New Tariffs Target U.S. Board Games and Game Consoles

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by cageymaru, May 24, 2019.

  1. Nobu

    Nobu 2[H]4U

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    I mean, you could do it on an assembly line with each person focusing on one part, but the overall quality may suffer a bit. You could get robots to do it, but they mey rebel when they start getting rsi and aren't allowed to see the technician.
     
  2. Master_shake_

    Master_shake_ [H]ardForum Junkie

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    you still have to pay each person on the line a fair wage or they aren't going to do it.

    silk screening on a 3d object is probably the best solution but can it be done?
     
  3. E4g1e

    E4g1e [H]ardness Supreme

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    This tariff action is definitely going to hurt the American consumer in the long run, even if that consumer buys nothing that's made in China. This is because companies who make products that are made domestically will raise their prices proportionately to match the percentage of the tariff increases. There is absolutely no getting around that.
     
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  4. zamardii12

    zamardii12 2[H]4U

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    Not to mention the fact that despite Trump's taxes and talk about keeping jobs here, there are still massive layoffs regardless and outsourcing. Changes nothing... the companies are just pocketing the extra money.
     
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  5. GoodBoy

    GoodBoy [H]ard|Gawd

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    Couldn't a lot of the parts of board games be 3d-printed and made cheaply anywhere? Seems like a business could succeed at that here in the US, custom 3d-printing some parts to keep costs down. And they could take and fill smaller orders from other niche board game companies which would help those companies while keeping their 3d-printer better utilized.

    There are movies that are burned to dvd on demand, books that are printed on demand, I think it could be done, made in the US, and be successful.
     
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  6. st01c

    st01c n00b

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    Being able to buy things cheaply isn't the only indicator of how well the consumer is doing.

    For example, you can buy everything for pennies in some places, yet everyone is poor and suffering.
     
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  7. dvsman

    dvsman 2[H]4U

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    As I have said in other threads, the tariffs are targeting China over the long term - make companies move their supply chains. While in a perfect world, they would relocate back here to the USA, but in reality for cases like knickknacks and small items like board games, even if you move it to Mexico (or any other country) which will still reduce production costs, it will still hurt China ... and that's the point. And China realizes this.

    There are other (much friendlier) countries out there besides China that can make things for cheaper. It's not just a China or US situation.
     
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  8. motomonkey

    motomonkey [H]ard|Gawd

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    Exactly, this really isn’t so much about moving jobs back to the US, punishing China doesn’t mean that it’s going to set the clock back to 1950 here, that ship has sailed long ago. If we are lucky, it will force China to tone down some of its more blatant exploitation. It’s not going to stop, China is looking out for China, but hopefully this will make them a bit more cautious in the future.
     
  9. Zion Halcyon

    Zion Halcyon 2[H]4U

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    Not really. The Tariff system has worked for hundreds of years in stabilizing economies across the world.

    It wasn't until this nonsense of the past 50 years or so about a global market and trying to get people to shuttle money from wealthier Nations to poorer Nations, that anyone ever questioned it because it function properly.

    People here may not like it because they want instant gratification, but the upshot of these tariffs is more people will then look to move production out of China and into if not the United States then a beneficial trade partner like Japan or other countries that enjoy a reciprocal relationship on trade.

    Which is the entire point of the Tariff in the first place.

    If you have any problems with the Tariff system, that I have to question whether you actually give a crap about China stealing everyone's intellectual property in the first place. The tariffs are there with China because of unfair Trade Practices the Chinese have been engaging in for quite some time.

    This has nothing to do with two pig-headed people in power and everything to do with economic Prosperity, National Security, and putting an end to the theft practices of the Chinese.

    Anyone saying otherwise generally falls into one of three categories: an idiot, a liar, or even worse than a liar a paid propagandist who is someway on the take, like that Justin Amash's of the political Realm.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019
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  10. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    As if anything in politics is about what politicians claim it to be. The long-term effect might be good (it remains to be seen how everything works out) but let's not pretend our government is on some noble crusade.
     
