Intel 8 Core

ZodaEX said:
It depends on the specific application you are running. All my games run faster on a higher clocked duel, but then on the flip side winrar and video encoding is faster on the lower clocked quad. Like most things it's a tradeoff and I don't like running super hot CPUs that incorporate both attributes.
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I would mostly be using the Creative Suite by Adobe. That's really what I am looking to run.



Still have these questions


Why chose 2011 over a dual 1366 board like this, other than upgrade paths? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813131652

In Video do you think it's more beneficial to have more cores, or more processors, or is it the same. And is it more beneficial to have a higher clock speed, and less cores, or the opposite?



Looking for a few more votes on what to do here. So for Video Editing which of these options would be most beneficial? And Why?

Single i7-3960X

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813131652 with Two Xeon Proc's http://ark.intel.com/products/series/39565

Or a single of the new 8 core Xeon's http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Xeon/T...0E5-2600.html# with the possibly of adding another later. Consider it with only one Proc for now though.
 
Single 8 core with capability to add another down the road gets my vote.
 
Tsumi said:
1366 is a dead socket. There is no upgrade path for 1366, while 2011 was just recently released, and will probably be around for at least another 2 years. The rumored Ivy Bridge-E (note, rumored, has not been confirmed yet) should be able to drop into 2011 platforms.
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OK so I will be able to upgrade to Ivy bridge-E when they come out. I don't really see a benfit in Ivy-bridge other than a better TDP is that the only thing to look forward too in IVB-E? I mean if they are both going to be 8 cores and 10cores and nothing better? Or is this a incorrect statement?
 
IB will have some minor changes that will be more processing efficient than SB clock for clock, and the rumors are stating anywhere between 3% to 30% faster. *shrug*
 
Keep in mind, when dealing with render times (video, 3d or sound) even single digit percentage increases are good because they lead to a faster finished product/job. I don't have cash to burn, but I would consider anything over 15-20% increase as a valid reason for upgrading (especially in dcc).
 
So from the time sb-e comes out till mid2013 there will not really be anything new is that right? So when the SB-E processors come out then I should probably buy, right?

So it seems everyone votes for this option. Right?

Or a single of the new 8 core Xeon's http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Xeon/T...0E5-2600.html# with the possibly of adding another later. Consider it with only one Proc for now though.
 
sonicboom said:
Keep in mind, when dealing with render times (video, 3d or sound) even single digit percentage increases are good because they lead to a faster finished product/job. I don't have cash to burn, but I would consider anything over 15-20% increase as a valid reason for upgrading (especially in dcc).
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Same here 3% to 30% I mean what the heck even if it is in the top 20% to 30% I am not sure if I would buy for that price.
 
The performance gains are in line with Intel's tick-tock strategy. Architecturally, Ivy Bridge and Ivy Bridge-E will be extremely similar to Sandy Bridge and Sandy Bridge-E, with a few minor tweaks and adjustments. This gives Intel time to mature the 22nm manufacturing process that IB and IB-E will be using. The gains of the smaller manufacturing process will be lower TDP and possibly higher overclock. In the case of IB-E, it will gain two additional cores over SB-E on the consumer desktop side.
 
Why would you get a i7-3960X over the i7-3930K other than the 3mb of cache and is it worth the extra $450?
 
ComputerGeek said:
Same here 3% to 30% I mean what the heck even if it is in the top 20% to 30% I am not sure if I would buy for that price.
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Rumor also has it that the prices of IB will be pretty much in line with SB.. so no price hikes for the newer tech. Of course, the biggest issue we'll face is the price gouging from resellers...
 
I cant see replacing my 6 core sandy unless the IBE stomping its face in and I dont see how being its the same architecture with noting more than a Die shrink. Unless the 8 core has some really spiffy features and is in fact an 8 core.
 
tangoseal said:
I cant see replacing my 6 core sandy unless the IBE stomping its face in and I dont see how being its the same architecture with noting more than a Die shrink. Unless the 8 core has some really spiffy features and is in fact an 8 core.
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I agree for existing SB/SBE owners, then IB/IBE will likely not be an upgrade worthy of spending the money on.

For people that are wanting/needing to perform a full overhaul, then it may be worth the wait for 1155 IB given it's lower TDP and better performance.

