Ivy Bridge Memory: 1600 or better?

Discussion in 'Memory' started by Eradan, May 10, 2012.

  1. Eradan

    Eradan [H]ard|Gawd

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    Just watching a YouTube video from PCPerspective with JJ Guerrero from Asus. They're putting a 3770 through the paces with an Asus Z77 board. The auto-tuning tools tweak both the multiplier and the BCLK and at one point (around 27:40), they show the RAM operating at just under 2GHz. JJ recommends 2133 or 2400 for this platform. This seems contradictory to Acer_Sheep's comment above and some other posts here on the [H].

    I'm not trying to call anyone out. I'm just trying to get my arms around today's overclocking landscape. Am I missing something here? Maybe "real" overclockers wouldn't be using these tools and the more expensive RAM isn't needed for manual overclocking. I don't know...


    I'd posted this in another thread as it seemed to contradict what I am reading here. I think I'm confusing memory transfer rates with actual clock speeds. I haven't messed with any of this stuff in years and the whole playing field seems to be completely different from the Athlon XP days.

    Nonetheless, the guys asks if overclockers should consider buying "performance" RAM and JJ from Asus suggests 2133 or 2400 rated memory. The consensus here seems to be that 1600 is the sweet spot. I guess I need to figure out what I'm going to do before I purchase RAM tomorrow or Saturday. I want to throw 8 or 16GB into my new build and forget about it for a couple years.

    Thoughts?

    E
     
  2. Tsumi

    Tsumi [H]ardForum Junkie

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    This and this should tell you all you need to know. Real world performance doesn't benefit from faster memory than 1600. Which, coincidentally, is also the current sweet spot in RAM pricing.
     
  3. Eradan

    Eradan [H]ard|Gawd

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    Done, done, and done.

    Probably go with the low profile Samsung RAM that's getting a lot of positive buzz.

    Thank you, sir.

    E
     
  4. flexcore

    flexcore Gawd

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    I just picked up 4 x 4GB of the LowProfile 30nm Samsung memory and it is excellent RAM! I love that stuff and I don't give two shits about heatspreaders that aren't necessary.

    This stuff is very flexible. It can be ran at 1600 w/ tight timings or 2133+ w/ timing loosened up.
     
  5. Eradan

    Eradan [H]ard|Gawd

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    Taking a closer look at this tonight.

    Am I correct in thinking that you just can't throw higher rated memory in your Z77 and just magically expect increased throughput? One would have to overclock their RAM in the BIOS to actually seen an increase in performance.

    The Tom's Hardware link you provided almost makes me wonder if they didn't just stick the faster RAM into their test system without making any settings changes. The Sandy Bridge tests on Anandtech show small RAM performance increases when overclocking the CPU. What settings are they using for the RAM though?

    I concede I probably have no idea what I'm talking about. Still trying to wrap my arms around all this even though I'll probably just look for 1600 RAM later today.

    Thanks for your help!
    E
     
  6. Tsumi

    Tsumi [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Well, you can tell there's obviously more bandwidth by the Aida memory bandwidth tests and Sandra memory tests. These specifically test for the bandwidth between the RAM and CPU.

    You cannot simply toss it in and have it work, usually, you either have to manually overclock it to those levels, or you enable the higher XMP profile with RAM that have the XMP profile. Also, timings play a large factor in how fast your RAM can cycle through data. Lower timings = lower access times = faster performance.

    Tom's Hardware and Anandtech also used different benchmarks, and each benchmark is going to react differently to the faster RAM. However, the point still remains that even if there is a benefit, it's usually so small it's not going to be noticeable.
     
  7. SonDa5

    SonDa5 [H]ardness Supreme

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    I have tested 1600mhz Samsung ram and Gskill 2133mhz DDR3 in my system and for over clocking the GSkill is more stable at higher system speeds.

    I recommend high speed high quality ram for higher bandwidth rating. My MSI Z68 GD65 G3 MB BIOS has DDR3 speed options up to almost 3000mhz.
     
  8. drescherjm

    drescherjm [H]ardForum Junkie

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    You need to overclock your memory controller to get the rated speed on a dimm higher than DDR3 1600 (or ddr3 1333 for SB). The BIOS will default to the chips maximum non overclocked speed provided the dimms report they can handle that..

    Agreed. In synthetic benchmarks you will see the expected gains from higher frequency ram. In real world applications the gains are usually less than 1 to 3% and usually for the cost difference your money is much better spent on some other component like getting a bigger SSD or a beefier GPU.
     
