Is There Any Hope In Choosing A LCD

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LiquidFlame

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I’ve been on the hunt in trying to choose a 24” LCD and it seems impossible. After reading many reviews and posts I narrowed it down to the BenQ FP241WZ and the Dell UltraSharp 2407WFP-HC. It was pretty hard in choosing which one, but after I read about the blackouts that can occur with the BenQ, I took it off my list because that is totally unacceptable for a $600+ LCD. I thought I had my mind made up and was going to get the Dell, but I then stumbled upon this post in the Dell forum: http://www.dellcommunity.com/suppor...thread.id=81254&view=by_date_ascending&page=1

Apperantly there is a really bad ghosting issue with the monitor. I know every monitor well have ghosting, but this sounds like it’s an actual defect. After reading this, I was pretty pissed off. It seems like manufactures don’t care any more about their products. How can a company sell a $600+ LCD and think its ok if has a couple of defects. Keep in mind, I’m not talking about ghosting or dead pixels, I can understand that, but for a monitor to have blackouts or defects with color, it’s not acceptable.

I’m completely lost and have no idea what LCD’s to look at anymore. I’m starting to think that I should just not buy one and keep my 19” CRT that I’ve been using for 6 years. Does anyone have any guidance? Thanks.
 
I'm in the exact same situation :)

The Dell 2407WFP-HC ghost/shadow issue will probably be fixed (http://www.dellcommunity.com/suppor...iew=by_date_ascending&message.id=81607#M81607) so that's good news. Although I'm still scared of some input lag reports i've read.

I'll probably be sticking to my 19" CRT NEC FP950 for some months, waiting for a new revision of the Dell 2407WHP-HC. Seems like the only good option to me... Or maybe I should have bought the Rev04 non-HC :rolleyes:,
 
LIQUID, the 24 inch LG246WPBN thats what I went with, 599 at best buy, best 24 inch panel, same lcd panel as the benq but without the benq problems and without the dell lottery, most everyone is happy with their LG246, I dont often recommend products but this panel is fantastic.
 
conghelach,

I have been looking into that LCD, have you heard of any issues with it? Also I've heard some good things about the SAMSUNG 245BW. Any one have an opinion on this LCD as well?
 
Well from the reviews that I've been reading, the LG L246WP-BN, sounds like the perfect LCD to get. Although I did hear about an issue with it when it goes into sleep mode, what is this? On the plus side, it uses the same panel as the BenQ, but doesn't have the issues that the BenQ has. I'm thinking of picking it up at best buy today when I get off of work, what do you guys think?
 
LF, I am in the same boat as you.....it is getting harder and harder to get an LCD.

I have the Dell 24" WFP Rev 4 the model before the HC and they fixed a few problems from Rev 2 and Rev 3 but i still see many shades of Red and Green when looking at print on the screen.

I bought a 22" Samsung CW....the latest and greatest and it was terrible......

So now, after reading the post that led to some other forum yesterday and all the problems with the HC....I guess the LG is the way to go.

But like you said so well...."Is there any hope in choosing a LCD?" My answer is that there is a slim hope but I believe we have to settle.

God luck

Elliot
 
Well, if I do pick up the LG today, I'll post back letting you know what I think, but I'm not an expert in LCD's, so I don't know how valuable my info will be.
 
I'm very interested to hear your thoughts as I'm in the same boat as the rest of you guys. I just can't seem to find the "perfect" monitor.
 
After pretty exhaustive "research" for the last week or so, as well as going and actually seeing the monitors in person at B&M stores, you really have to be utlra clear on what your goal with the monitor is. ie., For me, I have no consoles, am not a gamer at all, and really only want one for regular PC use and to watch movies on. So the one that's for me may not have certain options or be the best for use with consoles or for gaming.

And definitely go and actually see the monitors at stores, play around with their settings in store if possible (Best Buy, Future Shop, etc. let you tinker as much as you want with the display models).

And lastly, buy them with a solid return policy like Future Shop's. I'm getting at least 2 monitors this weekend and I have 2 weeks to test them out. I'll return the one that isn't up to snuff.
 
The LG 24" HD LCD L246WP-BN went on sale today at BB for $499......Instant savings of $100 off the $599 price......

I don't think you are going to find it any better than this until a new model comes out and they need to blow these out the door.

Regards

Elliot
 
elazarus said:
The LG 24" HD LCD L246WP-BN went on sale today at BB for $499......Instant savings of $100 off the $599 price......

I don't think you are going to find it any better than this until a new model comes out and they need to blow these out the door.

Regards

Elliot
Click to expand...

I'm about to pick this up and I'm also getting a free shipping deal, which is really nice since it offsets the tax.
 
