Linux Faster?

[jb_hafo]

well, in Win98 I had so many programs installed that, if I wanted to play music, I would
not know which one to click. The programs menu showed often the Shareware-Author and
not the program name. I spent weeks putting everything into a ledger.
.........
in Freebsd, it is
cd /usr/ports/audio
ls -lac | lookat
...shows all the audio programs (also avail, multimedia in a different folder)
installable. (multimedia would be in /usr/ports/multimedia/ ) ... "freebsd style"
rather than "unix style, " that is, they can be deinstalled by
#pkg_delete -f /var/db/pkg/[programname]...
(a difference why Freebsd might be faster in some respects than both
windows and linux and unix...)
........
and on my system,
cd /usr/ports/audio
find . -type d -name work
...........
would show all the installable ones that I've already installed
............
(cli's maybe tweakable for authenticity)

 

[synaptical]

You are comparing a gutted out Linux distro. Now go do the same thing with Ubuntu vs Vista and get back to me.

Where are you getting that idea? That wasn't "gutted out," the guy just changed things like reducing the number of ttys in /etc/inittab, stripping out raid/lvm/encrypted partition scripts, backgrounding some services, etc.

 

[AbJ32]

Are you sure you mean Gnome? KDE is far thicker and more closely resembles Windows in it's complexity. Gnome is thinner and is quicker and takes up far less memory to run than KDE or Windows (be it Vista or XP).

Yes, I mean GNOME. I wouldn't have said GNOME if I didn't.

As far as having programs that NEED to run natively. Same thing goes for avid Linux users. There's many programs that absolutely have no Windows counterpart. So really it comes down to which programs you prefer.

Okay, but in my situation, it's a matter of programs that don't have Linux counterparts, so that point doesn't really help my situation or the situation of many others.

The reason to switch is a completely different argument. The main reason I find is operating my computer with a different mindset. Money is a apart of it. However the ability to learn new and old technologies without spending globs of money on something that really is public knowledge I find to be priceless. It truly is freedom.

I have already learned a fair bit of Linux. It's really just a matter of 'Do I use Linux or Windows for my main computing needs?' Considering all factors there are to consider, there really is no sense in me switching. It's not happening.

 

[heatlesssun]

Are you sure you mean Gnome? KDE is far thicker and more closely resembles Windows in it's complexity. Gnome is thinner and is quicker and takes up far less memory to run than KDE or Windows (be it Vista or XP). As far as having programs that NEED to run natively. Same thing goes for avid Linux users. There's many programs that absolutely have no Windows counterpart. So really it comes down to which programs you prefer. The reason to switch is a completely different argument. The main reason I find is operating my computer with a different mindset. Money is a apart of it. However the ability to learn new and old technologies, without spending globs of money on something that really is public knowledge, is truly priceless. It truly is freedom.

So what do you use that on a *NIX system that doesn't exist on Windows? Just curious. I could see things dealing with the UI and that sort of thing but as far as applications proper I would think that saying many would be a stretch, definitely most all of the good FOSS runs on Windows.

Also, gobs of money to use Windows? Thats malarkey. I personally spend about $2000 a year on software, but the bulk of that is games and some mobile apps as well. Things like TMPGEnc 4.0 XPress and AnyDVD, so development tools like MyEclipse and Enterprise Architecht which are cross platform and the cost the same amount money to run on Linux legally as well, which costs money on Linux as well.

As for Windows and Office I get that through MSDN for free from work, but you can get ten copies of each for $350 from TechNet, and you can always find sales.

But heck you could just go with the same FOSS that's on Linux in Windows and pretty pay for nothing except the OS which you would likely have on a computer anyway which cost added about $50 to the cost of the machine.

My point is that you don't have to spend money on Windows. But if you spend some money there are some awesome tools out there that just don't exist in the FOSS world, at least not powerful and straight forward like TMPGEnc 4.0 XPress. That tool cost me $100 and I've actually done a couple of projects for people where with a few mouse clicks paid for itself.

 

[Boomslang]

I'm starting to wonder if it's possible to run Linux without being an "elitist snob."

Is it?

And if so, how?

 

[xorbe]

find engineers like me that have to use both daily, and we'll tell you they both suck. freaking exchange. damn nfs.

 

[heatlesssun]

find engineers like me that have to use both daily, and we'll tell you they both suck. freaking exchange. damn nfs.

So what's better?

 

[XOR != OR]

find engineers like me that have to use both daily, and we'll tell you they both suck. freaking exchange. damn nfs.

While I agree; NFS is a bit wonky, I do enjoy using linux more than windows ( I administrate both on a daily basis ). Probably because I use linux for tasks which it excels at ( simple tasks, automation of tasks ), and windows for what it excels at ( ms office, groupwise..yes I know.. )

So what's better?

Subjective; both have their strengths and weaknesses. Many administrative tasks are easier to accomplish, and thus more efficient, on linux. Like file sharing, for example. While there are downsides, the command line tools in linux far make up for any downsides ( again, in my opinion which is based on user habits ).

 

[requiemnoise]

While I agree; NFS is a bit wonky, I do enjoy using linux more than windows ( I administrate both on a daily basis ). Probably because I use linux for tasks which it excels at ( simple tasks, automation of tasks ), and windows for what it excels at ( ms office, groupwise..yes I know.. )
Subjective; both have their strengths and weaknesses. Many administrative tasks are easier to accomplish, and thus more efficient, on linux. Like file sharing, for example. While there are downsides, the command line tools in linux far make up for any downsides ( again, in my opinion which is based on user habits ).

These are very good educational repsonses. Notice, people who use both platforms offer more interesting opinions? Of course, end users who only LOVE windows always yell... "Are you Linux users, you are TROLLS, because we are too fucking dumb to give you good answers. TROLLS! That is only word I like to repeat all day, TROLLS!" If their boss give them a raise, they yell, "TROLLS." Where is that Jon55 dude when we need him? Every 10 words he says is "TROLLS!"

 

[heatlesssun]

These are very good educational repsonses. Notice, people who use both platforms offer more interesting opinions? Of course, end users who only LOVE windows always yell... "Are you Linux users, you are TROLLS, because we are too fucking dumb to give you good answers. TROLLS! That is only word I like to repeat all day, TROLLS!" If their boss give them a raise, they yell, "TROLLS." Where is that Jon55 dude when we need him? Every 10 words he says is "TROLLS!"

