My Upcoming Build

C

Crath

Weaksauce
Joined
Dec 6, 2008
Messages
73
Hey guys, I'm new around here, but have a few friends that already use the board. I'm not exactly sure if this is the right place to post this, so I'll see how it goes. Christmas is coming up so I'm building a new computer. I don't do any gaming, but I would like to be powerful enough to be able to keep it around for a couple years. I was thinking of using xp pro (86x) as my main OS, and then vmware or virtual pc (maybe another) to run win server 2008, which would host my active directory and all that fun stuff, then a virtual xp pro to do all my bittorrent and surfing crap so that way I dont screw up my main installation. I'm hoping to spend under $700 on the build, but we'll see how that goes. I don't plan on overclocking, or watercooling and shouldnt need any raid or anything fancy like that for a long time. Thanks for any tips I can get! Here is my currently wishlist i have setup. PS: i already have a 500gb sata drive in an external enclosure I plan to use on the build, so thats why I dont have any hdd's on the list.

Motherboard: ASUS P5Q SE PLUS LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard
CPU: Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 Kentsfield 2.4GHz LGA 775 Quad-Core Processor
RAM: OCZ Reaper HPC 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit
GPU: SAPPHIRE 100225L Radeon HD 3870 512MB 256-bit GDDR4 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card
PSU: Broadway Com Corp P4-OKIA600-BLACK 600W ATX Power Supply
Case: Antec Nine Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower
Optical: SAMSUNG 22X DVD Burner Black SATA

[Link to Wishlist]
 
I would suggest getting another motherboard. ATX connector placement will get in the way. And lose the 3870, if you need a good budget card, 4670 can stand toe to toe with the 3870 in 80% of most games and beat it on price and 1/3 power usage.
 
I concur with lt_shiro: go with another motherboard. The placement of that 24pin power connector is pretty stupid and horrible for cable management and air flow. I recommend this mobo:
Gigabyte GA-EP43-DS3L Intel P43 Motherboard - $85

Ditch the RAM since A) they're expensive and B) Overkill for the Q6600 even if you are planning on overclocking. I recommend getting this RAM set instead since A) it's cheaper, and B) all that you need for the Q6600, even with overclocking in mind:
G.Skill F2-6400CL5D-4GBPQ 2 x 2GB DDR2 800 RAM - $45

Ditch the PSU. One thing you should learn from this forum is that the PSU is one of the most IMPORTANT part of the PC. Read this PSU FAQ if you want to know more about PSUs:
http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1036

Go with this significantly better quality PSU instead:
BFG Tech LS-550 550W PSU - $80

If you're not planning on doing any gaming, then you really don't need that video card. You might be better off with motherboard with onboard video. But if you plan on having two monitors, then just go with a cheap PCI-E video card with two DVI ports.

Oh and welcome to the forums :D
 
In addition to lt_shiro and Danny's suggestions, I suggest getting a cheaper case if you want to save money. $110 for the 900 is pretty high, IMO. The CM 690, 590, or even the Antec 300 should be cheaper. Also, look for a place with free shipping, like buy.com or amazon.com.
 
NCIX US has the 900 for $93 at the moment, with a combo deal + a $30 MIR for the Corsair TX650W PSU. The power supply goes from $108 to $66.

You'd save a buck by buying the Gigabyte mobo there, but that's not really important. Check the shipping costs though.

Is XP Pro 32-bit really a good choice for the main system? Can VMWare run a 64-bit OS on top of this?
 
Wow, thanks for all the info guys! Alright, here is what im looking at.

Replace my mobo with this guy, but the FSB doesnt match the cpu? only supports 8gb?

Get this ram, but its only ddr2 800, compared to the ddr2 1066 i could get, much of a difference?

upgrade to this psu

switch to a cheap case like this

and @ using 32 or 64bit, i plan on the main os on the system being 64 bit xp pro, and the xp running in vmware, 32bit

thanks again to all the help!
 
The FSB does match. The board supports 1600 (OC), 1333, 1066 and 800 Mhz FSB speeds. It also supports 16GB of RAM. Here, check out the specs: Gigabyte GA-EP43-DS3L Specs

With the Core2 platform, you'll get the most optimal performance with the RAM and CPU running in a 1:1 ratio. You don't need anything higher than DDR2-800, as Danny mentioned. Here's some math to help you understand why...