  9. bitgod

    bitgod Gawd

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    Just get some of that nice Samsung 1600 memory, and you can either run it at stock, or play with it later and get some higher speeds off of it.
     
  10. Dangman

    Dangman Ninja Editor SuperMod

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  11. xxEIEIOxx

    xxEIEIOxx 2[H]4U

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  12. kazaakas

    kazaakas Limp Gawd

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    I got myself some 4x4GB 1600Mhz CL9 low profile Corsair RAM for a really cheap price.
    All I can say its just nice and solid, as one expects from a brand as Corsair, of course :)
     
  13. jbean7457

    jbean7457 Gawd

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    I bought two 4 gb samsung 30nm sticks and i'm loving it. I'm running it at 1866 with timings at 9-9-9-24 and it's running great. I didn't see the need to run it any faster, i'm pretty happy with it. I wish I would have bought another 2 sticks... guess I will eventually.
     
  14. bigdogchris

    bigdogchris [H]ard as it Gets

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    The only time I can think of when ram speed may have an actual performance impact is when using integrated graphics.
     
  15. Gsa700

    Gsa700 n00b

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    I just wanted to add that the Samsung memory is an excellent choice as it gives you future options for over clocking. I have seen one application, actually two, where faster ram makes a "real world" difference: The first is IBT. You can definitely measure the increase in Gflops capability.

    The second and more relevant is Folding at home. I have seen minutes shaved off WU's simply by increasing the ram speeds of my systems. That is a very real benefit and would surely benefit in other ways as well.

    I have three machines using the 30nm samsung memory, and they all run 2200 plus with 1.45 volts.
     
  16. PanzeR-

    PanzeR- Limp Gawd

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    that's crazy... what kind of timings are you using?
     
  17. AnonymousUser

    AnonymousUser Gawd

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    Anybody got a link to the Samsung memory a few people mentioned?
     
  18. drescherjm

    drescherjm [H]ardForum Junkie

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  19. centvalny

    centvalny 2[H]4U

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    I bught these rams for $20/4gb stick

    Generic Samsung ddr3. No XMP

    [​IMG]

    Default settings

    [​IMG]

    2600 10-12-12 1T

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2012
  20. AnonymousUser

    AnonymousUser Gawd

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  21. Eradan

    Eradan [H]ard|Gawd

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    I ended up with 8GB (2x4) of Corsair Vengeance 1600 for my Ivy Bridge build. The Micro Center near me did have the Samsung on Friday evening and I didn't want to wait.

    This thread was helpful in that I didn't feel compelled to buy any of the faster Corsair.

    Thank you.
    E
     
  22. lee0539

    lee0539 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Those are great if you do not wish to overclock. Those will run low voltage at tight timings at the rated 1600. You might be able to push it to 1866, but the samsung i have can do 2000 mhz at low timings while at 1.45 volts. so i'm getting more speed with it while being lower than other 1.5 v sticks. Plus they don't have obnoxious heat spreaders and easier to swap it out when you have a large heatsink. The samsung advantage is that it can be adjusted easily and can match what you want. higher bandwidth or tighter timings. The samsungs can also be run at those low 1.25 V at 1600 and same timings. so you get essentially the same memory but with samsung u have more options to do things with it.
     
  23. grambo

    grambo [H]ard|Gawd

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    What are some real world desktop applications (not benchmarks) that take advantage of increased memory bandwidth? Folding?

    Obviously gaming does not benefit at all, and encoding doesn't see much gain either.
     
  24. PanzeR-

    PanzeR- Limp Gawd

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    what about tigher timings ?
     
  25. Tsumi

    Tsumi [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Same thing. Hardly anything can take advantage of tighter timings or increased memory bandwidth. The bottleneck still remains on the CPU for the most part.
     
  26. Dangman

    Dangman Ninja Editor SuperMod

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    Well at least with Intel platforms without a doubt. However, no one has done extensive testing with AMD CPUs, RAM speeds, and timings that weren't related to the AMD APUs AFAIK. Small possibility but still a possibility nonetheless.
     
  27. DejaWiz

    DejaWiz Oracle of Unfortunate Truths

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    I've got 4x4GB G.Skill 1333 Value memory. I'm perfectly content knowing that my LGA1155 system runs just as fast as anyone who has wasted extra money on faster clocked memory.