I was about to pull the trigger on getting a Z68 MoBo and 2500K, but I'm going to wait just a little longer and get Z77 and IB for roughly the same price. I feel it's the best thing for my needs and hell, I've waited this long, so what's a couple/few more months? :p
 
Tsumi said:
The performance gains are in line with Intel's tick-tock strategy. Architecturally, Ivy Bridge and Ivy Bridge-E will be extremely similar to Sandy Bridge and Sandy Bridge-E, with a few minor tweaks and adjustments. This gives Intel time to mature the 22nm manufacturing process that IB and IB-E will be using. The gains of the smaller manufacturing process will be lower TDP and possibly higher overclock. In the case of IB-E, it will gain two additional cores over SB-E on the consumer desktop side.
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OK, I looked up Intels Tick-Tock Strategy, Sounds like a money making scheme to me.


Why would you get a i7-3960X over the i7-3930K other than the 3mb of cache and is it worth the extra $450?

And does any one know the release dates for SB-E, IB, and IVB-E I only found a few rumored dates.
 
ComputerGeek said:
OK, I looked up Intels Tick-Tock Strategy, Sounds like a money making scheme to me.
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Tick tock is FAR from a "money making" scheme.

ComputerGeek said:
Why would you get a i7-3960X over the i7-3930K other than the 3mb of cache and is it worth the extra $450?
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No it's not worth the extra $450. But it's based on a server part that does have that much cache (and server parts don't allow for overclocking, so the 3930K is clocked down a bit too... so the differentiation there is better). Also, Intel knows there are going to be "extreme" people who will buy this stuff regardless. If you have a problem with it, there are plenty of cheaper (and nearly as good) choices. (2500k/2700k/3570k/3770k/etc)

ComputerGeek said:
And does any one know the release dates for SB-E, IB, and IVB-E I only found a few rumored dates.
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2 of the 3 SB-E products are already released. 1 more (the i7-3820) is going to be released Q1 2012. If I remember correctly, this is priced around the $284 mark, but features little to no OC settings (no unlocked multi... and have fun with the clock strap settings). Pretty pointless.

IB Is going to be started to be released in April 2012, and every quarter there will be some slightly newer chips released (slightly higher clocks, more lower-end chips released, etc. This also might apply to the 3930k and 3960x).
IB-E is going to make its debut (this is more of a guess) Q4 2012 or Q1 2013.
 
Here is a timeline I keep. It keeps track of what products that intel releases (both WHEN, and the inital price... no price drops). This also excludes those power-efficient products, etc. The only one that is breaking the rule is the Q6600. That chip seemed to last FOREVER. It started north of $500 but I remember it being $199 for quite awhile at the end of its life.

Anything in "quotes" are chips named myself, but in intel leaked diagrams talk about new chips with a greater-than/or-equal-to sign in the front of their name (which indicates a possible higher-clocked variety).

intelmap.png


Here you can see that intel has the $133+ chips at least spoken about. Lower-end things will be talked about later in the year (like always).

Socket 1150 will make it's debut most likely in Q1 2013 and this will give us Haswell. (Just think about this release being like Sandy Bridge. New socket, new faster architecture, but the highend is still using the "old" socket (LGA2011 will be half way, or 1/3 way dead by now)). Q4 2012 probably being the time when IB-E is released to keep people enticed in LGA2011 a little longer.
 
Zero82z said:
Intel is a corporation. Everything they do is a money-making scheme. That's kind of the point.
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Well it's one of the points, but it also keeps things moving along at a quick pace (and a predictable one). Planning ahead for a corporation is a good thing, intel just happens to give it a name and people begin to criticize... I don't get it.

People for some reason think they need to upgrade every time there is a tick and tock... that shouldn't be the case for anyone who doesn't want to go broke. It does keep things always fresh though, die shrinks and newer+better microarchitectures is nothing bad.

Check out AMD's timeline. They have one too kind of, and it consists of similar plans... albeit a little less apparent (because they don't explicitly call it tick-tock).
 
colinstu said:
Well it's one of the points, but it also keeps things moving along at a quick pace (and a predictable one). Planning ahead for a corporation is a good thing, intel just happens to give it a name and people begin to criticize... I don't get it.

People for some reason think they need to upgrade every time there is a tick and tock... that shouldn't be the case for anyone who doesn't want to go broke. It does keep things always fresh though, die shrinks and newer+better microarchitectures is nothing bad.

Check out AMD's timeline. They have one too kind of, and it consists of similar plans... albeit a little less apparent (because they don't explicitly call it tick-tock).
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I didn't say it's a bad thing. However, it's important that people understand these are not charitable organizations that we're talking about. Pretending that they aren't in it for the money is a pretty silly thing to do.
 
