Need some advice on 939 MB selection

[Jabberdau]

Right. So I have been searching articles mostly at tomshardware and a few other sites about the 939 MBs that are availible. However I can´t really se too much of a difference in performance according to my needs. Thats where I need your help because I do not know too much about which features that makes one board more suitable than the other.
I am building a new rig a and it is purely for gaming. No need to perform well in other areas. The planned specs are as follows:

Athlon 64 3000+(or 3500+)
2x512MB Dual RAM (or 4x512MB or 2x1 GB, budget depending)
Geforce 6600GT GFXcard (PCIe)
Audigy card of some sort.

Onboard devices such as sound and LAN are not needed since I am going to re-use some old parts. I´m also re-using my 2 old harddrives, DVD and burner none of which are faster than ATA-100/IDE-100 devices so the board must be backwardscompatible. Raid is not needed. Overclocking is nice, but not a requirement although a bit of clocking dosnt hurt. Nothing hardcore here .
I am not going for SLI since I remember the Voodoo days and the performance gains with SLI versus cost is not very impressive according to tomshardware as seen here In gaming that is, if you like I, run your games in 1024 resulotion without AA and AF turned on. I didnt check for applications. Anyway I´m not so serious that I´m going for two cards. HOWEVER I dont know if a SLI board will perform better than a non-sli even if you only used one GFX card so I´d like some advice on that too.
Now here are a few candidates I have been looking at:

1. Abit AN8 Fatal1ty
2. MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum/SLI
3. Gigabyte K8NXP-SLI
4. Epox EP-9NPA+ Ultra
5. DFI nF4 Ultra-D

There are more, but these are what I have looked at. SO which one too choose? Overclocking is nice, but dosnt need to be much. I will be running ONE gfx card so will a SLI board perform worse? I do not need onboard sound, LAN and raid. 2 PCI slots is all I need. Should be backwardscompatible with ATA100 units(and slower). Its for gaming. The choice should reflect technology & performance availible now so no need for it to be compatible with future products like dual core CPUs. I would be thankfull for any advice. It truly is a jungle these days .

A side note: If you use the 1x and 4x PCIe slots for normal PCI expansions, do they really perform so much better that the cost of an upgrade is justifyable? Like a soundcard fx.

 

[knothead34]

i have the asus a8n sli and i love it. the abit board would be my second choice. im partial to asus and abit. if your thinking of dfi sli dr then wait for revision b that should be alot more stable then the one out now.

 

[theseeker]

SLI will allow you to upgrade in the future. I have owned ASUS SLI and currently use the DFI SLI DR. I like the DFI over the two because it allows you to OC and tweek moch moreso than the ASUS. However, you cant go wrong with ASUS.

 

[Banko]

I would recommend the DFI.

 

[HighTest]

. HOWEVER I dont know if a SLI board will perform better than a non-sli even if you only used one GFX card so I´d like some advice on that too.
Now here are a few candidates I have been looking at:

1. Abit AN8 Fatal1ty
2. MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum/SLI
3. Gigabyte K8NXP-SLI
4. Epox EP-9NPA+ Ultra
5. DFI nF4 Ultra-D

In answer, an SLI card won't perform any worse than a non-SLI board. Where the SLI board is superior even for single card owners, is the following:

1. Ability to add SLI or CrossFire (unless ATI's drivers prevent competing chipsets, the rest is all in the cards).

2. SLI boards, being the flag board usually have extra features on board that are not on the non-SLI editions.

That said, I like the MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum/SLI edition. Why? Because all of its extras are PCI-E (with the exception of the PCI Creative Labs Live! 24bit HD soundchipset). So it uses a PCI-E Marvell Gigabit LAN for the extra LAN connection and it uses a PCI-E SiI3132 SATA II (or SATA+IO 3Gb/s controller if you want to be accurate) rather than the PCI Marvel and PCI SiI3114R SATA (1.5Gb/s controller) that the ASUS and DFI use. The extra quality of the soundchipset is only approached by the Karanjan module used by the DFI.

