I'm BORED with the XBOX 360!?!?

[Marvelous]

ORiginal xbox had like 100 FPS shooter games and most of the platforms, adventure games were garbage. Seriously if you have a good computer it's really not worth to buy an xbox 360.

I can only name only a handful of games that is even worth paying for a game on the xbox. It'll be the same with xbox 360. PGR? I thought the gameplay is alright. I thought Forza was a better game than PGR series. I think DOA series suck hard too.

All platforms are overly done to a point that it's really getting boring unless it has a good story and game play. Why don't they just make different types of games? Why don't developers make games like Star Control anymore? That game had role playing and arcade space combat and a really good story all in one. I haven't seen too many space combat games anymore.

Why don't they take a chance and develop something else instead of the same old rehash of the same thing. They always play it safe and develop series after series. Then once in a decade we get something like Grand Theft Auto.

 

[alkoholik]

I do like the FPS genre. I played the Kameo demo and even though it's 3rd person it was really fun.

If you're into Zelda type games then maybe you should have looked at the 360 game lineup before purchasing one. The 360 doesn't even have an RPG yet. It's practically all sports and FPS right now.

There is supposed to be a new Sonic for the 360 released this year, maybe that will appeal to you.

AGAIN THAT IS NOT THE POINT OF THIS THREAD!!!!
I am not bashing the 360 or its games!!! I like the lineup and I enjoy the graphics, etc....what I am trying to get across is....is this next gen of consoles taking a step backward by basically taking a step forward with the graphics?? Does anybody get what I am trying to say here???

 

[alkoholik]

All platforms are overly done to a point that it's really getting boring unless it has a good story and game play. Why don't they just make different types of games? Why don't developers make games like Star Control anymore? That game had role playing and arcade space combat and a really good story all in one. I haven't seen too many space combat games anymore.

Why don't they take a chance and develop something else instead of the same old rehash of the same thing. They always play it safe and develop series after series. Then once in a decade we get something like Grand Theft Auto.

Finally, someone gets what I'm saying!!

 

[The_Tecknishen]

a modded xbox with an emulator is worth its weight in gold

amen to that!

 

[Naldo]

Now my memory may be a little fuzzy, but as I remember gaming was the same back then as it is now, there were tons of games that were just copies of other games (I can name about a dozen double dragon clones, a dozen mario clones, etc.), plenty of games came out with sequels that added little if anything to the game ( Ninja Gaidnen, Mega Man, Double Dragon, etc.), and most of the games that came out werent really all that good (there were like 700 NES games, how many of them do you remember fondly?) and replay value definatly wasnt a strong point in almost all of the games back then.

I think its not the fact that the older games are any better that makes people enjoy them so much, its the memories that go along with playing those games that make them seem alot better than they actually were.

Thats my take on it.

Also as for the graphics > gameplay thing, imo they go hand and hand, typically the game designers that put alot of effort into the graphics also put alot of effort into the rest of the game as well. There are some exceptions where you find a game that look pretty bad but is fun (katamari damacy), but they are few and far between, most good games have good graphics.

 

[alkoholik]

if the older games didnt have replay value then why did nintendo re-release a lot of their older "classics" for the gameboy/DS?

just the other day I played mario 3, castlevania, micro machines, rc pro am, soul caliber 2, and metroid. i can play those games over and over again.

as for the nintendo having over 700 games....you do have to realize that the system was introduced in the mid 80's and lasted to the early 90's and had almost no competition. every developer and their mother made a game for that system.

Sure there were sequals and whatnot on that system but for example the differences between mario bros 1, 2 and 3 were incredible and definately genre chaning.

 

[cb9fl]

How do you expect game manufacturers to be really innovative when there have been thousands upon thousands of games made?

I mean unless they come out with a game were you play Harvey Keitel raping a nun I just don't see much room for a truly new type of game.

 

[Naldo]

if the older games didnt have replay value then why did nintendo re-release a lot of their older "classics" for the gameboy/DS?

just the other day I played mario 3, castlevania, micro machines, rc pro am, soul caliber 2, and metroid. i can play those games over and over again.

as for the nintendo having over 700 games....you do have to realize that the system was introduced in the mid 80's and lasted to the early 90's and had almost no competition. every developer and their mother made a game for that system.

Sure there were sequals and whatnot on that system but for example the differences between mario bros 1, 2 and 3 were incredible and definately genre chaning.

When I think replay value I think "If I beat this game this week, will I be able to play it next week and still have a good time", not "if I beat this game this week, will I be able to enjoy it a year or two from now", I guess I should have cleared that up. I could pull Resident Evil 2 out of my closet and have a blast palying it, but I definatly wouldnt say the game has good replay value (ie. doing the exact same stuff everytime you play it and getting the exact same results).

As for the NES, disregard the NES, lets take a look at the SNES, which had quite a bit of competition, and the things I mentioned above still apply to it, take a look at the PS1, same situation, it applies to every system. I just picked out the NES because its the oldest system I had alot of experience with.