No I don't use Linux daily but enough to understand that it has its strengths. Open minded Windows dominant users freely admit Linux's strengths from a desktop perspective compared to Windows

1) Lower acquisition costs

2) Superior customization

3) Better security

4) Better performance on lower end hardware

5) A VERY passionate community

Now for Windows strengths

1) Windows is the richest desktop environment in existence today. Simply put combine the hardware, software and mind share support of Windows and there's no comparison to any other desktop OS.

2) Easier to use for non-technical people


These are very fair and educated bullet points I believe.

 

[XOR != OR]

No I don't use Linux daily but enough to understand that it has its strengths. Open minded Windows dominant users freely admit Linux's strengths from a desktop perspective compared to Windows

1) Lower acquisition costs

2) Superior customization

3) Better security

Eh. Security has always relied on the user, so I don't think this point is valid; or if it is, it's because the type of user inherent to linux.

4) Better performance on lower end hardware

5) A VERY passionate community

Now for Windows strengths

1) Windows is the richest desktop environment in existence today. Simply put combine the hardware, software and mind share support of Windows and there's no comparison to any other desktop OS.

Richest is subjective; one could easily say the same of linux and the various window managers out there.

Better way to say this might be, "Largest install base"

2) Easier to use for non-technical people


These are very fair and educated bullet points I believe.

 

[requiemnoise]

Eh. Security has always relied on the user, so I don't think this point is valid; or if it is, it's because the type of user inherent to linux. Richest is subjective; one could easily say the same of linux and the various window managers out there.

Better way to say this might be, "Largest install base"

I don't know. I think he has few valid points in few areas. Security is superior in Linux. Come on. It isn't only the end users. Microsoft's idea of security doesn't feel logical to me. I think they can do away with annoying the end users. Prompting isn't a solution. The flat file concept of Unix makes locking down each files to even layers configuration with an ease. Remember, DOS clients of the 80s were easily locked down with file permissions by applying permissions to each file configurations if they were running off the server. In Linux, not every configuration files in their home directory should be owned by the users. Also, Linux does have annoying SELINUX (US govt implementation) and Apparmor (Novell), which are less annoying to users, but annoying as hell for admins to configure. However, knowledgeable sysadmin can easily lock down the machine without using those tools. You are also forgetting that major vulnerability fixes are within 24hrs for some Linux distros. I never seen Microsoft issue a security fix within 24hrs. Don't forget even KDE is a lot lighter than the latest Microsoft graphical libraries.

MS's market share is still insane. Yea, Ms partnership with PC vendors are insane. That is how the business works. You need partnerships based around money to succeed. Linux will never have that.

 

[kac77]

Yes, I mean GNOME. I wouldn't have said GNOME if I didn't.

OK you mean Gnome. It just means you have no idea what you are talking about. I was giving you an opportunity to correct yourself. But if you don't want to then by all means have at it Hoss. Gnome is thinner than XP especially Vista. Its a fact whether you produce 10,000 posts, or not, it won't change it and I'm not going to try to save you from hoisting your own petard. If you want to market Windows on a forum by all means go for it.

Gnome if compiled by itself along with kernel takes up 1.8 Gigs of hard drive space ... that's it. In memory of daily use it hovers below 256 megs (only non SP versions of Windows XP could claim such a thing). Do you want to guess how fast an Intel chip loads an operating system of that size into memory? 12 seconds or less. So the fact that you hobbled around a default install of Linux and had no idea of it's capabilities makes your argument of Gnome being slower than Vista, which takes up 1 GB of memory by itself, seem all the more an example of the rantings of a noob trying to play in a sandbox without the knowledge of the earth which supports it.

Okay, but in my situation, it's a matter of programs that don't have Linux counterparts, so that point doesn't really help my situation or the situation of many others.

There are counter parts for just about everything you want to do. It just takes time, which if that was your argument I would concede but it's not. Your argument is that Linux lacks variety to be considered "ready" for the average user, which is something someone would say if they spent all of a day with an operating system instead of the amount of time you've spent with Windows and still not understand the complexities of which of what makes it go.

Games OK there's an argument to be made there. But I'm not defending that. I'm defending the 80% of users, not me or you, that just need to be able to use their computer to enhance their lives without going broke, Want to get on the Internet ? You'd have to be a fool to pay money for just that experience. Want to play music ? Again if you are paying money for something that's been around since configuring bat files to increase high mem apart from contingent memory you are insane. Want to check email ? If you want to pay $100 plus dollars for a collection of protocols that have been around since Terminal was a separate install and Prodigy was considered a "break through" then by all means open your wallet.

I have already learned a fair bit of Linux. It's really just a matter of 'Do I use Linux or Windows for my main computing needs?' Considering all factors there are to consider, there really is no sense in me switching. It's not happening.

Ok that's your personal preference and it's valid, after all only you can do you. But considering the thread is about which is faster, you could have said "I don't like Linux" and moved on instead of typing a eulogy of your capacity.

Something that short and sweet would have made me retort with a simple ...OK. Obviously I'm done with playing "my e-penis is bigger than yours" if you want to correspond on the topic (Linux Faster?) at hand then I'm more than willing to have a meaningful discussion. I just don't do trolling or talking about something that's covered in an alternate thread more suitable for the point you are trying to make.

 

[XOR != OR]

I don't know. I think he has few valid points in few areas. Security is superior in Linux. Come on. It isn't only the end users. Microsoft's idea of security doesn't feel logical to me. I think they can do away with annoying the end users. Prompting isn't a solution. The flat file concept of Unix makes locking down each files to even layers configuration with an ease. Remember, DOS clients of the 80s were easily locked down with file permissions by applying permissions to each file configurations if they were running off the server. In Linux, not every configuration files in their home directory should be owned by the users. Also, Linux does have annoying SELINUX (US govt implementation) and Apparmor (Novell), which are less annoying to users, but annoying as hell for admins to configure. However, knowledgeable sysadmin can easily lock down the machine without using those tools. You are also forgetting that major vulnerability fixes are within 24hrs for some Linux distros. I never seen Microsoft issue a security fix within 24hrs. Don't forget even KDE is a lot lighter than the latest Microsoft graphical libraries.

Security isn't about what tools are available, it's about the weakest link, which is the end user everytime.

Both MS and linux provide a platform with a remarkable number of tools and concepts related to security; the variable is always the end user. To put it another way, as a windows admin, I am confident I can lock down a windows box as tightly as I might a linux box.

 

[heatlesssun]

Eh. Security has always relied on the user, so I don't think this point is valid; or if it is, it's because the type of user inherent to linux. Richest is subjective; one could easily say the same of linux and the various window managers out there.

