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NAS/File Server build

  • Thread starter Deleted member 88227
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Deleted member 88227

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1) What will you be doing with this PC? Gaming? Photoshop? Web browsing? etc
This will be a NAS/File Server build only. I do not intend to host anything else on this server.

Primarily this server will be for storing recorded HD video. I want at least 20TB worth of storage for this setup. If I can't get 20TB with the budget laid out, then I want the ability to add 20TB worth of storage. Therefore I'm looking at either 10 2TB hard drives or 7 3TB hard drives.
2) What's your budget? Are tax and shipping included?
$1500 - $1700
3) Which country do you live in? If the U.S, please tell us the state and city if possible.

Amazon or Newegg :(
4) What exact parts do you need for that budget? CPU, RAM, case, etc. The word "Everything" is not a valid answer. Please list out all the parts you'll need.
CPU, RAM, Motherboard, Case, HDD, PSU, RAID Card
5) If reusing any parts, what parts will you be reusing? Please be especially specific about the power supply. List make and model.
Will not be reusing any parts.
6) Will you be overclocking?
Nope
7) 7) What is the max resolution of your monitor? What size is it?
Will be running this setup headless.
8) When do you plan on building/buying the PC?
Before the end of the month
9) What features do you need in a motherboard? RAID? Firewire? Crossfire or SLI support? USB 3.0? SATA 6Gb/s? eSATA? Onboard video (as a backup or main GPU)? UEFI? etc.
RAID 5, enough SATA ports for 20TB worth of storage. So either 10 2TB drives or 7 3TB drives. Also Gigabit network. Two ports if possible. A lot of HD data will be recorded to this server (Currently rocking three HD tuners on the network with two more HD tuners on the way)

Data stored on this server will not be super sensitive, nor will be a "backup" per se. I will however store files on here as a backup, but I have other ways of storing backups as well including physical media. RAID 5 is for redundancy and being able to add more drives to the array in the future to expand.
10) Do you already have a legit and reusable/transferable OS key/license? If so, what OS? Is it 32bit or 64bit?
Not really sure what I want to do here, either way I will not be using this budget to buy an operating system. If I need to get one, then I'll just fork out the money. Though I do want to try to run this on a free open source setup.


After setting up my new HTPC, I seen that I have 45 hours of HD recording on a 1TB hard drive. This isn't [H] enough for me. I need moar space. 900+ hours on the other hand, seems more like it. :D

This is the build I did, do note it does not include an HDD. Not sure what case I can use that will hold this many hard drives. With that being said, I'm okay with running it naked. However, if a nice case it suggested I'll bite. Also I went with the WD Red drives, since this is what they seem to be used for. However... if a green drive will handle what I intend to use than I'll save the money and go with them. No idea how much these drives will get used, could be a lot, could be every once in a while. I don't know.

$70 - Intel Pentium Dual-Core Processor G860 3.0 GHz 3 MB Cache LGA 1155 - BX80623G860
$55 - BIOSTAR H61MGC LGA 1155 Intel H61 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard
$23 - Samsung Electronics Extreme Low Voltage 30nm UDIMM 4 Not a kit (Single) DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM MV-3V4G3/US
$54 - Corsair Builder Series CX 430 Watt ATX/EPS 80 PLUS (CX430)
$265 - HighPoint RocketRAID 2320 8-Channel PCI-Express x4 SATA 3Gb/s RAID Controller
$1,190 - Western Digital Red WD30EFRX 3TB IntelliPower SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive

Okay few key things here.

  1. Processing power isn't going to be all that demanding. It's just copying/writing/moving files.
  2. While I would like to have dual gigabit ethernet ports, it's not a deal breaker. I can add a NIC later if I feel my network is holding me back.
  3. I love this RAM. :p
  4. 430W should be plenty to handle 7+ HDDs. According to the sticker on these, they draw 12v @ .45A and 5V @ .60A,
  5. Not much information about this controller card other than what the Newegg and Amazon reviews state. I've seen a lot of people complaining about customer support. Guess I'm gambling with hoping I don't have to deal with them. One user claimed 320MB/s write with RAID 5 and 8 1TB 5400RPM drives. Though as he pointed out, it's probably hitting the limits of the SATA ports. With that being said, a SATA 6.0GBb/sec RAID Controller with at least 8 SATA ports wasn't exactly cheap.
  6. I will have to either get these from Newegg since they limit 10 per customer, or make two orders with Amazon since they limit 5 per customer.
 
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When it comes to servers, I usually recommend that you figure out the OS first and then the hardware as different OSes kinda dictates what hadware you should get. Especially the hard drives.
 