 

[alkoholik]

How do you expect game manufacturers to be really innovative when there have been thousands upon thousands of games made?

I mean unless they come out with a game were you play Harvey Keitel raping a nun I just don't see much room for a truly new type of game.

somebody ALWAYS comes out with something that is new, innovative and fresh as someone said "once in a decade".....3 examples:

Grand Theft Auto
Half Life 1
Super Mario Bros

With all 3 of those games there were similar style games out but those changed the genre and were copied over and over....until we get what we have today...the same shit with updated graphics....I play 10 mins into some of these games and I'm bored to shit.

 

[Marvelous]

Why not? I can think of so many things you can do with 3D games.

They just don't put out quality anymore. I mean there are games that are still in that category but not enough. 1 person makes a good game then everybody follows.

People need to be original. But money talks. If they can make a game and take over small percentage of that game than that means they suceeded.

 

[alkoholik]

When I think replay value I think "If I beat this game this week, will I be able to play it next week and still have a good time", not "if I beat this game this week, will I be able to enjoy it a year or two from now", I guess I should have cleared that up. I could pull Resident Evil 2 out of my closet and have a blast palying it, but I definatly wouldnt say the game has good replay value (ie. doing the exact same stuff everytime you play it and getting the exact same results).

I think thats impossible to do with the older games as the AI isnt as advanced as it is now....games werent programmed that way. If you made move (a)....the computer would always make move (b)...and not have a variable in there. The only reason todays games are replayable is because of that and because of online multiplayer....something NONE of the older consoles had. I think the RE series is great as well....and it definately has replay value....i'm more inclined to play those games then some of my xbox games.

As for the NES, disregard the NES, lets take a look at the SNES, which had quite a bit of competition, and the things I mentioned above still apply to it, take a look at the PS1, same situation, it applies to every system. I just picked out the NES because its the oldest system I had alot of experience with.

not really sure what you mean....do u have examples?

 

[cb9fl]

What's innovative about HL or GTA?

The only thing that set HL apart was a really good story. The actual gameplay wasn't that different from other FPS games of the time.

As for GTA it just seems to have a lot of real life violence. The actual gameplay doesn't seem all that innovative.

All the basic genres seem to be covered. A good story and great graphics are what make a good game to me.

 

[JRT]

Well I just got me 360 today and I find Kameo to be fun and PGR3 is fun also.
However I am hooked on ZUMA, GW, and most of all Robotron.
Robotron was my game of choice back in the day.
I am 37 years old and grew up with all of the different games.
I love the marketplace classics and hope they come out with more such as Stargate Galaga.

Having said all of that, I want great graphics and great game play.
For me BOTH are a must, I must have sweet eye candy, but the game has to keep my interest too.

The thing is it is hard to be innovative and fresh, because it has all been done before.
In this world there are NO new ideas, everything has already been thought up, just not realized.
Same holds true for games, it has all been done before so there is little room for new development and innovation.

 

[alkoholik]

What's innovative about HL or GTA?

The only thing that set HL apart was a really good story. The actual gameplay wasn't that different from other FPS games of the time.

As for GTA it just seems to have a lot of real life violence. The actual gameplay doesn't seem all that innovative.

All the basic genres seem to be covered. A good story and great graphics are what make a good game to me.

you gotta be kidding me....if it wasnt for HL/CS then you probably wouldnt have seen the likes of UT, Doom, Far Cry, FEAR, etc...that game set the stage for ALL FPS. CS is by far and away the MOST popular game EVER...if you cant see what that game did for the industry then well, ur just blind.

The GTA series brought about that you can have violence, story and a map that you could roam around without limits or load times....games like THUG are based on that format as well as others (the getaway).

Like I said before....there are/were games out that were similar but these games stood out as the top of their classes and were copied by others

 

[DudeItsMe]

Ahhh I remember old school GTA. Alk is right, it gave you freedom to do whatever you wanted. Even if that meant piling up 30 cars and car bombing a firetruck to set them all off.

That game was crazy. I played some GTA2, then went back to the first GTA, and realized how damn FAST that game was. Especially on a Superbike. You would go maybe five seconds then crash, like every time Lol.

 

[CodeEx]

To the OP:

Yes. Everything you said is correct and I came to that realization about a year ago.

 

[alkoholik]

To the OP:

Yes. Everything you said is correct and I came to that realization about a year ago.

I actually realized it about a year ago as well when HL2 came out....just voicing my opinion now.

thanks for agreeing with me!

 

[RancidWAnnaRIot]

AGAIN THAT IS NOT THE POINT OF THIS THREAD!!!!
I am not bashing the 360 or its games!!! I like the lineup and I enjoy the graphics, etc....what I am trying to get across is....is this next gen of consoles taking a step backward by basically taking a step forward with the graphics?? Does anybody get what I am trying to say here???

yes i get what you're saying...

maybe you should look into the revolution

 

[xenogears]

I agree, how much more can you innovate an fps game now? What else is there that you can do differently? If the game is fun, the game is fun..no need to change it up.