Better way to say this might be, "Largest install base"

Linux is simply more secure on the desktop because it simply doesn't get targeted liked Windows. I'm not saying this is the only reason but it's a big one and I think that its not even much of a debating point these days.

When I said richest desktop environment I was not talking about OS GUI's but the TOTAL sum of what's out there for the OS. Games, Blu-Ray, bluetooth devices, media players, mobile phones, support, what have you.

 

[kac77]

So what do you use that on a *NIX system that doesn't exist on Windows? Just curious. I could see things dealing with the UI and that sort of thing but as far as applications proper I would think that saying many would be a stretch, definitely most all of the good FOSS runs on Windows.

There's just too many to name. I'm sorry but that's a lot of data to compile. If you have the time open up a package manager in a Linux distro and look at what's available.

Also, gobs of money to use Windows? Thats malarkey. I personally spend about $2000 a year on software, but the bulk of that is games and some mobile apps as well. Things like TMPGEnc 4.0 XPress and AnyDVD, so development tools like MyEclipse and Enterprise Architecht which are cross platform and the cost the same amount money to run on Linux legally as well, which costs money on Linux as well.

I work in the enterprise space. Creating a domain with LDAP / Kerberos compliance under Windows is damn expensive. A SQL compliant database doubles the cost. We are talking tens of thousands of dollars here. For the amount of users I support it's more like 100k or more.

As for Windows and Office I get that through MSDN for free from work, but you can get ten copies of each for $350 from TechNet, and you can always find sales.

Yes I've taken advantage of work MSDN subscriptions too, but that just reinforces my point. You are using software paid for by the company you work for. You didn't buy it.

But heck you could just go with the same FOSS that's on Linux in Windows and pretty pay for nothing except the OS which you would likely have on a computer anyway which cost added about $50 to the cost of the machine.

Yes that is true, but most of that software, the good stuff anyways started in Unix or Linux before being ported to Windows. In addition you are already in your example in realistic terms spending $100 bucks or more if you want to be productive where as a Linux user other than hardware pays nothing.

My point is that you don't have to spend money on Windows. But if you spend some money there are some awesome tools out there that just don't exist in the FOSS world, at least not powerful and straight forward like TMPGEnc 4.0 XPress. That tool cost me $100 and I've actually done a couple of projects for people where with a few mouse clicks paid for itself.

In terms of encoding (not editing) there are tons of tools out there that rival even TMPEnc. Tovid is pretty good. If you want something point and click easy Devede (which also has editing capability -- think Nero Vision) does a pretty good job.

 

[heatlesssun]

Games OK there's an argument to be made there. But I'm not defending that. I'm defending the 80% of users, not me or you, that just need to be able to use their computer to enhance their lives without going broke, Want to get on the Internet ? You'd have to be a fool to pay money for just that experience. Want to play music ? Again if you are paying money for something that's been around since configuring bat files to increase high mem apart from contingent memory you are insane. Want to check email ? If you want to pay $100 plus dollars for a collection of protocols that have been around since Terminal was a separate install and Prodigy was considered a "break through" then by all means open your wallet.

What the hell? Can you please explain to me how Linux provides FREE Internet connections now? That has nothing to do with Linux or Windows. Checking email and playing music is as free on Windows as it is on Linux. You're making stuff up dude.

 

[requiemnoise]

Security isn't about what tools are available, it's about the weakest link, which is the end user everytime.

Both MS and linux provide a platform with a remarkable number of tools and concepts related to security; the variable is always the end user. To put it another way, as a windows admin, I am confident I can lock down a windows box as tightly as I might a linux box.

I never said, the security is ONLY software. I am not a software marketer, I am a System Consultant or whatever my client tells me to dress. Security is mostly policies. It should always be about policies. Having a clean network policy always prevent crisis from happening. I don't know about you, but no one follows them. No users reads the security guidelines. We are reaching two decades of mass marketing of security software products. Still no end in site to have a perfect secure environment. It is just like buy an insurance policy these days. However, there are better tools than others. We all know majority of security breaks are based on weak communication layers, such as browsers, service ports, locations, and pc hardware itself. Now, these days Office software needs to get on the web. It seems everything needs to work off the web now. Every annoying apps will prompt the users with difficult questions. Like I said before, prompting the users isn't the solution. These can be faked. There are many hacks to change the dialog prompts. Sometimes, it can be even a fake worm disguise as a real app. Stopping this process in Windows world is very difficult. In Linux desktop, these don't exist. You only going to get one update prompt, which should be turned off anyway and updated by an admin. Only way for Linux users to be attacked is malicious commands that will force users to delete their home folders.

 

[requiemnoise]

Linux is simply more secure on the desktop because it simply doesn't get targeted liked Windows. I'm not saying this is the only reason but it's a big one and I think that its not even much of a debating point these days.

That isn't a true statement. That is a marketing statement. If you understand the directory structure to how kernel handles to calls, services, and libraries. Most attacks or hacks to Linux are service ports. That is why people who write service ports for Linux take security very seriously. Also, Apache is 70% of the market share. It gets attacked a lot more than Windows. Still, Apache has a better grade than IIS when it comes to security. However, I can't say samething about PHP.

 

[heatlesssun]

There's just too many to name. I'm sorry but that's a lot of data to compile. If you have the time open up a package manager in a Linux distro and look at what's available.

Yeah I can do that and see a lot of junk. I simply asked you to name ONE application that has no Windows equivalent. If you can't do that how are you supposed to convice people about the power of Linix? Not trying to be a smart ass but I think anyone gets that point.

I work in the enterprise space. Creating a domain with LDAP / Kerberos compliance under Windows is damn expensive. A SQL compliant database doubles the cost. We are talking tens of thousands of dollars here. For the amount of users I support it's more like 100k or more.

Yes I've taken advantage of work MSDN subscriptions too, but that just reinforces my point. You are using software paid for by the company you work for. You didn't buy it.

Yes that is true, but most of that software, the good stuff anyways started in Unix or Linux before being ported to Windows. In addition you are already in your example in realistic terms spending $100 bucks or more if you want to be productive where as a Linux user other than hardware pays nothing.

In terms of encoding (not editing) there are tons of tools out there that rival even TMPEnc. Tovid is pretty good. If you want something point and click easy Devede (which also has editing capability -- think Nero Vision) does a pretty good job.

If I've not been clear I've been trying to focus my points on the desktop. Debating enterprise environments is not an easy thing to debate. 100k for Windows servers for how many workstations? What kind of business? What other systems do you have? What apps do you run? 100k sounds like a lot of money in a large IT environment it really isn't.