So in ranking for features:

1. MSI
2. DFI
3. ASUS
4. Gigabyte

DFI does overclock the best, but the MSI is a close second in OC.

I'd also like to mention the SLI statement, for the current cost, some may consider SLI too expensive at this time. What's important is that with the release of the 7800GT and the 7800GTX, nVIDIA is going to be dropping the price on the 6800 series by $100.00. This will allow one to pickup a 6800 much cheaper than before, and add a second at an even lower cost latter. While you mention that you'll be running at a lower resolution and not using AA or AF, it's important to note that several games are about to be released that use HDR. This new lighting technique will dramatically improve the realism and currently won't work with AA at the same time anyways (if I understand it correctly), but are serious GPU hogs at this time. SLI will allow one to enjoy HDR without having to purchase a 7800GTX.

If you are looking at just the lower resolutions, you could pick up a 6800NU or 6600GT card for pretty cheap in comparison and still be able to add another latter. Also it has been rumoured for the intention for the 8x.xx series of drivers to allow one to match a Geforce 6 series with a Geforce 7 series card in SLI. Unprecedented, as you'll then be able to add a different card than what you would start with, very similar to what ATI is trying to do with CrossFire.

The point is that SLI is continuing to evolve, it's capabilities are not static (as shown by the resent addition of SLI AA, not released when SLI first came out), so it's quite possible that you may want this eventually, and having an SLI motherboard will prepare you for that eventuality without having to replace your motherboard again.

 

[gigaxtreme1]

Asrock 939 Dual SATAII. If you can wait a week or so. This is a board that uses the Uli 1695 chip and a Jmicro sata2 chip as well as a southbridge. You can use AGP or PCIEx16. Check out OCworkbench

 

[Jabberdau]

I'd also like to mention the SLI statement, for the current cost, some may consider SLI too expensive at this time. What's important is that with the release of the 7800GT and the 7800GTX, nVIDIA is going to be dropping the price on the 6800 series by $100.00. This will allow one to pickup a 6800 much cheaper than before, and add a second at an even lower cost latter.

Even though SLI might seem like a great technology, what I remember from the Voodoo days was that, when the next generation of GFX cards comes out even the basic model will nearly outperform what you can archeive by using 2 older cards. That said, maybe the times have changed. Features such as HDR is just another selling point. Its an old PR trick which have been used time and time again. Sure its impressive, but its not a nessesity (is that spelled correctly?). Some games will use it, but it will be able to be turned off, and will most likely not be that revolutionary. Gamemakers will support a wide range of GFX cards even in the future .
The MSI really looks like a winner, but I think, at least for the soundcard, I will use a PCI card. Can the quality of the onboard sound really match an Audigy 2? Then there is the question of onboard soundcards picking up unwanted noise, because of it beeing onboard.

PCI express performs better than their AGP counterparts and GFX cards are certainly one thing that are changed more often than other parts so from my point of view an AGP slot are not really an advantage.

Right now the DFI apeals most to me because of it beeing very OC friendly , but I am open for MORE suggestions . If I choose a DFI board should I go for the SLI version? Here I am more concerned about the performance of the chipset since that seems to be the only difference when using only one GFX card. Its upgradeable but thats not why I am looking at it.
Ofcourse if the price of the MSI card is nearly the same as the DFI ones here where I can get them a few extra features wouldnt hurt. Again that depends on if I am actually going to use them. I will take a closer look at these two then.

 

[gigaxtreme1]

My suggestion was for an upgrade path friendly motherboard. The board i suggested even supports M2 processors through an upgrade daughterboard. I was going to get one so that I could use my AIW 9600 until something better came around in the PCIE flavor at a decent price. This one seemed relatively future-proof. then again I use my machine as a HTPC and basic workstation primariily.

