HardOCP News
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Most people think self-driving cars are dangerous but have no problem riding around with a texting teen behind the wheel. 
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Most Motorists Think Self-Driving Cars Are 'Dangerous'
- Thread starter HardOCP News
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Semantics
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Yeah because we all know how undistracted and serious people are about driving.
Krenum
Fully [H]
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Only the ones that haven't been hit by drunk drivers think this.
Cmdrmonkey
Gawd
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Most people are complete morons when it comes to driving. I'd actually feel safer with machines driving cars than people.
I'd like to agree with you, but what will happen the first time someone dies because of a software glitch? Even worse, what if someone hacks or tampers with the software?
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could not agree more, especially down here, people can't drive worth a shift...
I would be less afraid of dieing due to a software glitch than:
getting hit by a drunk driver
getting hit by someone running a red light
getting hit by a stupid driver
getting hit by someone on the phone
getting hit by a stupid driver
getting hit by someone texting
getting hit by a trucker that fell asleep
getting hit by a stupid driver
etc
Maybe I should have been more clear: what are the legal ramifications? Is the car manufacturer/software programmer/etc criminally liable? Also, can you imagine the mass panic if actual malfeasance caused an accident?
jojo69
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yeah well...most motorists are terrifying
steakman1971
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I'd love to see self-driving cars someday. I wonder how many sensors are going to be required? It seems like we would be years away from having reliable technology.
No doubt, the legal system is totally unprepared for this. Software glitches, who is liable for wrecks, etc.
Think of the problems this could solve: DUI, sleepy motorists, texting/distracted drivers, etc.
Other social problems: jobs - taxi drivers, truck drivers. What happens to them? Speeding tickets - do the cars follow the speed limit? What happens to the lost "revenue" for cities that lose out on the tickets?
No doubt, the legal system is totally unprepared for this. Software glitches, who is liable for wrecks, etc.
Think of the problems this could solve: DUI, sleepy motorists, texting/distracted drivers, etc.
Other social problems: jobs - taxi drivers, truck drivers. What happens to them? Speeding tickets - do the cars follow the speed limit? What happens to the lost "revenue" for cities that lose out on the tickets?
OnStar could be hacked and remotely control all recent Chevrolet vehicles. GPSes could be hacked and tell everybody to go down a cliff. Internet connected radios could be hacked and play Brainwave Entertainment and put people to sleep.
Self driving cars could be hacked and be controlled from elsewhere. Anything could happen, but how are self driving cars any different from the above (especially OnStar)?
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Zarathustra[H]
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I'd trust a self driving car more than I would the average driver...
Yossarian22
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I haven't kept up with self-driving vehicles so I'm not sure they're ready... considering the state of computer vision, I'd say no.
However, there are ways around just pure computer vision for driving computation and I think there might be a lot of benefits, however, manual override would always be nice.
Consider the following:
At current technology and the variables of the road though is there no better person to respond to a potential accident than seasoned defensive driver. Been in some crazy stuff several times.
On the other hand, instead of hijacking planes, just hijack cars and trucks... right?
Anyway, I see the future having tighter urban sprawls and arcologies, where the only thing you'd be riding is personal fast transit/mass transit and the only thing being manually driven are personal mini-cars, bikes, loaders, et cetera...
Sorry car enthusiasts.
However, there are ways around just pure computer vision for driving computation and I think there might be a lot of benefits, however, manual override would always be nice.
Consider the following:
- Truckers who can put their trucks in self-drive mode to get more rest and reduce fatigue
- Assisted driving modes to teach teens/new drivers how to drive (statistically, young people really suck at driving)
- Self-drive modes for long highway trips where the road is predictable to lessen fatigue of drivers of the road trip
At current technology and the variables of the road though is there no better person to respond to a potential accident than seasoned defensive driver. Been in some crazy stuff several times.
On the other hand, instead of hijacking planes, just hijack cars and trucks... right?
Anyway, I see the future having tighter urban sprawls and arcologies, where the only thing you'd be riding is personal fast transit/mass transit and the only thing being manually driven are personal mini-cars, bikes, loaders, et cetera...
