NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

I probably don't speak for everyone, but even if the serial number plate adds $5-10 I know I'm already cognitively invested in this case and that is a neat feature.
 
I don't like to pay 5-10$ just for a number, it holds no real value to me as I'm more proud of what Necere and Wahaha360 have accomplished than the number of the case in the production line.
 
Serial numbers? How, exactly, do you plan to number them? Does it add to the cost of production by any noticeable amount to engrave/etch each individually?
 
Can the 3.5 inch hard drive mount be mounted on the bottom of the case in place of a 120mm fan? I am trying to determine if a thin single-slot card is installed, such as an Intel 4-port NIC, if two drives will exceed the available height.
 
So, is it completely out of the picture to increase the height of the case to accomodate a modular ATX psu?

The Silverstone 450W SFX psu appears to be extremely noisy on high loads (judging from customer reviews from all over the web; the general consensus is to steer clear of that psu if possible), and there is no other SFX psu that can power enthusiast hardware, as far as I know? To be honest, I don't consider 450W to be enough either. For medium grade hardware, sure, but not enthusiast.

Personally, I'd happily sacrifice the third graphics card expansion slot to avoid increasing the height of the case, in order to fit a modular ATX psu. Owners of oversized graphics card coolers will of course disagree. :)

I think the possibility to fit full size hardware (except the motherboard of course) in such a small case is the most interesting aspect of this project, but with an SFX psu, it's crippled.
 
backfeed said:
So, is it completely out of the picture to increase the height of the case to accomodate a modular ATX psu?

The Silverstone 450W SFX psu appears to be extremely noisy on high loads (judging from customer reviews from all over the web; the general consensus is to steer clear of that psu if possible), and there is no other SFX psu that can power enthusiast hardware, as far as I know? To be honest, I don't consider 450W to be enough either. For medium grade hardware, sure, but not enthusiast.

I think the possibility to fit full size hardware (except the motherboard of course) in such a small case is the most interesting aspect of this project, but with an SFX psu, it's crippled.
Click to expand...

I think "crippled" is a bit hyperbolic... that 450W SFX psu will run an i7 and a Titan at full bore; it might not give you absurd over-voltage headroom to get to 5Ghz, but getting all that additional heat out of the tiny case would probably be more problematic in that situation ;)

As for the noise, there is a very easy way to fix that -- the Noiseblocker swap how-to is linked in numerous threads in this sub-forum.
 
That's what I thought, really 450w should be enough if using a newer gen video card and CPU.
 
backfeed said:
So, is it completely out of the picture to increase the height of the case to accomodate a modular ATX psu?

The Silverstone 450W SFX psu appears to be extremely noisy on high loads (judging from customer reviews from all over the web; the general consensus is to steer clear of that psu if possible), and there is no other SFX psu that can power enthusiast hardware, as far as I know? To be honest, I don't consider 450W to be enough either. For medium grade hardware, sure, but not enthusiast.

Personally, I'd happily sacrifice the third graphics card expansion slot to avoid increasing the height of the case, in order to fit a modular ATX psu. Owners of oversized graphics card coolers will of course disagree. :)

I think the possibility to fit full size hardware (except the motherboard of course) in such a small case is the most interesting aspect of this project, but with an SFX psu, it's crippled.
Click to expand...
i second that.
actually, there's no powerfull & silent psu available.
need more room.
 
backfeed said:
The Silverstone 450W SFX psu appears to be extremely noisy on high loads (judging from customer reviews from all over the web; the general consensus is to steer clear of that psu if possible)
Click to expand...
I don't know where you are getting those bad vibes from, because I've seen the Silverstone 450W SFX PSU recommended by most. If you can't stand some more noise (you use the word "extremely"), just go with the non-modular version, which is quieter overall.

and there is no other SFX psu that can power enthusiast hardware, as far as I know? To be honest, I don't consider 450W to be enough either. For medium grade hardware, sure, but not enthusiast.
Click to expand...
What do you call medium grade hardware and what is enthusiast according to you ? If the 450W SFX PSU can power a Core i7-4770K and a GTX Titan without problems, what are you considering "enthusiast" that will fit in this case and is actually not a stupid idea ? Because you are worried about power, while your main concern should be cooling.

