Nissan to Introduce Steer-By-Wire Cars in 2013

Jorona said:
Actually no, Its because the pedal has a friction plate to improve the feel of the pedal. This plate wears and then the friction material causes it to stick. Maybe YOU should read up on the recall. Have a nice day.
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The pedal modification fix was done on a whole bunch of Toyota made cars. My parents own one that the dealer took the pedal off and ground it down so it wouldn't catch on the floormat.
 
This is a good thing step in the direction of self driving cars, as much as I enjoy driving people cant be trusted to drive just let computers do it for us one thing holding it all back is mechanical connections to the steering/brakes/shifter/accelerator.
 
DeathPrincess said:
You lost me there. Have you met most people? Go walk around outside a talk to some normal people. :p
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Do you know anything at all? Intelligence doesn't mean the brain is flawed or inferior, that's like saying a program with shitty coding is running shitty due to the processor and not the code.
 
randomdean100 said:
Do you know anything at all? Intelligence doesn't mean the brain is flawed or inferior, that's like saying a program with shitty coding is running shitty due to the processor and not the code.
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Brains vary in construction based on usage. Not used bits get killed off, often used bits get improved. So someone who uses it more will have a more developed brain. People have different response times, and this kind of thing isn't a instinct "oh dear my hand is in a fire" reaction type of thing. It needs some kind of higher thinking, and mental control which people have to varying degrees. Otherwise when in danger people wouldn't do silly things, which they often do.

It takes the average human 200ms to respond to something (process incoming data, think of a resonse, send signals, act upon it) as simple as a button press. Pretty sure that can be improved upon.
 
DeathPrincess said:
I had this idea of "drive by SMS" where you'd text the car and it would turn or go and stuff. Maybe using a shorthand like A20L20 (accelarate 20% turn L 20 degrees, I have a whole system worked out like OMG for emergency brake) but apparently it wasn't feasible due to SMS costs. Then this idea of where you could sit in the seat and drive using a touchscreen apllication on your phone (it's the latest thing!) but it was "pointless and fucking stupid". I tried to point out how it was "pointless and fucking stupid" for lots of other things, and they did it there, but they didn't seem to get it.

The cat idea may work however...
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I kinda like the driving by texting idea. That's pretty awesome, but I think my trunk cats would be able to react more quickly as long as it was the two or three hours of the day that they happened to be awake.
 
Crosshairs said:
Most new cars are fly by wire steering,and have been for a year or so... ...I dont know why Nissan thinks this is breaking news...

This is the first step towards the car itself controlling the steering when needed....such as collision avoidance or automatic parking
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No fair...mods can edit their news posts :p
 
Many electric forklifts already use this. So, what's the big deal?
 
I love technology when it solves a problem or makes something easier.

Drive by wire cars are a solution without a problem.

It's expensive and pointless.

Saying "aircraft have it!" is a terrible argument.
1) SOME aircraft have it. Certain large passenger jets and military are fully fly by wire. This is by necessity because these aircraft could not be flown at all without it.
2) Aircraft are operated under a rigorous and expensive maintenance schedule and frequent inspections that lead to... more maintenance. So things like the FBW system will be checked frequently for physical and software health.

The average driver won't ever change their oil and wouldn't ever know if something might be starting to go wrong with their car's computers.
 
Advil said:
I love technology when it solves a problem or makes something easier.

Drive by wire cars are a solution without a problem.

It's expensive and pointless.

Saying "aircraft have it!" is a terrible argument.
1) SOME aircraft have it. Certain large passenger jets and military are fully fly by wire. This is by necessity because these aircraft could not be flown at all without it.
2) Aircraft are operated under a rigorous and expensive maintenance schedule and frequent inspections that lead to... more maintenance. So things like the FBW system will be checked frequently for physical and software health.

The average driver won't ever change their oil and wouldn't ever know if something might be starting to go wrong with their car's computers.
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They aren't going to a full drive-by-wire setup like most race cars (although most of them still use normal steering/braking setups). They simply want to go with a steer-by-wire setup.

Like others have said, this will help with more automated driving. Parking assist or even full out, autonomous driving. While I highly doubt this car will be doing the latter, it will help to reduce prices on the technology. I certainly don't see this as being pointless.
 
Advil said:
I love technology when it solves a problem or makes something easier.

Drive by wire cars are a solution without a problem.

It's expensive and pointless.

Saying "aircraft have it!" is a terrible argument.
1) SOME aircraft have it. Certain large passenger jets and military are fully fly by wire. This is by necessity because these aircraft could not be flown at all without it.
2) Aircraft are operated under a rigorous and expensive maintenance schedule and frequent inspections that lead to... more maintenance. So things like the FBW system will be checked frequently for physical and software health.

The average driver won't ever change their oil and wouldn't ever know if something might be starting to go wrong with their car's computers.
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The problem is what do we do about traffic/accidents/road deaths. That is the problem, people make mistakes no matter how well the driver, people make mistakes shit happens and it will just get worse and worse. Imagine if we could forego some of the stupid amount of safety related equipment if accidents were much rarer than they are now. Imagine how much lighter/more efficient cars they would become.