Sorry car enthusiasts.
sfsuphysics
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Not exactly a shocking result. People for the most part are control freaks, if we don't have direct control over situations they inherently feel more dangerous, in the same way roller coasters give us thrills because they feel dangerous even though they're attached to rails. Hell commercials airlines only have windows because people would feel too helpless if they can't at least observe the sky/clouds even though windows don't serve any other purpose except maybe to get a view of your destation when landing.
Hmm I must have missed that part of the survey where respondents said they were okay with that.
By the way I'd be curious how the following is handled by current driverless cars:
Driving in residential area, you see little kids playing on sidewalk. If you're an aware driver you also watch UNDER parked cars as you drive through your neighborhood in case you see any little feet walking towards the road obscured by the parked cars. You see footsteps under the car. Self driving car continues as it has no situational awareness, it detects nothing in it's path so it continues. Aware driver slows/brakes in advance, or anticipates child emerging from behind parked car. Same as with a ball rolling down a driveway, also obscured near the road by a parked car- kid is likely going to follow it. People over estimate just how complete the current sensor and driving technology is...it is very very raw. It can successfully drive under very ideal road conditions and not be at fault in accidents, but that's not the same as defensively driving and avoiding accidents completely.
I can understand the sentiment. Self driving car is a bt unnerving because you don't know what could go wrong, with a person driving you have ahuman able to react to odd instances that causes accidents.
But human drivers can suck BADLY, so even if self driving cars can be scary, I can't really imagine it being worst.
But human drivers can suck BADLY, so even if self driving cars can be scary, I can't really imagine it being worst.
Ashbringer
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My biggest worry is when the car says something like "First Law Disabled".
There's at least one situation I can recall where if I had been in a driverless car I would likely either be dead or seriously injured, so that's enough for me. There's a rural highway and some backgroads near my house, and one particular intersection is known for cars coming perpendicular to the highway overlooking their stop sign and passing right through the intersection. There's tall grass/wheat fields nearby which mostly obscures the perpendicular traffic. I was driving with the family and spotted the very top of a car approaching this intersection at high speed...and they did not appear to be slowing down at all. To a basic vision system the viewable portion of the approaching car would basically be indistinguishable from a bird. I dropped our speed considerably as this car approached and it freaking blew right through the intersection, completely oblivious. If I had maintained my path my family and I would have likely been T-boned in a very serious or fatal accident. I do not trust a driverless car to defensively drive better than an aware, experienced driver.
Let them drive for a month in Houston, where about 50% of the drivers on the road are first or second generation immigrants from countries that don't have a long driving culture, and the other 50% are talking on their cellphones or have the rear view mirror adjusted to brush their hair or touch up their lipstick.
I'll take hyper aggressive but organized German drivers any day of the week, where its unheard of not to use a blinker, make multiple lane changes, or to stay in anything but the right most lane when not passing.
I was just side-swiped by a guy that THANK GOD had insurance, spoke no English (how do you get a license if you can't read signs or obey police officer verbal instructions?), and get this... there was a car in front of me, he passed me on the right, then because traffic in front of him was slow tried to merge right into the side of me and said I was in his blind spot so he didn't see me (didn't see a car he just passed... think about that)... even though I had the fast reflexes to honk the horn and move over as far left while slowing down as possible. Told the officer (who luckily spoke Spanish) that not only did he not see me, but he didn't hear me either because he was listening to music. How friggen loud do people jam tunes? What about an emergency vehicle?
*sigh*
Luckily his insurance wrote me a check quickly no hassle and nobody was hurt, but I tell you man, every year its worse than the year before.
So automated cars don't have to be perfectly safe, they just have to be safer than the average Thai girl or 90 year old grandpa on his way to country kitchen to be an improvement on the status quo.
I'll take hyper aggressive but organized German drivers any day of the week, where its unheard of not to use a blinker, make multiple lane changes, or to stay in anything but the right most lane when not passing.
