NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

dPunish3r said:
Hi all!

Here it is number 40. ;)

I love M1, check my NCASE build here:
Mini-ITX PC Gamer Maxed

My old and new rig were faced, at aesthetics and performance.
Minimax+vs+Blackow.jpg



P.S. prava, you're not alone, you're not the only one spanish NCASE man. :) I'll fill sheet you share in Drive. (In spanish: me sonaba tu nick de N3D. Saludos!)

Cheers!
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Did you have any hose kinking? Another user had some serious looking kink in one of his H100i rad hose. Curious if you avoided that somehow.
 
okwchin said:
What you can safely power from it, totally relies on keeping within the power handling capacity of the GPU fan controller. Safest thing to do is to stay within the power limit of the stock fan, as you can be sure they provisioned for that fan only. Read the rated power draw of the stock fan, and compare it to your fan.
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Seems that the fan of my 7870 Ghz is rated at 12V 2A. 24W power draw at 100% wtf, is that possible?
Something like the Noctua NF-F12 PWM is rated at 12V 0.05A. So I assume there's a lot of leeway.
 
THATS A 2A FAN!! wow. Yes, I would say its safe to have practically any conventional fan powered safely. Unless you go for a High output Delta fan.. thats another story ;)

Thats 24 watts!, no wonder its a jet engine.
 
Necere said:
Update on the Demciflex filters: it won't likely be until after the new year until they'll have them available on their site. I trust your guys' rigs won't get too dusty in the next few weeks :p
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Thanks for the update, I am still taking my time on this build and picking parts.
 
Skott said:
Did you have any hose kinking? Another user had some serious looking kink in one of his H100i rad hose. Curious if you avoided that somehow.
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You can get away with no kinks but the hoses have to be twisted around so they fit in.

cowsgomoo said:
$T2eC16FHJGkE9no8fyJzBQl7zVPPUg~~60_3.JPG


Does any one have experience with this? I'm wondering if I can power two PWM 120mm fans at the bottom with the GPU.

Well I ordered them already so I'll be the guinea pig.
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I've used the single version of that i'm thinking if your running two off the one connector on the PCB you mite not get full speed out of both fans.
 
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OverRated said:
I've used the single version of that i'm thinking if your running two off the one connector on the PCB you mite not get full speed out of both fans.
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I don't see why you can't get full speed on two fans. The original fan is PWM controlled. The 12v supply line will always provide 12v and up to 2A as a known. The fans you install will a also need to be PWM controlled to make use of the speed control of the graphics card. A PWM fan will set its speed according to the PWM output and draw the required power to do so. The only way for a PWM fan to not reach top speed is if you don't supply it 12v. Given that the gpu power suppy is known to be able to deliver 2A, there is a significant headroom and therefore not likely to cause the voltage to sag.

Using 3 pin fans will only give you 100% rpm so it defeats the purpose of using the gpu socket.
 
okwchin said:
I don't see why you can't get full speed on two fans. The original fan is PWM controlled. The 12v supply line will always provide 12v and up to 2A as a known. The fans you install will a also need to be PWM controlled to make use of the speed control of the graphics card. A PWM fan will set its speed according to the PWM output and draw the required power to do so. The only way for a PWM fan to not reach top speed is if you don't supply it 12v. Given that the gpu power suppy is known to be able to deliver 2A, there is a significant headroom and therefore not likely to cause the voltage to sag.

Using 3 pin fans will only give you 100% rpm so it defeats the purpose of using the gpu socket.
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Yer your right i was think about a molex spilter that did 2x 12v and 2x 7v, As long as you use the same fans it should be fine its not good to run two with different fans with different amps.
 
OverRated said:
Yer your right i was think about a molex spilter that did 2x 12v and 2x 7v, As long as you use the same fans it should be fine its not good to run two with different fans with different amps.
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Different amperage loads should not be detrimental to fan speed either, as the fans are all connected in parallel to the same voltage supply. They will draw the power each fan needs irrespective of the other fans. (as long as the total is within the rated current capacity of the source)

Remember that the whole computer is powered by the single 12V rail. All your HDDs, fans, motherboard, CD drive, these are all powered upstream by the same 12V rail. All the other voltages are actually powered by the same 12V rail, but go through additional DC-DC conversion to bring it to the lower voltages.

All items are connected in parallel. So as long as the power supply is not current limited, each will happily operate independently of each other.



You are right about the 12v and 7v splitter though, the different voltages will give a different fan speed for a given fan :)
 
okwchin said:
Different amperage loads should not be detrimental to fan speed either, as the fans are all connected in parallel to the same voltage supply. They will draw the power each fan needs irrespective of the other fans. (as long as the total is within the rated current capacity of the source)

Remember that the whole computer is powered by the single 12V rail. All your HDDs, fans, motherboard, CD drive, these are all powered upstream by the same 12V rail. All the other voltages are actually powered by the same 12V rail, but go through additional DC-DC conversion to bring it to the lower voltages.