Personally, I'd happily sacrifice the third graphics card expansion slot to avoid increasing the height of the case, in order to fit a modular ATX psu. Owners of oversized graphics card coolers will of course disagree. :)
Click to expand...
The only need for an ATX PSU is if you don't want to buy a new one and have one that's very short or that you think the 450W SFX PSU won't be enough. In that last case, you are trying to do stuff this case isn't meant to do. You are also forgetting that that space below the motherboard is also meant to place fans or atleast cool your GPU well enough. Trimming that spot down a slot means the difference between being able to place fans, 2,5" storage, larger cooling GPU's and general flexibility towards cabling and tubing.

I think the possibility to fit full size hardware (except the motherboard of course) in such a small case is the most interesting aspect of this project, but with an SFX psu, it's crippled.
Click to expand...
You are making the wrong conclusions here: this case doesn't fit all full-size hardware, as Nevere already said a dual-GPU card like the GTX 690 or Radeon 7990 is a bad idea in this case.

For the 104th time:

53407.png


53406.png


TOTAL SYSTEM POWER CONSUMPTION
(from the wall, meaning 10-20% less required for hardware)

Tested system:
CPU: Intel Core i7-3960X @ 4.3GHz
Motherboard: EVGA X79 SLI
Power Supply: Antec True Power Quattro 1200
Hard Disk: Samsung 470 (256GB)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3-1867 4 x 4GB (8-10-9-26)

So yes, a larger than 450W PSU is not needed in this case. If an overclocked 6-core i7-3960X on a X79 motherboard with a titan isn't enough to hit the 450W limit, no efficient hardware setup that this case can house is going to. And the Silverstone 450W SFX 85-Gold can supply 500+W for longer periods of time if needed.
 
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Machupo said:
As for the noise, there is a very easy way to fix that -- the Noiseblocker swap how-to is linked in numerous threads in this sub-forum.
Click to expand...

I recently discovered that ModDiy sells an adapter 3-pin fan to 2-pin MicroBlade.

http://www.moddiy.com/products/3%2d...-Mini-2%2dPin-GPU-Fan-Connector-(Female).html

You can use it to replace the stock fan in the ST45SF-G with the following fan (which many of us have tested under load). Easier than soldering :)

http://www.amazon.com/Noiseblocker-...=1370763983&sr=8-1&keywords=noiseblocker+pc-p
 
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Necere: since it looks like we're all going to have M1's sitting on our desks soon, what are your plans for the future? Back to the way things were before this started, or maybe continuing this further?
 
@Necere: mmmmmmmm. It seems some people would love to have additional space to put a short modular ATX psu but... you would have to make the case taller, and that is clearly a huge NO-NO.

UNLESS

You can make more space inside AND not make the case bigger at all.

HOW?

Right now the case has 3 slots for expansion cards. What if you created an extra set of stand-off holes in order to be able to put the motherboard one slot below its original position?

This way you are actually making more space by giving the psu a much needed extra few centimeters you would require, but because you are playing with the interior of the case, you don't have to make any big modification.

At the same time, making such thing possible wouldn't create a big trouble: just a few extra holes and not much more.

PS: sure, no HDD compatibility, but you can't have your cake and eat it too.
 
prava said:
......What if you created an extra set of stand-off holes in order to be able to put the motherboard one slot below its original position?
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We were exploring that option, but structural integrity is a big concern.

The extra reinforcements needed for structural integrity would push production costs much higher.

Necere decided against it in the end.
 
prava said:
Right now the case has 3 slots for expansion cards. What if you created an extra set of stand-off holes in order to be able to put the motherboard one slot below its original position?
Click to expand...

