New Gaming Build

[Jon55]

1) What will you be doing with this PC? Gaming? Photoshop? Web browsing? etc
Primarily gaming (CPU-intensive games such as Civilization, WoW, etc.)
2) What's your budget? Are tax and shipping included?
$1500.00 total (including tax and shipping), this is a general figure. I'd be willing to go a little over that by a $100 or so but if it can be avoided that's fine too
3) Where do you live?
Northern California (Fry's is close by, Microcenter is not )
4) What exact parts do you need for that budget? CPU, RAM, case, etc. "Everything" is not a valid answer. Please list out all the parts you'll need.
CPU, Mobo, RAM, CPU cooler (air), PSU, possibly case
5) If reusing any parts, what parts will you be reusing? Please be especially specific about the power supply. List make and model.
Might reuse the case (a Raidmax Smilodon), might hold on the 280 GTX GPU for a couple months
6) Will you be overclocking?
Yes
7) What size monitor do you have and/or plan to have?
24" Samsung LCD (currently have)
8) When do you plan on building/buying the PC?
Towards the middle/end of this month (October)
9) What features do you need in a motherboard? RAID? Firewire? Crossfire or SLI support? etc.
SATA 6 and USB 3, would prefer an ASUS board
10) Do you already have a legit and reusable/transferable OS key/license? If so, what OS? 32bit or 64bit?
Yes, Windows 7 64-bit


Right now I'm leaning towards an i5 760 with some kind of ASUS mobo, two F3 1TB hard drives (for RAID 0), holding on to my current 280 GTX for the time being, possibly holding on to the RAIDMAX Smilodon case (I'd be willing to give it up though), already have a monitor, keyboard/mouse, and speakers. So RAM, PSU, CPU cooler, and potentially case are all up in the air. I'm willing to take any suggestions or input.

My only real concern is the CPU choice. I understand the i5's are nearly just as fast as the i7's in gaming, but the majority of games I play are very CPU intensive. I've yet to find any benchmarks comparing an i5 vs and i7 in Civilization V. All I'm wondering is will an i7 help that much in games like that, because if so I'd totally be willing to make the jump to an i7 setup (which I know would increase the cost of the build).

I like SSD's a lot but they're too expensive for the capacity, and I really like the F3's, and RAID 0 is a risk I'm willing to take. As for the ASUS only board request, this is mainly due to bad personal experience in the past with many setups using Gigabyte. I know a lot of people have fantastic experiences with Gigabyte boards, but I have not, and much prefer ASUS boards in general. The request for SATA 6/USB 3 is mainly future-proofing (in case I decide to get an SSD in a year or so).

I also have a Fry's nearby, which has prices that match very closely to the one's on Newegg. Unfortunately, the closest Microcenter near me is like 2 hours away.

Hopefully that answers any questions. Thanks in advance for any input!

 

[Dangman]

That case should be fine to reuse. Even in CPU intensive games, the difference between a Core i7 and a Core i5 isn't that much different to justify the higher costs of the i7/X58 platform.

Prelim build:
$209 - Intel Core i5 750 CPU
$135 - Asus P7P55D-E LX Intel P55 ATX Motherboard
$87 - G.Skill Ripjaw Series F3-12800CL9D-4GBRL 2 x 2GB DDR3 1600 RAM
$30 - Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus HSF for LGA 1366 and LGA 1156
$110 - Antec Truepower New TP-750 750W PSU
---
Total: $571 plus tax and shipping.

 

[Jon55]

Is there any benefit to getting the Sabertooth 55i or the P7P55D-E Pro boards vs the one you listed?

 

[Dangman]

Is there any benefit to getting the Sabertooth 55i or the P7P55D-E Pro boards vs the one you listed?

The only big difference between the Pro and the regular E version is just SLI support. The regular E version does not support SLI. IMO, that's not worth the extra $45 for the Pro. As for the Sabertooth, it doesn't have USB 3.0 or SATA 6Gb/s support but it does have SLI support.

 

[Jon55]

The only big difference between the Pro and the regular E version is just SLI support. The regular E version does not support SLI. IMO, that's not worth the extra $45 for the Pro. As for the Sabertooth, it doesn't have USB 3.0 or SATA 6Gb/s support but it does have SLI support.