 

[JSF35rhino]

yea i know i talk about the dfi-ultra d and the a8n-sli deluxe alot . ther good MB's and they overclock well--

but i bought a little a754 ecs the other day for $47 expexting it to be a POS. well i was in for a suprise. it's a 754 nf4 mb--anyway it is stable, overclocks to 250fsb is well made, not near as cheap built as it's price would suggest. the best ECS mb i've ever had.


if you have to have a 939nf4 and need pci express--you can pick one of the ecs's up for like $60 shipped.has v-core and v-dimm adjustemnts if it runs as well as my a754--you'll like it even if it ain't the baddest oc'er out there.

i figure in a year or two you'll pe tossing the MB in the dumpster for the new socket so why spen more that is absoluty needed if you can get what is needed for less ? no the ecs isn't as good as my asus --or my dfi--but $47 is a hell of a long way form $187 --and it can run as stable as the expensive mb overclocked to 250fsb ? makes ya wonder if were not getting gouged $$$

a few years back MB's started getting fancy--and the more fancy they were the more they cost--i'll bet in a year or so well see $500mb's !--LOL sure it will have two of everything--but is there a reason besides to run up the price?

 

[turbominnow]

. Features such as HDR is just another selling point. Its an old PR trick which have been used time and time again. Sure its impressive, but its not a nessesity (is that spelled correctly?). Some games will use it, but it will be able to be turned off,

Keep in mind that laptops have now exceeded desktop sales. From what I have heard and seen the 7X cards are pretty large and I know that two of those are not going to fit into a laptop anytime soon. I get the feeling that developers are going to either support SLI or force gpu manufactures to support thier games with SLI. Game developers are going to have to modify thier buisness model to reflect the buying habits of thier consumer. This will probally force them to make the next gen games run on last years high end laptops.

 

[Jabberdau]

I get the feeling that developers are going to either support SLI or force gpu manufactures to support their games with SLI. Game developers are going to have to modify thier business model to reflect the buying habits of thier consumer. This will probally force them to make the next gen games run on last years high end laptops.

Or the technology might be abandoned just like with the Voodoo SLI although it wasnt the same it works in similar ways.
Anyway after reading some more tests about the DFI cards and the Neo4 I have settled down on the MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum/SLI. In stock trim it bests and is a little faster than the rest when it comes to gaming, even with a single card. There is also no doubt that the DFI is the absolute best overclocking board availible. However it is also diffecult to get running. BIOS upgrades are nessesary and there are memory and PSU compability issues. Also the layout of the board can cause problems if you want to use a rather large cooling system for the CPU which I am planning to do. I don´t feel I´m experienced enough to mess around with this board and I´m not planning to do serious overclocking so the MSI will be fine while beeing a bit more newbie friendly . If I had the skills though I would definately choose the DFI. I thank you for your guidance .

 

[[F8]]

I vote for epox 9npa+ultra, or the bfg board did very well in reviews. Apparently Chaintech makes almost the same board as bfg though, minus the warranty. But my vote goes to epox, it's a very solid board with all that you need without all the hype and price of dfi and abit fatility.

 

[magoo]

Hey....dont pull the trigger just yet......give the eVGA site a look see. Since your going to be building a new set-up anyway.....I dont know anything about the board they are GIVING AWAY....it might be worth a look. eVGA is giving away an NF4-SLI board fro FREE with the purchase of the 7800 GT or GTX. I know you are not interested in SLI but you cant go wrong with the eVGA card, it will give you much more horsepower than the 6600GT and you get a FREE MoBo to try out......wadda ya gotta lose??? Info is on their web page.
I do not work for eVGA or any other computer company.* I also feel that SLI or Crossfire technology is here to stay. There's a bunch of bucks being invested in this from MB to PSU to chipset to GPU.....given the splendid graphics in SLI I cant see going back, but who am I anyway??? give the free mobo deal a looksee anyway. Regards.
BTW I have the ASUS A8N-SLI and I dont OC at all....its ROCK solid.

 

[kirbyrj]

I had the Chaintech board and it did 300x9 with a 3000+ Venice for some 2.7Ghz action . My Neo4 Plat/SLI did jack squat with OCing. Barely got a 3200+ Winchester to 2.4Ghz (and that was from within Windows).