I was just side-swiped by a guy that THANK GOD had insurance, spoke no English (how do you get a license if you can't read signs or obey police officer verbal instructions?), and get this... there was a car in front of me, he passed me on the right, then because traffic in front of him was slow tried to merge right into the side of me and said I was in his blind spot so he didn't see me (didn't see a car he just passed... think about that)... even though I had the fast reflexes to honk the horn and move over as far left while slowing down as possible. Told the officer (who luckily spoke Spanish) that not only did he not see me, but he didn't hear me either because he was listening to music. How friggen loud do people jam tunes? What about an emergency vehicle?
*sigh*
Luckily his insurance wrote me a check quickly no hassle and nobody was hurt, but I tell you man, every year its worse than the year before.
So automated cars don't have to be perfectly safe, they just have to be safer than the average Thai girl or 90 year old grandpa on his way to country kitchen to be an improvement on the status quo.
defaultluser
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Or because they don't want to deal with the mountains of throw-up that people would spew from motion sickness every time the aircraft banked. Believe me, if I can't see the outside for reference when the plane is turning hard, I'd be chucking all over the place.
Same shit happens when people put on immersive VR headsets that are not totally synchronized with your movements. The difference here is that, rather than just wasting the time and money to accurately simulate the outside, the airline industry simply put holes in their metal cigars.
rat
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Your computer could be hacked and force you to post unfounded, hysterical hypotheticals on a forum....
blitzkommando
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On one hand, I really enjoy taking a drive through back roads. Put on some nice music (at a reasonable level), enjoy the scenery a bit, and enjoy the act of driving on a fun road with little traffic. That can be a great time.
On the other hand, 99% of my driving is not fun and is a great challenge because of the insanity I encounter daily from the other people in the streets. Whether they're driving, walking, biking, or what have you they are the greatest hazards I face driving. Not signaling is by far the most egregious problem. Yet, I also see this as the most difficult traffic for a driverless car to face: city traffic. It's chaotic, high paced, and simply highly variable. That said, I honestly don't see how a computer could be worse than the average driver that I see. Certainly computers would be less likely to tailgate and that alone would reduce my anger and frustration while driving, not to mention my anxiety when I'm a passenger.
On the other hand, 99% of my driving is not fun and is a great challenge because of the insanity I encounter daily from the other people in the streets. Whether they're driving, walking, biking, or what have you they are the greatest hazards I face driving. Not signaling is by far the most egregious problem. Yet, I also see this as the most difficult traffic for a driverless car to face: city traffic. It's chaotic, high paced, and simply highly variable. That said, I honestly don't see how a computer could be worse than the average driver that I see. Certainly computers would be less likely to tailgate and that alone would reduce my anger and frustration while driving, not to mention my anxiety when I'm a passenger.
I've never owned a GM vehicle, but the level of control OnStar has vs. the computer in a self driving car are night and day.
Again, I'm not saying I'm against them. I'm saying we have no legal framework for dealing with these and that the potential for hysteria is awfully high if/when something goes wrong. Look at how freaked out people are about ebola, and we've had what, two or three cases in the US?
I'm assuming your OnStar comment is hyperbole. OnStar and driverless cars are pretty far apart in capabilities.
Or the potential for mass death when the system drives 100 cars off the side of a mountain in rapid succession because of a "mistake" in where the road acutally is.
What about off road driving? What about natural disaster like hurricane or earthquake? The traffic signals are out, junk is all over the roads, or the ground has moved possibly meters from where it was an hour ago making all current GPS road maps... WRONG.
Shall we go on?
What about off road driving? What about natural disaster like hurricane or earthquake? The traffic signals are out, junk is all over the roads, or the ground has moved possibly meters from where it was an hour ago making all current GPS road maps... WRONG.
Shall we go on?
Ur_Mom
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ITT: Everyone is a bad driver, except for themselves of course.
I'm not the best driver, but when I'm on the road, I'm not so worried about getting into a wreck myself. I'm worried about the other guy wrecking into me. Hopefully, I can get out of the way.