Ah, I didn't even realize that about the Sabertooth.

Also, do RAM latencies really matter performance-wise? Would a CL7 vs CL9 make any noticeable difference?

 

[Dangman]

Also, do RAM latencies really matter performance-wise? Would a CL7 vs CL9 make any noticeable difference?

Nope, RAM latencies does not matter that much these days. You won't notice a difference between CL7 and CL9

 

[Jon55]

Nope, RAM latencies does not matter that much these days. You won't notice a difference between CL7 and CL9

Good to know. God damn you kick ass Danny, thanks so much for the help. One last question, I know the 6 series ATI cards are supposedly being released in November or sometime around then, but in case I do decide to pull the trigger and get a GPU, what would you recommend? I'd definitely be willing to make the GPU the most expensive part on the build. Any Nvidia cards you think might work?

 

[Jon55]

Good to know. God damn you kick ass Danny, thanks so much for the help. One last question, I know the 6 series ATI cards are supposedly being released in November or sometime around then, but in case I do decide to pull the trigger and get a GPU, what would you recommend? I'd definitely be willing to make the GPU the most expensive part on the build. Any Nvidia cards you think might work?

Anyone?

 

[E4g1e]

Nope, RAM latencies does not matter that much these days. You won't notice a difference between CL7 and CL9

However, a lower CL does buy you a little more overclocking room - but only if the rated DIMM voltage is also low enough. Unfortunately, most CL7 memory at DDR3-1600 speed requires 1.6V or 1.65V to run at its advertised speed and timings, which may hinder overclocking performance. In addition, the official JEDEC standard for DDR3-1600 memory specifies CL8, CL9 or CL10 and 1.5V.

In any event, if you're not going to overclock your system's CPU, don't spend more than you have to. And if you are planning to overclock a CPU that has its own IMC, rated DIMM voltages matter much more than CL latency timings.

 

[tenub]

If you have near $1500 to spend I would personally go for an LGA1366 solution. Many X58 boards are amazing, especially for overclocking.

Definitely hold on to your GTX 280 for now, at least until the dust settles from the new ATI line.

$200 - Core i7 930
$230 - ASUS P6X58D-E
$180 - Corsair Dominator 6GB (3x2GB) DDR3 1600
$62 - Prolimatech Megahalems
$30 - Two of any Scythe S-FLEX fans to suit your ears and performance requirements
$143 - Corsair CMPSU-850HX
$250 - Lian Li PC-V1020B

Leaves you with $400 for hard drives and video card(s). Personally, I'd wait for the new ATI cards to hit then grab two GTX 460s for around $300 in total.

 

[Jon55]

If you have near $1500 to spend I would personally go for an LGA1366 solution. Many X58 boards are amazing, especially for overclocking.

Definitely hold on to your GTX 280 for now, at least until the dust settles from the new ATI line.

$200 - Core i7 930
$230 - ASUS P6X58D-E
$180 - Corsair Dominator 6GB (3x2GB) DDR3 1600
$62 - Prolimatech Megahalems
$30 - Two of any Scythe S-FLEX fans to suit your ears and performance requirements
$143 - Corsair CMPSU-850HX
$250 - Lian Li PC-V1020B

Leaves you with $400 for hard drives and video card(s). Personally, I'd wait for the new ATI cards to hit then grab two GTX 460s for around $300 in total.

I've done so much jumping back and forth between the i5 and the i7 lines, trust me, but I have a hard time finding any solid proof that the i7's will do much better (at least in gaming) vs the i5 760. Especially at the price.

I really wish there was a "Civilization V: i5 vs i7" benchmark somewhere out there, but I've to come across one. As I said in my original post, I play mostly CPU intensive games. I'd be willing to make the $$$ jump to i7 if I there were some evidence out there that they'd help.

Thanks for the heads up on the GPU's. In comparison, how does the 280 GTX compare to modern cards?

 

[tenub]

If you play Civilization V and won't be interested in newer games such as Metro 2033 then why do you need to upgrade your system, especially if it's anything along the lines of your current video card (GTX 280)? If you're sticking with Civ V and WoW then keep your current system until you get bored of those games and want to play something more system intensive.

