Official BenQ FP241W Thread !!! Info, Pictures, Reviews

shingles said:
A couple hundred posts, mostly positive,some negative.....

Is this "the" 24" panel to get for general use and gaming? It would seem that most posts are positive but just would like to hear from people after having used it for a while if they would buy it again.

Shingles
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I just went from a Pf95 View sonic to the BenQ, and was very worried about the ghosting. But so far the ghosting is so minimal it does not bug me at all (It's really not noticeable unless you are looking for it) . And the Contrast's (another thing that scared me) is good. When the screen goes totally black you can see your desk. But with even minimal stuff on the screen the blacks look true black.

I can not see any area of the screen thats brighter then another. And the veiwing angles are very nice. And their is no input lag.

There is a noticeable deference between looking at the side and dead on. the color's look slightly dimmer and about the same. and thats looking to the side where you almost cannot see it. ( It almost certainly will not bug you). Personally i consider this a strong point.

The bottom of the screen is 3 inches from the desk and will not go any lower. The stand is really stable. The controls on the side are kinda cumbersome but no big deal, Something that interested me (probably most wont care about ) is you can change the size of the pip's.

The games i have played on it are Fear, Americas army, UT2004, RTW, NFSMW, and have not noticed any input lag . And i have watched a few movies. 480 movie content is probably the weakest point of this monitor, as the monitor is very sharp and will highlight any fuzz in the movies.

If you are going to hook a dvd player up make sure you wait for the 1:1 pixel mapping. I have only used the DVI and Composite input (Dreamcast). Otherwise I highly recommend this monitor
 
shingles said:
A couple hundred posts, mostly positive,some negative.....

Is this "the" 24" panel to get for general use and gaming? It would seem that most posts are positive but just would like to hear from people after having used it for a while if they would buy it again.

Shingles
Click to expand...

been using mine for around 2-3 weeks now,i mainly play on this comp,my old screen was a high quality 19" samsung CRT,going to this screen was easy actualy,only downside like ive said many times before is the brightnes level on the monitor,no mouse lag/ghosting.
 
SlyNine said:
When the screen goes totally black you can see your desk. But with even minimal stuff on the screen the blacks look true black.
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That's strange. The blacks are definitely grayish on my fp241w. In bright scenes it's not apparent but in a bit darker scenes it's obvious. Ghosting is not a problem, but a lack of true black is. This is from someone coming from a nice 19" Samsung crt. It has better colours and blacks.

Viewing angles are good, except for black. They change if the angle is even a bit off. Eventhough the backlight is very uniform the sides tend to look more "brighter" because the viewing angle is different to the sides.
 
Youri Carma said:
I think yourrright about the prices in Japan but in the Netherlands "The Swamp" you can get the Eizo FlexScan S2410W-BK (black) 24" for € 1109,00 say 1100 dollars
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I can't see where it is priced below 1150 euros in the NL. Either way, the dollar-euro exchange rate is not what you make of it. 1150 euros would be about 1400 $US now.
 
maarek99 said:
That's strange. The blacks are definitely grayish on my fp241w. In bright scenes it's not apparent but in a bit darker scenes it's obvious. Ghosting is not a problem, but a lack of true black is. This is from someone coming from a nice 19" Samsung crt. It has better colours and blacks.

Viewing angles are good, except for black. They change if the angle is even a bit off. Eventhough the backlight is very uniform the sides tend to look more "brighter" because the viewing angle is different to the sides.
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Unless I'm starring at a blank screen and my eyes are focused in on it.. the blacks do appear black to me. I also have a back light in my room. But its a very dim light.But like I said.. the blacks are good. If it were as good as my Pf95 I would have said amazing.

After re Reading what you said.. The sides look exactly the same to me. But i probably sit a bit farther away then you do.
 
Meow said:
I can't see where it is priced below 1150 euros in the NL. Either way, the dollar-euro exchange rate is not what you make of it. 1150 euros would be about 1400 $US now.
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That's not how it works If you look at the prices you can see that although the Euro is like 0,76 Dollar. The BenQ Fp241 doesn't cost around Euro's 600,- in Europe while in Dollars is sold for 800 Dollar. What I see from the prices in the US that you can put it one to one almost. That's why I made the remark "We pay always more anywayz". So for what you earn in the States you can do the same as the what we in Europe earn. But If I buy in the States now due to the Dollarrate I am rich. But yourright if you calculate 1100 Euro the price is in fact the same but do you think 1500 Dollar is a cool price? I do think that 1100 Euro's is a cool price! And in fact it was 1500 Euro's all the time but now they lowered the price only in one store in The Netherlands. So still "We alwayz pay more" cause it always was 1500 Euro and 1500 Dollar in the States (Or should I say North American Union) and still most resellers have the Eizo in store for 1500 Euro's.