So you are trying to compare Tovid and Devede to TMPGEnc? Try again, TMPEnc is a fantastic format converter and isn't a DVD authoring tool. Why do Linux guys think that every commercial app on Windows has an equivalently functional and easy to use FOSS app on Linux? Sometimes buy not every time I'm afraid.

I've got enough hardware to run what ever OS I want. If I find a piece of Linux software that suits my needs and is free don't you think I'd use it? The thing about Windows users is that we are not zealots. We simply want something that works. If its free that's awesome!

 

[requiemnoise]

Yeah I can do that and see a lot of junk. I simply asked you to name ONE application that has no Windows equivalent. If you can't do that how are you supposed to convice people about the power of Linix? Not trying to be a smart ass but I think anyone gets that point.

can you lower your tone. he does have valid points within various areas.

What apps do you run? 100k sounds like a lot of money in a large IT environment it really isn't.

100k? If I can save 100k right now. I can save two contractors who have kids from losing their jobs.

So you are trying to compare Tovid and Devede to TMPGEnc? Try again, TMPEnc is a fantastic format converter and isn't a DVD authoring tool. Why do Linux guys think that every commercial app on Windows has an equivalently functional and easy to use FOSS app on Linux? Sometimes buy not every time I'm afraid.

Tmpgenc isn't that much superior to the open source alternative. First of all, besides the interface changes, their mpeg2 encoder haven't went through many developments in over 9 years. There are plenty of forums based around codecs. You should ask them. I personally don't give a rat ass how fast it will calculate the white noise ratio for filters.

I've got enough hardware to run what ever OS I want. If I find a piece of Linux software that suits my needs and is free don't you think I'd use it? The thing about Windows users is that we are not zealots. We simply want something that works. If its free that's awesome!

Really, that's why I use Linux. I almost forgot today, I had a backup server. It updates patches for me. it sends me email reports. It has been up for a full year. I never have to babysit. That is the beauty of CRON with command lines. Everything is automated. I can even trim anything in my log and get a nice cute text messages to my phone. I think you are a very technical person, but something tells me you didn't dig your rabbit hole deep enough.

======
Anyway, let's all take a break... SAME BAT Channel...

 

[heatlesssun]

can you lower your tone. he does have valid points within various areas.

I simply asked for the name of an application on Linux that had no equivalent on Windows. I wasn't trying to mean I even said I so. Its simply that for years I've asked this question to Linux folks and if I had a nickle I've gotten the that same answer. X-tetris dosent count. Sorry!

100k? If I can save 100k right now. I can save two contractors who have kids from losing their jobs.

I work in banking so I'm living this mess everyday and I hate to seeanyone lose their job. That still dosen't change the fact that in a large enterprise 100k isn't necessarily a lot of money. There are just too many factors to consider. Your could easily save a 100k and spend 1M doing it.

Tmpgenc isn't that much superior to the open source alternative. First of all, besides the interface changes, their mpeg2 encoder haven't went through many developments in over 9 years. There are plenty of forums based around codecs. You should ask them. I personally don't give a rat ass how fast it will calculate the white noise ratio for filters.

So I'm asking as nicely as I can. What FOSS is as powerful and easy to use as Tmpgenc?

Really, that's why I use Linux. I almost forgot today, I had a backup server. It updates patches for me. it sends me email reports. It has been up for a full year. I never have to babysit. That is the beauty of CRON with command lines. Everything is automated. I can even trim anything in my log and get a nice cute text messages to my phone. I think you are a very technical person, but something tells me you didn't dig your rabbit hole deep enough.

======
Anyway, let's all take a break... SAME BAT Channel...

Cool. I played the FEAR 2 demo. Transcoded last nights CSI episode I recorded in Media Center to my phone and I wrote this post in the bed with a pen using Windows 7 on my tx2z tablet pc.

 

[Klob]

What if he never mentioned he uses Linux, but had a Linux shirt that says, "Linux Rocks."
Is he a still elitist? It is a called a freedom of speech. Wake up. Oh, if you are from a communist country, I'm sorry.

Anyone who feels the need to be a mindless zealot about anything is an idiot.

 

[requiemnoise]

Anyone who feels the need to be a mindless zealot about anything is an idiot.

Then why are you here all the time? Why do you hang out at a computer forum? Or is it, because you are upset people don't have the same attitude about your favorite things? Are you also a mindless zealot? You and him have something in common.

I

So I'm asking as nicely as I can. What FOSS is as powerful and easy to use as Tmpgenc?

He gave you the answer yesterday.
DEVEDE
By the way, why do you bother converting things to DVDs? That is so year 2001. I don't even own a standalone dvd player. Most people are doing the opposite. If you are doing the opposite, you already probably used Handbreak.

Cool. I played the FEAR 2 demo. Transcoded last nights CSI episode I recorded in Media Center to my phone and I wrote this post in the bed with a pen using Windows 7 on my tx2z tablet pc.

Yea, I was playing with entire network of UNIX cluster from my laptop. 38 servers. I might have to do some work for an ISP. These days, most average people play games on consoles. Windows Media Center is pretty? Ok. If you enjoy wearing the same t-shirt day and night. Try Boxee, XBMC and MythTV. Also, not everyone likes doodle on their laptop.
You are at point. You are refusing the alternative. That means it is pointless for you.

 

[heatlesssun]

He gave you the answer yesterday.
DEVEDE
By the way, why do you bother converting things to DVDs? That is so year 2001. I don't even own a standalone dvd player. Most people are doing the opposite. If you are doing the opposite, you already probably used Handbreak..

TMPGEnc is not a DVD authoring tool its a transcoder and these tools abound for Windows and Linux, there's nothing Linux specific about them really. I hadn't looked at HandBreak for a while it looks a lot more functional now, thanks for reminding me.

TMPGEnc still has a lot more capability than HandBreak it looks however and its still in beta. A lot of people still use DVD players if you hadn't noticed. I convert and burn stuff for family and friends that don't to multi-media on PCs.

Yea, I was playing with entire network of UNIX cluster from my laptop. 38 servers. I might have to do some work for an ISP. These days, most average people play games on consoles. Windows Media Center is pretty? Ok. If you enjoy wearing the same t-shirt day and night. Try Boxee, XBMC and MythTV. Also, not everyone likes doodle on their laptop.
You are at point. You are refusing the alternative. That means it is pointless for you.

Cool about the servers, your *NIX is paying some bills. The Windows servers I work on help pay mine.

