Microsoft Begs You to Stop Using Internet Explorer

Discussion in '[H]ard|OCP Front Page News' started by Megalith, Feb 9, 2019.

  1. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

    Messages:
    12,890
    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2006
    Microsoft’s security experts are calling on lazy businesses and organizations to send Internet Explorer where it truly belongs: the Recycling Bin. Enterprise users evidently remain enamored with the dead browser for its legacy web app support, but cybersecurity architects such as Chris Jackson warn they’re inadvertently racking up “technical debt,” creating problems down the line by targeting an obsolete product stuck on old, outdated standards. “It might be convenient to run old apps in IE, but it's safer, smarter and better long term to move to a modern browser.”

    Jackson laid out a scenario in which a company, choosing the easiest possible route since Internet Explorer 6, goes to make a webpage today and ends up using a 1999 implementation of web standards by default. Microsoft has tried to limit the technical debt accrued when using IE, including creating an Enterprise Mode for the browser back in 2014. Enterprise Mode lets websites render as they would in previous verisons of IE to avoid compatibility issues with old web apps. However, the best way to make sure you're not falling behind is by switching to a modern browser. Microsoft killed support for IE 8, 9 and 10 in 2016.
     
  2. TheOne&OnlyZeke

    TheOne&OnlyZeke 100% Irish

    Messages:
    10,017
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2000
    We have said issues in our org
    I would love to see the back of IE
     
  3. Stoly

    Stoly [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    6,128
    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2005
    Unfortunately there are plenty of sites that only work with IE. Heck even exchange control panel had lots of issues with Edge until recently.
     
    Armenius, blkt, Seelenlos and 3 others like this.
  4. Project_Nightmare

    Project_Nightmare Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    356
    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2006
    But it is the only browser that supports NPAPI on Windows. NVR systems are still using it because they are too lazy to switch to a newer plugin.
     
    Armenius and MavericK like this.
  5. stephen2002

    stephen2002 Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    142
    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2005
    I work for a large company that has IE11 as their only officially supported browser. Not just for legacy! Brand new web apps are being created today with IE11 support as a requirement.

    They can say whatever they want but what MS really needs to do is EOL it yesterday. Sadly MS won't. Their official stance is that the support is tied to Win 10. Since Win 10 is supposed to be the last OS that means who knows how many years from now IE11 will still be a thing. I can see a world with Chrome v100 and IEchromeium v20, who knows what version of Javascript we're on or what crazy web technologies the new browsers enable ... and corporations still wanting new sites with IE11 support because they have no real incentive to switch.
     
    Armenius and blkt like this.
  6. Spidey329

    Spidey329 [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,660
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2003
    Yeah, my NVR won't load on anything but IE. And it doesn't even necessarily like IE11, it wants an older version to be fully working.
     
    Armenius likes this.
  7. Lakados

    Lakados [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,172
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2014
    I am thankful that my higher ups have been working for the last 5 years to remove all those old legacy programs. Now I just have to convince my accounting department to bite the bullet and ditch our old AR/PR system (It runs on NT4) for something modern.
     
  8. Time2Kill

    Time2Kill [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,142
    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2005
    I still have IE installed for one reason, and that's to access my Windows Home Server. All of the remote desktop functions rely on Active X which only IE supports. Microsoft needs to STFU if they're not even going to provide fixes for their software.
     
    Armenius, blkt, Jim Kim and 3 others like this.
  9. The Mad Atheist

    The Mad Atheist Gawd

    Messages:
    834
    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2018
    IDK the last time I used IE, soooo ya, no problem MS.
     
  10. Galvin

    Galvin 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,637
    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2002
    Why don't they just remove it from your computer. They had no issues installing win 10 for you. Surely they can uninstall IE for you too
     
    Monkey34, SolidBladez and Jim Kim like this.
  11. nutzo

    nutzo [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,304
    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2004
    Still running an older version of Microsoft CRM, that only works fully on IE. (maybe the company will finally spend the money to upgrade it this year)
    Also some of the older equipment interfaces use Active-X and only work on IE.