The main problem is self driving cars people bitch about drive by wire gas pedals and they seem to work fine, everything needs to be drive by wire to have self driving cars its that simple and guess what I imagine Japan will be one of the first countries to accept it socially the idea of cars driving themselves.

It needs to happen its the next step of evolution of cars we wont be getting flying cars but cars working together with traffic lights all knowing where each wants to go will greatly improve traffic and I think once we get to an adoption rate of 20% there will be noticeable difference in accidents. I think if we ever hit 85% deaths would be near zero for travelling on the roads.

Also as far as just because aircraft have it we need to, is a good point but guess what MANY of our automotive technologies were derived from aircraft and the good thing with that is aircraft proved to be a testing ground for what works and what does not what fails and what does not. I like the idea of thing being tested on aircraft first because they tend to be safer.

Look up self driving cars each company is working to take more and more things away from the driver and have a computer handle is such as parking and emergency situations eventually they will sell a model that can drive its self. Everyone is working towards it and it makes the most sense. My only fears are government involvement to be honest but that me.
 
krotch said:
They aren't going to a full drive-by-wire setup like most race cars (although most of them still use normal steering/braking setups). They simply want to go with a steer-by-wire setup./QUOTE]
Simply? That's the most critical part. I can operate a vehicle without the engine or brakes (though that's a little scary). Without steering you're in a 4000 pound shopping cart.
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Aluisious said:
Simply? That's the most critical part. I can operate a vehicle without the engine or brakes (though that's a little scary). Without steering you're in a 4000 pound shopping cart.
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There will always be some form of safety mechanism for drive-by-wire systems. Your engine fails, the car still has brakes to stop. Your brakes hydraulics fail, well you still have a cable system e-brake.

In the case of these new steer-by-wire setup, you'll have a clutch system to reconnect the steering wheel to the wheels.
 
These die-by-wire systems cannot be used in a lot of countries for civilian ground vehicles, and I doubt they're going to look over those laws again.
 
Computers are my strong suit... cars not so much. Forgive me, but I thought we already had this.
 
Another solution to a problem that doesn't exist. All this automated parking bullshit, bad enough people don't know how to drive as it is. Lol, when I was in drivers ed, we went out to the frozen lake and were taught how to brake and steer on the ice ! Now ah days, most people don't even know enough to place their hand centered on the bottom part of the wheel when backing up so they can steer properly. I guess this will just get chalked up with math.
 
JosiahBradley said:
The reason I suck at racing games is the exact same reason I could never drive a car with such a system. I demand positive bumpy force feedback from the real road. I actually enjoy gripping my wheel as I go over rough roads and that fine minute tweaks that make me proud that I can power a 2,000lb vehicle. When you loose traction or take a turn to fast and can feel the actual feedback from the road, you can regain control and use the worlds fastest and most accurate processor ever created, the human brain. If I want to feel like I'm in a video game I'll go get GT5 where crashing doesn't end with me dieing.
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Well it's not like you're flying. You'll still be on the road feeling every nook and crannies and cracks and potholes and bumps. I'd say there's a vast difference sitting in a stationary, stiff arcade stimulation versus driving an actual car, electronic steering or no electronic steering.

I wonder though how often would you need to get the steering program re-calibrated.
 
Just another small step in 'human disconnect' that is further separating our ability to govern what we do with our technology by instead letting technology do it for us.

Our technology should be an extension of self (i.e. leave control of the vehicle completely in the hands of the driver) not replacement of thought. If you want cars to drive themselves then get rid of roads and make more trains.
 
DiabloRojo said:
Just another small step in 'human disconnect' that is further separating our ability to govern what we do with our technology by instead letting technology do it for us.

Our technology should be an extension of self (i.e. leave control of the vehicle completely in the hands of the driver) not replacement of thought. If you want cars to drive themselves then get rid of roads and make more trains.
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What? You mean we can't steer our own cars anymore?

How's that phone technology thingy doing for you? Or do you still walk to someone else's house to relay messages?
 
krotch said:
They aren't going to a full drive-by-wire setup like most race cars (although most of them still use normal steering/braking setups). They simply want to go with a steer-by-wire setup.
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I'm not aware of a single racecar that uses drive by wire. Most purpose built racecars don't even have power steering since power steering. This is because drive by wire systems are heavy, give you no feedback, and just suck in general.
 
Azhar said:
Well it's not like you're flying. You'll still be on the road feeling every nook and crannies and cracks and potholes and bumps. I'd say there's a vast difference sitting in a stationary, stiff arcade stimulation versus driving an actual car, electronic steering or no electronic steering.

I wonder though how often would you need to get the steering program re-calibrated.
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I guess what I meant to say was that I won't feel the feedback *from the wheel* itself. That level of connection makes me feel safer and more aware that I am in control. Arcade systems feel gimmicky and the wheels jump around far more than on a real car. Handling is my favourite part of driving and I have a rather tight steering wheel. I'm not sure how this thing can be faster than mechanical power assisted inputs. I see the car move as I gradually rotate the wheel a few degrees here and there. There is not much of a perceivable lag.
 