Danny Bui said:
When it comes to servers, I usually recommend that you figure out the OS first and then the hardware as different OSes kinda dictates what hadware you should get. Especially the hard drives.
Click to expand...

Then for simplicity sake, let's go with Windows 7 or Windows Home Server.
 
Quick question: Is that 20TB of usable storage or 20TB of raw storage?
 
Danny Bui said:
Quick question: Is that 20TB of usable storage or 20TB of raw storage?
Click to expand...

I'm okay with raw. I know it wont actually show up at 20TB with 10 2TB hard drives or 21GB with 7 3TB hard drives.
 
Skillz said:
I'm okay with raw. I know it wont actually show up at 20TB with 10 2TB hard drives or 21GB with 7 3TB hard drives.
Click to expand...
So basically you're fine with 18TB of usable storage?

Looking at your build, it's not that solid mainly due to the controller. That's a software RAID controller, not a true hardware RAID controller. As such, it's actually using the PC's CPU to do all of the parity calculations. Which means a major impact in system performance. In addition, it doesn't support RAID 6. Now I bring up RAID 6 because from what I recall reading over in the Data Storage subforum, past 10TB or so, RAID 6 should be looked at due to the worsening reliability of hard drives and some other technical bits I kinda forgot. Also, did you make sure that 3TB drives would actually work with that controller? Finally, that card doesn't seem to be all that popular here on the forums i.e I don't ever see the storage gurus over in the Data Storage ever recommending that card.

If you do end up buying from Newegg, might as well buy the PSU from there as as well as Amazon's price for the Cx430 is absurdly high IMO. The Antec Neo Eco 520C is clearly the better deal.
 
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Also something I also forgot to bring up: Instead of RAID 6 with Windows, you may want to consider RAID 6 with Linux MDADM. Or if you want to use Windows and can ditch the RAID 6, check out Drive Pool, FlexRAID, or SnapRAID. Another option is ZFS RAID with OpenIndiana and napp-it:
http://www.servethehome.com/installing-configuring-napp-it-openindiana-zfs/

I recommend checking out the above options FIRST since none of them would require you to spend $265+ for a RAID controller. So if you have a spare PC or know how to use Virtual machines and have spare hard drives, try out any of the above options for awhile and see which one you like best. Considering that RAID 6 with 20TB of raw storage and Windows requires relatively expensive controllers, it's worth checking out the other options first hand.
 
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Didn't see your edit after I made that post.

As for RAID 6, I never thought about considering it to be honest. After reading up on RAID 6 in general, seems it's a setup I would probably rather have since it's fault tolerance is higher than that of RAID 5 and that alone is worth it to me.

That controller claims it supports 2TB+ hard drives, so I assumed it would work with the 3TB drives. I have no proof that it does. To be honest, I just looked on Newegg for a reasonably priced controller with at least 8 SATA ports. Speed isn't a real big concern; as long as it can handle writing at least 3 HD streams at once I'll be okay with it. I don't foresee me recording enough shows to overlap the recordings more than 3 times.

You are right on the PSU, I even had it in my Newegg shopping cart but I copied the Amazon link. I did not bother looking at the Antec Neo Eco 520C (or any other PSU for that matter) since I already have this PSU in another build and I know it will handle the number of drives I need (minus having enough connections) I didn't bother searching for anything else.

I am curious to know what solution you have that will allow me to connect at least 7+ drives at once without a $265+ controller card. What does RAID 6 offer that I am missing in that sense?

As for checking out each one of those options one by one, I am going to be perfectly honest here. Reason why I decided to just stick with Windows 7 and/or Windows Home Server is for the ease of use and my familiarity with Windows in general. All I intended to do was make the RAID array on the box, then network map the drives on the other computer(s), point WMC to that drive for recording and forget about it. Seems to be the simplest solution to me. I'm also familiar with setting that up, since I did it with my previous HTPC setup when I was using one of the 1TB drives in my main rig as a second recording location.

However, if one of those solutions can save me $265; then that might be worth it for me to check out. I just don't really have a lot of time to fool with it. My g/f already gets mad at the little time I spend on the PC now, I can only imagine how aggravated she'd get if I spent even more time testing out setups. :/

edit
After doing a quick search on Linux MDADM, it seems it's a type of Software RAID, thus meaning all the drives don't have to be on the same controller. However in my searches I found it rather difficult or near impossible to find a motherboard that had 7 - 8 SATA ports. In fact, the only motherboards that I found with that many SATA ports (other than server motherboards) was made by ASRock and that's a company I would rather avoid. Additionally, what makes these software RAID controllers better than the built in Windows software RAID controller?
 