You're right about the i5 vs. i7 issue though, but when you can get an i7 930 for $199 at Micro Center, why not? Right?

 

[Jon55]

If you play Civilization V and won't be interested in newer games such as Metro 2033 then why do you need to upgrade your system, especially if it's anything along the lines of your current video card (GTX 280)? If you're sticking with Civ V and WoW then keep your current system until you get bored of those games and want to play something more system intensive.

You're right about the i5 vs. i7 issue though, but when you can get an i7 930 for $199 at Micro Center, why not? Right?

Uh, I never even gave any info on my previous system (aside from the GPU card). So I'm not sure where you're pulling that information from.

And regarding Microcenter, did you even read my post at all?

 

[tenub]

Well, I'm assuming your current system is along the lines of your current video card. Who would pair a Pentium 4 with a GTX 280, right?

I did read your post; four hours is worth it though in my opinion. I'd spend the extra $15-20 in gas for it.

 

[Jon55]

Well, I'm assuming your current system is along the lines of your current video card. Who would pair a Pentium 4 with a GTX 280, right?

Uh, those two weren't even slight released around the same time frame. Have you been inside a computer before?

Anyway, thank you again to those of you who helped. I'll see if I can't get pics up after the build.

 

[Dangman]

Sorry, missed your thread for some reason.

Good to know. God damn you kick ass Danny, thanks so much for the help. One last question, I know the 6 series ATI cards are supposedly being released in November or sometime around then, but in case I do decide to pull the trigger and get a GPU, what would you recommend? I'd definitely be willing to make the GPU the most expensive part on the build. Any Nvidia cards you think might work?

Right now, I would recommend the GTX 460 1GB. It's pretty much one of the better bang for the buck card out now at normal pricing. And it just ahppens to be a Nvidia card. With that said, it's not gonna be a dramatic difference in performance over your GTX 280 card. Unfortunately the other Nvidia cards are seriously overpriced IMO. Then again, GTX 460 1GB SLI is also a very good value.

So yeah I agree with tenub, hold onto your GTX 285 for now.

Thanks for the heads up on the GPU's. In comparison, how does the 280 GTX compare to modern cards?

The GTX 280 is roughly 17% slower than the GTX 460 1GB under the most ideal conditions. In some games, the GTX 280 is roughly the same as the GTX 460 1GB.

 

[tenub]

Uh, those two weren't even slight released around the same time frame.

I don't think you've correctly understood the meaning behind what I wrote. I was simply demonstrating the extreme end of my point. Anyone can buy a GTX 280 and upgrade their 4-5 year old computer but that would be stupid and probably not what you did.

You never mentioned the rest of your current components, so I could only assume that they were along the lines of your GTX 280, ie. released around the same time (something like an E8400 with a P45 board). This led me to the conclusion that for playing WoW and Civilization V, a system upgrade would simply be a waste of money as not much improvement would be seen.

If, however, your GTX 280 is somehow running inside an ancient system such as a Prescott in a cheap LGA 775 board with 1GB memory then I would indeed suggest you upgrade as you will definitely see performance increases in those two games.

I hate having to write all that. It's much easier when everyone else understands the meaning behind what I write but I guess that sometimes it isn't the case.

 

[vjcsmoke]

If you're spending $1500 to upgrade your system to something modern there is absolutely NO REASON not to get an SLI capable motherboard. Depending on if you go i5 or i7 then the P55 and X58 chipsets would likely be best for your needs.

Here is a nice x58 combo that includes the sabertooth mobo, an i950, and a huge HAF X case. Combo Price: $624.99.

Or if you go i5, you can stretch your dollar further. $811.99 but also includes ram, a PSU, and a 60GB SSD.

 

[Jon55]

Sorry, missed your thread for some reason.

Right now, I would recommend the GTX 460 1GB. It's pretty much one of the better bang for the buck card out now at normal pricing. And it just ahppens to be a Nvidia card. With that said, it's not gonna be a dramatic difference in performance over your GTX 280 card. Unfortunately the other Nvidia cards are seriously overpriced IMO. Then again, GTX 460 1GB SLI is also a very good value.

So yeah I agree with tenub, hold onto your GTX 285 for now.