    I'd be glad to get rid of IE, if I their modern browsers supported the older servers/equipment.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
    Armenius and blkt like this.
  12. viper1152012

    viper1152012 Gawd

    Messages:
    1,021
    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2012
    Just saying if they killes IE with a switch tomorrow, alot of retail would screech to a halt
     
    Armenius and blkt like this.
  13. sadsteve

    sadsteve Gawd

    Messages:
    525
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2010
    I stopped using IE years ago (along with most other Microsoft applications). About the only Microsoft applications I use regularly are robocopy and regedit.
     
    Jim Kim likes this.
  14. AtomClock

    AtomClock [H]Lite

    Messages:
    66
    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2018
    Microsoft... I'll make you a deal. I'll listen to what you want and stop using IE. Now, you listen to me and give me back windows 7!

    I think that is a fair trade.

    P.S. Win 10 would be ok too if you strip out all of the spy ware and put back in a proper desktop.
     
    blkt, Seelenlos, sadsteve and 4 others like this.
  15. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    9,891
    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2007
    So, a proper desktop is program manager and file manager, ala: Windows 3.1, right?
     
  16. trparky

    trparky Gawd

    Messages:
    910
    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2009
    What do you exactly mean by a "proper desktop"? I see a desktop, I see program windows on it, I see a taskbar. Yep, looks like a proper desktop to me.
     
  17. Loose Nut

    Loose Nut Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    352
    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
    We can't track and record your data as well in older IE please stop using it.
    also stop using cash, and please start using only your credit/debt card.

    you are causing us to loose millions off your data
     
    Armenius, clockdogg and Jim Kim like this.
  18. harbingerofdoom

    harbingerofdoom Gawd

    Messages:
    710
    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2007
    as with all other things microsoft... you are a number of years to late in asking me to stop using IE.
     
    Armenius and Jim Kim like this.
  19. harbingerofdoom

    harbingerofdoom Gawd

    Messages:
    710
    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2007
    not sure the term "proper desktop" is really what he was after as much as "i hate win10"


    i hate it too... but i just come out and say it. win10 sucks....
     
  20. GSDragoon

    GSDragoon [H]Lite

    Messages:
    95
    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2004
    Just release the source code and list of security issues not fixed. Make it an even bigger security risk than it already is. That will get people to stop real quick.
     
  21. Dekoth-E-

    Dekoth-E- [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,555
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2010
    Already on top of it MS. I use a modern browser, Firefox. I don't use garbage like IE, even if you renamed it edge.
     
  22. trparky

    trparky Gawd

    Messages:
    910
    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2009
    You're not going to get any argument from me on that one, Windows 10 sucks in a lot of ways. I will however say that since the original version of Windows 10 release almost four years ago, Windows 10 has seen a lot of improvements. Four years ago it was an absolute dumpster fire. Now? It's gotten a lot better but as many here know, it's still got a very long way to go.
     
  23. savagepagan

    savagepagan Gawd

    Messages:
    648
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2010
    Don't have to ask me twice.
     
  24. BloodyIron

    BloodyIron 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,349
    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Dear Microsoft,

    We can't.

    Thanks to your fucking tools like your CRM, SharePoint, and so much more, we are forced to use Silverlight. Guess what browser is the only browser that can still run Silverlight?

    Internet. Explorer.

    You made your bed, now lay in it.
     
    PestXs, Armenius, blkt and 2 others like this.
  25. BloodyIron

    BloodyIron 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,349
    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    It's also worth considering that Ubuntu/Linux has been improving at a rate faster than Windows.

     
  26. M76

    M76 [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,557
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2012
    It's the only browser that still supports JRE, so what can I do? I certainly don't want to use it, but edge, firefox, chrome, etc banned java.
     
    Armenius likes this.
  27. ReaperX22

    ReaperX22 Gawd

    Messages:
    624
    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2013
    This. Our entire national system is built around CRM and Sharepoint integration. We moved to Sharepoint 2016 whilst on Dynamics 365, and guess what? The integration between the two is broken! MS's own plugin doesn't work! Because we need to 'update' to the latest CRM version, which is of course another release, involving testing etc.. So the 2017 system we're using isn't actually compatible with the 2016 version of Sharepoint? What?

