Microsoft Served With Xbox 360 Lawsuit

This guy doesn't deserve a single game. Hell I am sure we all have lost a cd or two in a optical reader... so should we all go and sue? lol.


What a nutjob.

He needs a swift kick in the balls and a discount coupon for future purchases... hell... just a swift kick in the balls.
 
idividebyzero said:
I hope he wins because its unacceptable for a manufacturer to be so insanely stupid that they allow the lens of the laser to rise so far up that it hits the disc. The PS2 did this to a couple of my games when it cant read the data very well. Its completely ridiculous that something that stupid can happen and manufacturers can just get away with it.
Click to expand...

You do realize that the drives in the Xbox 360 are manufactured by another company (I believe it's LiteOn, now) based on one of their existing designs, right? In other words, if our DVD readers and burners aren't butting the laser lens right up against the disk then is the Xbox 360 really doing that?
 
Well, I for one, and Im sure all of you disagree, think that he is doing the right thing.

MS rushed the 360 and it suffered from several design flaws, overheating, power supply probloems, crashing problems, scratching discs to name a few.

Then they charge thier customers to fix the console, or to replace the damaged games.

Sure the 360 is a great console, but its not built great, and thier business practices are not great.

Now I know that 5 million is a drop of water in the ocean to MS, but it still sends a message.

Now ... granted Id rather see a class action lawsuit, than just a single guy sueing over 2 discs. Then it doesn't get dismissed as some crazy greedy guy looking for a handout.

Plus, its going to be a pain in the ass for the guy to sue MS, ... a serious pain. and he almost certainly knows that he will never win. I would guess that as I said he is doing it to make a point, so I actualy applaud him, myself haveing already had to pay for repairs on a practicly new console.

and lets not even get started on how long it took to get the unit back from MS .... MONTHS.

Ryan
 
Luthorcrow said:
Turn off Rush Limbaugh and take a deep breath.:D
Click to expand...
Huh?

Luthorcrow said:
I doubt that it will cost Microsoft much money to defend themselves against a baseless lawsuit. This would be a matter easily handled and dismissed in court by the in-house legal team. To imagine that this case would cost a few hundred thousand dollars to defend at minimum is pure hyperbole.
Click to expand...
Microsoft is sued several times each week. It has to respond to the suit, however baseless it is. If it doesn't, it opens itself to being at the wrong end of a default judgement. Any defendant has to assume that the case won't be dismissed, because if they do, they submarine their own defense.

While my monetary estimate is a guess, it isn't hyperbole. The in-house legal team isn't free just because they're in-house.
 
gopher0x said:
Well, I for one, and Im sure all of you disagree, think that he is doing the right thing.

MS rushed the 360 and it suffered from several design flaws, overheating, power supply probloems, crashing problems, scratching discs to name a few.

Then they charge thier customers to fix the console, or to replace the damaged games.

Sure the 360 is a great console, but its not built great, and thier business practices are not great.

Now I know that 5 million is a drop of water in the ocean to MS, but it still sends a message.

Now ... granted Id rather see a class action lawsuit, than just a single guy sueing over 2 discs. Then it doesn't get dismissed as some crazy greedy guy looking for a handout.

Plus, its going to be a pain in the ass for the guy to sue MS, ... a serious pain. and he almost certainly knows that he will never win. I would guess that as I said he is doing it to make a point, so I actualy applaud him, myself haveing already had to pay for repairs on a practicly new console.

and lets not even get started on how long it took to get the unit back from MS .... MONTHS.

Ryan
Click to expand...

5 million dollars in damages is complete and total bullshit. It's a frivilous lawsuit and I hope the judge throws that shit out like it should be. Something like this belongs in small claims court. This asshole is simply looking for a cash cow and had nothing better to sue about then two scratched games.

People like this greedy jerk-off need to quit wasting the court's time.
 
This kind of thing just boggles the mind. People that initiate frivolous lawsuits like this should be lynched for wasting tax payer dollars.
 
NeoNemesis said:
This kind of thing just boggles the mind. People that initiate frivolous lawsuits like this should be lynched for wasting tax payer dollars.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I also think the laws on this should change. I think people should be prosecuted for filing frivilous lawsuits like this. It really should be a crime.
 
GilmourD said:
You do realize that the drives in the Xbox 360 are manufactured by another company (I believe it's LiteOn, now) based on one of their existing designs, right?
Click to expand...

Man, that sucks. I've been using LiteOn drives in my computers forever, and I've never had a problem like that before. Guess I'm lucky?

mikeblas said:
Then why did you buy one?
Click to expand...