If you would have studied and compared the prices in the US and Europe you can see that easely.
 
peTeMelster said:
The Dell shouldn't even be compared to the BenQ. The Dell is just horrible. It was the first 24" I ruled out, with Samsung's 244T ruled out next.
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I'm going to get a chance to spend about 30 min with a Dell 2407 in the next few days... anything I should test? I'm pretty much down to the Dell and BenQ, but wondering if the BenQ is worth the extra $ for what I want it for: HDTV, SD TV, movies, etc. through an HTPC run at native rez, and PS2 (maybe PS3 some day). I'm going to try and run some tests with HD trailers from my MacBook Pro, and then maybe take my PS2 along to try.

I'm just trying to figure out why some are so down on the Dell. The 2405 was excellent... did they really mess up the 2407 that much? From what I read about the banding... I don't think that would hurt me too much even if it is still there... as I'd not be using it as a graphic artist much if at all.

So... what is bad about the Dell... and what makes the BenQ so much better?


maarek99 said:
Ghosting is not a problem, but a lack of true black is. This is from someone coming from a nice 19" Samsung crt. It has better colours and blacks.
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This is pretty much the case with LCDs. But, I think once other things are on the screen so I get some contrast going... it doesn't really bother me that much. Though, for really color sensitive work, etc.. I'd still prefer a CRT.

That said... I ONLY have LCDs now... LOL
 
SteveW928 said:
This is pretty much the case with LCDs. But, I think once other things are on the screen so I get some contrast going... it doesn't really bother me that much. Though, for really color sensitive work, etc.. I'd still prefer a CRT.

That said... I ONLY have LCDs now... LOL
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I do a lot of photo and video editing, and for me color-work is very important, which is exactly why I prefer LCD over CRT (even technically older LCD than those great specs they have today!), because with DVI-D your color-control is much more stable than with CRT. There is no visible shading (al least not with decent LCD's) in red to yellow to green and the blue is really blue etc. The focussing on LCD's is always the same, and the same over the entire screen. With a decent viewing angle LCD really gives much smoother pictures. The reds, yellows and greens you can get out of a DVI on LCD are always higher quality than with analog CRT. With CRT they will tend to look colder than the output actually is.
I'm sure it's a matter of taste, but for nature-photography there is no doubt for me that LCD is superior to work on. The most part of my life I've worked using many types of CRT monitors for that, but nothing beats a good LCD panel with DVI.

The most important thing might be that if there are deviations in your LCD screen, they are much more reliable and constant than with CRT. You know what they are, and you can rely on them not changing while you work on something. So even if some blacks might look a little grey, you know they do, and you can adapt to working with that. They have never been an issue for me. With the CRT you would have to be really sure your luminance and contrast are set exactly like the day before, and set correctly. They never are, and they differ with room temperature etc. CRT is just so unstable and uncertain compared to a decent LCD/TFT when using DVI.
 
Meow said:
I can't see where it is priced below 1150 euros in the NL. Either way, the dollar-euro exchange rate is not what you make of it. 1150 euros would be about 1400 $US now.
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Yes Sir!

€ 1109,-(Inclusief BTW) Eizo FlexScan S2410W-BK (zwart) 24" :D http://www.eizoshop.nl/Product.aspx?productID=1723

(I answer post below here)
Tweakers is not what is was. It was sold to some publisher. I wrote a lot on Tweakers.net but I left. Here on Hardforum nobody makes a big fuzz about youngsters asking advice about there new system. I even like to give them some advice and often get advise myself that way and learn. On tweakers they do! Also the moderators are a big F***UP over there. To make a short story even longer: They are not as good as they used to be.

Dead Pixel waranty? Donnow
Warranty: 5 years on site!
VAT?
 
Youri Carma said:
Yes Sir!

€ 1109,-Eizo FlexScan S2410W-BK (zwart) 24" :D http://www.eizoshop.nl/Product.aspx?productID=1723
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Interesting. That one is not included in the pricewatch sites. (and I don't particularly mean the tweakers one, there are more, even in Germany it's not that 'cheap')

Is that 1109 *with* some type of no-dead-pixel guarantee? I see it is including VAT and the original Eizo pixel-policy.
 
Stankia said:
So someone tested how does the monitor display a HD source via HDMI? Does it stretch?
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I think that it has been universally confirmed that this monitor stretches all signals that come from a non-PC source.

A PC video card will scale the image for you, essentially adding black bars to the signal, so in those instances it doesn't stretch (assuming your video card is capable of this).

