Microsoft Admits Normal Windows 10 Users Are "Testing" Unstable Updates

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by Megalith, Dec 15, 2018.

  1. mda

    mda [H]ard|Gawd

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    Not entirely sure what Win10 updates are doing.

    I've had several Win10 Pro in our organization that randomly BSOD'ed last week, including my home PC.

    All probably update related. Some of them were on the semi annual channel, too.
     
  2. Mega6

    Mega6 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Yeah I’m on semiannual targeted channel and this garbage is still being pushed.
     
  3. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    This is dumb. Check for updates should do exactly the same thing as auto install does (and if there's not a way to opt out of optional updates by default, there should be one).

    I'm a big proponent of auto installing security updates on non-business computers, but B/C doesn't sound like security patches.
     
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  4. naib

    naib [H]ard|Gawd

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    does MS really wonder why people were not installing patches/updates/servicePack's pre-windows10... This is WHY! Microsoft cannot be trusted
    The irony is too much, MS didn't like it that people were not installing patches and then their behaviour when they fully controlled the patches vindicated why people did not trust microsoft with the patches.
     
  5. Dead Parrot

    Dead Parrot 2[H]4U

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    A lot of data breeches happen via compromised workstations. The old word macro, exe email attachment, pdf with executable code type stuff. The type of crap being current on OS security patches might prevent if folks weren't choosing between loading spyware via patch or spyware via malware.
     
  6. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    People did not do it because they did not realize that they should do it. It was left up to them and most home users and many SMB users did not update their systems. Therefore, virus and malware type stuff spread a lot easier.
     
  7. naib

    naib [H]ard|Gawd

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    and now it isn't left up to them and MS is clearly showing why it should not be left up to them: no QA, using machines as beta machines ....
     
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  8. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I disagree People didn't do it, because they never thought about it. I had friends and some co-workers (all engineers) that just never got around to it. In the case of friends, it wasn't uncommon to have 6 months or more of uninstalled patches and I can promise you it had nothing to do with patch quality. Co-workers didn't do it, because they didn't feel like taking the time to install them and reboot the computer (though eventually the company forced patches after about a week).

    If you're worried about a bad patch, you wait a week or 2 and see what issues have popped up, not 6 months.
     
  9. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    They're not fucking qualified to determine if they should or not. MS did this, because every time there was an attack based on a vector that was patched 6 months or a year earlier, they got shit for it. They need to stop forcing non-security patches when you click check for updates. And since apparently other users are having issues with patches, they need to come up with better testing, but forcing security patches should continue for non-enterprise systems.
     
  10. mda

    mda [H]ard|Gawd

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    I can't wait for some 3 letter USA government agency's critical Win10 machine to BSOD or update at some inopportune time...

    A fuckup that big will make MS shape up on its update policy.
     
  11. Mega6

    Mega6 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Enterprise organizations typically have the patches tested internally and then push them out via their own Wsus servers. Not relying on internet updates.
     
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  12. Uvaman2

    Uvaman2 2[H]4U

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    Let's not mix the reason of automatic updates with the sleazy move of making beta testers out of people that press a button... All updates should be equally ready as much as humanly possible. If they want to put a beta channel update button so be it.
     
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  13. Mega6

    Mega6 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Linux provides
    -a stable update pathway (fedora stable)
    -update security patches only.

    MS just wants control because we all know most windows users aren’t smart enough do update their computers properly and should just stay on their apple and android phones.
     
  14. DeathFromBelow

    DeathFromBelow [H]ardness Supreme

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    There's a complete fix for all Windows update issues right here.
     
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  15. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    No major business or government organization is running anything other than Enterprise, and AFAIK, they control when patches are applied. The good IT shops are testing the patches in their environment before the patches are sent out to individual PCs.
     
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  16. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Isn't that what the Fast Track is supposed to me? I generally find a reason to defend MS, but on this one, there's no excuse.
     