 

[[F8]]

Hey....dont pull the trigger just yet......give the eVGA site a look see. Since your going to be building a new set-up anyway.....I dont know anything about the board they are GIVING AWAY....it might be worth a look. eVGA is giving away an NF4-SLI board fro FREE with the purchase of the 7800 GT or GTX. I know you are not interested in SLI but you cant go wrong with the eVGA card, it will give you much more horsepower than the 6600GT and you get a FREE MoBo to try out......wadda ya gotta lose??? Info is on their web page.
I do not work for eVGA or any other computer company.* I also feel that SLI or Crossfire technology is here to stay. There's a bunch of bucks being invested in this from MB to PSU to chipset to GPU.....given the splendid graphics in SLI I cant see going back, but who am I anyway??? give the free mobo deal a looksee anyway. Regards.
BTW I have the ASUS A8N-SLI and I dont OC at all....its ROCK solid.

http://www.evga.com/articles/public.asp?AID=258

 

[kirbyrj]

I saw that also, but if you can get a deal like the $347 BFG 7800GT OC from Dell, you can just buy the mobo you want anyway for the same price.

I did almost bite on that deal when I first saw it though...until I found out the board was made by Jetway .

 

[JSF35rhino]

cheap , quality and stability --and did i say cheap ?--LOL

i would look for a nf4 under $100 that has good quality and stability overclocking would be a secondary item--but any nf4 should have some oc ability --if not limited by the bios to 250 or so .my picks would be --referbed ultr a d # 1 for $86 , # 2 new chaintec vnf4 ultra $80- to $90

and the dark horse -ESC nf4 for $60 and they all got pros and cons

pros DFI referb , good overclocker , cheap super stable if set up proper .

cons you just joined DFI street ! welcome to the !!!!!!Club ! everybody is a expert --never say anything negative about DFI ! you'll be sent home without desert ! LOL and being a referb expect it to come with nothing as most referbs are OEM-bare-bone.

pros chaintec--decent overclocker --nice price (the rest i don't know cause i haven't built one) cons--don't know--but there has got to be a few.

ECS-- inexpensive quality better than expected , overclocking options v-dimm and v-core and the usual divisors and locks stable like a nf4 should be..oh and did i say inexpensive !?!!

cons-- very bare stuff- for retail--just a box a mb one driver disk a small number of cables just barely above the referbes in bundled stuff.

and people laugh when you tell um you've got a ECS --but they don't know how much ECS has improved . running the same cpu and ram with the cpu and videocard from the DFI-ultra d playing the same games--seems about the same as the DFI ? maybe you don't need the gold-plated stuff afterall?

i can remember a time when DFI produced very bland and some what lacking quality wise OEM type MB- now their cult bait ??--LOL

i'm waiting for ECS streeters to start bashing me for saying the retail package is a bit bare !!--LOL

and one last con--i don't know if the ECS bios supports the DC cpu's -- i'm thinking it will however ECS as well as about any oem mb maker are dreadfully slow about writing new bioses. so if it don't support the DC's--it could be a long wait untill it supports the DC's

you should feel better with that extra $100 still in your pocket though--LOL

 

[Jabberdau]

Well I don´t know about that eVGA motherboard he he, never heard of it! I think I will choose one which I have at least read some tests of . The price however is not too much of a concern since I value this component to be of great importance. The MSI is actually in the cheap end here while Abit, Asus, Gigabyte and DFI boards cost about 50% more (those that also have the SLI chip). The SLI chip seems to yield a bit better in the reviews over the nF4 Ultra based boards.
I did get the impression though, that the MSI board was very stable and failure free. Is there something I have missed? While I am at it, how much can the bus speed be pushed too ? I looked into the RAM forum for a while and noticed some nice gains with certain ram so it would be good to know what the board can handle before spending a lot on memory.
Havn´t checked up on the Epox, BFG and Chaintechs OCing capabilities though. Maybe there is an alternative solution to be discovered there? The optimal offcause would be stabilty at an lightly OCed board without problems.