There is supposedly a new version of the monitor coming out... someday... that will fix this problem.
 
Meow said:
With the CRT you would have to be really sure your luminance and contrast are set exactly like the day before, and set correctly. They never are, and they differ with room temperature etc. CRT is just so unstable and uncertain compared to a decent LCD/TFT when using DVI.
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LCD color reproduction degrades with time.

http://presentation.digitalmedianet.com/2003/04_apr/features/long_live_dlp.htm

There was a study about Eizos purported good color compared to other lcd's that tended to lose their color accuracy with time. But I can't find it just now. That test is about lcd projectors but color degradation happens with lcd monitors too. And a lot quicker than people assume. You still need to calibrate your lcd.

When when watching movies good blacks are pretty much paramount (especially if you turn the lights down). By the way, what's the point in turning lights down when watching movies on an lcd? You just see the greys better. It's like a fog is pulled over the image.

Dark games like Thief and Doom 3 are also negatively affected by this. When doing color correction the lack of blacks tend to make people enhance contrast too much. I do a lot video editing too and we edit with crt's. Graphic artists at our post production house utilise lcd's though.

CRT's still have better colours. They lack in brightness though so they don't have as much impact, but the colours are indeed better. I have my old Samsung 19" 959nf here beside my 24" BenQ and it still holds its own eventhough the brightness has waned even further after all these years.

LCD's are better for desktop work, there's no question about that. But for gaming and movies? Not yet for me anyway. Maybe when led-illuminated backlights are common or SED comes around. People underestimate the importance of real blacks and overemphasize ghosting problems.

Ofcourse a cheap crt configured at 60hz will look usually look pretty bad. I had a friend who had used his crt monitor for months without focusing it properly. I went there and messed around with the settings and suddenly his monitor was much more precise.
 
maarek99 said:
LCD color reproduction degrades with time.
http://presentation.digitalmedianet.com/2003/04_apr/features/long_live_dlp.htm
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Sorry, not only do I have a hard time buying that, since I have some 19 inch Samsung screens for which this degradation is not noticeable after 5 years of intense usage, I also believe it's an outdated 'feature'.

They said the same thing about LEDs. Now see what they are used for. LED will take over the entire planet's electric bulb-lighting.
 
blackseed said:
I think that it has been universally confirmed that this monitor stretches all signals that come from a non-PC source.

A PC video card will scale the image for you, essentially adding black bars to the signal, so in those instances it doesn't stretch (assuming your video card is capable of this).

There is supposedly a new version of the monitor coming out... someday... that will fix this problem.
Click to expand...
It stretches only the non-DVI-D signals that are input 16:9 to 16:10. If you feed it 16:10, nothing will be done with its aspect ratio.

With DVI there are no issues with scaling, it is always 1:1 or the videocard will not be able to make the screen show anything at all. Most mediaplaying software, like my favorite K-Multimedia Player, is capable of stretching the source video (even dvd-v) to anything you prefer, and KMPlayer gives you a sea of configuration options for that.

It's not the monitor, it's the firmware that is new. One can also update older monitors with the new firmware, but you need to be a bit of a tech person to handle that.
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/news.htm#fp241wz
 
Ordered a BenQ FP241W from NewEgg. Recieved it in 4 days. Opened the box and plugged it in. Monitor promptly began to sizzel and smoke from the top grate/slits with a pungent odor. Re-packaged monitor and RMA'd it back to NewEgg, who willingly refunded without a restocking fee. I'll still probably go with the FP241W, but anyone else have anything like this happen?
 
Meow said:
It stretches only the non-DVI-D signals that are input 16:9 to 16:10. If you feed it 16:10, nothing will be done with its aspect ratio.

With DVI there are no issues with scaling, it is always 1:1 or the videocard will not be able to make the screen show anything at all. Most mediaplaying software, like my favorite K-Multimedia Player, are capable of stretching the source video (even dvd-v) to anything you prefer, and KMP gives you a sea of configuration options for that.

It's not the monitor, it's the firmware that is new. One can also update older monitors with the new firmware, but you need to be a bit of a tech person to handle that.
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/news.htm#fp241wz
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Non-DVI, ok, if is possible to use a VGA->DVI converter (for X360 for example) and don´t have the image stretched?
 
There is no actual 1 on 1 pixel-mapping taking place on the other inputs, since they aren't DVI-D. There will be things like 2 or 4 screen pixels matched to 1 input pixel, or the other way around, depending on the resolutions you're dealing with on your HDMI for example.