  11. NKD

    NKD [H]ardness Supreme

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    It don't matter. Trump supporters will happily pay 25% more on everything and food. It's called being a Patriot! :D:D:D
     
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  12. Jagger100

    Jagger100 [H]ardness Supreme

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    It doesn't happen overnight. But will also happen is jobs/business will come back. As demand for labor goes up, wages go up.

    So what happens i cost of goods go up but wages of workers go up more . The three groups that are screwed are the rich, government employees, and government aid recipients. The government employees and aid recipients will get their pay adjusted eventually. So its really the rich who hurt from tarriffs and conversely benefit from imports..

    It also isn't a coincidence when a came across a person tripping over themselves to buy foreign goods, they usually fell in one of those 3 groups. There's also a 4th group, people whose jobs were protected due to government regulation, geography and/or language. They think they're immune to import's effects on their wages and act like it, but they aren't protected. Just takes a little longer. Those are the biggest fools.
     
  13. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    Lol. Jobs aren't going to come back to the US. Especially jobs that were never in the US in the first place. If operating in China becomes too expensive companies will move to Taiwan, South Korea, India, anywhere they can go to exploit cheap labor and production. The whole notion that this will bring jobs back is pure fantasy and a outright lie from the government. The outsourcing ship sailed decades ago and its not coming back. Even if the government tried to outlaw outsourcing companies would just pack up and leave the country entirely as that would be cheaper than bringing all production back to the US.
     
  14. Zion Halcyon

    Zion Halcyon 2[H]4U

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    Framing it the way you have does not take away from the fact that it is vital to National Security.
     
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  15. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    Of course, even though all the claims made recently have never been backed up by any evidence (Supermicro, Huawei) and we're trying to get all buddy-buddy with even worse dictators than China.
     
  16. Zion Halcyon

    Zion Halcyon 2[H]4U

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    And this is how I know you are delusional. I could smell it but now this is proof.

    Those jobs you are claiming are never coming back already started to pour back in, especially in the manufacturing and mining sector.

    3 steel plants already reopened in my home state that were shuttered since Clinton. Coal miners have long reported being back to work in Pennsylvania. Manufacturing and energy jobs are booming right now.

    In short, you suffer from a severe case of cognitive dissonance, because reality already doesn't match what you state it to be.
     
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  17. Zion Halcyon

    Zion Halcyon 2[H]4U

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    Seriously?

    No proof?

    Ok, either you are on the take or beyond help....

    Wow...
     
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  18. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    Context is important. Look at the title of the topic and what it is about. Then look at my post. Its almost as it I'm talking about the topic at hand.
    So where's the proof of Supermicro's supposed spy chips? Where's the proof behind the Huawei claims? I'm not doubting that spying happens, but vague claims being used as excuses don't really hold up in my book. I'm not interested in drinking the government Kool-Aid. Apparently you are.
     
  19. NKD

    NKD [H]ardness Supreme

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    Those jobs are not coming back to the U.S. Lets just put an end to it. They are moving at most to other countries if you referring to manufacturing jobs. We can wrap that up and put it away, not happening.
     
  20. NKD

    NKD [H]ardness Supreme

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    This! Everyone spies on one another. Fuck I am ready to believe it. Its like they just tell you and we are supposed to believe it, I got no love for China or Huwai but I am not going to eat whatever the government wants to feed me. I guess its the logical person in me speaking. I always believe in "Show don't just tell"
     
  21. motomonkey

    motomonkey [H]ard|Gawd

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    Would you rather we just let China continue to exploit the system? with no repercussions? are you Chinese?

    And production certainly will move from China eventually anyway. The Chinese are well aware of the long term effects of a boom economy. Wages increase. production costs increase, Production moves to countries with low production costs. This cycle started years ago. When I was a kid, no one wanted that "Made in Japan crap" then it was that "made in Taiwan crap" now it's that "made in China crap"

    All you have to do is observe where Chinese companies are investing now to see where the next centers of manufacturing will be.
     