I have an even easier solution for you. Get a flexible pci-e riser and just mount the graphics card 1 slot lower.

Or get a short PCB video card like that Asus GTX670 that is only 6.7 inches long.
 
PolarBear said:
That'd also result in the need for some sort of adjustable/changable I/O sheild panel.
Click to expand...

Exactly what I was thinking, How would you make the IO shield opening adjustable? Also I think the design of this case is perfect and pretty much complete, It wasn't intended to be some insane overclocking case and it seems some people are trying to push it that way?
 
I'm very interested in this case, especially as it looks like I'll be putting my future SFF build on hold for some time. Hopefully this case will be on the market by the time I build my next computer.

In regards to the logo: I would prefer a moderately-sized charcoal-grey "NCASE" logo (without the "M1" part), centered at the bottom of the front panel, right above the power button.
 
Logo design is done they said, leave it alone. They say it's done and then there's like 3-4 pages after that of people talking about what they'd prefer.
 
hdale85 said:
Logo design is done they said, leave it alone. They say it's done and then there's like 3-4 pages after that of people talking about what they'd prefer.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I didn't see the logo mentioned in the last couple of pages. The finished design is brilliant, it even has the NCASE logo right above the power button like I wanted. I think the M1 on the sides is unnecessary but entirely acceptable.
 
Yeah no worries, just get emails about new posts and it's always about the logo or changing the design completely! I want the case already no more changes! lol.
 
Only change I'd like to see is - start selling it!

Have been following this thread for a short while now. That case looks fantastic. Add a little PSU from Silverstone, mini-ITX ROG, H220 cooler, GTX780, SSD - perfect little gamer if you ask me.

A big thanks to all those who helped make this happen.
 
Machupo said:
I think "crippled" is a bit hyperbolic... that 450W SFX psu will run an i7 and a Titan at full bore; it might not give you absurd over-voltage headroom to get to 5Ghz, but getting all that additional heat out of the tiny case would probably be more problematic in that situation ;)

As for the noise, there is a very easy way to fix that -- the Noiseblocker swap how-to is linked in numerous threads in this sub-forum.
Click to expand...

The NoiseBlocker swap is interesting, thanks.

Phuncz said:
I don't know where you are getting those bad vibes from, because I've seen the Silverstone 450W SFX PSU recommended by most. If you can't stand some more noise (you use the word "extremely"), just go with the non-modular version, which is quieter overall.

What do you call medium grade hardware and what is enthusiast according to you ? If the 450W SFX PSU can power a Core i7-4770K and a GTX Titan without problems, what are you considering "enthusiast" that will fit in this case and is actually not a stupid idea ? Because you are worried about power, while your main concern should be cooling.
...
You are making the wrong conclusions here: this case doesn't fit all full-size hardware, as Nevere already said a dual-GPU card like the GTX 690 or Radeon 7990 is a bad idea in this case.
...
So yes, a larger than 450W PSU is not needed in this case. If an overclocked 6-core i7-3960X on a X79 motherboard with a titan isn't enough to hit the 450W limit, no efficient hardware setup that this case can house is going to. And the Silverstone 450W SFX 85-Gold can supply 500+W for longer periods of time if needed.
Click to expand...

If a fan swap reduces the noise to an acceptable level, which it apparently seems to do, then that part is of course easily taken care of.

Yes, I'm thinking about a Radeon 7990 or a GTX 690, and potentially even more power hungry graphics cards emerging in the near future. The 7990 is out of the question with a 450W psu, but then again, all 7990 coolers I've seen dump the heat inside the case, which would of course be less than ideal in the M1. The GTX 690 will at least dump some of the heat outside, but the 450W limit is a bit too close for comfort, I think. Which is a pity.

I personally don't like being close to the max psu power output, but I guess I'll have to manage.

But, what's to stop psu manufacturers to offer sfx psus with higher power output in the future? Hopefully Silverstone's 450W sfx is just the beginning of a new era. As long as they manage to keep the noise down. :)

Screes said:
I thought it would fit a standard depth (140mm) non modular ATX PSU?
700 watts should be enough for you: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817256072

So what's the problem?