I'm fine with automated drivers. My concern is that while automated cars are fine and can be predictable. I'm just not sure how they react to human drivers - defensive driving, avoiding a drunk/distracted driver, etc.. Like if a crash is unavoidable, does it rear end the school bus or does it crash into the ditch?
rat
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Yes, we shall go on... since you're completely avoiding other methods for driving that the current driverless cars use, such as cameras.
Everyone is making it sound like these cars are blind as a bat if they weren't using a data connection somehow when it's actually the opposite.
Everyone thinks they're a better than average driver. They're wrong.
Every argument against mentioned has been an engineering problem. Machines are very good a repetitive tasks, people - not so much. Self driving cars will be safer than the current system. They will be able to respond faster, look further ahead, and will talk to each other to preemptively avoid collisions. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if at some point down the road they even work together to track older cars and motorcycles.
Hell, even now there are working, in production and being sold automatic braking systems that will pick up and apply the brakes before the driver notices a problem, be it a pedestrian or traffic.
We all know people that find driving a chore, self driving cars will be perfect for them. As a gearhead and motorcyclist, I can't wait.
Every argument against mentioned has been an engineering problem. Machines are very good a repetitive tasks, people - not so much. Self driving cars will be safer than the current system. They will be able to respond faster, look further ahead, and will talk to each other to preemptively avoid collisions. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if at some point down the road they even work together to track older cars and motorcycles.
Hell, even now there are working, in production and being sold automatic braking systems that will pick up and apply the brakes before the driver notices a problem, be it a pedestrian or traffic.
We all know people that find driving a chore, self driving cars will be perfect for them. As a gearhead and motorcyclist, I can't wait.
The difference is a collision involves at least two parties meaning despite all the morons driving doing their makeup, texting, drinking, sleeping, etc, I somehow still made it to 53 years old and haven't been in one yet. Means no matter how fucked up the other driver is an alert competent driver can usually avoid an accident. It's the combination of the fucked up driver and a complacent sheeple oblivious themselves to the world around them that ends in shared disaster and grief.
I call Forbes to the stand to testify in my behalf.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/moneybuilder/2011/07/27/how-many-times-will-you-crash-your-car/
I am an aggressive driver and I don't drive a car that's a pig and can't respond to what I need it to do. Because I am aggressive I stay engaged in what is going on around me. All these "defensive driving" types automatically equate aggressive with careless and that is wrong thinking. Aggressive doesn't mean careless, it means aggressive. It means not complacent, not distracted, not asleep, not doing things other then what you are supposed to be doing, driving and staying out of trouble.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/moneybuilder/2011/07/27/how-many-times-will-you-crash-your-car/
I am 54, just how far do you try and stretch the "lucky"
I am an aggressive driver and I don't drive a car that's a pig and can't respond to what I need it to do. Because I am aggressive I stay engaged in what is going on around me. All these "defensive driving" types automatically equate aggressive with careless and that is wrong thinking. Aggressive doesn't mean careless, it means aggressive. It means not complacent, not distracted, not asleep, not doing things other then what you are supposed to be doing, driving and staying out of trouble.
Agreed, and in the end, they can't be initiative or predictive.
Add to that liability, just how is that going to work? Who is going to be responsible when an automatic car fuck's up and can't respond properly, how well will that lawsuit work out when it's you against the manufacturer? Better hope for a class action so you can get a sliver of what you should get because alone you are going to suck it.
Self driving cars have sensors to keep themselves on the road and avoid objects, they don't just rely on GPS and drive off cliffs like some drivers do
However, they still have a along way to go before self driving cars can safely drive around on city streets and avoid hitting stuff/people. I think we'll initially see them in controlled locations like on large company campuses. Next they will start switch carpool lanes to self driving lanes, and eventually most freeways will only allow self driving cars. As for residential streets, remote highways, etc. it will take a lot longer.
I'd love to be able to get on the freeway, press a button and kick back and watch a movie, nap, etc. while the car drives me to where I need to go. It would make much longer road trips practical, especially if you can have the car drive all night while you sleep. I think we'd see a noticeable drop in people taking airplanes on shorter trips.