Does anyone have any opinions on the Samsung 245BW? I like the LG but I was wondering about the Samsung...
 
Will I picked up the LG from Best Buy for $499 and all I can say is I'm really disappointed. The first one I bought, the stand didn’t fit right so I had to take it back to get another. Once I got back with the second one I set it up and it all seemed ok until I tired watching a movie on it. I noticed that about an inch down the screen there is a rectangle band that stretches across the entire screen where everything is offset. The image isn’t aligned right and it runs slower, also it seems like the colors are very grainy when I watch a movie. I hope this makes sense; I’ll try posting an image later when I get home. I do have to say that I really like the size of it, but it seems yet again, I cannot find a good LCD. Has anyone else had this issue or knows how to correct it?
 
no chance at all

at least not for the first 10 years coming...

been trying to find one for about 3 years now
 
Scarby Jones said:
Does anyone have any opinions on the Samsung 245BW? I like the LG but I was wondering about the Samsung...
Click to expand...

i've got that samsung and its really quite a good monitor *if* you can get it for a good price. the LG is better but maybe not by as much as you'd think depending on if TN panels bother you or not.

i find my samsung more than i could ask in every way except it has that classic TN problem of vertical viewing angle/colour shift. doesn't bother me much, but if it does bother you look at the LG.

i'd try them both at a store with a lax return policy. buy them both, and try them out for a week or whatever they'll allow under their refund policy. take back the one you don't like.
 
I have a Samsung 204BW and I'm looking to get a 24" widescreen display. I'd have NO problem going with the Samsung 245BW (A friend has it and I've used it) regardless of it's TN heritage. I don't have any problem with my current TN display. The viewing angles aren't bad and I only connect it to my computer. However, the 245BW has one thing that is VERY irritating: the gloss bezel. I'd be fine with it if only the flat, broad area that parallel to the screen (the part facing the user, there the buttons and samsung branding are) were glossy. However, the inset of the bezel - the part between the broad area mentioned above and the screen, the little perpendicular inset - is glossy too and that makes me angry. Why? Because I constantly see mirror reflections of my desktop icons and games. Why is Samsung so stupid?

Because of that I thought to try the Dell out - but the inverse ghosting defect bothers me as well. The BenQ has issues - and for $600+ I'd expect no isses AND a 1:1 pixel mapping for all those inputs. The LG seems ok except you have to convert your DVI to HDMI (that and the glossy base pisses me off, lol).

There's really no choice. I should have gone with the Samsung 244T last year =\
 
Thanks for the posts on this stuff. I tried both the LG and the Samsung. I really like the LG so far. LiquidFlame I am sorry that you have had those issues with the LG with mine I have not noticed this. I am running the monitor in 1920 x 1200. If you need me to I will take a picture of mine so that we can compare. I have noticed a lot of the other issues in the other brands that have been mentioned... I am on my 4th different 24 inch monitor it really does seem hard to find a good one, and honestly I am not even sure if I trust this one. I can still see a little bit of a shadow effect when I move my mouse over a white background. So far for games and surfing it seems to be pretty good and I have not noticed the shadowing in games. I have an 8800gtx and am finally pushing the graphics card on FPS games.
 
Hmm. I'd try looking into the LG, but I have a few questions.

1) Does the DVI -> HDMI converter introduce lag or make you lose any signal? Or have any negative effects? I don't want this monitor primarily because of the HDMI.

2) 8ms lag?? What the.

3) Is it possible to mount it on a different stand?

(On a side note, do TN panels have overdrive too? I'm on a Samsung 204B right now and I don't notice any input lag. So either it's not there or I'm not sensitive enough)

Thanks.
 
antioch,

1. Not that I know of / could tell.

2. It is 2ms more than the 6ms of the other monitors however I believe the Black to Black is still all rated the same. If you look at reviews it should be very similar.

3. If you took it apart I suppose you could. The Arm is actually on the unit when you get it out of the box and then you put it on to the base with a screw. I know on the Samsung 245BW it is VESA wallmount compatible but I am not sure on the LG.

I am not sure of the overdrive on the TN panels but from what I could tell all of the 24 inch monitors I have tried have some kind of shadowing / ghosting effect if you look hard enough you will see it. I have noticed by looking at the screen as a whole and not focusing on the text or the mouse moving you will not notice it. Let me know if you have more questions and I will try to help.

I have been playing CS:S and it appears to be keeping up pretty good. I would like to compare it to a CRT in regards to response time. One thing that was already mentioned on here is to just buy it and try it out to see if you like it... for some reason as per the thread these monitors seem to be the hardest purchase to make.
 
Damn.....I picked up the LG 24" today and have not even taken it out of the box....and I just read of your problem with it.