What the 1:1 fix brings is firmware by which we have control over the aspect ratio of the source. I'm guessing the option to exactly match the source ratio to what is shown will be there. No more stretching. 'Always keep aspect ratio of source and fit inside screen' or something along those lines..
That way one can send a standard 16:9 ratio to the BenQ and be sure it will show up as 16:9 on the screen, creating two black bars (top and bottom) to fill up the un-used pixels.
 
peTeMelster said:
Is the 1:1 fix for 1:1 mapping or 1:1 scaling or both?
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Good point. If there's no scaling, anything below 1080p would look too tiny if it doesn't scale the image to fit the screen.
 
kadiir said:
Has the FP241W been discontinued? On the Benq site, I only see FP241WZ and FP241VW.
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No, I still see it. It would be good news if it were discontinued, though, then maybe the fp241wz would drop in price. The fp241vw is basically the fp241w with an ugly stand and audio out.
 
I prefer non-Z over Z version, since apparently the Z version has bad colors, very different than the non-Z version. Also, the Z version might have switched panels (at least according to Behardware), which is no good.

I'll stick with the non-Z when the 1:1 fix comes out (again, is it 1:1 mapping or 1:1 scaling or both?)
 
SlyNine said:
The games i have played on it are Fear, Americas army, UT2004, RTW, NFSMW, and have not noticed any input lag . And i have watched a few movies. 480 movie content is probably the weakest point of this monitor, as the monitor is very sharp and will highlight any fuzz in the movies.

If you are going to hook a dvd player up make sure you wait for the 1:1 pixel mapping. I have only used the DVI and Composite input (Dreamcast). Otherwise I highly recommend this monitor
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This is not a particular "problem" of this BenQ FP241! You'll have this on any 24" monitor since the artifacts are blown up on the big sharp 24". It is nice that you mention it anyawyz people now know what to expect. So you need to play High Quality movs on this kind of big screens which isn't a punishment (Best Industry protection you can imagine...lol). Maybe they make a artificial blur (Seems the Apple's have something like this but I am not sure.) The artificial blurr will also hide obvious rasterpoints. That's something I don't read much about:

How obvious is the TFT raster on the Samsung FP241? I hate seeing any raster at all!
 
so if i were to hook up my xbox 360 to the Benq FP241W it would look bad b/c of the 1:1 pixel problem?
 
How it looks (good/bad) is subjective. From what I've read in this thread, on a non-updated FP241W, the image will be stretched.
 
peTeMelster said:
I prefer non-Z over Z version, since apparently the Z version has bad colors, very different than the non-Z version. Also, the Z version might have switched panels (at least according to Behardware), which is no good.

I'll stick with the non-Z when the 1:1 fix comes out (again, is it 1:1 mapping or 1:1 scaling or both?)
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I just read this and wow! what a disapointment. I was so looking foward to this monitor. I had it on order for a while but after reading this I cancelled it straight away. BenQ, have been so secretive about the details of the technology in this screen and now I see why. They have blatantly lied about the BFI and on top of that they have changed the panel so the glowing reviews of the W version are meaningless. Even if I could buy the W version, which is not available in this country anyway, I would not.

I should have known something was wrong when asking their customer support about the different versions of this panel, none of their people knew what BFI was and I'm starting to see why. Oh and all the people at BenQ assured me that the 2 version were the same accept the BFI, Lies!!!. Oh well, I am going back to my original monitor choice, the NEC 2690. I hope it comes out soon.
 
Hmmm, until we have seen verified tests with the final and actual shipping version of that display and have had users actually use them we have nothing but assumptions, make believe and misinterpretations. (Behardware.com´s review didn´t state which revision of the display they had but I am quite certain that it wasn´t the shipping version, for example the display that trustedreview had was sent back to BenQ for the firmware update and that was late last week.)

Ok, support personnel can be incompetent or completely ignorant when it comes to new products, especially to ones that have not even shipped out yet. The failure to keep support or sales personnel up to date is a fault of BenQ as a corporation. I don´t really think that they would intentionally lie just to sell a unit or two of a certain product, it really doesn´t play into their hands or make sense.

I am eagerly waiting to see the end result of this admittedly patchy product launch. BenQ could have done many things a lot smarter, for example keep people more informed about what actually goes on. Given the limited timerame I am not surprised that this hasn´t taken place. Getting infromation ok´d for release can be a major hassle.

Anyway, I´m not going to tell you what to do with your money, you have all the right to buy a competing product if it suits you or makes you feel better.
 
dannyallen34 said:
Also, does the BenQ do X360 1080p over component but not accept the signal from the Xbox 360 VGA cable?
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This has already been sorted out on this thread. This BenQ can handle 1080p from the 360 through component, but not through VGA (I can confirm this myself). Waiting for another patch, Major Nelson has replied back to my emails letting me know their engineering team is aware of it.

