Need thoughts on upgrading brother's basic system

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GJSNeptune

[H]F Junkie
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I built my brother a basic computer back in Sept. 2006. It was to be as cheap as possible, and it came out to just under $400 after a rebate or two.

He knows cars like I know computers. Decent trade-off. He recently bought Overlord (2007) and didn't realize it would run so horribly. I feel kind of bad, and I'm thinking for christmas I can help him beef up his rig a bit.

Prior to building him a computer, he had bought a house because he was making good money. Awhile later he decided to find a new job because his current employer was driving the business into the ground. He isn't making as much where he works now, so money's tight. It doesn't help that his house was built in the 50s or 60s and has no insulation.

- Antec Solution SLK1650B Black Steel ATX Mini Tower w/ 350W PSU
- PC CHIPS A11G V1.0 AM2 NVIDIA GeForce 6100 Micro ATX
- AMD Sempron 64 2800+ Manila 1.6GHz Socket AM2 62W Single-Core
- G.SKILL 512MB 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 533 (PC2 4200)
- MASSCOOL FD12025B1L3/4 120mm Case Fan
- Western Digital Caviar Blue WD800JD 80GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s
- Microsoft Windows XP Home With SP2B for System Builders 1 Pack - OEM
- NEC 16X DVD±R DVD Burner Black IDE/ATAPI Model ND-3550A

I can't decide if his system is worth upgrading. Should I aim for a new CPU and throw in a video card, or just a video card? Or go with a new mobo, CPU, and GPU? I don't even know what to do with any parts we replace. They wouldn't be worth the effort trying to Craigslist them. His system could probably fetch $100 or so as an Internet system, and that would go towards a completely new system for him, one that could run 3D games.

I only went with PC Chips because it was cheap with decent onboard video. It apparently has a PCI-E x16 slot, but the CPU is my biggest concern I think.

I don't have a budget because I don't know exactly what I'd like to do for him yet. Any thoughts?
 
I think you'll be doing a more substantial upgrade. 512mb of RAM is pretty low, and the 350W PSU is going to make upgrading difficult. You could probably put together an entire new system for...meh, I'll just go do one and edit this post.

Asus P5Q Pro/Intel e8400 combo - $275 (before $15 MIR)
4gb Corsair RAM - $55 (before $30 MIR)
Antec 650W - $60
Sapphire 4850 - $160 (before $15 MIR)

Total - $550 - $60 MIR = $490

You can reuse the other parts, though I would suggest a newer hard drive.

I'm sure you could go cheaper here, but you'd be saving MAYBE $100 and sacrificing a lot of power to do so. This build seems to be the "sweet spot."
 
First, see whether or not your brother's motherboard could support newer processors (often with a BIOS update). If you can, you could update the processor to one of the cheaper X2 dual-cores (like the X2 5000+). If you can't, you may want to replace the system outright.

For immediate improvement, however, upgrading your RAM to at least 2GB and a stand-alone low-end video card could offer some improvement... or, they could expose your processor as the new system bottleneck.

However, if you have around $200-$300 available for upgrades, you might as well get a new processor, motherboard, and RAM. There are various AMD- and Intel (Core 2)-based setups available for around that price. For example:

$85 - Gigabyte GA-EP43-DS3L
$83 - Intel Pentium Dual Core E5200 (free shipping)
$32 - G.Skill 2x1GB DDR2 800 kit (free shipping)
=====
$200 - Subtotal (not including shipping, taxes, or rebates)

For $12-$13 more, you could double the amount of RAM to 4GB. With the latest holiday sales, there are also a variety of decent video cards available for under/around $100. You could go with the ever-reliable 9600GT, or you could try the newer HD 4670. You can even find the 9800GT or the HD 4830 available for under/around $150.
 
tiraides said:
First, see whether or not your brother's motherboard could support newer processors (often with a BIOS update). If you can, you could update the processor to one of the cheaper X2 dual-cores (like the X2 5000+). If you can't, you may want to replace the system outright.

For immediate improvement, however, upgrading your RAM to at least 2GB and a stand-alone low-end video card could offer some improvement... or, they could expose your processor as the new system bottleneck.

However, if you have around $200-$300 available for upgrades, you might as well get a new processor, motherboard, and RAM. There are various AMD- and Intel (Core 2)-based setups available for around that price. For example:

$85 - Gigabyte GA-EP43-DS3L
$83 - Intel Pentium Dual Core E5200 (free shipping)
$32 - G.Skill 2x1GB DDR2 800 kit (free shipping)
=====
$200 - Subtotal (not including shipping, taxes, or rebates)

For $12-$13 more, you could double the amount of RAM to 4GB. With the latest holiday sales, there are also a variety of decent video cards available for under/around $100. You could go with the ever-reliable 9600GT, or you could try the newer HD 4670. You can even find the 9800GT or the HD 4830 available for under/around $150.
Click to expand...

This is definitely another alternative, but once you add a video card (which I assume you'll want to give the issue is playing games), I'm fairly certain you'll run into issues with the PSU.
 
Whoa, an E8400/P5Q Pro is what I'm using now. That's far too much power for him. He doesn't need a hardcore gaming machine. Something that'll let him play games smoothly at low resolutions. I think he has a 17" CRT, but I'm not sure.

Since he already has DDR2-800, I'd rather just throw in another 512MB module instead of getting a kit.

His board is AM2, and apparently supports X2 CPUs. Whether it would need a BIOS update or not I have no idea. Does PC Chips even bother with updates? :D
 
GJSNeptune said:
Whoa, an E8400/P5Q Pro is what I'm using now. That's far too much power for him. He doesn't need a hardcore gaming machine. Something that'll let him play games smoothly at low resolutions. I think he has a 17" CRT, but I'm not sure.

