Navi Rumors

[Auer]

Mostly what I take away from all of this so far is that nV is not going to drop prices in the near future....

 

[Snowdog]

Just posting this here because this guy is elaborating on AdoredTV's latest rumors on Navi + Nvidia's possible reaction. I'm not a big fan of him because while sometimes he seems to make some neutral sense, often he just rants about Nvidia with no other apparent purpose. Still, fuel for the flames. If the 2060 were to drop to $250 (price at which it should've launched, although I highly doubt Nvidia will cut prices that much) that'd make it a worthy purchase vs AMD. I'd rather have HW based raytracing than software. If price cuts are in the cards, I wouldn't expect any lower than $300, assuming Navi releases at $250.

Shrug. Speculations made up in answer to rumors that were most likely made up. Not worth bothering with a click.

I'll say what I always do about "reactions" to other companies. If one is necessary, it will mostly be marketing/pricing, not new HW. HW cycles are years long, they can't "react" with any speed.

 

[NKD]

Just posting this here because this guy is elaborating on AdoredTV's latest rumors on Navi + Nvidia's possible reaction. I'm not a big fan of him because while sometimes he seems to make some neutral sense, often he just rants about Nvidia with no other apparent purpose. Still, fuel for the flames. If the 2060 were to drop to $250 (price at which it should've launched, although I highly doubt Nvidia will cut prices that much) that'd make it a worthy purchase vs AMD. I'd rather have HW based raytracing than software. If price cuts are in the cards, I wouldn't expect any lower than $300, assuming Navi releases at $250.

I am simply tired of this notion that Navi is going to be priced that low. Adored should have known he was being trolled with those prices. 250 for vega 64+ 15% peformance. I never believed that for a bit. AMD knows by now they are not going to win by starting a price war, it just doesn't work. if Navi is at 350-400 and it gets close to the rtx 2070 in a performance that will easibly be plenty cheap. I doubt they will put navi on firesale. I am pretty sure AMD is eager to end the GCN era and move on and I think they will do that in 2020.

 

[noko]

Bla, I don't see buying a gaming card until 2020 or even 2021. Probably will be Nvidia's next generation or Turing on 7nm at least. We just have to see how Navi really performs but even if better than expected I see no buy.

 

[Jandor]

So here are all the (bad) news collected all together about Navi.
Navi is going to appear in 2 GPU for graphics card, but at different levels depending on the activated compute units.
Smaller navi (Navi 10?) will have up to 40 compute units. Bigger Navi (12 ?) will have up to 52 or 56 (depending on source).
First, bigger (middle range) Navi chip is kind of a big one. It's 1.5x Polaris. It is not based on Vega but an enhancement to Polaris and meant for gaming, not compute. Expect it to be slower per compute unit than Polaris at the same frequency and especially Vega. It will be lacking FP16, FP64 (from Radeon VII) and raytrace (Nvidia RTX and Pascal GTX), but it will have VRS (that also Nvidia Turing has). It is supposed to clock higher than Vega using lower TDP. Recent leaks say it is not good on TDP, and so need huge TDP to be on par with Vega 56 (think of 250/300W which is more than Vega 56).
Prices are not foing to be so nice. 200 dollars for the biggest Navi 10 40 compute units is good but it is not sure now that it will be with 8GB but rater 4GB. Navi 12 with 56 compute units, only competing with Vega 56 will be 250$, but this will not be to top version, but the lower version, with 48 compute units and maybe 4GB. The top version with all compute units and 8 or 16GB (the leak is not sure) will be sold 400$. It's all good but not great.
There will be a smwaller GPu made for the Zen 2 APU chiplet with 20 units. That may be quite batter than Vega APU but not quite so much to get Intel far away. Intel iGPU Gen11 with cache (Iris Pro) may beet Navi APU.
Sony PS5 in 2020 will have a different Navi GPU. It will have a separate Sony Raytracing unit, as wil Microsoft future Xbox GPU.
Now what is really bad :
AMD has developped the Navi 20 GPU, which is a bit bigger than Navi 10/12 with 64 compute units. This GPU will have back the FP16 and FP64 units and should compete Radeon VII. Actually, AMD is not able to make it better than Radeon VII and that GPU is actually slower than Radeon VII while having a bigger TDP, as long as AMD is still using 7nm... which makes the Radeon VII for anything else than gaming Raytracing, a much better GPU. There are people saying AMD is waiting for the 7 EUV to mature to use that technology on the Navi 20, just to be on par with Radeon VII. They say actual scope is to get Navi 20 on 7nm EUV, with a partially deactvated chip, on par with Radeon VII, and Full Navi 20 chip 10% better, at whatever TDP possible.