Also, to address your other points, no noise can be heard from the monitor while it's on, and yes, the lowest it goes is about 3 inches off of wherever it's sitting (perhaps a little more? I don't exactly have any measuring tape on me).
 
Horna said:
Hmmm, until we have seen verified tests with the final and actual shipping version of that display and have had users actually use them we have nothing but assumptions, make believe and misinterpretations. (Behardware.com´s review didn´t state which revision of the display they had but I am quite certain that it wasn´t the shipping version, for example the display that trustedreview had was sent back to BenQ for the firmware update and that was late last week.)

Ok, support personnel can be incompetent or completely ignorant when it comes to new products, especially to ones that have not even shipped out yet. The failure to keep support or sales personnel up to date is a fault of BenQ as a corporation. I don´t really think that they would intentionally lie just to sell a unit or two of a certain product, it really doesn´t play into their hands or make sense.

I am eagerly waiting to see the end result of this admittedly patchy product launch. BenQ could have done many things a lot smarter, for example keep people more informed about what actually goes on. Given the limited timerame I am not surprised that this hasn´t taken place. Getting infromation ok´d for release can be a major hassle.

Anyway, I´m not going to tell you what to do with your money, you have all the right to buy a competing product if it suits you or makes you feel better.
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well put there :)

BenQ have actually confirmed some details and that both versions will use AUO P-MVA. See here :D
 
Lack of 1:1 Pixel Mapping: The absence of this feature from the FP241W is strange, and might well be an issue to potential buyers. Without it, the image from external devices or non native resolutions from a PC are always stretched and scaled to fill the screen, rather than offering options to maintain the aspect ratio or map the pixels 1:1 via the hardware itself. It has been confirmed in the FP241W manual that this option is not available, and also by BenQ support.

Update (19/11/06): there has recently been word across the internet that there would be a firmware update for the FP241W to fix the main gripe everyone seemed to have with the screen, the lack of aspect ratio options and 1:1 pixel mapping. We can confirm that UK management at BenQ have confirmed that this WILL be happening, and while there is limited detail at this time, BenQ have stated that the "24W series will have new firmware to phase in new functions, such as display mode//Windows Vista-DDC/CI". This confirmation only came on Friday, and more details will follow soon. This upgrade will not be possible by the user directly, and I would imagine screens would need to be sent to service centres for the update to be applied. New stock after a certain point (expected December) will have this updated firmware in place.

Update (7/12/06): BenQ have confirmed that on it's release (in the UK at least), the FP241WZ stock will feature the new firmware which as reported, will feature options for aspect ratio control and 1:1 pixel mapping. The release date and price of the FP241WZ has not been officially announced as yet.

From a PC, sources with black borders will maintain them. For instance if you watched a 4:3 TV show on the screen, since the graphics card is still outputting 1920 x 1200 the screen will see that the borders down the right and left hand sides are part of the source and keep these. Likewise for a 16:9 movie played from a PC, the black borders at the top and bottom are part of the source and will be kept. It is when using external devices like XBox 360, HD-DVD players etc that the source resolution does not match the screens native resolution. If an XBox tries to output 1080i which is 1920 x 1080 resolution, the screen will stretch the image to fill the screen, meaning the image is stretched vertically somewhat.

It will be the same situation when playing games on the screen from a PC at aspect ratios outside of the 16:10 format (e.g. at 1280 x 1024). There may still be hope if you need to use such options, as some software (including NVIDIA display drivers) can achieve this instead and maintain 1:1 pixel mapping or aspect ratio retention as shown below:

Source: http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/benq_fp241w.htm
 
So after the immense time it took to read through the thread - the only questions i have still remaining are

- If i buy the FP241W - out now; will I still be able to get the firmware update from Benq to get the 1 : 1 pixel mapping?

- Also if im running an xbox 360 - how do I get its audio as well its visuals?
 
Tyson Perkins said:
So after the immense time it took to read through the thread - the only questions i have still remaining are

- If i buy the FP241W - out now; will I still be able to get the firmware update from Benq to get the 1 : 1 pixel mapping?

- Also if im running an xbox 360 - how do I get its audio as well its visuals?
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Nope. And use a Y-adapter (included with Xbox 360 VGA cable) to run the RCA stereo audio plugs into a 3.5 mm (1/8") Line-In or Microphone port on your PC or speakers.
 
Yeah audio was a question with me as well. But what I really want to know is the following:

1) Will the Xbox 360 HD VGA Cable be fully compatible with this monitor (1080p)?

2) The price of this monitor... it wouldn't be any higher than $1,100 right?
 
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