Without even seeing mine, I just know what we talked about over the weekend.....there is no go 24" or 22" for the price that they charge....ON SALE OR NOT.

I have been using my Dell today and I can't believe that every picture that I post process for the web looks different in each software package and they are all set to sRGB......

Elliot
 
Seems like the Westinghouse L2410NM has descent reviews on Newegg... and it's for $399 at the moment. Seems like a price you can't really beat. Although the only gripe seems that it doesn't have a DVI input, but that's about it...

Does anyone have experience with this monitor specifically with a ps3 like one of the reviewers on newegg had mentioned?
 
Well, my 204BW has ghosting when I move the mouse over this white text box - but that doesn't bother me. When I say ghosting I mean horrid ghosting or quite noticeable ghosting.

I'm having trouble deciding between the LG and the Dell. The Dell I know I can return, the LG I'm not sure about how much a d*ck BestBuy will be. And then theres the whole BenQ issue.

Ah - Also. What is the deal with the semi-gloss screen coating? I dislike gloss coating =\ It's hard to tell from pictures though.

Thanks for your help, I appreciate it.
 
Well guys I feel really stupid and I owe LG an apology. Turns out it wasn’t the monitor at all that was causing my issue. I went to a different Best Buy and picked up my third one hoping that everything would be fine. Once I turned it on it seemed ok, then I tested it again with the same movie and to my horror, I saw the same issue. It didn’t make sense to me that two in a row would have this defect, especially when no one else was saying they had this issue. So I tried running the movie on a different video player, previously I was using Windows Media Player, but this time I tired it on my Nero Media Player, and the picture was fine. I felt really stupid, because I don’t know why I didn’t try that with the last monitor and I probably sent back a perfectly good one. So it looks like Windows is at fault, does anyone know why this would be happing because I would also like to use Windows Media Player; I’m guessing it’s the refresh rate or something?

The thing that makes me really upset, is the monitor that I took back seemed like all the pixels were good, but this third one that I got, there is one pixel towards the center of the screen, that takes a longer time to change its color (about 5 seconds, I know it’s not long, but its long enough to notice). I notice it when I go from something white to black. I ran two programs, CheckeMon, and Nokia LCD Monitor Test and had them run some random background colors, and it seemed to fix the pixel. After the programs ran, I didn’t notice the pixel, but it could have been because I was staring at the screen for so long, so after work I’m going to check it again. Can anyone else recommend some programs or are the one’s that I’m using fine, also does anyone know how to fix my pixel, or am I out of luck? Thanks.

Oh Scarby Jones, what settings are you using for your colors?
 
antioch,

The slight gloss coating really is not noticeable. It is not like the TrueLife displays or the HP 2408. I think that is what you are referring to if not let me know.


LiquidFlame,

Right now (kind of embarrassed about this) I am using the default settings (100 contrast 61brightness 100 RGB) I have not messed around with it much. I am really trying to get a feel for the monitor to make sure I like it. So far I think it is one of the better 24 inch panels on the market.

If you could take a picture of what the Windows MP is doing I would like to look at it as I am not 100% sure what would be causing it.

As for your stuck pixel what you are doing with the 2 programs should help/fix it. The other thing I heard was that if it really was stuck and not budging you can lightly massage the spot (be careful when doing this not to put too much pressure on the screen) this should help the stuck pixel... if not and it is in the center you might want to get one more panel. Manufacturers usually have a rule that it has to be a certain number of dead pixels before they will do anything.

Let me know what colors you have on the monitor so we can compare as I know I need to calibrate it. I know everyone has different rigs and panels are not exactly the same... however the computer I built also is using an 8800GTX card hopefully even though panels can be different I can still get an idea of what you have yours set at. Let me know if you have any more questions.
 
Scarby - How is the arm attached to the monitor?
Also, what is the minimum height the LCD will move down to (from desk top to bottom edge of LCD bezel).

Thanks!
 
I know it's a bit small compared to the ones mentioned in this thread, but I just got a Dell 2007wfp 20". Absolutely zero backlight bleed, not a single dead pixel, no ghosting that I can tell, height adjustable, can be turned on it's side for vertical viewing, and showed up at my house 2 days after ordering it. I couldn't be happier. S-IPS too, like everyone is getting lately.
 
Scarby Jones,

When I get off of work today, I'll try posting a picture and the color settings that I am using. The programs seemed to fix the one pixel, but I have found another one that seems like it won't go away. I'll try the rubbing method to see if that helps, but I might be returning the monitor because of this pixel, plus I just got a flat tire yesterday and had to buy myself two new tires since one of the other ones treed was pretty low. I’ll post back later tonight and maybe also PM you.
 