The comment about about gaming must be out of some Linux playbook. Whenever the subject of gaming comes up without fail "most people play on consoles" comes from the Linux person. Then what's all this talk about freedom and choice? And have you actually looked at this forum? A LOT of hard core PC gamers who spend major money on PC gaming because they love it as do I. Windows PC gamers may not have the numbers, but its still a big market with people on average who spend a LOT more money than consolers because they want the overall better gaming experience that PC provide.

And again, "not everyone likes to doodle on their laptop" comment smacks of hypocrisy. Linux people love to say "Windows is for the masses of sheep". What's wrong with a niche technology that all the "sheep" don't use? Once again, right out of a Linux playbook.

Linux people criticize tablet technology because it simply doesn't exist on Linux in any fashion that any where as powerful as what's on Windows these days. It's supposed to be all about freedom. People can user tablets in ways and environments that simply don't work with a keyboard and mouse. And while its a small market, its a very loyal and lucrative one. Good Tablet PC's have very high average selling prices and the popular models have very good resale value. I'm on my fourth tablet.

 

[heatlesssun]

Now for a little good cop. When I buy a piece of software I always look for FOSS alternatives. I bought this last year: http://www.deskshare.com/smp.aspx.

Nice application, $190, I was kind of in a hurry and didn't research this well as in the middle of setting of my home surveillance system, I had a death in the family and was going to be gone for a while and just wanted to get something up and running. It works pretty well.

I actually try to take away something from these debates and decide to do some more research on my software inventory and found ZoneMinder: http://www.zoneminder.com/

Looks pretty sweet. So here's something that doesn't seem to have a powerful free alternative to Windows. I'll need to check this out I might have been able to have $190. If anyone has used it I'd love to hear from them.

Most Windows really don't give a rats ass about Windows per se, we simply want stuff that gets the job done. If it's free and runs on Linux that's totally fine.

 

[requiemnoise]

TMPGEnc is not a DVD authoring tool its a transcoder and these tools abound for Windows and Linux, there's nothing Linux specific about them really. I hadn't looked at HandBreak for a while it looks a lot more functional now, thanks for reminding me.

Dude... You need to relax. Seriously. You get crushed by the people on other threads and you are constantly angry at me.

Alright... answer to your question... TURN OFF DVD authoring on DEVEDE.
ok? If you actually downloaded and used it. You would know that. Turn off authoring feature and save the files as mpeg2 or mpeg1.

TMPGEnc still has a lot more capability than HandBreak it looks however and its still in beta. A lot of people still use DVD players if you hadn't noticed. I convert and burn stuff for family and friends that don't to multi-media on PCs.

Tmpgenc is mpeg2 converter (mostly for DVD). Handbreak is anything for avi and mp4 container. You can always visit their website for the detail information. Handbreak has been around for a very LONG time. I think it is about four years old. It was originally available only for OSX. I guess you haven't used it. You should try some software before yelling, "everything sucks." It comes off very negative.

Cool about the servers, your *NIX is paying some bills. The Windows servers I work on help pay mine.

Hey. I work on both platforms. I have been maintaining NT since 3.51. Please, don't assume I know nothing about Windows.

The comment about about gaming must be out of some Linux playbook. Whenever the subject of gaming comes up without fail "most people play on consoles" comes from the Linux person.

I don't think you get it... Writing a game requires few years with various team members. Who is going to pay for their salaries? It is a lot of work. It isn't Linux isn't game ready. Many commercial game providers are scared to release their games without a DRM.
I hope that answer your questions. You can also join few game development forums. They can probably answer your question better.

Then what's all this talk about freedom and choice? And have you actually looked at this forum? A LOT of hard core PC gamers who spend major money on PC gaming because they love it as do I. Windows PC gamers may not have the numbers, but its still a big market with people on average who spend a LOT more money than consolers because they want the overall better gaming experience that PC provide.

Most moms and dads like consoles. If you want to play on your computer, that is fine. But, most people like their Wii. Moms and Dads don't want to worry about speed of their GPU and tweaking their OS to run the latest games.

And again, "not everyone likes to doodle on their laptop" comment smacks of hypocrisy. Linux people love to say "Windows is for the masses of sheep". What's wrong with a niche technology that all the "sheep" don't use? Once again, right out of a Linux playbook.

I think you have a serious anger issue. LOWER YOUR TONE. Did I insulted you? When did I called you a sheep? Are you reading words I can't see? You are nuts, dude.

Linux people criticize tablet technology because it simply doesn't exist on Linux in any fashion that any where as powerful as what's on Windows these days. It's supposed to be all about freedom. People can user tablets in ways and environments that simply don't work with a keyboard and mouse. And while its a small market, its a very loyal and lucrative one. Good Tablet PC's have very high average selling prices and the popular models have very good resale value. I'm on my fourth tablet.

It isn't true. There isn't whole a lot of demand for it. Why is it every laptops for Windows isn't tablet ready? Why is it one out of 300 laptops have these functions? You are saying all these Windows users are sheeps? It doesn't sell, because not everyone wants it. Maybe, you do... Listen man.. calm down. Learn to think in other people's shoes. It is a big world out there.

 

[heatlesssun]

Why are you assuming I'm angry? I don't even know you, I’m just debating. I said thanks for the heads up on Handbrake. Also I never said anything about your level of Windows knowledge. You might know a whole lot more about Windows than I do, I'm sure you know a lot more about *NIX since I don't work much on those platforms.

I have my biases and you have yours. My goal was to learn something and hopefully you might as well. Since you said I was nuts and say I get crushed all the time in debates I guess I have nothing to offer you so I'm sorry.

But as I said you and I have our deferring bias, that’s life. I like to debate with people with views differing mine because I this it’s easier to learn. If I had had this debate a few months ago I might have discovered ZoneMinder and saved $190. That would have been totally cool with me.

My main difference with you like most Linux folks that I talk to is that you simply discount Linux's weaknesses. Plenty of people love their PC's for gaming and I've created at least two tablet converts that won't touch a conventional laptop anymore because they love the flexibility that you just don’t have with only a keyboard and mouse. I can’t live without a “bedbook”. You can’t use a conventional laptop lying on your side in the dark.

Granted it’s a niche, but so is Linux on the desktop. So I don’t understand why a crowd that loves on niche thinks others are without merit. I think that this is a valid critique not made of anger but experience.

If this sounds angry or crazy or narrow minded I apologize.

 

[Joe Average]

To quote the immortal words of the guy the police claimed was doing 155 MPH down the L.A. Freeway years past... (maybe if it was tricked out by ricers with Nitrous and there happened to be a hurricane pushing it, perhaps...):

"Can't we all just... get along?"