QFT, and a LMAO for good measure! :D
 
Here's what I do not get. It's documented that tilting the console while it is running will scratch the disc. How is he going to prove that he did not do that?
 
LeTUOtter said:
Man, that sucks. I've been using LiteOn drives in my computers forever, and I've never had a problem like that before. Guess I'm lucky?
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say you're lucky. I'd just say that I don't think that the laser lens is hitting the disks. That's a really frickin' dumb mistake to make on the part of the drive manufacturer since the motor shouldn't even have the range to move the lens that far and all the current drive OEMs have been making similar drives for a couple decades, now. I doubt that any engineer employed at these companies would make such a n00b mistake and another QC engineer wouldn't catch it. Anybody have actual proof that lenses are hitting disks?
 
GilmourD said:
I wouldn't say you're lucky. I'd just say that I don't think that the laser lens is hitting the disks. That's a really frickin' dumb mistake to make on the part of the drive manufacturer since the motor shouldn't even have the range to move the lens that far and all the current drive OEMs have been making similar drives for a couple decades, now. I doubt that any engineer employed at these companies would make such a n00b mistake and another QC engineer wouldn't catch it. Anybody have actual proof that lenses are hitting disks?
Click to expand...

Yeah, I guess I don't have much of a propensity to tip my computer over while I'm watching movies. *chuckles*
Sometimes people, even many people, will miss a mistake because it's just too darn obvious. Methinks this may have been the case.
 
I hate sue-happy people! Hey, I got a flat Dr. Pepper with my 12 pack, can I sue for $5 mil.?

Idiots!!
 
If i was the judge in this case, the guy would be awarded the cost to replace the two games (40 dollars + shipping), but he would also be required to pay all court costs for wasting my time.




5 MILLION dollars for damaging 100 dollars worth of games is ridicules
 
RadCliffeX said:
If i was the judge in this case, the guy would be awarded the cost to replace the two games (40 dollars + shipping), but he would also be required to pay all court costs for wasting my time.




5 MILLION dollars for damaging 100 dollars worth of games is ridicules
Click to expand...

Precisely my point. How you turn $100 worth of merchandise into 5 million dollars of pain and suffering I'll never know. You have to wonder what kind of ambulance chasing fucktard would take such a case?
 
Any good judge, after he has stopped laughing hysterically, will dismiss the case, without prejudice, and say he needs to go to small-claims court, and perhaps fine his lawyer for not telling him it's a small-claims case. Maybe, he'll grant a summary judgement in the amount a small claims judge would do and laugh as he still has to pay attorney fees for more than the judgement.


Yes, I have heard stories of some people getting their discs scratched from stray bits of plastic on the laser assembly not properly ground off in the manufacture process, with the unit sitting perfectly still. Sometimes a simple CD lens cleaner is all that is needed to fix it (I assume it knocks the plastic bit out of the danger zone). However, this guys frustration at having to pay MS for their defect is understandable. Nevertheless, the court costs and costs of replacement for the discs and perhaps the Xbox360 is all he is entitled to under the law as I understand it (I'm not an attorney).


The guy is an idiot in my opinion. He'll end up paying his sleazy lawyer considerably more than he's getting, if anything.
 
Dan_D said:
5 million dollars in damages is complete and total bullshit. It's a frivilous lawsuit and I hope the judge throws that shit out like it should be. Something like this belongs in small claims court. This asshole is simply looking for a cash cow and had nothing better to sue about then two scratched games.

People like this greedy jerk-off need to quit wasting the court's time.
Click to expand...

I'd have to agree with you on the 5 mil. Funny thing, I called Microsoft regarding Pinata Viva and asked If I could get replacement, they said it wouldn't be a problem at all. You just go to the website and you can send your old game in to get a replacement. I don't think there's any real fee for it, other than shipping. This of course is only for Microsoft published games. If it's from other publisher, they won't do that.
 
mikeblas said:
Microsoft is sued several times each week. It has to respond to the suit, however baseless it is. If it doesn't, it opens itself to being at the wrong end of a default judgement. Any defendant has to assume that the case won't be dismissed, because if they do, they submarine their own defense.

While my monetary estimate is a guess, it isn't hyperbole. The in-house legal team isn't free just because they're in-house.
Click to expand...
I never suggested that they not respond but i disagree with you suggestion that this would anyway be a costly suit to defend and have dismissed.

Frivolous lawsuits do not cost corporations large sums of money to defend. It is only the cases the either are genuine breaches of trust or have enough merit to warrant a settlement. Companies do not settle cases that are frivolous. Many companies do make settlements to avoid trails but in most cases they are avoiding a case they would lose or settle because the case has enough merit that a judge would not dismiss it. Do companies settle cases they could win, sure a lot of companies do if the numbers make sense. But this case clearly is not that kind of case.