/*------------- <cut n paste> -------------*/
Formulas for Intel platform @ 1:1 settings: (base FSB speed is SDR, or single data rate)
c x [Base FSB speed] = CPU speed (c = CPU Multiplier)
2 x [Base FSB speed] = RAM speed (DDR: double data rate)
4 x [Base FSB speed] = FSB speed (QDR: quad data rate; Effective FSB speed)

On Intel platforms, running the RAM higher than a 1:1 ratio with the CPU is, for the most part, useless, so don't bother trying to do so. If the BIOS does it for you, just let it. All you need is a 1:1 config, though. Here's some possible clock speeds (as always with OC'ing, your results will vary):

Q6600: 9 × 266 = 2.4Ghz, DDR2-533 << STOCK speeds
Q6600: 9 × 333 = 3.0Ghz, DDR2-667 << Nice OC
Q6600: 9 × 378 = 3.4Ghz, DDR2-756 << Good OC, near max for B3 stepping
Q6600: 9 × 400 = 3.6Ghz, DDR2-800 << Great OC, near max for G0 stepping
/*------------- </cut n paste> -------------*/

The Centurion 5 is a good case, but the 532, 534, and 590 are better choices since they have better airflow/cooling. Order it now, while it has free shipping!

$50 - Cooler Master Centurion 590 RC-590-KKN1-GP Black (FS)

So you already have a license for XP 64-bit? If not, I'd suggest Vista 64-bit instead.
 
Hmm, I kinda see see what its saying, so thats clearified.

I already have a XP Pro 32 anx 64 bit license, and a server license, I forget if its 32bit or 64bit though. also, i would never use vista on my home machine, eek.

Also, about the video card, would getting say, a 512mb card vs a 256mb card, be noticeable in photoshop? i use photoshop quite often and with decent sized files. I figure it uses scratch disks for most of the grunt work, but i never really looked much into how photoshop uses hardware :p (havent cared)

here is my updated wishlist (with no video card yet)

thanks!
 
Crath said:
...
I already have a XP Pro 32 anx 64 bit license, and a server license, I forget if its 32bit or 64bit though. also, i would never use vista on my home machine, eek.

Also, about the video card, would getting say, a 512mb card vs a 256mb card, be noticeable in photoshop? i use photoshop quite often and with decent sized files. I figure it uses scratch disks for most of the grunt work, but i never really looked much into how photoshop uses hardware :p (havent cared)...
Click to expand...

You must be misinformed about Vista. It works great and makes better use of your system resources.

The new CS4 will make use of CUDA, which is on NVIDIA cards, but its not a huge performance boost. No, a 512MB card won't help much more than a 256MB card for photoshop. If you want better performance with photoshop, get 8GB of RAM and make a RAMdisk for your scratch disk.
 
how much ram does x64 xp pro support? i may just have todo that.

as for vista, its not how it works, its how it looks/navigates that i dislike
 
Crath said:
how much ram does x64 xp pro support? i may just have todo that.

as for vista, its not how it works, its how it looks/navigates that i dislike
Click to expand...

128GB, IIRC.

You learn to like it. I remember saying the same thing about Win95, 3.11, and XP.
 
enginurd said:
You learn to like it. I remember saying the same thing about Win95, 3.11, and XP.
Click to expand...
vista is just... that really hot blond that is a dumb b**ch and couldnt find her way out of a paper bag
xp is that cute chick that is cool and has common sense

so a 256mb pci-e 2 card sounds good?
 
Danny Bui said:
Max of 16GB of RAM:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/283247/en-us
Click to expand...

So I guess it was planned to support more...

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/64bit/russel_exploringx64.mspx

My mind wasn't playing tricks on me.

Crath said:
vista is just... that really hot blond that is a dumb b**ch and couldnt find her way out of a paper bag
xp is that cute chick that is cool and has common sense

so a 256mb pci-e 2 card sounds good?
Click to expand...

I think of it more like Vista is a late model sports car, like a 2008 G37, E46 or 911, while XP is simply an older 90's model.

Yup, the 9400/9500/9600GT should be nice and cheap.
 