You two are basically batting eyelashes at each other now... this thread died like two days ago, here's your wake up call.

Move on, fellas...

 

[heatlesssun]

To quote the immortal words of the guy the police claimed was doing 155 MPH down the L.A. Freeway years past... (maybe if it was tricked out by ricers with Nitrous and there happened to be a hurricane pushing it, perhaps...):

"Can't we all just... get along?"

You two are basically batting eyelashes at each other now... this thread died like two days ago, here's your wake up call.

Move on, fellas...

Like I said, I just want to learn something. Because of debate I discovered ZoneMinder and rediscovered HandBrake so it worked for me.

Getting ones notions challenged now and then is a good thing. It's not about anger or hate. It's too easy to get complacent and think yours is the only or best way so I appreciate the exchange!

 

[kac77]

What the hell? Can you please explain to me how Linux provides FREE Internet connections now? That has nothing to do with Linux or Windows. Checking email and playing music is as free on Windows as it is on Linux. You're making stuff up dude.

I wasn't aware Windows was free? Really? Someone should tell MS. I'm not talking about service. I'm talking about the applications that make any of that stuff possible.

 

[heatlesssun]

I wasn't aware Windows was free? Really? Someone should tell MS. I'm not talking about service. I'm talking about the applications that make any of that stuff possible.

http://www.crunchgear.com/2009/01/21/even-ubuntus-founder-likes-windows-7/

"You can make the argument Linux is more expensive that Windows XP because Microsoft has been very aggressive in licensing," Shuttleworth said.

So take what you will from this.

 

[requiemnoise]

Why are you assuming I'm angry? I don't even know you, I’m just debating. I said thanks for the heads up on Handbrake. Also I never said anything about your level of Windows knowledge. You might know a whole lot more about Windows than I do, I'm sure you know a lot more about *NIX since I don't work much on those platforms.

I have my biases and you have yours. My goal was to learn something and hopefully you might as well. Since you said I was nuts and say I get crushed all the time in debates I guess I have nothing to offer you so I'm sorry.

But as I said you and I have our deferring bias, that’s life. I like to debate with people with views differing mine because I this it’s easier to learn. If I had had this debate a few months ago I might have discovered ZoneMinder and saved $190. That would have been totally cool with me.

My main difference with you like most Linux folks that I talk to is that you simply discount Linux's weaknesses. Plenty of people love their PC's for gaming and I've created at least two tablet converts that won't touch a conventional laptop anymore because they love the flexibility that you just don’t have with only a keyboard and mouse. I can’t live without a “bedbook”. You can’t use a conventional laptop lying on your side in the dark.

Granted it’s a niche, but so is Linux on the desktop. So I don’t understand why a crowd that loves on niche thinks others are without merit. I think that this is a valid critique not made of anger but experience.

If this sounds angry or crazy or narrow minded I apologize.

Na... Please don't worry about it. I think you had multiple debates going. I understand. Those things happen to me too. I came to a conclusion, Linux on the Desktop isn't for you. Your needs are different than some people. Like you said, the tablet feature is a key to your desktop use. You are a minority of that group, and can't live without it. You are better off Windows on the Desktop. Maybe, you should try a Linux server at home. Maybe, find a niche use.

 

[kac77]

Yeah I can do that and see a lot of junk. I simply asked you to name ONE application that has no Windows equivalent. If you can't do that how are you supposed to convice people about the power of Linix? Not trying to be a smart ass but I think anyone gets that point.

You see junk because that's what you want to see. Here's a short list of stuff:

CUPS - Print Server with Web Front End
Amarok - Yes there are media players for Windows but how many of them can sit on an enterprise grade database? None that I know of.
MythTv - Again there's software like it, but none of them offer the features of this software.
Pulse Audio - Yes it's implementation can be a pain depending on distro however there's nothing on the Windows side that replicates sound output over your network for a desktop machine.

There's more but like I said there's just too many applications out there to provide a definite list.

If I've not been clear I've been trying to focus my points on the desktop. Debating enterprise environments is not an easy thing to debate. 100k for Windows servers for how many workstations? What kind of business? What other systems do you have? What apps do you run? 100k sounds like a lot of money in a large IT environment it really isn't.

That's the whole point. There's no such thing really as a "server" version of linux. All distros can run the same stuff. If you want your desktop to be a server there's nothing stopping you. If you want a server to be a desktop machine again there's no limitation there. You're confining it to just desktop because Windows doesn't really offer that kind of fleixability. A prime example would be something like Amarok paired with media streaming software like jinzora. In linux both of those applications can concievably work together on the database back end. Music imported into Amarok can be inserted into the Jinzora media streaming server with a few additional procedures. You just can't do something like this in Windows.

As far as 100,000k not being alot of money. LOL If you include Windows of course it isn't. But $100,000 dedicated to just hardware could completely replace most server farms. Hardware now a days is relatively cheap. It's the proprietary software that kills people not the hardware. That amount of money would buy you anywhere from 10 to 20.... 2 socket quad core poweredges with a substantial amount of VM capability. If you built those yourself now you are talking about 5 TB of storage for each with a grand total of 50 TB of data storage. No matter how you slice it that's alot of power. Can a company spend more? Of course but that's not the point. The point is that's a lot of hardware no matter who has it.

So you are trying to compare Tovid and Devede to TMPGEnc? Try again, TMPEnc is a fantastic format converter and isn't a DVD authoring tool. Why do Linux guys think that every commercial app on Windows has an equivalently functional and easy to use FOSS app on Linux? Sometimes buy not every time I'm afraid.

Try most of the time. ToVid and Devede are front ends to variety of codecs... you have a choice. Mencoder, FFmpeg, etc. You aren't locked into a program since the frontends are compiled against codecs. You don't have to author DVD content either. If you just want to transcode (either muxing or demux) in either of these tools the options are there for you to do just that.

 

[kac77]

http://www.crunchgear.com/2009/01/21/even-ubuntus-founder-likes-windows-7/



So take what you will from this.

Ok he likes it. How does that address my point?

 

[heatlesssun]

Ok he likes it. How does that address my point?

You left out the point where where he says that Windows XP was cheaper than Linux.

 

[AbJ32]

OK you mean Gnome. It just means you have no idea what you are talking about. I was giving you an opportunity to correct yourself. But if you don't want to then by all means have at it Hoss. Gnome is thinner than XP especially Vista. Its a fact whether you produce 10,000 posts, or not, it won't change it and I'm not going to try to save you from hoisting your own petard. If you want to market Windows on a forum by all means go for it.

