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New graphic design build

P

penpen2015

n00b
Joined
Aug 16, 2012
Messages
9
1) What will you be doing with this PC? Gaming? Photoshop? Web browsing? etc
Photoshop, Illustrator, web dev, browsing, some video editing (light to middle weight post work for short web videos), watching movies, file serving
2) What's your budget? Are tax and shipping included?
I'd like to keep it around $1000 but I'm flexible up to $1300 if there is something that really warrants it. Yes tax and shipping are included. (hate sales tax)
3) Which country do you live in? If the U.S, please tell us the state and city if possible.
Los Angeles, CA
4) What exact parts do you need for that budget? CPU, RAM, case, etc. The word "Everything" is not a valid answer. Please list out all the parts you'll need.
CPU, RAM, Mobo, GFX Card, maybe power supply
5) If reusing any parts, what parts will you be reusing? Please be especially specific about the power supply. List make and model.
2x 1tb WD Green, 1x 2tb WD Green, 100 gb SanDisk SSD (although I may get a 128 gb Crucial M4 (not part of this budget), 1tb WD Black drive (appdata drive etc), SATA DVD-RW drive, Antec P180 case, Corsair Power Supply HX620. With regard to the power supply, I've been running it on my Q6600 pretty much non stop for maybe 5 years. Hence my comment above. Maybe it's time to change?
6) Will you be overclocking?
Not sure. Stability more important as this is a work computer but might try to overclock to extend the usable life of the computer by a bit.
7) 7) What is the max resolution of your monitor? What size is it?
2x 24 inch monitors 1920x1200
8) When do you plan on building/buying the PC?
Within the next 2 weeks to month.
9) What features do you need in a motherboard? RAID? Firewire? Crossfire or SLI support? USB 3.0? SATA 6Gb/s? eSATA? Onboard video (as a backup or main GPU)? UEFI? etc.
Would like SLI for option of adding more monitors later, more SATA ports the better (as I'm out of SATA slots on my current machine), something quiet, stable.
10) Do you already have a legit and reusable/transferable OS key/license? If so, what OS? Is it 32bit or 64bit?
Yes. Windows 7 Pro 64


I'm willing to drive to the Microcenter in Tustin assuming they have the parts in stock. It's a bit of a drive but I usually have to head out there once a month on business. I'd like to be able to take advantage of CUDA cores for the Adobe stuff (I'm currently running a 9600GT and it feels rather old and tired =P) so maybe a 660Ti although I'm not sure if Adobe will recognize it. Responsiveness is pretty important.

I've been out of the loop for quite a while (had this current rig for almost 5 years? maybe more... ) but it seems like most of the advice has been the Asus Z77 series with either Sandy Bridge or Ivy Bridge. Would love to hear what you guys have to say about this in general. Thanks for your time and look forward to hearing your ideas.
 
penpen2015 said:
I'm willing to drive to the Microcenter in Tustin assuming they have the parts in stock. It's a bit of a drive but I usually have to head out there once a month on business.
Click to expand...
Ok, what's the likelihood of you heading out to that area before August 31st?
 
50/50? I can move my schedule around to accommodate going there earlier. And if need be, I do have a friend down there that can pick up parts for me if there is a time constraint.
 
50/50 is not good enough for me nor does having your friend pick it up seems worth the effort. For now I'm gonna assume that you can't make it to MC:
$310 - Intel Core i7-3770 CPU
$177 - MSI Z77A-GD65 Intel Z77 ATX Motherboard
$160 - 4 x Corsair CMV8GX3M1A1333C9 8GB DDR3 1333 RAM
$130 - Corsair AX650 650W Modular PSU
---
Total: $777 shipped.

I went with Amazon.com since they don't charge us CA residents sales tax. Technically you don't need a new PSU as that Corsair HX620, even after five years of constant use, is still solid enough for the above build. With that said, I'm assuming that you may want to reuse your old PC as a HTPC, NAS or file server, etc later on and that you don't have a spare PSU to begin with. So might as well use the HX620 for that and get a new PSU for the new system. That motherboard is a bit overkill for your needs but it's probably the cheapest mobo I can recommend that has 8 SATA ports that comes with a solid UEFI interface. If you want to be able to OC past 3.6Ghz, spend the extra $20 for the Core i7 3770K. Yes, that is 32GB of RAM total.