  17. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    True, but then i'd have to run ubuntu ;)
     
  18. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    Oh look a Windows post! Time for me to tell everyone how I use Linux!
     
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  19. Executioner

    Executioner Limp Gawd

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    I'm typing this message on Linux Mint 18.3. I love the way Linux Mint does updates. The Linux Mint Update Manager is designed to avoid (inexperienced) users from installing updates that require a certain level of experience and knowledge. The update Manager categorizes all updates into 5 levels. By default, level 1 to 3 are selected for updating, level 4 and 5 are deselected and won't be updated. Furthermore, each level can be set as safe and visible by selecting or deselecting these options. in addition to above, all updates are being checked by the developers team before being released. https://sites.google.com/site/easytipsforlinux/linux-mint-update-manager-explained
     
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  20. naib

    naib [H]ard|Gawd

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    And as evidence has shown, neither is Microsoft. " Mmm should we push this unverified patch out?... Sure why not"
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2018
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  21. mufcfan

    mufcfan Limp Gawd

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    Yeah, the targeted IS where the beta stuff comes. Try switching to the non-targeted channel and see if it STILL gets pushed to you.
     
  22. Dr. Righteous

    Dr. Righteous 2[H]4U

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    I bought a new laptop a few months ago and I can confidently say that windows10 is the biggest pile of $hit I've put my hands on.
    Had to hack the registry the OS to stop the annoying Cortana interference. Then the constant windows updates made it the totally useless. Had to hack it again to stop the constant updates. If there was driver support for windows 7 I would ditch window 10 in a second.

    The wife has a company provided laptop with win10 and after an update the wifi just quit working. I poked drivers at it, still no dice. I installed Ubuntu on it in a dual boot. Works 100%. No issues with the wifi connection at all.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2018
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  23. GNUse_the_force

    GNUse_the_force Limp Gawd

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    You say that but with the way MS has moved towards cloud based services and continues to do so, i can't see how a forum like this would exist in the same capacity if we all just log into a thin client attached to a "MS certified compatible" monitor to Windows 11 Cloud 365. Linux, like it or not keeps the possibility of Hardware and gaming on the edge and staves of 'cloud everything' for longer.

    If you look at how MS has embraced Linux this last two years ( not posting the extensive list of articles here ) it looks more and more like that when windows finally moves to 90% cloud then that cloud OS will in fact be called windows but run a Linux kernal.
     
  24. DeathFromBelow

    DeathFromBelow [H]ardness Supreme

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    Oh I know. I've been saying for some time that I'm expecting to see a desktop 'Azure OS.' The recent update disasters show just how bad a shape the Windows team is in right now. The 1809 update was so bad it even accidentally deleted our beloved Heatlesssun chatbot.

    I switched a couple years ago and I've been very happy with Mint and Ubuntu. Desktop Linux isn't a hobby OS like it was a decade ago.
     
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  25. GNUse_the_force

    GNUse_the_force Limp Gawd

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    It might be too late to steer the ship for Linux to become the primary PC gaming platform.

    Potentially Gaming, home office and even productivity ( cloud compute ) could start to make waves when you can buy an entire easy to use 'PC' thin client for $50 all running through MS / Google / Apple services and it performs almost the same, who knows they might even supply the display as part of the premium subscription. All the pieces of the puzzle are in place from an infrastructure perspective, only limited by people's internet speed and 'refocusing' people's expectation on how a PC (thin client) looks and connects. But speeds increase..

    I hope it's not the case for a good long while but it does seem like all the big tech companies are chomping at the bit to get everyone into that usage / subscription model.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2018
  26. nightfly

    nightfly 2[H]4U

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    I'll be honest; whenever I think about updating windows in any way, all I can think of, is, how are they going to try to fuck me this time? Not, will this close any security holes, not will this resolve a potential compatibility problem. Not how does this make windows better. Just, how are they going to fuck me over again, and will I be kicking myself for doing this update and wind up spending a couple of hours having to reinstall windows and everything else again for some stupid reason 'just trust microsoft, they know better than you do' even though time and time again, that turned out not to be true. And yes, I use some software that will only run on windows.
    When DOS 6 came out with doublespace and cost me an entire weekend, I will remember that for the rest of my life and just thinking of it probably pushes my blood pressure up about 20 points. Then all the debacles since.
     