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Skillz said:
As for checking out each one of those options one by one, I am going to be perfectly honest here. Reason why I decided to just stick with Windows 7 and/or Windows Home Server is for the ease of use and my familiarity with Windows in general. All I intended to do was make the RAID array on the box, then network map the drives on the other computer(s), point WMC to that drive for recording and forget about it. Seems to be the simplest solution to me. I'm also familiar with setting that up, since I did it with my previous HTPC setup when I was using one of the 1TB drives in my main rig as a second recording location.
Click to expand...
If we were talking a small-scale setup, yeah I could definitely see that working. But you wanted 20TB so yeah that complicates things quite a bit.

Skillz said:
I am curious to know what solution you have that will allow me to connect at least 7+ drives at once without a $265+ controller card. What does RAID 6 offer that I am missing in that sense?

........

After doing a quick search on Linux MDADM, it seems it's a type of Software RAID, thus meaning all the drives don't have to be on the same controller. However in my searches I found it rather difficult or near impossible to find a motherboard that had 7 - 8 SATA ports. In fact, the only motherboards that I found with that many SATA ports (other than server motherboards) was made by ASRock and that's a company I would rather avoid.
Click to expand...
This is actually one of the few situations where AMD is viable budget option. Specifically the FM2 platform:
http://www.amazon.com/MSI-Socket-US.../B009HP42IU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1358589202
http://www.amazon.com/Gigabyte-GA-F.../B009O7YZ7O/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1358589184
http://www.amazon.com/Gigabyte-A85X.../B00A67GUZG/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1358589218
http://www.amazon.com/BIOSTAR-Socke...f=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1358589579

The above mobos all have eight SATA ports, are reasonably priced, and are not AsRock. Yes all eight SATA ports are on the same RAID controller but the AMD RAID controller doesn't support RAID 6 from what I can tell. So you basically have to use some form of software RAID with the above mobos if you want RAID 6.

Now if you want Intel, unfortunately AsRock is gonna be your best bet for budget as the cheapest non-AsRock Intel mobo with eight SATA ports costs $142:
http://www.amazon.com/Gigabyte-Cros.../B007R21KBC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1358589075

While the onboard Intel RAID controller does support RAID 6, they're maxed out at six SATA ports.
Skillz said:
Additionally, what makes these software RAID controllers better than the built in Windows software RAID controller?
Click to expand...
At the core of it, just better algorithums, coding, design, architecture, etc. Over in the Data Storage subforum, the built-in software RAID in the Windows OS itself seems to reviled for its low performance and low reliability. Thats why even the motherboard's onboard fakeRAID controller is recommended over the Windows OS software RAID. But as you saw above, the motherboard's onboard fakeRAID controler has some limitations. Hence the push towards other non-traditional parity basedor redundancy solutions like FlexRAID, SnapRAID, Drive Pool, or Drive Bender (forgot this one earlier) when Windows is needed but not much money is available for a good RAID controller.

Also, case wise, I'd definitely recommend the NZX Source 210 Elite here since it can fit eight hard drives easily.
 
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Thanks for the clarification Danny.

Looks like, just reading the features at least, I will be going with either Drive Pool or Drive Bender, mostly because of the prices of them. If neither of those work, then I will try out FlexRAID. SnapRAID seems to be Linux only.

With that being said, the Source 210 Elite will have to do for now. Though eventually I intend to push towards a rack setup, since I already have a rack mountable server that I play around with, however I do not own a rack so it's not terribly important. The 210 Elite will do.

Now; since I know little to nothing about the AMD FM2 platform I'm going to need your help with a reliable motherboard, cpu that will handle my needs and RAM that will work. (Hopefully the Samsung RAM will be good for it; I love how low profile it is and super low voltage)
 
Skillz said:
Now; since I know little to nothing about the AMD FM2 platform I'm going to need your help with a reliable motherboard, cpu that will handle my needs and RAM that will work. (Hopefully the Samsung RAM will be good for it; I love how low profile it is and super low voltage)
Click to expand...
That Samsung RAM should still do the trick. CPU wise, the AMD A6-5400K should do the job but I'd go for the quad-core A8-5600K since it'll give you the option of re-encoding video on that server itself. Motherboard wise, this is pretty much a shot in the dark for me as three of the FM2 mobos don't have that many Newegg user reviews. So how reliable those three aren't well known. The Biostar has quite a few reviews compared to the other three which paints it so far as a so-so motherboard.
 
I think I'll go with the Biostar then; I've used them before years ago during the AM2 days with my lovely Brisbane 3600+ setup that I overclocked like mad. I also have one, if you remember, in my new HTPC. So I'll take my chances with them. I also like the number of PCI-e 16x, 4x and 1x slots it offers to expand ability should I want to add more SATA slots and/or go with more ethernet ports.