Since he already has DDR2-800, I'd rather just throw in another 512MB module instead of getting a kit.

His board is AM2, and apparently supports X2 CPUs. Whether it would need a BIOS update or not I have no idea. Does PC Chips even bother with updates? :D
Click to expand...


Ah, my mistake, for some reason I thought the sempron 2800 was a socket A.

If it supports X2 cpus, I'd go for the following:

AMD X2 6000 - $76
512mb G. skill 533 - $9
Antec 650W - $60
MSI 9600 GT - $103 before $30 MIR

Total - $248 - $30 = $218

Reasoning:
  • The 6000 is only $20 more than the one below it, and it's worth the extra $$.
  • I included the matching G. skill, but since it's only 533 ram, I would REALLY recommend moving to this 2gb G. Skill kit for $32.
  • I maintain the need for a new PSU, and this one is a bargain at $60.
  • I also maintain that the 4850 is an incredible bargain at $145.

If you go with the 2gb of RAM, which I strongly suggest, the total is $271 - $30 = $241.
 
Good price for a 650W, but that's too much power, and wouldn't be utilizing enough of it, which I think is bad for it.

What to do with the parts we swap?
 
GJSNeptune said:
Good price for a 650W, but that's too much power, and wouldn't be utilizing enough of it, which I think is bad for it.

What to do with the parts we swap?
Click to expand...

I'd stick with the 650W. A good quality PSU with lower wattage will cost you the same amount of money. I would recommend the Corsair 450W, but that's $80 before a $10 MIR. The antec earthwatts 430W is probably decent as well, but is $70.

You could try to sell some of the parts on the forum here, but I'm not sure how in demand a sempron 2800 is.
 
GJSNeptune, check to see whether the BIOS on your brother's motherboard currently supports X2 processors as it is (and if so, see which models it can support). If what you're telling us is correct, you may not even need a BIOS update.

Do you know the specific model and age of your (brother's) 350W power supply? If it's built within the past year or two, you may not need a new one for a video card that doesn't require a separate PCI-E (PSU) connector. (joeshmo1985, I hear what you're saying... but let's find out first....)

With the price of DDR2 RAM nowadays, I suggest that you get at least 2GB. Though this is supposed to be a budget upgrade, the overall performance of XP improves greatly (in many cases) with 2GB rather than 1GB.
 
I built it in Sept. 2006. It's in the first line of the thread. :D I don't know the model.

The problem with upgrading parts is having crappy parts leftover.
 
tiraides said:
Do you know the specific model and age of your (brother's) 350W power supply? If it's built within the past year or two, you may not need a new one for a video card that doesn't require a separate PCI-E (PSU) connector. (joeshmo1985, I hear what you're saying... but let's find out first....)
Click to expand...

Personally, even without needing the PCI-E connector, I'd be concerned about using a 350W PSU.

Here's the case on newegg with the 350W power supply. A lot of the reviews report failed PSUs.

This should be the PSU.
 
Well his certainly hasn't failed, or he'd have told me. I wouldn't be comfortable using it with a decent graphics card though.
 
GJSNeptune said:
... Since he already has DDR2-800, I'd rather just throw in another 512MB module instead of getting a kit. ...
Click to expand...

GJSNeptune said:
I built my brother a basic computer back in Sept. 2006. It was to be as cheap as possible...
- G.SKILL 512MB 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 533 (PC2 4200)
...
Click to expand...

/me confoozed. :confused:

Smartpowers used capacitors that fail in high heat conditions. They have a 3yr warranty, so you should get it RMA'd for an Earthwatts E380D, which is of much better quality than the Smartpower.

A 9600GT will run fine off of the Earthwatts (27A on the +12V rail(s)), but not so much so with the Smartpower (18A on the +12V rail(s)).
 
Oops about the memory. Had a huge brain fart there. Got my computers mixing me up I guess.
 
Working from joeshmo1985's build, here's what I'd recommend instead:

AMD Athlon64 X2 6000+ CPU - $76
Kingston KVR800D2N6K2/2G 2 x 1GB DDR2 800 RAM - $23
Antec Earthwatts 650W PSU - $60
XFX PVT96OSDFH 9600GSO 768MB PCI-E Video Card - $78
---
Total: $237 plus tax and shipping

The RAM cost twice as much as that DDR2 533 RAM but offers four times the RAM. Hence why I recommended that. The 9600GSO 768MB performs almost the same as the 9600GT and is cheaper as well. But whatever you do, avoid MSI video cards since they only have a 1 year warranty.

Yes the EA650 is overkill in terms of power output, as joeshmo1985 pointed out, other quality PSUs but of lower wattage cost as much and often more than the EA650. So in other words, the EA650 has a way better price to performance ratio.

Enginurd had a point about RMAing' that PSU. So, listen to your bro's current Smartpower PSU and see if there's any sort of squealing or whining sound coming from it, especitally after you just shut-down the system. If there's an odd noise, then you should be able to RMA it back to Antec for a quality replacement.

Oh and here's the CPU support list for that PC Chips mobo:
http://www.pcchips.com.tw/PCCWebSite/Support/CPU_Support_Model.aspx?detailid=380&MenuID=1&LanID=2
 
A good build by Danny also. I probably would go for his video card over the one I suggested. I'm personally not a fan of Kingston RAM though.

Why did I think the 9600 GT was better than the 9600 GSO?:confused:
 
joeshmo1985 said:
Why did I think the 9600 GT was better than the 9600 GSO?:confused:
Click to expand...

Because it technically is. The 9600GT is faster, no doubt about that, but GSO's price and the fact that it's not that much slower than the 9600GT makes it a good choice.
 
Just tell them about the high pitched whine and they'll give you an RMA #. ;)
 
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