The GTX 280 is roughly 17% slower than the GTX 460 1GB under the most ideal conditions. In some games, the GTX 280 is roughly the same as the GTX 460 1GB.

Yikes, Nvidia card numbering schemes at their finest I guess. I'll definitely hang on to it for now then. Thanks for the heads up.

If you're spending $1500 to upgrade your system to something modern there is absolutely NO REASON not to get an SLI capable motherboard. Depending on if you go i5 or i7 then the P55 and X58 chipsets would likely be best for your needs.

Here is a nice x58 combo that includes the sabertooth mobo, an i950, and a huge HAF X case. Combo Price: $624.99.

Or if you go i5, you can stretch your dollar further. $811.99 but also includes ram, a PSU, and a 60GB SSD.

Not for me it isn't. I've realized I upgrade my entire machine every 2 years or so (give or take 6 months)- the jump in price just isn't worth the money to me. It's weird, part of me wants to think the i7 is this magical jump that really will help performance and remove this invisible performance ceiling that the i5 has, but the reality is the i5 really isn't that much slower than the i7- at least not from what I can tell. I've yet to see any huge gains to be had (at least gaming wise). Just because I have a $1500 limit doesn't mean I need to blow every last dollar. Also, if you had read my original post at all, SSD's are no good to me right now (not for the price/capacity ratio that's offered). Not to mention 60 GB is pathetically small.

That last link you pointed out is an i7 build by the way- not sure why you mentioned the i5.

I hate having to write all that. It's much easier when everyone else understands the meaning behind what I write but I guess that sometimes it isn't the case.

Forgive me for not being able to read minds.

 

[Shalafi]

May I suggest you hold onto that 280 GTX for the time being, ATI should be releasing new cards in the next few months, I'm pretty sure that your card will be able to handle games just fine untill then. This leaves you with enough money pretty much to get a dual video card solution if you want to go down that road further down the line.

I do want to add something. I know you say that SSD's aren't "good for you now" but . . . if you use one as your OS drive, you will notice a difference in your everyday computing environment. You are right that 60 GB is small. But with Windows 7, there are guides out there on how to trim your OS install to as little as 7 GB of space, that'd leave you for more or less 50ish GB to use for the rest of your needs. Plenty of room to install your most frequently used programs and a few games.

May I also add that WoW is the one game that sees a noticeable improvement with a SSD? That is because while it IS a CPU intensive game, it is continuously loading data off your hard drive as you move through areas in the game, enter/exit places, and fly around and shit.

I'm pretty sure you could fit your OS install and WoW on that SSD and be happy.

I'm just not so sure i'd pay $150 for it, I have seen it cheaper a few times in the HotDeals section of this forum.

Ok, just my 2 cents . . . .

 

[Jon55]

May I suggest you hold onto that 280 GTX for the time being, ATI should be releasing new cards in the next few months, I'm pretty sure that your card will be able to handle games just fine untill then. This leaves you with enough money pretty much to get a dual video card solution if you want to go down that road further down the line.

I do want to add something. I know you say that SSD's aren't "good for you now" but . . . if you use one as your OS drive, you will notice a difference in your everyday computing environment. You are right that 60 GB is small. But with Windows 7, there are guides out there on how to trim your OS install to as little as 7 GB of space, that'd leave you for more or less 50ish GB to use for the rest of your needs. Plenty of room to install your most frequently used programs and a few games.

May I also add that WoW is the one game that sees a noticeable improvement with a SSD? That is because while it IS a CPU intensive game, it is continuously loading data off your hard drive as you move through areas in the game, enter/exit places, and fly around and shit.

I'm pretty sure you could fit your OS install and WoW on that SSD and be happy.

I'm just not so sure i'd pay $150 for it, I have seen it cheaper a few times in the HotDeals section of this forum.

Ok, just my 2 cents . . . .

Oh I totally know that I'd see a huge gain in load times and read/writes from an SSD. And games such as WoW would be absolutely killer. But even 80 GB is too small for me. I know it works for some people, but just not for me. Especially when 80 GB is going to set me back $200. But prices are falling and I have faith they'll fall even more, not to mention the next gen. will be even faster/better/cheaper than the current. I have no doubt that SSD's are the future, and I'm all for them. But for me personally it's just not worth the jump yet.