    Also I.E. being the only official browser being supported, Chrome just doesn't play nicely with Sharepoint/document integration.. So stupid.
     
    BloodyIron, Armenius and blkt like this.
  28. sadsteve

    sadsteve Gawd

    Messages:
    525
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2010
    Except after trying to update 4 of my desktops to the 1809 release, only 2 of them successfully updated. The other 2 machines just told me it failed to update, no error codes, nothing. I had to do fresh installs. It sure doesn't feel like it got better too me.
     
  29. blkt

    blkt Gawd

    Messages:
    642
    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    If you need NPAPI support there's always Waterfox and Pale Moon.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2019
    Armenius likes this.
  30. sephkeene

    sephkeene [H]Lite

    Messages:
    95
    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2007
    Without support for Java, we're totally stuck using IE. We're actually looking at moving off of Oracle to an open source solution for reasons like this...
     
    Armenius likes this.
  31. IndyColtsFan

    IndyColtsFan Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    245
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Same with SharePoint. Microsoft rushed Edge out of the door instead of making it a truly Enterprise-capable browser. And while the guy quoted in the article is absolutely correct about technical debt, it generally isn’t cheap or simple to rewrite enterprise applications on the scale necessary to eliminate IE. I remember in the early to mid 2000s, Oracle (aka Obstacle) was responsible for my company remaining on IE 6 for YEARS even after IE 9 (IIRC) was the current version.
     
    Armenius and blkt like this.
  32. Pyro411

    Pyro411 [H]Lite

    Messages:
    88
    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2009
    Another hat in the bucket for websites that won't work with anything but Internet Explorer are State & Federal websites, especially those on the employee side of things. To make matters worse getting them to do stuff like re-signing Java Applets so newer versions of Java work, or even so they just stop spitting out expired certificate warnings can take forever... one of which is at least 22 months past expiration with numerous tickets put in for them to fix it. :S Ahh the joys lol.
     
    Armenius likes this.
  33. Dodge245

    Dodge245 [H]Lite

    Messages:
    98
    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2018
    surely have the apps moved to use HTML5 instead? (looking at latest implementations of vCentre Console)
     
  34. Stoly

    Stoly [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    6,128
    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2005
    And lets not forget Silverlight. Our company uses it for its portal.
     
  35. NoOther

    NoOther [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    6,118
    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    I am confused, all browsers still support Java. If you are speaking specifically about applets, that is a different issue. Applets were pretty dumb to begin with.
     
  36. sephkeene

    sephkeene [H]Lite

    Messages:
    95
    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2007
    IE is the only browser that supports the Java Plugin. Oracle Forms application front end for Oracle database runs on Java. Without java, none of our applications work. Hence, we have to use IE for our applications...
     

    Attached Files:

  37. shad0w4life

    shad0w4life Gawd

    Messages:
    679
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    new browsers SUCK in corporations

    Hey here's a system that has amazing robust functionality that houses all our records and allows you to search their content in a matter of seconds to locate that Legal file you wanted without someone manually reading thousands of pages.


    Oh you want the filename to match the title someone added? Can't do that because we are using Chrome and Edge that phased out Java and the useful functionality it brought, I get for security reasons, but it's like they don't even care about thin clients, the push now is going to be thick clients to restore functionality of software because browsers are horrible. Chrome and it's stupid cache can die in a horrible fire.
     
  38. M76

    M76 [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,557
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2012
    Java != javascript.

    And dumb or not dumb it's not a choice. It's a service I use. And no, there is no alternative.
     
  39. NoOther

    NoOther [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    6,118
    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    I don't understand your point here. There are many ways to use Java with websites. There are definitely alternatives. For reference, I work on a team that develops both Java and Javascript for Web Applications on all modern browsers.
     
  40. trparky

    trparky Gawd

    Messages:
    910
    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2009
    That's why I put emphasis on "a long way to go" because it's true, Windows 10 has a long way to go if Microsoft wants Windows 10 to be as stable and trouble-free as Windows 7 is. Unfortunately with these twice-a-year huge updates and them changing stuff under the hood all the damn time it may take years to approach the stability of Windows 7.