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  27. GNUse_the_force

    GNUse_the_force Limp Gawd

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    Better than being the cattle.

    :p
     
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  28. DeathFromBelow

    DeathFromBelow [H]ardness Supreme

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    Vegans? I keep seeing a bunch of Windows cucks trying to rationalize paying for the privilege of desktop ads and broken updates. Sad!

    Make the PC great again: switch to Linux. :)
     
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  29. Todd Walter

    Todd Walter Gawd

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    Naw, that'd be Arch users!
     
  30. SlipperyPete

    SlipperyPete Gawd

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    Went Apple just to escape the Windows 10 disaster...
     
  31. Mega6

    Mega6 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Win7 cheaper
     
  32. DogsofJune

    DogsofJune 2[H]4U

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    I couldn't bring myself to dual boot. Separate OS's, separate boxes. Current setups, three Win 10 and two Linux. Statistically, I'm covered when I "need" a system to do stuff. One of these sumbich's has to work..... Diversify son, no chicken in one basket.



    It's good to know now what Microsoft is doing. My ol x79 with 4820k was forced to reinstall windows 10 twice, because I manually updated with it. I thought it was getting to be a buggy box due to age. Nope, just a newb at the keyboard. A warning would have been nice. I will refrain from subjecting the thredripper, 3770k, and i3 boxes from manually updates.
     
  33. IcePickFreak

    IcePickFreak [H]ard|Gawd

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    I'm still on Win 7 and deal with stuff on XP & even NT. But I just do dumb shit like CAD/CAM with computers where there's no Linux support (I know, excuses.) I have come across 1 mill with controls running on Linux though, which honestly is a good way to go for that. It will be interesting to see where this industry goes in the future.

    That said, let us know how much of you're Steam library works under Linux so we can get back to filling out our Windows Thread Bingo Cards.
     
  34. polonyc2

    polonyc2 [H]ard as it Gets

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    does this only apply to the major updates (Creator's Update, Anniversary Update etc) or every Patch Tuesday updates as well?
     
  35. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Moooooooooo........ :D :p
     
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  36. katanaD

    katanaD [H]ard|Gawd

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    Was working last week via VPN when all the sudden the VPN connection died and it said to restart to clear it up.. restart system.. windows updates.. LOL

    its always nice of MS to force me to take breaks in the middle of a work day

    thanks for thinking of me!!!!

    :rolleyes:(y)
     
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  37. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Stop it. If you can't figure out how to use google to shut off any ads (though even those aren't really ads), then you're incapable of using linux. You are capable of using linux, so stop trolling.
     
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  38. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    What was the BSOD message/number?
     
  39. DeathFromBelow

    DeathFromBelow [H]ardness Supreme

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    That doesn't really help when Microsoft just resets your settings every few months, assuming they don't also delete your user data or put your PC in an endless BSOD loop while they're reinstalling Candy Crush.

    Climb a Tree.png

    I was a Windows supporter, even in the Vista days when people were constantly posting misinformation and stupid shit about UAC and the like. Windows 8 and 10 are garbage and Microsoft refused to listen to feedback, so I found a better solution.

    Telling me to shut up isn't going to fix the problems or make me stop encouraging people to get away from Windows. Even if they ever manage to release a proper successor to 7 I doubt I'll be coming back.
     
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  40. mda

    mda [H]ard|Gawd

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    Didn't take notice. On my personal machine, I was in too much of a hurry to get my next task done that I just hard reset the PC.

    I'd like to add that I chalked it up to user error until my own PC did it - nothing new on it except updates.