Now you may have noticed that I left out the GPU. Your GPU choice depends on your answer to the following questions:
1) Which version of Adobe Photoshop are you using?
2) If not CS6, what's the likelihood of you upgrading to CS6?
 
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Put in my order for CS6 earlier this week hence this post. =P

Also, lets assume I CAN make it to Microcenter. Does that change anything drastically?
 
penpen2015 said:
Put in my order for CS6 earlier this week hence this post. =P
Click to expand...
In that case, you don't specifically need a Nvidia GPU as CS6 no longer uses Nvidia's CUDA tech but the openly supported (which means it can be used by either GPU company) OpenGL and OpenCL frameworks. But the GTX 660 Ti is a solid card and is available from Amazon.com at a reasonable price. The 660 TI just came out so it might be awhile before it's fully supported in CS6 however.
penpen2015 said:
Also, lets assume I CAN make it to Microcenter. Does that change anything drastically?
Click to expand...
Yes (Sales tax factored in):
$422 - Core i7 2700K CPU + Asus P8Z77-V Intel Z77 Motherboard

$65 cheaper and gets you roughly the same performance as the 3770 + MSI mobo I linked to above but with the ability to OC past 3.6Ghz and has a better UEFI interface. Not to mention lower temperatures when overclocking. But the onboard video is slower (just in case the main GPU ever dies) and you won't have the ability to connect three monitors to the onboard video alone (only two monitors max with the 2700K). If you're not in the area already for business, the $65 savings isn't worth the gas + time spent IMO.
 
Danny Bui said:
In that case, you don't specifically need a Nvidia GPU as CS6 no longer uses Nvidia's CUDA tech but the openly supported (which means it can be used by either GPU company) OpenGL and OpenCL frameworks. But the GTX 660 Ti is a solid card and is available from Amazon.com at a reasonable price. The 660 TI just came out so it might be awhile before it's fully supported in CS6 however.
Click to expand...

I assume that you mean Photoshop CS6?

Premiere Pro CS6, on the other hand, still does not support OpenCL at all (at least not in Windows). The GPU acceleration in the Windows version of Premiere Pro CS6 is still CUDA-exclusive. OpenCL GPU acceleration in Premiere Pro CS6 is supported only on OSX (Mac).
 
Yeah I do some small cuts here and there in Premiere so the CUDA cores might be quite helpful.

Looking at the Microcenter in Tustin, it looks like that particular Asus board is sold out. So very sad. T_T Out of curiosity, does Microcenter tend to restock frequently? I figure I'll sort my schedule and if my work takes me down there next week and they might have it in stock, then I'd probably go for that. If not, I'll probably just order the MSI x 3770 in the next couple of days.
 
Very well. Time to give them a call I guess. Thanks for all the info. Will let you know how it all shakes out in a week or so.

For future reference, they apparently get shipments in a couple of times a week and apparently they have no knowledge of what is coming in. The wonders of discount computer stores. =P Thanks again Danny. Your input has proven to be invaluable. ^_^
 
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penpen2015 said:
Yeah I do some small cuts here and there in Premiere so the CUDA cores might be quite helpful.
Click to expand...

Actually, the CUDA GPU acceleration in Premiere works if you're using any GPU-accelerated effects and/or if you're converting your videos from a given resolution to a lower or higher resolution (for example, you're trying to convert 720p to 480p for some Web site that still doesn't support HD video hosting).
 
Danny-

Wanted to ask you a question. Assuming I'm willing to give up two SATA slots, what is your opinion on the ASUS P8Z77 V LK? I ask because it appears that it has a 20 dollar rebate on top of the existing discount which drops it to 50 dollar cheaper than the standard V from Microcenter with the obvious differences being the Intel NIC and the loss of two SATA ports. If I convert the existing rig I have to a file server, storage space might not be that big of an issue but I wanted to get your opinion in terms of if there other items that I might be missing in terms of build quality and other intangibles. For a $30 dollar difference, I wouldn't really bother but at $50, that is starting to reach that price threshold where I'm starting to care.
 
The LK is a good mobo. That was gonna be my first recommendation until I reread your SATA requirements.
 
Why do you rule out the AMD bundle at Microcenter ? FX8120 + a good motherboard could be below $300.
 
Melon said:
Because the 2700k is going to run circles around that Bulldozer processor.
Click to expand...

This. Not to mention that it'll do it while at stock speeds, using significantly less power, and generates less heat. Hell even the 3570K would do that.
 
If running circles around Bulldozer chip meaning 10 percent faster, then I'd rather use Bulldozer.

