NAEP Tests: Girls Outscore Boys In IT Literacy

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National Assessment of Educational Progress administered the first-ever nationally representative assessment of technology and engineering literacy in 2014 and the results have just been made public. The test results provide a baseline of eighth-graders’ technology and engineering literacy. The charts below show results based on gender and by race.
 

Armenius

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Well we have to remember that Common Core has a female bias in its learning practices. Public schools have continued to favor learning methods for which female students do best in for the past 20 years. Let's not also forget that brain maturity is achieved at a younger age in females than males. I believe females hit their peak around ages 12-16 while males do so at ages 18-22.
is 3 points even statistically significant?
If we're talking 3 percentage points, then no. If we're talking about raw score then we would have to know out of what the total possible was.
 

Kalabalana

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Unfortunately this number is not even remotely representative of what I see in the field.

I'm afraid there must be some serious bias in the design of this test. Or boys just develop later? Either way, despite training several females in IT and development, I cannot find this study representative of adult competency in the IT field.
 

Nukester

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Wow, whites caught up with Asians. Unfortunately blacks are about where I expected. Maybe when it's finally "cool" in their culture to be academic and business oriented, things will change. Sorry, no Ghetto wanted.

Sounds racist, but it's not. And yes, there are a lot of white/brown trash too.
 

schizrade

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Unfortunately this number is not even remotely representative of what I see in the field.

I'm afraid there must be some serious bias in the design of this test. Or boys just develop later? Either way, despite training several females in IT and development, I cannot find this study representative of adult competency in the IT field.
I agree, not even close. But whatever makes the pollsters and bean counters feel good I guess.
 

Liger88

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Bingo!

Other research is finally starting to show the differences between girls and boys developement and it's affect on academic learning.

Doesn't even include our education system being heavily skewed towards girls for the past 20 years. It would be common sense that they should be above boys all around even if you didn't take into account boys development stages being later in life. It's a well established fact at this point that girls develop faster than boys.
 

Nukester

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In grade eight?

Wow. So just when a boy is reaching his retardation years, the girls are outperforming him?

I'm betting it gets worse for a few years after that.

Most of us were all boys at one time. We all know how breath-takingly stupid we were.
Well said. I quit being so Penis driven when I hit about 22. Then my brain kicked in.
 

lcpiper

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Unfortunately this number is not even remotely representative of what I see in the field.

I'm afraid there must be some serious bias in the design of this test. Or boys just develop later? Either way, despite training several females in IT and development, I cannot find this study representative of adult competency in the IT field.

I don't think this test even touches on IT, technology as in being a Luser, yes, but actual technical IT, I didn't see the relevance of this test for that purpose.
 

schizrade

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I don't think this test even touches on IT, technology as in being a Luser, yes, but actual technical IT, I didn't see the relevance of this test for that purpose.
Most of the women I know that work in "IT" aren't engineers, they are usually the finance and people managers for IT depts. They do it very well BTW, way better than most of the IT Manager men I have worked around.
 

AK0tA

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I learned 2 things from this or may be just one.

Blacks need to pick up the pace or test is stupid and predictable.

txt'ing ability is not a major IT skill for 8'th graders.
 

trudude

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Should have told the boys the test was a game and they would have easily beaten the girls.
 

thejokker

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Camille Paglia, one of the founding members of the Women's Movement, described today's educational system as a "toxic environment" for boys. This study? Garbage in, garbage out...
 

phillyboy

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Should have told the boys the test was a game and they would have easily beaten the girls.
Maybe not specifically games, but this is part of the issue too with being able to reach out to boys when it comes to literacy and school. For too long parents and teachers pushed that the only good reading for a child had to be the classics like "To Kill a Mockingbird," "The Scarlet Letter", "Romeo and Juliet" etc. Boys would get scorned when they would just want to read encyclopedias, equipment manuals, comic books, etc. which turns them off of the process entirely.

Same thing with the later maturation age and the general idea that young boys HAVE A LOT OF ENERGY AND CANNOT SIT IN A CHAIR FOR EIGHT HOURS STRAIGHT.

My wife deals with this a lot being a youth & teen librarian. Parents still want to make their young boys read "the classics" when they damn well should know better that their kids either want to read technical bullshit or comic books / manga. She reminds them that ALL types of reading helps a child's general development and they don't need to read certain specific books to get there, and then gives them a few suggestions to try out.

Some parents listen, some don't. Go figure.
 

Time2Kill

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Maybe not specifically games, but this is part of the issue too with being able to reach out to boys when it comes to literacy and school. For too long parents and teachers pushed that the only good reading for a child had to be the classics like "To Kill a Mockingbird," "The Scarlet Letter", "Romeo and Juliet" etc. Boys would get scorned when they would just want to read encyclopedias, equipment manuals, comic books, etc. which turns them off of the process entirely.