Gloably, Navi design is a huge failure. Take into account that Navi was Raja Koduri project and even if Raja was left with a reduced team by Lisa Su, he just got out of AMD with the rest of the good team and went to Intel. So AMD developped Navi with no head, and at best, an inexperienced fresh team. The result is what it should be.
Everything is Lisa Su fault, which seem to be a self-sufficient incompetent autocratic manager, only good at low level technical decisions, but everybody seem to try to escape from her grip at AMD.

 

[Jandor]

Bla, I don't see buying a gaming card until 2020 or even 2021. Probably will be Nvidia's next generation or Turing on 7nm at least. We just have to see how Navi really performs but even if better than expected I see no buy.

Best Navi in October is going to be on par with GTX 1660TI. Lower spec Navi will be on par with GTX 1650. prices won't be at AMD advantage but AMD may put more GDDR6 RAM to make a difference, when it is not needed in gaming for that level of GPU.
Navi 20 in 2020, if it ever makes it (some people say it may be abandoned), is going to be on par at best with RTX 2070/RTX2080, including ray-tracing, but at a huge TDP cost, and that will be the only difference with Radeon VII.

 

[_mockingbird]

So here are all the (bad) news collected all together about Navi.
Navi is going to appear in 2 GPU for graphics card, but at different levels depending on the activated compute units.
Smaller navi (Navi 10?) will have up to 40 compute units. Bigger Navi (12 ?) will have up to 52 or 56 (depending on source).
First, bigger (middle range) Navi chip is kind of a big one. It's 1.5x Polaris. It is not based on Vega but an enhancement to Polaris and meant for gaming, not compute. Expect it to be slower per compute unit than Polaris at the same frequency and especially Vega. It will be lacking FP16, FP64 (from Radeon VII) and raytrace (Nvidia RTX and Pascal GTX), but it will have VRS (that also Nvidia Turing has). It is supposed to clock higher than Vega using lower TDP. Recent leaks say it is not good on TDP, and so need huge TDP to be on par with Vega 56 (think of 250/300W which is more than Vega 56).
Prices are not foing to be so nice. 200 dollars for the biggest Navi 10 40 compute units is good but it is not sure now that it will be with 8GB but rater 4GB. Navi 12 with 56 compute units, only competing with Vega 56 will be 250$, but this will not be to top version, but the lower version, with 48 compute units and maybe 4GB. The top version with all compute units and 8 or 16GB (the leak is not sure) will be sold 400$. It's all good but not great.
There will be a smwaller GPu made for the Zen 2 APU chiplet with 20 units. That may be quite batter than Vega APU but not quite so much to get Intel far away. Intel iGPU Gen11 with cache (Iris Pro) may beet Navi APU.
Sony PS5 in 2020 will have a different Navi GPU. It will have a separate Sony Raytracing unit, as wil Microsoft future Xbox GPU.
Now what is really bad :
AMD has developped the Navi 20 GPU, which is a bit bigger than Navi 10/12 with 64 compute units. This GPU will have back the FP16 and FP64 units and should compete Radeon VII. Actually, AMD is not able to make it better than Radeon VII and that GPU is actually slower than Radeon VII while having a bigger TDP, as long as AMD is still using 7nm... which makes the Radeon VII for anything else than gaming Raytracing, a much better GPU. There are people saying AMD is waiting for the 7 EUV to mature to use that technology on the Navi 20, just to be on par with Radeon VII. They say actual scope is to get Navi 20 on 7nm EUV, with a partially deactvated chip, on par with Radeon VII, and Full Navi 20 chip 10% better, at whatever TDP possible.

Gloably, Navi design is a huge failure. Take into account that Navi was Raja Koduri project and even if Raja was left with a reduced team by Lisa Su, he just got out of AMD with the rest of the good team and went to Intel. So AMD developped Navi with no head, and at best, an inexperienced fresh team. The result is what it should be.
Everything is Lisa Su fault, which seem to be a self-sufficient incompetent autocratic manager, only good at low level technical decisions, but everybody seem to try to escape from her grip at AMD.

These are nothing more than speculations that you (poorly) masqueraded as facts.