My previous cost was $1657 without a case ($1707 with the Elite 210). This setup will be, with 7 3TB hdds...
$1507.86

Looks good to me. Heck I could even add an 8th HDD to the setup and still be less.

However, lets say I want to add 2 more drives to the setup. What SATA controller would you recommend going with? I realize the case only has 8 3.5" bays, but I can easily find a 5.25" to 3.5" bracket so I'm not worried about that.
 
Skillz said:
I think I'll go with the Biostar then; I've used them before years ago during the AM2 days with my lovely Brisbane 3600+ setup that I overclocked like mad. I also have one, if you remember, in my new HTPC. So I'll take my chances with them. I also like the number of PCI-e 16x, 4x and 1x slots it offers to expand ability should I want to add more SATA slots and/or go with more ethernet ports.
Click to expand...

Good luck with the Biostar
Skillz said:
My previous cost was $1657 without a case ($1707 with the Elite 210). This setup will be, with 7 3TB hdds...
$1507.86
Click to expand...
is that $1507 with the case?
Skillz said:
However, lets say I want to add 2 more drives to the setup. What SATA controller would you recommend going with?
Click to expand...
Don't know to be honest. I'm more familiar with the mid to high-end range (8+ SATA ports) of storage controllers than the low-end ones (anything less than 8).
 
Then which 8+ storage controller would you recommend?

Yes that $1507 is with the case. Basically everything I need except the software license; but I wont pay that until the end of this month and/or the middle of next month as I will take advantage of the free trial they offer.
 
Nice card, however I am finding it rather difficult to find it for the $75 price that most posts and article talk about. Seems the price on ebay has doubled, except a few from sellers selling it for around the $100 mark, those sellers don't see to be very reputable.
 
Yeah you won't find it for $75 anymore. But it's still a good deal even at $120.
 
To make that controller work with SATA drives, I will need one of these cables right?

$17 - Discrete SATA to SFF-8087 Mini SAS Reverse breakout cable

Which appears to only allow 4 SATA drives to connect to it, so to get the full potential of using 8 I'll need two of them? Not that I intend to have 16 drives anytime soon.
 
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Wrong cable: It has to be forward breakout cables, not reverse.

Yes you'll need two of them to get 8 drive capability.
 
Ah okay. Glad I asked.

$12 - Monoprice 0.5m 30AWG Internal Mini SAS 36pin (SFF-8087) Male w/ Latch to SATA 7pin Female (x4) Forward Breakout Cable - Black

Little cheaper too.
 
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Guess I'll go ahead and get that card and two of those cables as well.
 
Why? Just go for the 3TB drives and get the controller when you need it.
 
Danny Bui said:
Why? Just go for the 3TB drives and get the controller when you need it.
Click to expand...

Because if that controller was ~$75 just a couple months ago and has gone up in the used market, one could argue that it could potentially go up again making it a not so great buy anymore. Additionally, now that I intend to use one of those RAID solutions, t hey claim you do not have to use the same size disks in the array for it to work. Thus I have two 320GB 2.5" hard drives, a 250GB 3.5" hard drive and a couple other drives I'm not sure of their size right off hand that are all SATA that I could use. :D I know it's not much, but if I have them; might as well put them to use. ;)
 
Skillz said:
Because if that controller was ~$75 just a couple months ago and has gone up in the used market, one could argue that it could potentially go up again making it a not so great buy anymore.
Click to expand...
While true, the thing is that there will probably be something better to replace it as the top choice. Before the IBM M1015, I was recommending the BR10i. Before the BR10i, I was recommending the Perc 5/i and Supermicro AOC-SASLP-MV8 cards. Before either of those cards, I was recommending the SuperMicro AOC-SAT2-MV8. So in other words, there's will more than likely be a better card available by the time you truly need the storage space. And that better card will probably have additional features that may prove more useful in the long-run. With each stage of card recommendation, there was always good feature added (greater drive size support, greater drive support in general, better drivers, higher performance, better compatibility etc).
Skillz said:
Additionally, now that I intend to use one of those RAID solutions, they claim you do not have to use the same size disks in the array for it to work. Thus I have two 320GB 2.5" hard drives, a 250GB 3.5" hard drive and a couple other drives I'm not sure of their size right off hand that are all SATA that I could use. :D I know it's not much, but if I have them; might as well put them to use. ;)
Click to expand...
I guess. But still not sure if it's worthwhile to do that.
 
Luckily I haven't bought it. I just went with a free trial on amazon, put everything in my Amazon cart (it now lets me buy all 7 drives) and the priced shipped is now $1492.23 AND I can get it in two days.
 
Yes, yes. Now I just need to click the button to buy it. LOL
 
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