JosiahBradley said:
I guess what I meant to say was that I won't feel the feedback *from the wheel* itself. That level of connection makes me feel safer and more aware that I am in control. Arcade systems feel gimmicky and the wheels jump around far more than on a real car. Handling is my favourite part of driving and I have a rather tight steering wheel. I'm not sure how this thing can be faster than mechanical power assisted inputs. I see the car move as I gradually rotate the wheel a few degrees here and there. There is not much of a perceivable lag.
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I think you're giving "steering wheel feedback" too much credit. Most of what you describe is really "suspension and chassis" feedback.

And the "why do we need automobiles when my horse is faster and can pull more!" argument goes on again...
 
Jorona said:
Actually no, Its because the pedal has a friction plate to improve the feel of the pedal. This plate wears and then the friction material causes it to stick. Maybe YOU should read up on the recall. Have a nice day.
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Worked for Toyota and performed the recalls DAILY.... But I'm going to guess you engineered the car and helped Al Gore invent the Internet.
 
blackhand1001 said:
As if the horrid CVT transmissions wasn't already enough reason to avoid them. Those thing are horrible and don't even get better mpg than a 6/5 speed auto let alone an 8 speed.
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Eh, I love my 2011 rogue and its CVT transmission. Was one of the reasons I bought it. That and it gets fantastic mileage for a small suv with all wheel drive.
 
After owning a 2010 Corolla, I came to the conclusion that no one in the general populace gives a shit about steering feeling. On the highway, the wheel was completely limp and you constantly had to "drive" the car just to keep it pointed straight. Any slight body movement would turn the wheel as well. With no resistance, you needed have to exert effort just to keep the wheel from not moving. I had someone drive my car to see if they would notice anything. They took off down the highway, sawing back and forth on the wheel to keep the car between the lines, never mentioned anything about it.

Sold that car in ~2 months to buy a Jetta. Near the end of the model Corolla model year they started a TSB to fix the issue, but it was only applied if people complained about it.
 
Dekoth-E- said:
Eh, I love my 2011 rogue and its CVT transmission. Was one of the reasons I bought it. That and it gets fantastic mileage for a small suv with all wheel drive.
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Drive the new escape, or the new grand cherokee with the 8 speed auto. You probably upgraded from an old 4 speed auto or 5 speed. There are far better transmissions than cvt's. The rogue gets 22 city 26 highway. Compare this to the ford escape (6 speed auto) which gets 23 city 33 highway with more power and tons more torque. The escape is nearly 2 seconds faster in the 0-60 as well.
 
ocellaris said:
After owning a 2010 Corolla, I came to the conclusion that no one in the general populace gives a shit about steering feeling. On the highway, the wheel was completely limp and you constantly had to "drive" the car just to keep it pointed straight. Any slight body movement would turn the wheel as well. With no resistance, you needed have to exert effort just to keep the wheel from not moving. I had someone drive my car to see if they would notice anything. They took off down the highway, sawing back and forth on the wheel to keep the car between the lines, never mentioned anything about it.

Sold that car in ~2 months to buy a Jetta. Near the end of the model Corolla model year they started a TSB to fix the issue, but it was only applied if people complained about it.
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Toyotas are infamous for limp steering thats far too light. Everyone I have driven thats made in the last 8-10 years is like this.
 
blackhand1001 said:
Drive the new escape, or the new grand cherokee with the 8 speed auto. You probably upgraded from an old 4 speed auto or 5 speed. There are far better transmissions than cvt's. The rogue gets 22 city 26 highway. Compare this to the ford escape (6 speed auto) which gets 23 city 33 highway with more power and tons more torque. The escape is nearly 2 seconds faster in the 0-60 as well.
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No, I upgraded out of a modified eclipse..thanks kids! :(

I will actually be getting an escape here soon. I drive a dodge journey for a fleet vehicle and it is getting replaced with an escape in 4k miles.

That said, what the paper says and what I get are two entirely different things. I have put 40k on it in just over a year and a half and the mileage for me is 27 city and 31 highway. I track every single fillup. I got lucky with mine obviously. As for the transmission, I don't get the big deal. I don't feel it shift ever and as such I like that. It is a car for hauling the family and it does a good job. Are there better? I'm sure there are. It has been nearly two years since I bought it, but when I did I liked it better then the rest I drove.
 
blackhand1001 said:
Toyotas are infamous for limp steering thats far too light. Everyone I have driven thats made in the last 8-10 years is like this.
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I've driven a bunch of Toyotas, this was worse. I believe it was Toyotas first crack at a full EPS system in a volume selling car :eek: They fixed it in 2011 models. Any by fixed it, I mean they replaced the spaghetti noodle wheel feedback with two spaghetti noodles :D

Sucked for me though, I test drove the car a few times and didn't notice it. Then once everything was broken in and loosened up a bit, I was totally convinced there was something wrong with the car.
 
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