All items are connected in parallel. So as long as the power supply is not current limited, each will happily operate independently of each other.


You are right about the 12v and 7v splitter though, the different voltages will give a different fan speed for a given fan :)
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Yer but it can create problems running it off a fan headers on your motherboard or graphics card, You get a splitter with some noctua fans but they only say to use it if your using the same fans, Running two fans of a PSU splitter will be fine.
 
A PSU fan splitter is fine because the fans all connect to the same voltage, A voltage that is NOT varied. Fans run full bore all the time, and all fans run at their own speed and power consumption.

Connecting different fan types to a Voltage controlled header will "work", except that the control of fan RPMs is not reliable (one might be happily running, while the other hasn't and cant start. In a case of a voltage controlled header with a high internal resistance (i.e. output voltage drops in response to current draw) could also result in unreliable starting of the fans due to start up currents interfering with each other. This is a disclaimer Noctua puts in because they are trying to discourage the use of any other fans, and as a disclaimer to protect them from any possible combination that may result in degradation of performance of their product, and thus a warranty claim.

An example could be, installing two fans. You have Fan A on the case front, and Fan B on the heatsink. Fan A starts at 40% power, and fan B starts reliably at 70% power.

The user wants a silent system, so you set the fan speed down to 50%. At this level, fan A is just ticking over nicely. You can see fan A, but cant see Fan B, because its inside the case. Fan B needed a voltage at 70% to start. Because the user did not notice that Fan B hasnt started yet, they happily use their computer for gaming. Within 20 minutes the CPU fries itself and the user then complains noisily to the retailer, saying that the heatsink was a dud, wants an RMA.

Connecting multiple fans to a single voltage controlled header must always be done with care, such as for the reason above, and from a liability point of view, Noctua has taken the safe approach. The physics behind their operation is such that problems are possibly, but highly unlikely if you are aware of how they work and what happens. I run multiple fans off a single voltage controlled header happily, but you must pick compatible fans, or a high enough minimum fan speed.


On the other hand... Back to the GPU scenario.
Connecting multiple Various PWM fans (that will be PWM controlled) on the same GPU is perfectly fine if within amperage limits, because a PWM fan only ever uses 12V. The PWM control wire is at signal level currents and connecting multiple fans of different brands/types/speeds is of absolutely no concern. Its like connecting multiple monitors to a video splitter. Each and every monitor connects to the same power board, but what is shown on screen is dependent on a digital signal that is independent of the power consumption. Connecting multiple monitors doesn't change the image. (talking theoretical here)
 
OverRated said:
Yer but it can create problems running it off a fan headers on your motherboard or graphics card, You get a splitter with some noctua fans but they only say to use it if your using the same fans, Running two fans of a PSU splitter will be fine.
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A lot of those warnings are just to keep people safe, and are more of a 'wet blanket approach'. Where if you follow the warning, you will always be OK, however ther are ALSO some scenarios where you are OK even if you don't, as okwchin mentions above.
 
I just got mine on thursday, I will probably be messing with a build sometime this week. Does anyone know if there is any room with an h100i to fit a 3.5in drive (Maybe under the graphics card that has a blower style?)
 
updawg said:
I just got mine on thursday, I will probably be messing with a build sometime this week. Does anyone know if there is any room with an h100i to fit a 3.5in drive (Maybe under the graphics card that has a blower style?)
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yep, one should fit under the gpu
 
I just recieved the e-mail about the FrozenQ reservoir being shipped, but the tracking number I recieved was incorrect.
I'll probably send them an e-mail tomorrow or so. Did anyone else get a wrong tracking number?
 
Toans said:
I just recieved the e-mail about the FrozenQ reservoir being shipped, but the tracking number I recieved was incorrect.
I'll probably send them an e-mail tomorrow or so. Did anyone else get a wrong tracking number?
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Yeah mine just says "not found". Maybe just give it a day to process.
 
AFD said:
That was just sooo fucking weird. Love it! :D
Really nice build, and thanks for the write-up & testing you did!
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lol!
Thank you AFD

Smitty2k1 said:
Why did you go with the Corsair H100i instead of the Swiftech 220 like everyone else is doing?
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Because I like to be different. ;) j/k but real
Simply I was happy with H100 performance and quality (after 2 years of use) and I thought H100i was good and enough for new build.

Skott said:
Did you have any hose kinking? Another user had some serious looking kink in one of his H100i rad hose. Curious if you avoided that somehow.
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I try to install hose avoiding kinks, doing smooth curves as much as possible. Btw it's working well, good temps, but I have pending do more stress testing.
 
Hey Wahaha360,

Any word yet on whether the ship has arrived to NL? The uncertainty of the duration of the wait is killing us here :p
 
I guess they tried to deliver mine today but I wasn't home. Milwaukee, WI.