I like to use virtual machines. Bulldozer with 8 real cores is nicer. Wondering if 8 real cores would help graphics design.
 
Obviously we're looking at different sites: AT shows thats there's a 25% performance difference between the 2600 and FX-8150 in Photoshop work. Same performance difference when it comes to video rendering tasks as well. Even in heavily multi-threaded video benchmarks like Cinebench, there's gonna be at least a 15% performance difference between the 2700K and the FX-8120. Like I said earlier, there's also the dramatically lower temperatures and lower power usage of the Intels. Finally then there's the awesome UEFI interface that the newer Intel mobos have which many current AMD mobos do not have.

Considering that the OP is now planning on getting the P8Z77-V LK, his purchase cost is now $325 for the CPU and mobo. $85 for at least a 15% to 25% performance increase plus lower heat, lower power usage, and UEFI is totally worth it IMO.

But let's say he couldn't afford that extra $85. Would the AMD be a good choice then? The answer is still no. He could still get the Core i5 3570K + Asus P8Z77-V for $265, just $15 more. Again over at AT, adding 3% to the performance of the 2500K to get the close approximation of the performance increase of the 3570K, the 3570K still outperforms the FX-8150 by about 10% to 20% in video rendering applications. So $15 more for higher performance, lower power usage, lower heat, and UEFI is again well worth the extra cash.

So in the case of the MC deals, unless you absolutely cannot spare $15, AMD Bulldozer still isn't a cost-effective solution for the kind of usage that OP is talking about.
 
I really like the fact that Intel chip is low powered and all. as for UEFI not sure if that's working well.

Did you take into account of overclocking? AMD chip after overclocking could do wonder.

Anyway, I am waiting hopelessly for the next AMD chip. It's supposed to be low powered as well.
 
adobian said:
as for UEFI not sure if that's working well.
Click to expand...
It has been working well in the case of MSI and Asus. Gigabyte to a certain extent as well. Just look at the HardOCP reviews of Z77 mobos and you'll see that UEFI is working just fine.
adobian said:
Did you take into account of overclocking? AMD chip after overclocking could do wonder.
Click to expand...
So would the Intel CPUs we're talking about. Remember, these are the K series Intels we're talking. They can be OC'd as well.
adobian said:
Intel chip, the unlocked version is not compatible with Virtualization.
Click to expand...
Two things:
1) Why bring up Virtualization if the OP hasn't mentioned virtualization at all? It's not pertinent to the discussion at hand about the OP's needs, not yours.
2) You're wrong: The K series CPUs work just fine with virtual machines as they still have VT-x support which allows for increased virtualization performance and capability. However, the K series do not have VT-D support which allows for direct access of hardware by virtual machines i.e the VM now has full control over a video card or storage controller. However it's only hypervisors that actually let you take use that VT-D capability for VM use, not desktop OSes. So in other words, VT-D isn't a big deal unless this is gonna be a full-time virtualization server, which again, the OP is not doing.

Anyway, don't bring up virtualization unless the OP actually says he's going to be doing VM.

So again, for the OP, AMD isn't a good option. There are certain situations where AMD might be the better choice but none of those options apply to the OP or gaming/high performance enthusiasts.
 
Um... wow. Really didn't expect the conversation to go this way. I'm definitely not doing any form of virtualization and I've felt that its better to pay up front as the percentage performance increase would pay for itself within a month considering the amount of work I do. Picked up the P8Z77-V-LK and the 2700k today (had my meeting pushed up to today). Thanks for the suggestions Danny.

On a side note, I was a total idiot and forgot to buy the RAM before leaving today and now the price has gone up by 10 dollars a stick to about 50 bucks. Is that the best deal out there right now? I'm not concerned about the 40 dollar hit but if there is a better option, I'd love to hear it. =P

Thanks again.
 
penpen2015 said:
hanks for the suggestions Danny.
No prob man.

penpen2015 said:
On a side note, I was a total idiot and forgot to buy the RAM before leaving today and now the price has gone up by 10 dollars a stick to about 50 bucks. Is that the best deal out there right now? I'm not concerned about the 40 dollar hit but if there is a better option, I'd love to hear it. =P

Thanks again.
Click to expand...
There is a better option for the money:
http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-1333M...DKIKX0DER&s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1345441051&sr=1-30

Not as great of a deal like what I originally posted but at least you're only $16 more rather than $40 more.
Click to expand...
 
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