I know it is popular to bash the legal system but lets keep some perspective.

P.S. The bulk of corporate legal work is contracts not lawsuits.
 
RTFA PLEASE.

The guy is not suing for $5,000,000 JUST for himself. He is suing for $5,000,000 with the expectation the court will accept this suit as a CLASS ACTION SUIT.

I always expect more from HardOCP'ers, and it is a rare day that I am disappointed, but today is one of those days.
 
I don't know much about class-action suits. How can they assign a dollar amount to the settlement before they know how many people are in the class, with how many games damaged?
 
mikeblas said:
I don't know much about class-action suits. How can they assign a dollar amount to the settlement before they know how many people are in the class, with how many games damaged?
Click to expand...

Estimate. Amend complaint later when more accurate figures come out.
 
Luthorcrow said:
P.S. The bulk of corporate legal work is contracts not lawsuits.
Click to expand...
In general, I'd agree. But specifically at Microsoft, there's lots of other crap going on. IP is obviously very big, and the company gets sued several times a month. Sometimes they get sued by their own employees. There's tons of immigration work, as well.
 
mikeblas said:
I don't know much about class-action suits. How can they assign a dollar amount to the settlement before they know how many people are in the class, with how many games damaged?
Click to expand...

arentol said:
RTFA PLEASE.

The guy is not suing for $5,000,000 JUST for himself. He is suing for $5,000,000 with the expectation the court will accept this suit as a CLASS ACTION SUIT.

I always expect more from HardOCP'ers, and it is a rare day that I am disappointed, but today is one of those days.
Click to expand...

Where the hell did you get the idea this is a Class-Action Lawsuit? I didn't see that in the article.
 
It's the last sentence of the second paragraph of the article.

SEATTLE -- A Florida man who claims Microsoft Corp.'s Xbox 360 scratches game discs has sued the company, saying the consoles are "negligently designed and manufactured."

In the lawsuit filed Monday in a Florida federal court, Jorge Brouwer says Microsoft has received thousands of complaints but has not replaced all scratched discs. The lawsuit seeks class-action status.
Click to expand...
 
It is in the article. Last setence of second paragraph.

A Florida man who claims Microsoft Corp.'s Xbox 360 scratches game discs has sued the company, saying the consoles are "negligently designed and manufactured."

In the lawsuit filed Monday in a Florida federal court, Jorge Brouwer says Microsoft has received thousands of complaints but has not replaced all scratched discs. The lawsuit seeks class-action status.
Click to expand...
 
zooraf said:
What would be sad about that? Why should Microsoft make a profit off of selling defective products to unsuspecting consumers?
Click to expand...

ahhh that statement makes me think about a story I heard a while back about car makers setting the computers in the cars nowadays to start going stupid after so many miles
 
Flyingcrazy said:
Some judge sued a dry cleaners for 57mil when they lost is favorite pair of pants, you can sue for anything these days.
Click to expand...

You can and always have been able to sue for anything. It's just that people are now starting to take advantage of that ability after hearing the crazy stories about people occasionally winning large amounts of money over stupid things.

Of course, such wins hardly ever actually happen. Remember the McDonald's lady who spilled coffee on herself? Few people know that McDonald's appealed and won, drastically reducing the amount of money awarded.

Sure. But the defendant in these cases has to suffer. They're paying legal bills to defend themselves, they might have problems giving up things during discovery, and so on. It'll cost the company a few hundred thousand dollars, at a minimum, and that's just in direct costs.
Click to expand...

Umm...no. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe a judge "throws a case out of court" when the plantiff's argument is so bad that the judge sees its flaws before a defense lawyer has a chance to point them out. Therefore, little or no defense is necessary.

Even if I'm wrong, Microsoft wouldn't need to spend close to "a few hundred thousand dollars" on a lawyer to defend this case. Heck, I could tear that guy's argument to pieces, and I'd do it for a couple hundred bucks.
 
mikeblas said:
With the legal climate in the United States, these days, why does anyone bother going into business?
Click to expand...
It's tough, that's for sure. All the legal crap you've gotta do to cover your ass is getting to the point it is ridiculous. Back in the good ol' days, people actually took responsibility for their own actions, and prices to consumers were lower because of it.

I know medical field is a big playground for this sort of thing, but I know a doctor friend of mine says he pays like $50,000 a year in malpractice insurance? That's ridiculous. And the bad part of it is, I'm sure that isn't the most expensive out there. Once again- the cost ultimately gets passed to the consumer, and drives prices for everything up.