There's a bunch of 9600GT's for the same price, but with a rebate on top of that. I'd go for one of those instead. However, since you're not doing any gaming, a 9400GT should be almost half the price of a 9600GT.
 
enginurd said:
There's a bunch of 9600GT's for the same price, but with a rebate on top of that. I'd go for one of those instead. However, since you're not doing any gaming, a 9400GT should be almost half the price of a 9600GT.
Click to expand...

well i see most of them are 128-bit instead of 256-bit. mind clarifying? :p thanks
 
Danny Bui said:
I stand corrected :)
Click to expand...

Well, the one I linked seems to be written pre-release, and your KB seems to be post release. So, I still don't know the answer, but I'd trust the more recent article. However, I do remember having workstations with XP64 and much more than 4GB of RAM when I worked in IT a few years ago, lol.

Crath said:
well i see most of them are 128-bit instead of 256-bit. mind clarifying? :p thanks
Click to expand...

The larger the bus width, the faster data gets pushed across. The lower GPUs don't have a higher bus width, which keeps costs down.
 
enginurd said:
The larger the bus width, the faster data gets pushed across. The lower GPUs don't have a higher bus width, which keeps costs down.
Click to expand...
would that be something i notice while using photoshop? or maybe watching a movie?
 
Danny Bui said:
Outside of gaming and 3D rendering, probably not.
Click to expand...
alright thanks for all the tips, i think im just gonna go with the 512mb 256-bit just incase i drop out of high school and pick up WoW or something :D

so here is my updated wishlist. planning to do photoshop, rare movie watching, very rarely modeling in blender 3d, and possibly vmware running winserver

any objections?

thanks again guys
 
hmm, thanks, you made me realize the rebates

20 off the psu
15 off the graphics card

so the total ends up being $545

now this is a great deal, so im torn between this or a decent laptop (college starts in june for me, and i have multiple jobs that a laptop would be nice for)

i wish everything was free :p
 
If you game more than anything, stick with a desktop. If you hardly play games, get a laptop.
 
Crath said:
hmm, thanks, you made me realize the rebates

20 off the psu
15 off the graphics card

so the total ends up being $545

now this is a great deal, so im torn between this or a decent laptop (college starts in june for me, and i have multiple jobs that a laptop would be nice for)

i wish everything was free :p
Click to expand...

Don't count the rebates just yet. It takes weeks after you receive everything before the rebate checks arrive, and there's no guarantee (especially now, with news of rebate-handling companies filing for bankruptcy) that you'll receive all of your rebate checks.

enginurd's advice about getting a laptop is also sound. Which is the greater priority for you: gaming or versatility?
 
I don't play games at all, thats the thing.

but i cant find a decent laptop for under 700
 
Then you may benefit more from a laptop. Check out the Dell Outlet, for refurbished laptops at lower-than-MSRP prices, or check out some bargain sites, like gotapex.com or techbargains.com, for some deals and/or specials.
 
Crath said:
I don't play games at all, thats the thing.

but i cant find a decent laptop for under 700
Click to expand...

If you don't game at all, then you only need the cheapest GPU. Even the HD3450 or 9400GT are a bit overkill. :p

You can find decent laptops for $650 - $750, you just have to keep your eyes peeled. My coworker recently (Aug.) picked up a Dell E1525 w/ T8400, 2GB RAM, 200GB HDD, WLAN.b/g, bluetooth, 1680x1050 15" trulife screen (this isnt even a choice anymore!), 9-cell battery, X3100 onboard video, and vista home premium for $680 shipped. I should have bought one, too, lol. Anyhow, keep an eye on the deal sites, like gotapex.com and slickdeals.net.
 
Think about getting two RAM sets, as it was said, you can install a RAMdisk and Photoshop will work on that rather than the HDD.

Adobe CS4 works with ATI Stream, so ATi or nVidia doesn't make a huge difference. A $115 Radeon 4830 outperforms the 9600GT.

If you don't game at all, then you only need the cheapest GPU. Even the HD3450 or 9400GT are a bit overkill.
Click to expand...
Even for Photoshop?
 
DragonMaster said:
... Even for Photoshop?
Click to expand...

Well, you could go even lower, is my point. The 8400GS is even cheaper than the 9400GT and will also provide extra computing power to CS4. I'm guessing even the onboard 8000/9000 GeForce series would also be able to speed up CS4.
 
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