    However...
    With DDR3 1333 creeping up a little in price the past couple of weeks, there is literally a $0-3 difference in price from the 1600 speed memory. Now that 1600 is a non-OC supported speed with IB, then get whatever 1333 or 1600 1.5V (or less) is cheapest. Still some sales and promo codes popping up on memory out there.
     
  28. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardForum Junkie

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    +1 for this.
    I bought alot of the 1333 ram when it was cheap so later on I could put it into other new rigs. Still have 16gb's in my main and test comp. The kids and others only have 8 which is fine.
     
  29. Flekx

    Flekx Limp Gawd

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    Thanks for the info. Saved me a bunch of dollars =)
     
  30. NeoDiNardo

    NeoDiNardo Limp Gawd

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  31. NeoDiNardo

    NeoDiNardo Limp Gawd

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  32. DejaWiz

    DejaWiz Oracle of Unfortunate Truths

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    If you need/want 16GB and don't mind paying a little more for a dual module kit at that capacity, then just get whatever 1333 or 1600 1.5V kit is the cheapest from a reputable brand. Yeah, that Samsung memory is cool and all, but what's the point since it's been proven that memory speed and timing don't have a real world impact on the LGA1155 platform? It makes zero logical sense to get faster memory or even OC it unlike years gone by.
     
  33. NeoDiNardo

    NeoDiNardo Limp Gawd

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    Strangely enough, I want the 2x8gb Vengence LP kit just for looks, but it has the worst timings compared to the less pretty yellow Crucial, but you say it does not matter eh?

    But if price is my thing, the Samsung wins out of all of them, only I have to fill up all my slots, which is ok but will it affect OC for my system to have all the banks filled and by how much?

    Leaning towards the Samsung just cus 16Gb is cheaper that way.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2012
  34. DejaWiz

    DejaWiz Oracle of Unfortunate Truths

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    Depends on how hard you want to push your OC. With my RAM configuration, I'm able to get my IB to 4.4 with ease, and I know there's more there. I just don't push it because I have zero need to. Things runs everything fine at stock clocks, let alone OC'd.
     
  35. grambo

    grambo [H]ard|Gawd

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    I'd get the Samsung because the price is reasonably cheap (compared to other DDR3-1600 9-9-9-24 kits) and it has the capability to hit higher speeds/tighter timings when you run it at 1.5V instead of 1.35V. I went with this Mushkin kit because it was on sale for $79, and the Samsung would've run me $119 here in Canada at the time. Overall, faster RAM/lower timings don't matter for most applications.

    I would not pay extra for 2x8GB unless you are going to need more than 16GB for your system. 4 DIMMs does not seem to have a negative impact on IB overclocking, at least from my experience. I thought about getting 2x8GB to "futureproof" for the ability to run 32GB down the road, but decided by the time I'd want to do that, 8GB DIMMs would be a lot cheaper... 16GB is in truth massive overkill for my needs on a gaming PC.
     
  36. DejaWiz

    DejaWiz Oracle of Unfortunate Truths

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    16GB, be it in 2 or 4 modules, is massive overkill for 99% of us, anyway. I did it only because it is dirt cheap to do so, and I'm set for the future should apps and games be able to use that much in the future or if there's another "mystery" fire at one of the manuf plants or some shit causing prices to skyrocket overnight.
     
  37. Tsumi

    Tsumi [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I got my 24gb simply because it was $60 AR from Fry's.

    So far, I'm running at 8-9gb usage with a 4gb RAMDisk for internet cache (I know, way overkill, but I have the room to spare).
     
  38. NeoDiNardo

    NeoDiNardo Limp Gawd

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    I ended up with 16gbs (4x4gb) of that Samsung ram. If I use all 16gbs or not will depend on some personal rig testing, 8gb might be all I can really make use of from what everyone is saying. If so, I could always use the ram in another build for family.
     
  39. grambo

    grambo [H]ard|Gawd

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    Pretty much exactly why I bought 16GB lol. $79 on sale for a decent kit, decided to just go for the overkill. I was dying with only 4GB DDR2 on my previous setup toward the end of it's life (huge browser sessions open + trying to play BF3 = nope).
     
  40. DejaWiz

    DejaWiz Oracle of Unfortunate Truths

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    Yep, I'm loving these current memory prices. I recall how ecstatic I was when the price of the G.Skill 2x2GB DDR2-800 kit dropped to $64.99 on Newegg about 5-6 years ago. And I was thinking that memory was getting so cheap back then!