Personally I plan to mod an AP-14 to the side of the Silverstone SFX PSU and duct it to the side vent. Low noise and plenty of power.
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The problem is that most (all?) non-modular ATX psus are less efficient and of lower quality. For me, that matters. :)

True, using a larger fan with a duct is also something to consider. Thanks.

WiSK said:
I recently discovered that ModDiy sells an adapter 3-pin fan to 2-pin MicroBlade.

http://www.moddiy.com/products/3%2d...-Mini-2%2dPin-GPU-Fan-Connector-(Female).html

You can use it to replace the stock fan in the ST45SF-G with the following fan (which many of us have tested under load). Easier than soldering :)

http://www.amazon.com/Noiseblocker-...=1370763983&sr=8-1&keywords=noiseblocker+pc-p
Click to expand...

Thanks for the adapter tip. I'd solder, but good to know anyway!

Screes said:
I have an even easier solution for you. Get a flexible pci-e riser and just mount the graphics card 1 slot lower.

Or get a short PCB video card like that Asus GTX670 that is only 6.7 inches long.
Click to expand...

That is a very interesting idea! Too bad that flexible pci-e cables seem to be highly susceptible to interference from what I've heard, but it's still something to consider!

Yeah, it would be great if all graphics card manufacturers would concentrate on keeping the pcb as short as possible, without having to resort to extremely noisy coolers of course. I hope the Asus GTX 670 mini is just the beginning!
 
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by the time this case is bought/manufactured/shipped there might be a new sfx out, or an announced product out in the near future.
 
hey guys im working on building a small pc to take with me to college and this case looks very enticing..when is the projected date for release? I need to build my computer at the latest in august :) thanks!
 
backfeed said:
Don't know about the graphics card, but the Seasonic X-650 will not fit, since it's 16 cm long. Though it would work fine if you replaced your GTX 670 with Asus' mini version.
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:/ I cant afford that, do you know when this case is being released? what size does the psu have to be?
 
PolarBear said:
That'd also result in the need for some sort of adjustable/changable I/O sheild panel.
Click to expand...
This was the problem I ran into with the idea. It would've added a lot of complexity and resulted in some less than ideal solutions.

Fa11acy said:
hey guys im working on building a small pc to take with me to college and this case looks very enticing..when is the projected date for release? I need to build my computer at the latest in august :) thanks!
Click to expand...
At this point, an August ship date is unlikely.

Fa11acy said:
also, will my asus gtx 670 TOP fit in this case?
Click to expand...
Going by the specs it shouldn't have a problem fitting.

SithSolo1 said:
140mm or shorter non-modular for ATX with a long video card or SFX(~$100 for a 450w modular).
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This, although using an ATX PSU can't be recommended. The amount and length of cables that ATX PSUs typically have just make it too much of a headache trying to stuff it all into the case. If you're going to shorten the cables, fine. Just know what you're getting into.
 
Screes said:
You don't think these will be shipping in the next 2 months? What's the hold up? I thought everything was basically done.
Click to expand...
Seriously dude? You are borderline trolling all over the place. Take easy it noobie. It's a high risk, time consuming and complicated process bringing a product from the drawing table to reality. Especially when working with international manufacturers and trying your best to take in and consider all the community feedback. Be thankful anybody has the talent and dedication to see this through. And I'll say what I said to you in another thread, dial it down a bit.
 
CMadki4 said:
Seriously dude? You are borderline trolling all over the place. Take easy it noobie. It's a high risk, time consuming and complicated process bringing a product from the drawing table to reality. Especially when working with international manufacturers and trying your best to take in and consider all the community feedback. Be thankful anybody has the talent and dedication to see this through. And I'll say what I said to you in another thread, dial it down a bit.
Click to expand...

It's just a question, I'd like to know why the delay. What's wrong with that?
 
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