Zero82z said:
I didn't say it's a bad thing. However, it's important that people understand these are not charitable organizations that we're talking about. Pretending that they aren't in it for the money is a pretty silly thing to do.
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Mhmm of course. I might of over-reacted to the point of it being only a money making scheme though.

And on the charitable organization point... heck that's why intel isn't even looking at 8-core being common on the desktop still. 1) Most apps don't need it 2) AMD's "8 core" (really 4 core) thing is a waste and doesn't compete, 3) Basically halves the amount of chips they can sell.

Haswell and Broadwell for the matter will continue to have 4-core chips for the most part (6 and maybe 8 core being $1000). Intel has no reason to make 8-core mainstream right now.

8 and 10 core products have been available as Xeon server parts since Q1 2010 and Q2 2011 respectively. We know it's already possible, again... just no point for the consumer.
 
Thanks colinstu for that chart really helps.

MIght you or you of the other fourm member have a chart for Xeons, I would like to find out about those.

Anyone else care to comment on this? Why would you get a i7-3960X over the i7-3930K other than the 3mb of cache and is it worth the extra $450

Also, I won't bee getting CS6 till April, However, I would like to get a rig bulit, tested, and running before the software comes out.

What would you guy's suggest doing at this point? I want a rig that is going to edit 4k video really well, the software won't be out till April (rumored) though. What would you suggest to do?

Thanks!
 
ComputerGeek said:
What would you guy's suggest doing at this point? I want a rig that is going to edit 4k video really well, the software won't be out till April (rumored) though. What would you suggest to do?
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Waiting until April would seem to be the intelligent course of action.
 
ComputerGeek said:
What would you guy's suggest doing at this point? I want a rig that is going to edit 4k video really well, the software won't be out till April (rumored) though. What would you suggest to do?
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I'd wait for April if I were you. The 3770k and 3930k are both pretty tasty looking chips, but with hearing you wanting to edit 4k and such, sounds like the 3930K will be the better choice. Q2 there is a possible chance of the 3930K coming out with a slightly OC'd version... but that's going to be useless if you're already going to OC it yourself.

Heck, buy the 3930K now. The only other thing you could wait for would be IB-E during Q4 2012... but that's pretty far off.
 
So you wait till right before Cs6 comes out then Buy?

Does anyone know the release dates for the Xeons, for both the SB-E and IVB? And possibly the chip nummbers These are the chips for Sb-e right?
http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Xeon/TYPE-Xeon E5-2600.html#

Also will there be no 10 core SB-E chips? There are already several 10 core chips for Socket 1567 is that socket dead as well of will it be reused on IVB?

Does anyone think that I should go with a Xeon setup instead of say the 3930K?
 
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ComputerGeek said:
So you wait till right before Cs6 comes out then Buy?

Does anyone know the release dates for the Xeons, for both the SB-E and IVB? And possibly the chip nummbers These are the chips for Sb-e right?
http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Xeon/TYPE-Xeon E5-2600.html#

Also will there be no 10 core SB-E chips? There are already several 10 core chips for Socket 1567 is that socket dead as well of will it be reused on IVB?

Does anyone think that I should go with a Xeon setup instead of say the 3930K?
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Unless you can spend $20k+ on a machine, I wouldn't worry about the 10-core Xeons. The socket is not dead btw. Not sure of specifics though.

Go with a 3930K.
 
colinstu said:
Unless you can spend $20k+ on a machine, I wouldn't worry about the 10-core Xeons. The socket is not dead btw. Not sure of specifics though.

Go with a 3930K.
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Would it really cost 20k? I thought that some of the chips not the 10 core, were ~1200.


Will Socket 1567 be reused on IVB?
 
ComputerGeek said:
Would it really cost 20k? I thought that some of the chips not the 10 core, were ~1200.


Will Socket 1567 be reused on IVB?
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You can get 10-core westmere-ex chips starting at $3000 a pop (easily go past $5000), but 1567 only comes in quad socket or greater configurations... so minimally you're looking at $12k in processors, $1000+ for a mobo, and good luck finding a case etc.
 
Didn't see the part where you are editing 4k video. That is 6 times as large as 1080p. Do you have your disk array planned out for that?

The disk array can also really add to the cost as well. I'll likely be reusing my old disk array in my new machine.

More cores is better for video editing software that will take advantage of all those cores but more cores is also pricier

LGA2011 will be replacing 1567 so you want to go with LGA2011 which will be compatible with IVB or so they say.

