moving into the NA/EU markets. the ddc top you linked to looks sweet. altho ive never seen a top- out port like that before.
     
  14. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

    Messages:
    672
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2014
    Yeah. I am in Canada. Usually the cost for me from guys like frozencpu or ppc works out to taking the price in USA $ and duubling that by the time it gets to me :(

    Don't get me wrong, the Barrow pump looks like a pretty solid piece and will work with 95% of the ddc pump tops or top+res out there. They a;so look reasonably slick. But getting a sleeve case+heatsink for them is hella costly even from aliexpress.

    Yeah having an output at the top of the pump face is pretty handy if you are not going to use an integrated res. Makes the package pretty small if you have limited space. You could even put a water temp sensor in the other output port if you wanted to.

    Knockoffs or not they do have some pretty nifty designs.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2018
  15. hititnquitit

    hititnquitit Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    272
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2018
    you know what im thinkin? its time for CyberGuyz wcing shop to open up in Canada! then YOU could copy all of these Chinese made knock offs and make a fortune!
     
    cyberguyz likes this.
  16. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

    Messages:
    672
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2014
    LOL! It's funny you mentioned that. I actually threw a similar idea around, as well as some more lofty ones about 15 years ago. I even partnered up with a fellow with similar ideas to make some nice overclocking memory and custom WC stuff like custom bay reservoirs & water blocks. Went so far as make a few prototypes and sold a few. They worked pretty much as good as the more mainstream stuff you could find back then. Even sampled a few high-end thermal compounds from manufacturers trying to get some NA advertisers & distributors (one of them was IC Diamond 7 Carat before they actually found a distributor to take them on - it was a little too hard to use for us). The whole thing never gained any momentum and we both moved on to more mundane things plus I didn't want my employer then to have any legal hold on the company. We were gonna call the company "Cyberguyz Technologies".

    These days I'm way too old to get into that kind of thing :D