Do let us know if you decide to return the monitor and not get another LG replacement.


Again: How low is the lowest the stand will let the monitor go?
 
Ok guys, here are some pictures that I took that show the problem pretty well.






As to my settings I'm just using the default for HDMI PC
 
LiquidFlame (And everyone else) - Do you notice the picture, while having bright colors, being slightly unclear and or unclean? Is the text crisp? (As crisp/clean as other LCDs you've used) Is your brightness and contrast changed from the default?

One person posted here (http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1218412) that he noticed such issues. This worries me as I am very close to purchasing this monitor.

I also saw one post somewhere where the poster claimed that the LG doesn't display dark colors well with lowered brightness, that they all group together into a "mucky glob."

Also, there are no drivers for this display on LG's website. What the heck?!
 
antioch,

I am no expert on LCD's, but the LG does look pretty good, the picture quality is pretty good and I had no issue with the brightness. My best advice would be to go to Best Buy pick one up for $499, which is extremely cheap, test it out for yourself, and if you don't like it, you have 14 days to return it. I will be returning mine today because mine has a dead pixel and I'm pretty picky when it comes to anything electronic, and when I paying that kind of price, I expect the monitor to work with all my applications. Good Luck.
 
:pThis may or may not be on topic, but I think the LCD technology for people who are still "holding out" will never be what their looking for. I came to this realization when I went through a phase of "well everyone else has an LCD and I'm still using a CRT maybe I should try them now and they can't be that bad cause its now the standard". I even went through it with TV's as well buying all of the latest LCD TV's like the samsung 4665f etc... and all having some sort of problem that gave me that buyers remorse soon after owning it. Then I plunked down the extra cash for a Panasonic 50" 700U 1080P Plasma. I think the plasma tech is much more of what die hard CRT owners are looking for. I also bought a DVI to HDMI cable to hook my PC to it and dear god is it beautiful. No lag whatsoever and no blurring or ghosting even when playing CS:S with constant 300 fps rates. If they made a plasma at a reasonable size (24"-30") with good resolution, i'd be all over it for my PC display. Obviously, I get some image retention now and then if I leave a static image on the screen for a while, but I could easily be careful of that and have the rest of the picture technology be rock solid vs. a screen that has an uneven backlight that never goes away or ghosting or any of those other permanent "defects".

Just my .02
 
Yes, LCD cannot compare to Plasma any day of the week.....

I looked at Plasma AND LCD 1 1/2 years ago and bought a 50" Pioneer...never looked back....a few months later I needed another screen for our media room and took a quick look at 42" LCD vs Plasma......

Within an hour I was on the phone to the guy I purchased from and a 42" Pioneer was delivered a few days later...same picture quality....EXCELLENT

I put up a post of having the LG 24 and the Dell 2407 (non HC but rev 4) side by side and I am driving myself nuts as the 2 pictures are so different.....colors, clarity, brightness, you name it.

LCD's just don't have it yet.

Elliot
 
elazarus, I was all set to buy the L246 until I read your thread :(

While I am not a die hard CRT fan, and I realize that LCDs still have issues, I am complaicent with my Samsung 204B TN LCD. Yes, its backlighting is uneven and bleeds a bit, its viewing angles are lacking, and the colors might not be as good as other technologies - but it doesn't bother me. While those issues will exist on the L246 as well, the L246's severity will be less than my 204B.

However, after you complained about text cleanliness I became worried. I would go out to BestBuy and pick one up to try it out but for some reason all 6 area stores don't carry the L246 - odd. Anyways, the nearest store that does stock it is 35 miles away, so I want to make sure it's worth the trip. Can you please post a picture showing this unclean text as compared to your Dell's immaculate text?

Thanks!
 
antioch said:
Also, there are no drivers for this display on LG's website. What the heck?!
Click to expand...

Tried Windows update yet?? They usually always have the monitor drivers listed in the other hardware section.
 
No. I dont yet have the LCD so I haven't tried. But unfindable drivers is a big turnoff.

Have you found them there?
 
I don't know, it's obviously highly subjective, but I've been using my LCD side by side with my CRT and it just whoops it in every way. The colours, brightness, text sharpness/clarity, movies, etc. I admit I am not a big gamer and if you're super anal-ytical about it, there's probably some shortcomings, but I've played ET and Q3 for a while last few days and I can notice no real difference, and I've been playing Quake for 10-11 years, at one time competitively in LAN tournaments and such-- I definitely know when something isn't right with performance. And my CRT is a killer NEC that despite some power issues lately, still looks fantastic. Just not even close to the Samsung LCD.

With that said, of course LCD is no perfect technology, for there is no such thing of course. It's still fantastic in many ways and I'm very happy with my monitor.
 
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