A dual processor socket 2011 rig will cost more then a single processor 3930 rig but offer more room for upgrades adding more cores or ram later. Dual processor server boards tend to be more reliable then desktop boards as well.

I'd say wait till April and CS6 is out and see the benchmarks and make your decision then knowing the price versus real life performance.

I'm looking at off the top of my head for my own upgrade later this year well after CS6 came out and I can look at benchmarks.
dual socket 2011 build
2 x e2609 4 cores @ 2.4 ghz over clocked to ?? ghz on air estimated $300 each based prerelease pricing.
EVGA SRX estimated $650 based on SR2 cost.
extra cpu cooler for second processor $40
estimated price $1290
vs
single socket 2011 build
3930k 6 cores @ 3.2 ghz overclocks to 4.0 ghz on air $600
Asus Rampage iv extreme $450
Total Price $1150

Assuming both take the same DDR3 which is the same price and I will be getting the same Corsair 1k PSU for both systems. Drives and everything else will cost same.

If the estimated price holds true the dual socket 2011 SRX most likely wins if the overclock is good. Thinking the e2609s should overclock to at least 3.0 ghz on air your looking at 8 cores at 3.0 ghz (Dual socket SRX) vs 6 at 4.0 ghz (single 3930 asus rampage 4) for $140 more.

Have to wait till the EVGA SRX and CS6 come out and see how well the SRX actually performs and benchmarks for both systems before making my decision. Pricing might change also.

Then there is the whole hackintosh aspect of it since I like to use Final Cut Pro.

Do you have a current machine or you starting from scratch and what is your budget for the new rig? Also are you willing to over clock are you running everything stock speeds?
 
colinstu said:
You can get 10-core westmere-ex chips starting at $3000 a pop (easily go past $5000), but 1567 only comes in quad socket or greater configurations... so minimally you're looking at $12k in processors, $1000+ for a mobo, and good luck finding a case etc.
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But, do you have to fill the whole board all at once on can you operate it with only one or two processors? I know I could operate my quad socket board with only one processor though it would disable a few features and with two Procs it was fully functional.

Also, 4 10 core Procs just ended on ebay for 500

http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTEL-XEON-...73?pt=CPUs&hash=item3f1304f539#ht_1138wt_1165

http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTEL-XEON-...51?pt=CPUs&hash=item4161e3ef03#ht_1138wt_1165

http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTEL-XEON-...29?pt=CPUs&hash=item4161d1c35d#ht_1138wt_1165

http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTEL-XEON-...67?pt=CPUs&hash=item3f12f41673#ht_1138wt_1165

Finding a cheap motherboard is a little harder.




Kirika said:
Didn't see the part where you are editing 4k video. That is 6 times as large as 1080p. Do you have your disk array planned out for that?
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I don't have any 4k to edit yet but I want to future proof somewhat, I really would like to get the RED SCARLET X it shoots 5k stills, 4k Video, and can be droped down to 120fps @ 1080p.

Oh and 4k is only 4 times as large as 1080. ;)

Well I currently have 7 1TB hard drives sitting on my shelf waiting to Go into a Raid 5 array.

LGA2011 will be replacing 1567 so you want to go with LGA2011 which will be compatible with IVB or so they say.
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Will the 2011 Motherboards be the same for the Xeons and the High End Proc's like the 3930K?

I'd say wait till April and CS6 is out and see the benchmarks and make your decision then knowing the price versus real life performance.
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That seems to be the General suggestion.

I'm looking at off the top of my head for my own upgrade later this year well after CS6 came out and I can look at benchmarks.
dual socket 2011 build
2 x e2609 4 cores @ 2.4 ghz over clocked to ?? ghz on air estimated $300 each based prerelease pricing.
EVGA SRX estimated $650 based on SR2 cost.
extra cpu cooler for second processor $40
estimated price $1290
vs
single socket 2011 build
3930k 6 cores @ 3.2 ghz overclocks to 4.0 ghz on air $600
Asus Rampage iv extreme $450
Total Price $1150

Assuming both take the same DDR3 which is the same price and I will be getting the same Corsair 1k PSU for both systems. Drives and everything else will cost same.
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Thanks for that pricing on those combo's, the 2011 had seemed to me to be a better choice just because of the upgradeability of the System.


Then there is the whole hackintosh aspect of it since I like to use Final Cut Pro.
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How easy is Hackintosh? I know you need to make sure the Proc's are intel, and other parts are compatible, but is that all? Also, have they come out with a 64 bit version last time I checked they hadn't.