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  22. GotNoRice

    GotNoRice [H]ardForum Junkie

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    That's true, but there is a difference between a country that is a democracy and a country where you're not even allowed to do an internet search for the word democracy. If you don't understand the difference when these two types of countries conduct spying operations, that's on you.
     
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  23. NKD

    NKD [H]ardness Supreme

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    You mad? Where did he ever defend china. He said the same thing you said without pointing fingers. Relax, making logical sense doesn't make you a china lover.
     
  24. NKD

    NKD [H]ardness Supreme

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    Still everyone spies on one another. Anything else? I know what democracy means, I know the value of the opportunity. That was a general comment leading to another comment. Lets stop taking things out of context. Fuck China for all I care. My comment wasn't about democracy or freedom, it was about showing me what the F is Huwai actually doing other than telling me what is politically correct.
     
  25. motomonkey

    motomonkey [H]ard|Gawd

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    He's defending China by attacking the Tariffs. if indirectly. And saying that the Jobs won't come back to the US is certainly not the same thing as saying they will move from China eventually due to economic pressure from within. I already said that the Jobs won't be coming back to the US, that's a pipe dream at this point. At he's certainly not making "Logical sense" overall, whatever are you smoking?

    Anyone with any common sense can see the problem. We've known what it is for years. we've tried negotiating deals with the Chinese time and again, but we've not had the combination of a US economy stable enough to take the hit, a Chinese economy with a sub prime crisis of it's own, and a US president willing to do the dirty dead of starting a trade war to force China to play nice. Arguing that all a Tariff does is hurt the common man on both sides is while correct on the surface, is short sighted, as this helps the US economy in the long term, either from forcing China to respect what we can do to their economy, or dealing a heavy blow to Chinese growth and causing difficulties to the Chinese Communist party. either outcome is a win for the US.
     
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  26. NKD

    NKD [H]ardness Supreme

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    Nope he is not. You think he is. Just becuase someone doesn't agree with Tariffs, doesn't make them less patriotic or china lover. Learn to disagree without calling names and assuming a boatload. Get over it, we have the right to our opinion without being labeled. So I am sure you agree with the new bullshit Tariffs on mexico too because of our governments inability to have immigration reform? Just read up how good of trade deals are with mexico, back and forth. Fool is creating mess around the world while Russia is getting stronger and sitting on the sidelines. Don't fool yourself. Trump will get his Trump tower in Russia when he is out of office, I promise! lol. Russia has mastered the geopolitics game, although it took them a few decades I am sure we will start dividing lines in another decade with the political bullshit that politicians feed us.
     
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  27. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    Things aren't as black and white as you'd like to believe. Not buying the government's claims and lies hook line and sinker isn't "pro China" or "defending China". Our duty, as citizens of the US, is to question the actions of our leaders and hold them accountable for their words and actions. I said both that jobs would not come back to the US AND that they would move from China, if it became too expensive to operate there. Helps if you read what someone actually wrote versus what you want them to have said in order to fit your narrative.

    Yes, the tariffs will hurt the common people, they will hurt small businesses, they will cause businesses to go out of business and put more people out of work. It might work out in the long run, but how much damage will it do before then? The disparity between the poor and the rich is only going to increase due to this, hurting people that already have trouble affording their basic needs. I'm not questioning the need to do something (tensions have been building for a long time) I'm questioning if this exact something is worth it or if the harm it does will become irrevocable before things get "better".
     
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  28. Jim Kim

    Jim Kim 2[H]4U

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  29. motomonkey

    motomonkey [H]ard|Gawd

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    You are certainly entitled to your opinion, no matter how illogical. as I am entitled to call out how silly I think it is, and what name did I call anyone? I asked if he was Chinese, it's a valid question. you are the one making assumptions.

