One hot 12700k 100c - Asus Z690-i - NR200P Max - Solved

Pasic

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Update - Issue was with cool master 280mm AIOthat comes with NR200P Max case. The waterblock was not flat and had ridges in it. I sanded this down with 240 grit paper, then 2000 Grit.

While at it I also added M4 Nylon Washers to the ILM, raising it by 1mm. CPU now runs 30c cooler in games and boosts 500mhz more.




What the heck is going on here. Not sure what might be the issue, Motherboard, CPU or cooling issue.

In game like overwatch ill hit 80c. Time Spy CPU part is 100c, Cinebench 100c.

Asus Z690-I Strix - Default settings, only set XMP
Trident Z 6000, 36,36,36,76 1.3v
Cool Master AIO loop

CPU SP rating
Total SP 68, SP 79 P-core & SP 49 e-core

I have tired to benchmark with E-cores disabled, same temp.
AIO Case fan set to max, pump.
Removed waterblock, reseated, and applied new thermal paste - Noctua
Have tired overclocked settings - Inteligent Asus tweak - same issue.
Case thermals should not be issue, ive tired it with videocard removed and whole case open, fans 100%..

Thoughts ?
 

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pendragon1

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ok, oem page says its a 280mm, which is ok. what does the paste look like when you take the block off? is the pump on full speed? i guess it could be that z-height issue people have talked about and you may been that washer mod.
 

Pasic

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ok, oem page says its a 280mm, which is ok. what does the paste look like when you take the block off? is the pump on full speed? i guess it could be that z-height issue people have talked about and you may been that washer mod.
This is when I took it off. I think i may had a little too much on there.
This chip is huge haha

After redoing with less paste my temps are same.
 

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Dan_D

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ok, oem page says its a 280mm, which is ok. what does the paste look like when you take the block off? is the pump on full speed? i guess it could be that z-height issue people have talked about and you may been that washer mod.
Given what I'm seeing with the paste contact and the temps, I'm inclined to think this is the case.
 

pendragon1

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This is when I took it off. I think i may had a little too much on there.
This chip is huge haha

After redoing with less paste my temps are same.
amount looks ok but it hasnt squished out like it should. can you tighten it any more? if not, look into the washer mod or contact CM for advice.
 

evhvis

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This is when I took it off. I think i may had a little too much on there.
This chip is huge haha

After redoing with less paste my temps are same.
Looks like a contact/mounting pressure issue. There should only be a thin film with a border of thermal paste around where the cold plate contacted the IHS, if you have good contact and mounting pressure. Basically most of thermal paste should have been squeezed out. Never had any issues where noctua NT-H1 didn't squeeze out easily. Did you get any resistance when fastening the CPU block?

If you have good contact and mounting pressure then the thermal paste on the IHS should look similar to the image below. Most of the paste has been squeezed out on mounting (slightly more paste left on the cold plate where the IHS had contact):
1644609745571.jpeg


The CPU bending under mounting is most likely not the primary issue in your case, but it can worth looking into as well. Igors lab has two good articles on that issue, but they only saw around 4-6 degrees gains by preventing the CPU from bending.
 

chameleoneel

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This is when I took it off. I think i may had a little too much on there.
This chip is huge haha

After redoing with less paste my temps are same.
I agree with others----I don't think you tightened the block all the way down.

Additionally, make sure the Asus mobo isn't applying any performance enchancements by default. Especially check the LLC settings. Anything higher than a medium/mid setting, can make Alder Lake get hot, really quickly.
 

pendragon1

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Overall, I just think it would be cool if the general invasions were streamlined and just more focused on "this enemy is a real player". Rather than being subject to really complicated metas about gear and levels.

Save the complex metas for a specific PVP covenant and/or covenants which are about protecting certain areas, etc.
wat?!
 

Pasic

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Morning all, I thx for your input.

Sorry should have mentioned it, as soon as I started seeing thermal issues I tried to torque up the screws.

They were tight, I redone them even more so and it did make 1-2c difference on E cores, those were cool 88c but rest of the P cores no change.

Next up I've done core voltage
offset - 0.110v

Core 5 peaks at 97c but sits 92-96c
Core 7 peak at 95c


Ive purchased some Nylon M4 washers that are 1mm high.
I'll be doing that shortly.
 

chameleoneel

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Morning all, I thx for your input.

Sorry should have mentioned it, as soon as I started seeing thermal issues I tried to torque up the screws.

They were tight, I redone them even more so and it did make 1-2c difference on E cores, those were cool 88c but rest of the P cores no change.

Next up I've done core voltage
offset - 0.110v

Core 5 peaks at 97c but sits 92-96c
Core 7 peak at 95c


Ive purchased some Nylon M4 washers that are 1mm high.
I'll be doing that shortly.
Does your Cooler Master AIO have an LGA 1700 backplate and mounting hardware?
 