Thinner or otherwise, it doesn't make much difference in regards to performance. You can turn Aero on, along with all the 'Visual' features in Windows on a decent PC, and it's not going to make a performance difference. So unless you're running a dinosaur of a PC, there won't be a difference.

Gnome if compiled by itself along with kernel takes up 1.8 Gigs of hard drive space ... that's it. In memory of daily use it hovers below 256 megs (only non SP versions of Windows XP could claim such a thing). Do you want to guess how fast an Intel chip loads an operating system of that size into memory? 12 seconds or less. So the fact that you hobbled around a default install of Linux and had no idea of it's capabilities makes your argument of Gnome being slower than Vista, which takes up 1 GB of memory by itself, seem all the more an example of the rantings of a noob trying to play in a sandbox without the knowledge of the earth which supports it.

By your theory, Windows 95 should be faster than Windows Vista, since less memory usage = faster. The correlation between Memory Use and Performance are not directly related.

There are counter parts for just about everything you want to do. It just takes time, which if that was your argument I would concede but it's not. Your argument is that Linux lacks variety to be considered "ready" for the average user, which is something someone would say if they spent all of a day with an operating system instead of the amount of time you've spent with Windows and still not understand the complexities of which of what makes it go.

Oh, really? Well then, if you're sure of it, let's see you go find some open source audio production software and open source instrument processing software that gets the job done as well as what I currently use. Let's see it.

Games OK there's an argument to be made there. But I'm not defending that. I'm defending the 80% of users, not me or you, that just need to be able to use their computer to enhance their lives without going broke, Want to get on the Internet ? You'd have to be a fool to pay money for just that experience. Want to play music ? Again if you are paying money for something that's been around since configuring bat files to increase high mem apart from contingent memory you are insane. Want to check email ? If you want to pay $100 plus dollars for a collection of protocols that have been around since Terminal was a separate install and Prodigy was considered a "break through" then by all means open your wallet.

If $100 gets me an interface that my family members are capable of using without asking me 18 times a week how to check emails, then it's completely worth it. Add on top of that the fact that all the software I need works on it, and it runs just as fast as my alternatives, I don't see any reason why it wouldn't be worth the money.

Ok that's your personal preference and it's valid, after all only you can do you. But considering the thread is about which is faster, you could have said "I don't like Linux" and moved on instead of typing a eulogy of your capacity.

I've stated, I really don't see any performance advantage. I've installed it side by side on nearly identical PCs, and it wasn't any faster than Windows XP.

Something that short and sweet would have made me retort with a simple ...OK. Obviously I'm done with playing "my e-penis is bigger than yours" if you want to correspond on the topic (Linux Faster?) at hand then I'm more than willing to have a meaningful discussion. I just don't do trolling or talking about something that's covered in an alternate thread more suitable for the point you are trying to make.

I've already stated, it's not tremendously faster (If it even is faster at all. On any respectable PC, the difference won't be noticeable, even if it is there.) This opinion comes with direct experience with the operating system. If you want to say it's all bullshit, fine. I don't care whether some fanboy on some forum I rarely post on thinks I'm full of shit. My point is, it's not fast enough to justify everything you lose.

 

[heatlesssun]

You see junk because that's what you want to see. Here's a short list of stuff:

CUPS - Print Server with Web Front End
Amarok - Yes there are media players for Windows but how many of them can sit on an enterprise grade database? None that I know of.
MythTv - Again there's software like it, but none of them offer the features of this software.
Pulse Audio - Yes it's implementation can be a pain depending on distro however there's nothing on the Windows side that replicates sound output over your network for a desktop machine.

Amarok is currently available but not supported on Windows. Pulse Audio is available on Windows and supported.

Not to take anything away from an app I've never used, but how many Windows users really want yet another media player? Another thing to consider. I have a Zune pass subscription (yeah I'm a total Microsoftie I'm afraid) which yes I know $15 bucks a month but if you know of a way to LEGALLY obtain all music for free then you need to let me in on the secret please! With a Zune pass the available content is cloud based, so local storage is just that. There's just so much content everywhere from so many places that there just isn't any one media player that's going to fit everyone ones needs. Hopefully the Amarock developers put some time into their Windows version. I might take a look at it in Ubuntu when I do my ZoneMinder setup.

I've actually worked with MythTV and IIRC something called LinuxTV which was an Ubuntu distro that included MythTV in it. Never could get it working really and I admit I just gave up. The thing is that I have two Windows Media Centers that work great and spending a lot of time on it just wasn't going to buy me much. Hey, you guys are the Linux gurus!

That's the whole point. There's no such thing really as a "server" version of linux. All distros can run the same stuff. If you want your desktop to be a server there's nothing stopping you. If you want a server to be a desktop machine again there's no limitation there. You're confining it to just desktop because Windows doesn't really offer that kind of fleixability. A prime example would be something like Amarok paired with media streaming software like jinzora. In linux both of those applications can concievably work together on the database back end. Music imported into Amarok can be inserted into the Jinzora media streaming server with a few additional procedures. You just can't do something like this in Windows.

As far as 100,000k not being alot of money. LOL If you include Windows of course it isn't. But $100,000 dedicated to just hardware could completely replace most server farms. Hardware now a days is relatively cheap. It's the proprietary software that kills people not the hardware. That amount of money would buy you anywhere from 10 to 20.... 2 socket quad core poweredges with a substantial amount of VM capability. If you built those yourself now you are talking about 5 TB of storage for each with a grand total of 50 TB of data storage. No matter how you slice it that's alot of power. Can a company spend more? Of course but that's not the point. The point is that's a lot of hardware no matter who has it.

Try most of the time. ToVid and Devede are front ends to variety of codecs... you have a choice. Mencoder, FFmpeg, etc. You aren't locked into a program since the frontends are compiled against codecs. You don't have to author DVD content either. If you just want to transcode (either muxing or demux) in either of these tools the options are there for you to do just that.

We'll there might not be such a thing as a Linux server but there's definitely such a thing as a desktop environment that has different needs and demands than a server. Things like battery power consumption, human machine interfaces, and bluetooth devices don't really apply to traditional servers. Not saying that they can't but why on earth would someone be worried about their web or print server running Call Of Duty (not the server, the actuall game). Not every solution is a hammer nor every problem a nail.

As far the $100k, where I work hardware and software costs don't even begin to touch development and support costs. Plus where I work we get a super sweet deal with Microsoft so the acquisition costs are MUCH lower than retail. Microsoft's licensing sucks because they do confuse the hell out of people about pricing. But if you know what you are doing the costs are far lower than most Linux people will state in debates like this.