Do you have a current machine or you starting from scratch and what is your budget for the new rig? Also are you willing to over clock are you running everything stock speeds?
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Well I Currently have a 4P Quad Core System with 8354 Opteron Processors at 2.2Ghz for a total of 16 cores so I am no stranger to multiprocessor systems, actually my build pretty much went off without a hitch, pretty glad of that. It's got a 1200w PSU, Dual DVI graphics card and what not. It's got 16GB memory however it's ddr2 so it doesn't do well with Video. I want to sell this one Before I go out and buy my next system, I have a laptop and a standby system that will hold me over in between builds. I was going to try to get $2000 with everything and 4 or 5 1tb hard drives. I don't know if that's a reasonably price though? Does anyone have any ideas of where I might try to sell it locally?

Thanks for the Help Guys.
 
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4k is 6 times the size of 1080p, get proper pixel counts before trying to compare the 2.

Second off, wait until the software comes out and read reviews that will tell you to scale either on core count or on core speed. Then you can choose AMD vs Intel. SR2 (and SRX) are going to be the only 2 OC able intel server boards you are gonna find, period, keep that in mind as well. Also, I would figure higher than 600$'s for a pair of quads, unless you are getting the slowest quads intel will make. I would just expect more.
 
Vaulter98c said:
4k is 6 times the size of 1080p, get proper pixel counts before trying to compare the 2.

Second off, wait until the software comes out and read reviews that will tell you to scale either on core count or on core speed. Then you can choose AMD vs Intel. SR2 (and SRX) are going to be the only 2 OC able intel server boards you are gonna find, period, keep that in mind as well. Also, I would figure higher than 600$'s for a pair of quads, unless you are getting the slowest quads intel will make. I would just expect more.
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OK, I am not sure how you are getting the 4k is 6 times 1080p thing. You must remember that 4k is a horizontal measurement whereas 1080p is a vertical measurement, so the pixel count will vary with Aspect Ratio. If you shooting in 4:3 (Who shoots in that any more?) then 4k will be 8.09 times the size of 1080p. However, if you are shooting in 16:9 standard widescreen the the difference will only be 4.55 times the size of 1080p. And more and more movies are tending to be cut in Panavision Ratio 2.39:1 the differerance between 4k and 1080 is only 2.51. This is why they choose a horizontal measurement vs a vertical measurement, because as movies are tending to get wider 4k will make the movies more efficient to store with a higher horizontal resolution.

Zero82z said:
And the heatspreaders clearly have "Intel Confidential" printed on them.
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OK, it was late, I totally missed that. :rolleyes: :eek:
 
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Kirika said:
LGA2011 will be replacing 1567
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Not exactly.

Looking at LGA2011 it seems to sit somewhere between 1356/1366 and 1567 in terms of capabilities.

1366 supports up to two sockets with three ram channels per socket. fast PCIe is supplied by one or two seperate IO hubs providing a total of between 24 and 72 fast PCIe lanes (maybe 76 if the DMI on the second IOH can be repurposed but if that can be done i've never seen a diagram that shows it)

1567 supports up to eight sockets with four flexible memory buffers (each providing two ram channels) per socket. I'm not sure what the most PCIe you could theoretically have is but most boards i've seen diagrams for had 1-2 IO hubs giving similar PCIe availability to the top end of dual 1366 boards (trying to add more would probablly lead to the problem of simply running out of space)..

1356 supports up to two sockets with three ram channels per socket, 24 PCIe lanes on the first socket and 28 PCIe lanes on the second socket.

2011 supports up to four sockets with four ram channels per socket. 40 PCIe lanes on the first socket and 44 PCIe lanes on the second (and presumablly subsequent but I can't find any direct conformation of that) sockets.

Afaict no replacement for LGA1567 at the really high end has been announced yet.
 
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Ivy Bridge-E will have some minor microarchitectural tweaks (so you'll see ~6% IPC gain), but the main thing on the LGA 2011 side is that you'll start seeing > 8 cores (on the 2P platform, 10C/20T or 12C/24T are very likely).

However, if you're just looking for a beast rendering workstation that you just want to "set and forget" for several years, I'd have no problems just recommending a pair of Westmere-EP 6C/12T chips and just rocking them.

The 8C/16T Sandy Bridge-EP chips will be very expensive if you're looking for the higher clocked ones anyway, so...yeah.
 
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