If Microsoft sold these consoles that were known to fry after 2 months of regular usage, did nothing about it, and a class action suit was based on that: I'd understand it.
But when a company attempts (and does) fix the issues, it gets to the point where people abuse the legal system for any little thing they can find to sue about.

But scratched disks? Come on. DVD players for my TV, drives in my computer, console drives? They all scratch. It's the nature of the beast.
Most times when they do scratch is entirely due to user neglect as well (I've never had this be an issue for myself at all!)

As someone else has said- I'd be interested to see how he can prove he didn't scratch it by his own actions. It's well documented moving any drive while it is running can scratch a disk... And zero documentation to support his claim.

Blu_Haze said:
If this guy actually wins anything close to what he's asking for, I'm officially moving to canada out of embarrassment of our legal system. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
I might be right behind you...
Our legal system needs a rework.

Quick example... Family member died. Good sum of money there, supposedly had a locked down solid trust setup that was bullet-proof. A hand-written will mysteriously shows up after the death, throws everything into a 5 year legal ordeal. To this day, still not resolved...

Takes too damn long to administer justice. And then you deal with the shit like this, which could [probably] be attributed to why so much of the "major" items take too long (months and months between hearings? Ridiculous!)

Following into another quote...

Dan_D said:
Agreed. I also think the laws on this should change. I think people should be prosecuted for filing frivilous lawsuits like this. It really should be a crime.
Click to expand...

Exactly. People who waste everyone else's time (And ultimately- money) on crap like this need to be fined.
 
piako said:
The title of this thread is perfect. Does it make anyone else laugh?
Seriously it should be if you win you get 5 million dollars, if you loose you pay 5 million dollars to charity. That would fuck him over. :) :)
Click to expand...

Now there's an idea. Seriously though, one thing that we need is a law stating that the loser of a case must pay the other side's court costs. As I said, most of the coffee-spill cases get stopped in the appellate courts, but by then, the defendant has already spent a lot of money on court fees and lawyers.
 
idividebyzero said:
I hope he wins because its unacceptable for a manufacturer to be so insanely stupid that they allow the lens of the laser to rise so far up that it hits the disc. The PS2 did this to a couple of my games when it cant read the data very well. Its completely ridiculous that something that stupid can happen and manufacturers can just get away with it.
Click to expand...


huh!
 
arentol said:
RTFA PLEASE.

The guy is not suing for $5,000,000 JUST for himself. He is suing for $5,000,000 with the expectation the court will accept this suit as a CLASS ACTION SUIT.

I always expect more from HardOCP'ers, and it is a rare day that I am disappointed, but today is one of those days.
Click to expand...
I'm no expert in law. But I'm interested in knowing if lets say, he wins, will the 5 million all goes into his pocket?

If so, IMO it's ridiculous. How can two damaged dvd and a defective console cost a person to lose 5 million dollars.
 
gopher0x said:
Well, I for one, and Im sure all of you disagree, think that he is doing the right thing.

MS rushed the 360 and it suffered from several design flaws, overheating, power supply probloems, crashing problems, scratching discs to name a few.

Then they charge thier customers to fix the console, or to replace the damaged games.

Ryan
Click to expand...

You do know there is now a 3 year warranty for RROD, it costs you nothing to send it in for a repair (they even send you a box), and the fact that they refunded any costs that early owners had in getting consoles fixed?

MS offers all the repairs, etc. for free under warranty.

Also, I know tons of people that have 360s and not one of us has had an issue with our 360s and all of them are early units (knocks on wood!). Even at the gamestop store I bought mine from the manager was talking about how out of pallet loads of 360s they have sold, only 2 or 3 have come back for actual hardware issues.

Yes there are some design flaws, but welcome to the modern world of products. The manufacture is standing behind this product in this case though so it is less of an issue. There are plenty of products out there that you buy and if it craps out on you your SOL and the company will not do jack-sh*t. Or in most cases charge you to send it in/etc.



Also to those talking about the optical drives, there is no exclusive company that supplies the drives. Hitatchi, LG, Lite-On and others are in the 360s and it was one of the brands (cant remember which) early model that was in some 360s that caused the scratching issue. MS replaced the disks for free because of the issue and would also repair the 360s. The drives were quickly not used anymore in the new production runs (but obviously many already built units were already in retail channels so it took awhile to get over the "Scratching Disk" issue).
 
Grentz said:
Yes there are some design flaws, but welcome to the modern world of products.
Click to expand...

I strongly feel that no "console" user should have to deal with any of this. 360 is the only console out that has all of these problems (consistently having these problems). I can't think of a single console outside of the PS2 that has had these types of problems. PS2 being that it would have problems reading cds or dvds.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top