Moral of the story, if you are paying retail price for MS products you are getting ripped off. You can easily get stuff at 20% or less of retail.

Look, people who love Linux love Linux. It's awesome to have such a passionate community that want to do the world a favor. I'm all for it and I have actually donated to a FOSS project, Audacity because its something I use to use a lot and thought I'd throw them $20. People need to get something for their sweat.

I just think that some in the Linux/FOSS community however just blast Windows because its cool or something. I'm all for lowering my costs. I'm all for freedom and choice, but that's just it. If I try something, it doesn't work out I move on. Sure I have my biases because I make a living working on Windows, it pays the bills. But I have to remember to have an open mind and force myself to learn about things I don't know.

So you've pointed me in the direction of Amarock, never have used it but looks kind of cool I and do plan on taking a look. Thanks!

 

[requiemnoise]

I think we should all walk about from this thread for few days and think about this. Both sides made valid points. Now, please digest each others ideas. You guys are randomly shooting at each other like crazy! Hey, I think even I learned few things. The end users might need some extra GUI tools.

 

[kac77]

Thinner or otherwise, it doesn't make much difference in regards to performance. You can turn Aero on, along with all the 'Visual' features in Windows on a decent PC, and it's not going to make a performance difference. So unless you're running a dinosaur of a PC, there won't be a difference.


By your theory, Windows 95 should be faster than Windows Vista, since less memory usage = faster. The correlation between Memory Use and Performance are not directly related.

There's a difference. If there wasn't, turning Aero off wouldn't be considered a Performance option by MS it self now would it ? Are you telling me MS is wrong now too? As far as Windows 95, there's no doubt in my mind at all that it would fly like the wind. Trouble is it's buggy as hell and it's not even in the same universe as the linux kernel.

Oh, really? Well then, if you're sure of it, let's see you go find some open source audio production software and open source instrument processing software that gets the job done as well as what I currently use. Let's see it.

How's this:

Graphical Programming

* gAlan, graphical audio language.
* Ingen, modular audio system formerly known as Om.
* jMax, modular visual programming environment for music. (NB: jMax is no longer in development.)
* OpenSoundWorld, sound programming environment.
* Pure Data or Pd, graphical programming language.

Audio Programming Languages (Text based)

* ChucK, an audio programming language for realtime synthesis, composition, and performance.
* Csound, composition, synthesis and processing.
* Nyquist, Lisp-based language for sound generation and analysis. Audacity supports plug-ins written in the Nyquist language.
* SuperCollider, Smalltalk-like language for real-time audio synthesis.

DJ Tools

* Digital-Scratch
* DJPlay
* Mixxx
* TerminatorX
* UltraMixer
* xwax

Drum Machine

* csDrummer, Record a drum session in a virtual studio
* Hydrogen
* Jackbeat

Recording / Editing

* Ardour, a multi-track audio recorder.
* Audacity, audio editor.
* Baudline, signal analyzer.
* Buzztard, music composer.
* Ecasound, audio recorder.
* Freecycle, beat slicer.
* Gnome Wave Cleaner, denoise, dehiss and amplify.
* gramofile, apply filters to reduce ticks and scratches on gramophone recordings.
* JAMin, JACK Audio Mastering interface.
* Jokosher, audio editor.
* LinuxSampler, sampler.
* LMMS, music composer
* mhWaveEdit, audio editor.
* Mp3gain, adjust MP3 playback volume without re-encoding.
* Mp3splt, splits MP3 and Ogg Vorbis files without re-encoding.
* MusE, MIDI sequencer (not to be confused with MuSE).
* NoteEdit, score writer.
* Renoise, modern tracker-style sequencer.
* ReZound, audio editor.
* Qtractor, a full featured multi-track audio and MIDI workstation.
* Rosegarden, MIDI sequencer.
* Seq24, a loop based midi sequencer.
* Snd, audio editor.
* Sweep, audio editor.
* Timemachine, small JACK buffer capture tool.
* Traverso DAW, a multi-track audio recorder.

Sound Server

* aRts, the KDE soundserver.
* EsounD, the Enlightened Sound Daemon.
* Fst, how to get the vst, instruments under Linux.
* JACK Audio Connection Kit, low latency sound server.
* JEsd, a Java implementation of EsounD.
* MAS, the Multimedia Audio Server, a network audio server for X.
* MuSE, a multipurpose network streaming sound server and mixer.
* NAS, the Network Audio System.
* NMM, Network-Integrated Multimedia Middleware.
* PulseAudio, a sound server. A drop-in replacement for EsounD.

Patch Bays

* Qjackctl, JACK control panel and patch bay
* Patchage, JACK patch bay

Synthesizers

* Aeolus, organ synth.
* AlsaModularSynth
* Amsynth
* Bristol, synthesiser emulation package.
* FluidSynth, with the QSynth interface.
* Gnaural, binaural beat and pink noise synthesizer.
* LMMS, tracker/sequencer/synth.
* OM Synth, (ingen) software synthesizer, LADSPA host.
* San-dysth
* Specimen, a MIDI controllable audio sampler.
* TiMidity, Play/Convert MIDI files as/to PCM
* RT-synth
* ZynAddSubFX, software synthesizer.

Effects Processing

* Ecamegapedal, real-time frontend for LADSPA plugins.
* FreqTweak, real-time audio processing with spectral displays.
* Jack Rack, a graphical frontend for the chaining together of multiple LADSPA plugins.
* Rakarrack, Guitar Effects Processor.
* LADSPA, the Linux Audio Developers Simple Plugin API.
* DSSI, Disposable Soft Synth Interface, a virtual instrument (software synthesizer) plugin architecture.
* SoX, the Audio Swiss Army knife.
* LV2, is the new audio Linux standard for plugins.


Don't make assumptions please. It makes it look like you've come to conclusions on stuff without actually trying any of it out yourself.

If $100 gets me an interface that my family members are capable of using without asking me 18 times a week how to check emails, then it's completely worth it. Add on top of that the fact that all the software I need works on it, and it runs just as fast as my alternatives, I don't see any reason why it wouldn't be worth the money.

The only problem is you'll be called out more times than I would to clean off all of the virus's they would get running Windows XP.

I've stated, I really don't see any performance advantage. I've installed it side by side on nearly identical PCs, and it wasn't any faster than Windows XP.

What happened to Vista? Oh that's right in order for it to do it's job as quickly as XP or Linux for that matter you're buying more RAM to accomplish the same goal and if wasn't the case why is Windows 7 thinner than VIsta? Are you saying you know better than MS here too?