EDIT: It's here!!! Number 0075.
 
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Toans said:
I just recieved the e-mail about the FrozenQ reservoir being shipped, but the tracking number I recieved was incorrect.
I'll probably send them an e-mail tomorrow or so. Did anyone else get a wrong tracking number?
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I placed a order with them a few days ago for one i wonder if ill have to wait till next year for it to ship?
 
Need a sanity check on my upgrades when transferring my rig to my M1...

I've decided to see how quiet I can go without going full-tilt-SPCR style...

Right now I'm looking at:
Mobo: P8Z77I-Deluxe (current)
CPU: i5-3570k (current)
RAM: Corsair Vengeance LP (current)
HDD: Samsung 840 (current)
New Parts:
PSU: Seasonic S12G-550 (will void the hell out of the warranty customizing the cables)
GPU: EVGA 770SC w/ACX cooler
CPU Cooler: Noctuna NH-C12P SE14
Case Fans: None if I can help it...

1. That cooler has been confirmed to fit with the P8Z77I-D, with an ATX PSU in the M1, correct?
2. Slightly concerned going with a non-blower cooler, but I'm tired of reference cooler noise. I may fab up an air dam on the fan shroud to essentially make the case into 2 seperate air compartments, forcing the GPU to draw air in from the bottom of the case and exhaust into the positive pressure environment above created by the CPU cooler drawing in fresh air... I'm not overclocking the CPU or GPU, and it'll only see 2-3 hour gaming sessions once or twice a week, if that. Thoughts?
 
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OverRated said:
I placed a order with them a few days ago for one i wonder if ill have to wait till next year for it to ship?
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Alex mentioned to me a couple of weeks back that the first batch would be going out then, and that the second batch that accumulated after the first week of Nov or so, would be going out a couple of weeks later. Since all the dates are extended out now, that estimate is probably extended as well. So new orders probably go into the queue for a future batch. You are probably looking at several weeks unless he has made up a bunch in advance (which I doubt he has had time or parts to do). I think the biggest problem he is facing is the lack of a laser cutter. Until he gets his replacement laser, he has to send them out to be cut before he can finish them.
 
adamantium said:
More hope for #26 on the west coast before the 25th. Sure hope we see #26 shipments showing up around NY/NJ on or before Wednesday.
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Me too! Anyone get the USPS "requested label archived" resolved for their tracking yet?

I'm gonna be kinda pissed if I miss my 1st delivery attempt because of this.
 
adamantium said:
More hope for #26 on the west coast before the 25th. Sure hope we see #26 shipments showing up around NY/NJ on or before Wednesday.
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well, as a #26'er myself, i will let you know. I live in CT, and i have the request label archived aswell, but i will be home this entire week, so i don't think UPS will have to come twice.
 
The seasonic has an awesome (not) mains IEC socket placement that will have you bending your cable sharply to fit in the case. Heat the cable _gently_ with a flame torch to help soften it up at the area you want to bend it.

I would strongly recommend the use of bottom case fans to help provide cool air supply for the GPU. The alternative is to create ducts from the GPU to the case bottom to ensure they pull in cool air.

In my testing with my twin fan cooler, the duct system was finicky to implement, and not hugely effective. Possibly because of the trouble I had at the experimentation stage ensuring an effective seal. In theory it sounds like it should work though.

Bottom fans provided the most significant benefit to temperatures, and all you need are for the bottom fans to be ticking over sub 1K rpm. The noise penalty of the bottom fans is compensated for by reducing the RPMs

I used slim fans, and then used full thickness fans. Both worked well, but not completely silent. The thicker fans certainly get a lot more air in for the same noise, but I had concerns with the bottom fan motor hub blocking the GPU fan itself, since I was using a GT, which has a huge motor diameter.

The fans on that Graphics card look substantial, so should work nicely with a ducted system. Alternative is to replace the fans with just the bottom case fans. Giving you a better cool air supply, and allowing the use of larger diameter and quieter fans. Also having good positive air supply allows you to evacuate the hot air faster.

I have installed a Noctua A9 fan on the rear, PWM controlled off the GPU, and its Awesome! Super quiet, and idles at 300rpm, which is slow enough to just start seeing the blades turning. practically silent though.


Several hours of gaming is essentially thermally maxing out the system. Within 10 minutes, you are going beyond the thermal mass of the system, and start to rely on thermal dissipation of the system to keep it cool, so having a compromised system on the basis of short term use is only healthy if it is not used more than 10 minutes or so. Several hours of gaming is essentially reliant on an effective long term cooling solution.
 
okwchin said:
The seasonic has an awesome (not) mains IEC socket placement that will have you bending your cable sharply to fit in the case. Heat the cable _gently_ with a flame torch to help soften it up at the area you want to bend it.
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Thanks for the input! Care to elaborate on the socket placement? Are you talking about the AC socket or the DC cables (any extraneous ones will be removed)?
 
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