Pasic

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Does your Cooler Master AIO have an LGA 1700 backplate and mounting hardware?
Yes it does have LGA1700 backplate, everything else is the same screws.

LGA Backplate looks of much lesser quality, cheaper plastic as opposed to the other one.


Just Finished Cinebench.

Before voltage offset 21610 and with - 0.110v offset I got 22332
 

Pasic

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Arh Asus.... Can't do the washer mod. Looks like I need to go buy Torx bit.. All my tools packed since I moved house. :(

Anyways here's few pics of thermal paste on second application.

I think my first application X method was better tbh.

 

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Dreamerbydesign

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Yes it does have LGA1700 backplate, everything else is the same screws.

LGA Backplate looks of much lesser quality, cheaper plastic as opposed to the other one.


Just Finished Cinebench.

Before voltage offset 21610 and with - 0.110v offset I got 22332
The z depth is different for 1700. I had to have a new set of screws for my Corsair AIO. The backplate was not the only difference. I suppose it may be different with Coolermaster but from the pic you posted, it looked like not enough mounting pressure. That paste would have been forced out of the side more with proper pressure imo.
 

NattyKathy

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Arh Asus.... Can't do the washer mod. Looks like I need to go buy Torx bit.. All my tools packed since I moved house. :(

Anyways here's few pics of thermal paste on second application.

I think my first application X method was better tbh.


Definitely not enough mounting pressure for some reason- looks like the coldplate and CPU are making terrible contact from the attached pics.
 

Pasic

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I'm going to have a rant now. This Cool master AIO is absolute piece of shit.

Surface of the block has ridges in it, you can feel that one side is higher.

What a piece of crap. I feel like I need some 6000 grit paper.

Not sure if this is normal for AIO. My previous pc was on water and components I've used from xsps, aquacomputer were works of art.

Not sure if AIO is issue or not.
I don't want to refund if all AIO are same, I do love the case.
 

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AP514

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Have a look at this case review...she said she had to put more fans in to keep CPU COOL. Also put a big "X" on that CPU..not enough paste IMO or contact.
 
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Pasic

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Have a look at this case review...she said she had to put more fans in to keep CPU COOL. Also put a big "X" on that CPU..not enough paste IMO or contact.

Haha yeah seen that. That looks same as my pc I got 3080ti suprim x, but I went with 12700k. I went to buy another 12700k to compare but none in stock.
 

Pasic

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Sanded down with 240 grit you can see how it was uneven one side.

Onto 2000 Grit, massive difference.
It's like a morrow now, you can see where I circled there was still little dip but ihs is far from here and it. Didn't want to loose more copper.

I might bolt it up and see temps before doing washer mod.


Keeps you posted
 

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Pasic

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Good news.

Just sanding down waterblock, with default vcore I am now sitting on peak 92c after Cinebench completed. This is over 10c cooler on core 5.

Not sure if I should bother with washer mod now??

 

Pasic

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Just installed the washers. Two of Torx screws were hand loose on the motherboard !
Installed 4x M4 Nylon washers that was 1mm high. These are the results below, Washer mod i got ATH Cinebench scrore. Seems like Pcores are cooler and Ecores run hotter 2c, maybe they were actually doing something this time LOL.

No Washer - Washer Mod
Cinebench Cinebench
22875 pts 22928 pts


P-Cores
P0 89c -> 88c
P1 85c -> 82c
P2 94c -> 93c
P3 89c = 89c
P4 90c -> 88c
P5 95c = 95c
P6 85c = 85c
P7 93c -> 92c

E-Cores
E8 79c <- 81c
E9 79c <- 81c
E10 79c <- 81c
E11 79c <- 81c
 

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wandplus

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The technique if I remember correctly for lapping is putting water and dishwashing detergent on sheet of sand paper on a flat mirror. The mirror should be flat enough to do the work correctly.
EDIT: I know some people have said in the past put an amount of thermal grease in the middle and the heatsink will spread it out. But I found that it won't get to the corners. And putting a lot seems to act as an insulator instead of conductor. So now I prefer to put a small amount and spread it around with a piece of plastic. I don't care if people say that spreading it manually can introduce air bubbles. Not covering the corners and putting too much is probably way worse.
 
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evhvis

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The technique if I remember correctly for lapping is putting water and dishwashing detergent on sheet of sand paper on a flat mirror. The mirror should be flat enough to do the work correctly.
EDIT: I know some people have said in the past put an amount of thermal grease in the middle and the heatsink will spread it out. But I found that it won't get to the corners. And putting a lot seems to act as an insulator instead of conductor. So now I prefer to put a small amount and spread it around with a piece of plastic. I don't care if people say that spreading it manually can introduce air bubbles. Not covering the corners and putting too much is probably way worse.
It will spread out if you have good contact, unless the paste is really difficult to work with, but you need enough paste. Different CPUs often need different patterns unless you use a massive excess so I prefer spreading as well to avoid the guesswork. A massive excess isn't an issue outside of the mess it makes and air bubbles get squished out by cooler pressure.
 

kirbyrj

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The X pattern for your paste is fine. You will cover the entire block.