Same thing with the later maturation age and the general idea that young boys HAVE A LOT OF ENERGY AND CANNOT SIT IN A CHAIR FOR EIGHT HOURS STRAIGHT.

My wife deals with this a lot being a youth & teen librarian. Parents still want to make their young boys read "the classics" when they damn well should know better that their kids either want to read technical bullshit or comic books / manga. She reminds them that ALL types of reading helps a child's general development and they don't need to read certain specific books to get there, and then gives them a few suggestions to try out.

Some parents listen, some don't. Go figure.
You obviously missed the article posted on [H] the other days about boys testing better when they're told its a game and not a test.
 

nutzo

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My daughter has been asked a few time to help one of her on-line class teachers or fellow students.
Pretty sad when the student is more computer savvy than the teacher :(

Of course she has been using computers since she was 1 year old so she might have more years of experience :p
 

phillyboy

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You obviously missed the article posted on [H] the other days about boys testing better when they're told its a game and not a test.
Sure did, but were you going to address anything else? I'm still contributing to the thread.

I see the point about them doing better though in that aspect.
 

lcpiper

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Most of the women I know that work in "IT" aren't engineers, they are usually the finance and people managers for IT depts. They do it very well BTW, way better than most of the IT Manager men I have worked around.
Exactly, but those are not really IT jobs, they are business and finance and HR. Technical IT work is very different. Now I have to say, I have seen some women that are great developers, they can code damn well. Java, SQL, Oracle, C++, web devs, all that women can do very well. But when was the last time you saw a woman as a SAN or Network Engineer?

I think they are fine when it comes to managing anything that has a GUI. Women do fine with AD and Windows administration too. But I don't think they like actually putting their hands on the toys and handling the back end of the infrastructure. And I am not sold on the idea that it's men driving them away from that kind of work. I think that kind of work involves a level of planning and design concepts that are boring for most women. That they just don't find any beauty in managing such things, it don't trip their trigger.
 
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The differences between Whites and Blacks are far more statistically significant than the ones between boys and girls. Yet the 3 point difference is what they focus on? Really? Sounds like denial.

Would the same three-point trend have shown up if we were comparing White boys to White girls, or Asian boys to Asian girls? How do we know there weren't more Black boys than Black girls, or that the Black boys didn't drag down the male average by having the worst scores?

I never understood this whole obsession with the idea that boys in general can't passively absorb information at a younger age. I never had a problem sitting still in school, and I made As all throughout 8th grade. Didn't really start having a problem with keeping my grades up until I hit college-level Math.

This whole idea that men have less self-control and ability to focus is a very new idea. It's probably got something to do with feminism and empowering women. Bear in mind that lecturing, testing, and other instructional methods that exist were in place even back when the majority of scholars were male.

So I think they're trying to paint this as a problem that all men have. When in reality, Black men think White men sound "effeminate" for being able to enunciate words correctly, and don't have any respect for us. I can tell you that I got into a lot of trouble in elementary school because I kept complaining about how loud/distracting the Black boys were, and how I was afraid to walk to school with them. But my grades were always good.
 
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Scizyr

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This mostly tests "technology literacy" in its effect on the environment and society. You can even see in the sample task, they aren't testing anything rational or technical. It's mostly about feelings, how students are supposed to feel about how certain aspects of technology supposedly have an effect on the environment. It doesn't surprise me that women scored higher. Most of these tasks were probably developed by women.

This has nothing to do with literacy of technology and engineering. And absolutely nothing to do with IT. The title of this thread makes no sense, is misleading and demonstrably false.
 

Nukester

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The differences between Whites and Blacks are far more statistically significant than the ones between boys and girls. Yet the 3 point difference is what they focus on? Really? Sounds like denial.

Would the same three-point trend have shown up if we were comparing White boys to White girls, or Asian boys to Asian girls? How do we know there weren't more Black boys than Black girls, or that the Black boys didn't drag down the male average by having the worst scores?

I never understood this whole obsession with the idea that boys in general can't passively absorb information at a younger age. I never had a problem sitting still in school, and I made As all throughout 8th grade. Didn't really start having a problem with keeping my grades up until I hit college-level Math.

This whole idea that men have less self-control and ability to focus is a very new idea. It's probably got something to do with feminism and empowering women. Bear in mind that lecturing, testing, and other instructional methods that exist were in place even back when the majority of scholars were male.

So I think they're trying to paint this as a problem that all men have. When in reality, Black men think White men sound "effeminate" for being able to enunciate words correctly, and don't have any respect for us. I can tell you that I got into a lot of trouble in elementary school because I kept complaining about how loud/distracting the Black boys were, and how I was afraid to walk to school with them. But my grades were always good.
You game with a GTX 670 so you don't count.
 
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You game with a GTX 670 so you don't count.
LOL. Well, not much time for gaming until recently... I was busy with school between 2014 and 2016. Even did Summer and Winter terms. Last game I played was Assassin's Creed Rogue. Besides, I'm buying a 1080 as soon as I can get one, because this card won't cut it for the newer games I want to play.
 

haste.