    As for making assumptions, just because >I< don't agree with you, you are assuming I am a Trump supporter. I think the Mexico Tariffs are silly ass posturing, and that Russia is a getting away with murder.
     
  30. NKD

    NKD [H]ardness Supreme

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    I guess we can come to an agreement. I believe in not escalating things, this is one of the reasons I believe people tend to gain better understanding in person than in online format. Appreciate your detailed response. The reason I don't like the tariff game right now is everyone one in my family is worried about their 401k lol. My brother's got hammered pretty well. My sister in law is trump supporter and my brother isn't but now she is feeling it too.
     
  31. Zion Halcyon

    Zion Halcyon 2[H]4U

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    As I said before, those jobs you are saying won't come back to the US aren't just on their way back - THEY ARE ALREADY HERE.

    Anyone, ANYONE who says manufacturing jobs won't be coming back to the US when steel plants are reopening, coal miners are back to work, and jobs and job projections in manufacturing and energy in the US are through the roof beating all estimates is essentially showing their underbelly, ripping off their mask, and showing their true self. The Jobs are already here in the US, and they are also growing. Foreign companies like Foxconn are investing in the US even as some politicians who benefited from the old way of doing things are attempting to stop them. To deny this is to deny reality.

    Which means the people who keep saying jobs that are already here "won't come back" are either ignorant, stupid, or ACTIVELY engaging in DISINFORMATION. The jobs ARE back. And Energy and Manufacture are two of the largest job growth sectors right now in the US. Not just talking about lying sacks of shit in the media spouting talking points. I'm talking first hand information - people I know who work in those areas talking about long-inactive steel and aluminum plants being fired back up and reopened, coal miners talking about being able to go back to work again, about how a lot of the bullshit red tape that pushed them out of business is being removed, and they are able to make a good living again.

    So yeah. Anyone, ANYONE who says "the jobs won't come back" either needs their head examined....or their background....
     
  32. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    I'd argue anyone trying to use fucking Foxconn as an example has an agenda to spread. Foxconn has done nothing but lie, change plans, and fuck over the communities it has invaded. All the lofty promises they made Wisconsin? All complete lies. Foxconn isn't bringing jobs to the US, unless you count robots as employees. Also, Foxconn was looking for another US location to fuck over BEFORE the trade war and it might even have been before Trump was in office. Trying to use Foxconn's lies as an example of a good thing happening from the trade war is a bold faced lie. So any VALID examples of major tech companies opening US operations as a DIRECT RESULT of the trade war?
     
  33. Joust

    Joust 2[H]4U

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    I'm not going to defend what the other guy said, but, you have to understand that planning horizons for the type of capital investments you're talking about is way, way longer than the trade war business. This is an impossible request.
     
  34. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    I mean...That was kind of my entire point. He is making claims that companies are already opening new plants and jobs in he US as a direct result of the trade war.
     
  35. filip

    filip [H]ard|Gawd

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    Other companies planed ahead, I don't need to hear the sob stories of the companies that did not prepare.
     
  36. Joust

    Joust 2[H]4U

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    Planned ahead for...what?
     
  37. filip

    filip [H]ard|Gawd

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    Tariffs. The whole world did not get a 25% tariff, some companies moved manufacturing early.
     
  38. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    Manufacturing deals can take several months to work out. Also, if a company has a contract with a specific manufacturing company that can't just up and break it without incurring penalties. You act like massive changes can be made at the drop of a hat.
     
  39. filip

    filip [H]ard|Gawd

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    They had like 1-2 years to do it. They just bet it was going to work out, a bad bet on their part and I wont feel sorry for them in the slightest.
     
  40. NKD

    NKD [H]ardness Supreme

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    I lost you at Foxconn. Please stop right there. They haven’t done shit and wasted tax payer money. Proof is every where. Their office is a portable last I read lol.

    As far as manufacturing jobs I wasn’t talking about coal mining or steel jobs. I was referring to tech manufacturing jobs.

    Again stop using Foxconn please. It’s an insult of an example.