I've used the pea method, spread out method, etc. I like the X the best with MX-4.
 

Pasic

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Much success!!!

My temps have halfed in some games and I'm pushing 500mhz more out of the CPU.

Oh this pin from 8pin pci nearly caught me out, that could have been a shit day.
 

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prtzlboy

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Looks like I'm late to the party here but I was looking for info on this case, and it seems to be pretty much gone from all vendors (the MAX version with psu and aio).

I have to wonder if the shitty AIO is the reason this thing doesn't seem to be for sale anymore.
 

noko

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The X pattern for your paste is fine. You will cover the entire block.

I've used the pea method, spread out method, etc. I like the X the best with MX-4.
I spread a very thin coat + small pea size in the middle -> Best of both worlds :D. Maybe try spread + X pattern next time (very thin that is to prevent a mess)
 

ikjadoon

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Nice fix and thank you for documenting the process. That'll be really helpful for future readers.

To add another data point, as we have similar setups (i7-12700K / ROG STRIX Z690-I / Meshlicious dual-mesh / Arctic Cooling Liquid Freezer II 280mm). With 25C ambient and PL1 = PL2 = 4096W but otherwise stock, 10min Cinebench R23 multi-core loop had it at 72 C core avg / 80 C package avg. This is with Arctic's LGA1700 redesigned bracket, however (which needed a bit of trimming to avoid hitting the DRAM / VRM).

Haven't done the washer mod (yet); noticed a bit of TIM pooling after a remount (because I forgot I should've installed the RAM first), but with lower / thinner "peaks" vs your well-shot photos. I did the spread the paste out manually into a thin layer w/ the MX-5 spatula; maybe an old habit. Tried to tighten as much as possible, but Buildzoid also mentioned high tightening was part of the problem (causing the center of the IHS to dip down / become concave). Thus, he claimed the washer mod is for concave cold plates (e.g., two concave surfaces mating = gap in the middle).

But your convincing results are making me curious. Nicely done.
 
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Pasic

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I've also found that i get better results with cheaper cool master thermal paste that came with kit then Noctua NT-H1. Thermal paste from coolmaster is easier spread, noctua is thicker consistency and didnt work for me as good.
 

Pasic

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With all you spent on this I'd just have trashed the included AIO and bought a quality model.
I wasn't aware that these were bad, reviewers on youtube don't talk about how crap the AIO was when they reviewed this case and i never really looked into AIO as i have always used custom loops since 2007 ( Q6600 CPU) Dual D5s, and quality blocks from aquacomputer, xspc.

When i started building this pc i looked on aquacomputer website everything is out of stock.... In Australia you can buy EK stuff of the shelf, but i never been a fan i just prefer the looks and finish of Aquacomputer.

I got thermals under control now added couple Noctua A15s under the case, and replaced two cool master fans with 2x Noctua A14 iPPC2000. No longer run the mesh on top of PC or filter at bottom, there is so muchh air flow now that i dont loose much performance running PC with glass panel.


12700k-3080ti.jpg

Once i get the 12900ks, i may need to do full custom loop again, and i got few ideas already it will require fair bit of custom work. :) :)
 

Elios

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where you getting the high temp spikes with all load or just AVX? if load up my 12900k with non AVX load temps are ok but AVX just make the cpu run SUPER hot. not sure if thats just how its going to be or if should try reseating or laping my AIO and or CPU IHS. im thinking its contact issue since AIO coolent temp isnt jumping up right away either, it does heat up over time but its odd a 360mm AIO cant keep up even if set the fans and pump full speed all the time before putting the load on.
 

Gunner_V

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Thanks for posting your success, I have been looking at this case but have been wary of the stock cooling solution. Looks like it may be better just to buy the regular 200 and roll your own.
 

Elios

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This is when I took it off. I think i may had a little too much on there.
This chip is huge haha

After redoing with less paste my temps are same.
that looks fine really really i think these chips just run super hot
 

pavel

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Can you get the washers at Home Depot or some place like that? Or where on Amazon? I just know the washers should be M4, 1mm in height.
 

Odigo

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If you don't have enough pressure it definitely makes a difference. I just built a 12700k rig with a EK-AIO. Had to order the LGA1700 adapter. The included bracket screws didn't secure tight enough.. resulted in the bracket not applying enough pressure. I would average 80ish while gaming. I ended up using the included bracket screws that came with the AIO (instead of the adapter kit), and applied MX-4 in a "X" pattern. I now top out around 65ish.
 
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