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Wow, whites caught up with Asians. Unfortunately blacks are about where I expected. Maybe when it's finally "cool" in their culture to be academic and business oriented, things will change. Sorry, no Ghetto wanted.

Sounds racist, but it's not. And yes, there are a lot of white/brown trash too.
It's fairly racist to say it that way, but google Flynn Effect. This should not be a surprise - environmental factors effect these scores.
 

illram

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Wow, whites caught up with Asians. Unfortunately blacks are about where I expected. Maybe when it's finally "cool" in their culture to be academic and business oriented, things will change. Sorry, no Ghetto wanted.

Sounds racist, but it's not. And yes, there are a lot of white/brown trash too.
Phew, I'm glad you clarified that this isn't racist! I was pretty worried there for a second.............................
 

Makaveli@BETA

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LOL. Well, not much time for gaming until recently... I was busy with school between 2014 and 2016. Even did Summer and Winter terms. Last game I played was Assassin's Creed Rogue. Besides, I'm buying a 1080 as soon as I can get one, because this card won't cut it for the newer games I want to play.
lol no need to defend yourself nothing wrong with gaming on a 670.

Some people have lives like you clearly do and don't have time to be upgrading GPU's every 6 months.
 

Nukester

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It's fairly racist to say it that way, but google Flynn Effect. This should not be a surprise - environmental factors effect these scores.
But how is stating facts racist? Even intellectual blacks admit to the cultural pressures.
 

Nukester

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LOL. Well, not much time for gaming until recently... I was busy with school between 2014 and 2016. Even did Summer and Winter terms. Last game I played was Assassin's Creed Rogue. Besides, I'm buying a 1080 as soon as I can get one, because this card won't cut it for the newer games I want to play.
Forgiven. ;). Your priorities are right. Good luck with your career!
 

Nukester

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lol no need to defend yourself nothing wrong with gaming on a 670.

Some people have lives like you clearly do and don't have time to be upgrading GPU's every 6 months.
I use too, but had money to blow. Move 18 years into the future and I'm as frugal as anyone. Putting daughter through college, no student loans. Saving for retirement. Saving for college that's coming for second daughter.

But, my upgrade time is near. Baby needed new shoes, daddy now needs a video card.
 

pothb

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Wel, he did say, as expected. Can't really call that a fact, right?

Not that I think he was being racists... just saying things don't mean jack, it's the intentions behind them that matter.
 

Nukester

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Wel, he did say, as expected. Can't really call that a fact, right?

Not that I think he was being racists... just saying things don't mean jack, it's the intentions behind them that matter.
As expected based on past experiences and studies that show cultural influences. You cannot deny this. Look at the number of single parent black households. When a child does not have the life experiences of two adults to learn from, it takes a toll.

Our society has been going backwards at a horrid pace. I hope things turn around.

Do you know how badly I want blacks to rise up intellectually (as a whole)? They are Americans too. I'm not speaking of the many that have succeeded, but the masses that are being left in the dust.
 

sfsuphysics

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So from what I gathered for every 38 boys who were proficient 41 girls were as well, as far as being "advanced" it's identical across the board, it's good to be white or asian, and definitely don't want to be black, and hopefully you're not poor enough to be eligible for the national school lunch program, because then you're 28% less.
 

raz-0

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is 3 points even statistically significant?
It is unlikely unless the scores are out of a small possible total.

So from what I gathered for every 38 boys who were proficient 41 girls were as well, as far as being "advanced" it's identical across the board, it's good to be white or asian, and definitely don't want to be black, and hopefully you're not poor enough to be eligible for the national school lunch program, because then you're 28% less.
Which begs the question, if we haven't fixed STEM awareness/preparedness/whatever for girls, and they are outscoring the boys, why is there some kind of STEM educational crisis for girls being played up?

Who knows? But I'm sure whatever answer is posed next will involve someone else doing something to them rather than accepting that they are capable of, and DO make their own decisions.
 

Jagger100

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Which begs the question, if we haven't fixed STEM awareness/preparedness/whatever for girls, and they are outscoring the boys, why is there some kind of STEM educational crisis for girls being played up?

Who knows? But I'm sure whatever answer is posed next will involve someone else doing something to them rather than accepting that they are capable of, and DO make their own decisions.
Because you can't sell solutions to problems that don't exist. You can't be someone's savior unless you convince them they are oppressed.
 

lcpiper

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It's fairly racist to say it that way, but google Flynn Effect. This should not be a surprise - environmental factors effect these scores.
Actually I don't think it's racists to say that the results of a statistical analysis turned out how you would have predicted.

I think it just means a person has a clear view of how things are, regardless of cause.

I think racism would show it's head when you start drawing conclusion on the data based solely on race.
 
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