 

[steviep]

I agree, how much more can you innovate an fps game now? What else is there that you can do differently? If the game is fun, the game is fun..no need to change it up.

Maybe they need to stop making so many damn cookie cutter FPS/GTA clones and RTS titles and start focusing on other things... so that some of us aren't so bored with the stale genres.

 

[Darakian]

Best FPS out IMO is natural selection, wonderful mix of fps and RTS, and you get to eat people
http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns/

Give it a try

 

[rayg]

Maybe they need to stop making so many damn cookie cutter FPS/GTA clones and RTS titles and start focusing on other things... so that some of us aren't so bored with the stale genres.

Until they stop making profits, they aren't going to change a damn thing, and they shouldn't...

 

[HHunt]

How do you expect game manufacturers to be really innovative when there have been thousands upon thousands of games made?

I mean unless they come out with a game were you play Harvey Keitel raping a nun I just don't see much room for a truly new type of game.

Bah. Ripoff of Custer's revenge.


And to stay on subject: I think I'll be buying Meteos next. Technically, it could probably have run on a NES, but it sort of requires a touchscreen. The DS seems to attract games like that.
The only games I've been playing lately is WoW (which sidesteps the replay value discussion a bit) and NFS:MW, because racing games are a good way to cease conscious thought for a while.
Oh, and I've been LANing BF 1942 lately.The final version of the Lost Hope mod is good, better IMO than BF2.

So. A MMORPG, a racing game (because I'm so familiar with them that I don't have to think), and a three year old FPS because the mods are good LAN fun. I very much see your point

 

[steviep]

Until they stop making profits, they aren't going to change a damn thing, and they shouldn't...

I disagree, though we all have our disagreements here. Personally I'm currently enjoying a PC game here and there (The Movies, Civ IV) and I've been playing a hell of a lot on my DS - it seems to be offering me some different games from the cookie cutter stuff I've been playing lately and am bored of. It will be a little while before I get back into FPS/RTS, that's for sure.

 

[Kahnvex]

FPS games are always going to fall victim to the repetition argument. There just happen to be some of them that combine elements we are all used to within a single game, that ends up making that game stand out.

I for one am loving the old school replayability of the Live Arcade games. I've always loved puzzlers too, and I get my fill of that as well. Bejeweled 2 is kicking my ass right now, and I love Hexic. My friends all joke that I use a 400 dollar console to play flash games. I can't wait for some old school refreshed titles on the Revolution, provided the pricing model is in line with what I feel the games are worth.

I got bored only having one game on my 360, but if I had unlimited funds, there are at least 5 titles I would be able to amuse myself with until march. I've only got NFS:MW and DOA4 for it, so instead of playing those to exhaustion, I've loaded up my cube to play some games I bought and never opened. I just switch between them to play a little of each systems offerings

 

[alkoholik]

FPS games are always going to fall victim to the repetition argument. There just happen to be some of them that combine elements we are all used to within a single game, that ends up making that game stand out.

I think game developers just need to take more risks then just implimenting the "best of" from other successful games. It just seems for the most part that they go for the quick buck rather then just come up with something new. I havent played a game recently where I said HOLY SHIT that was a cool game....rather I find myself saying ah, it was ok or I'm just bored to tears.

I for one am loving the old school replayability of the Live Arcade games. I've always loved puzzlers too, and I get my fill of that as well. Bejeweled 2 is kicking my ass right now, and I love Hexic. My friends all joke that I use a 400 dollar console to play flash games. I can't wait for some old school refreshed titles on the Revolution, provided the pricing model is in line with what I feel the games are worth.

Why do you think that a lot of people are enjoying the XBL marketplace games so much to the point they are enjoying them more or equal to the actual 360s games? Is it we are enjoying the arcade style games or just looking for something more simple?

 

[Slartibartfast]

you gotta be kidding me....if it wasnt for HL/CS then you probably wouldnt have seen the likes of UT, Doom, Far Cry, FEAR, etc...that game set the stage for ALL FPS. CS is by far and away the MOST popular game EVER...if you cant see what that game did for the industry then well, ur just blind.

He's blind, but you are claiming that HL inspired Doom??? HL set the stage for all FPS's???? Were you even alive in the 90's????? You wanna talk about FPS history let's talk about Wolf 3D or Ken's Labyrinth.

Now my memory may be a little fuzzy, but as I remember gaming was the same back then as it is now, there were tons of games that were just copies of other games (I can name about a dozen double dragon clones, a dozen mario clones, etc.), plenty of games came out with sequels that added little if anything to the game ( Ninja Gaidnen, Mega Man, Double Dragon, etc.), and most of the games that came out werent really all that good (there were like 700 NES games, how many of them do you remember fondly?) and replay value definatly wasnt a strong point in almost all of the games back then.

I think its not the fact that the older games are any better that makes people enjoy them so much, its the memories that go along with playing those games that make them seem alot better than they actually were.

I tend to agree with you on this point, there was not a lot of genre innovation back in the day either. But I do believe there was more. I think that the early to mid 90's saw a few genres invented that we are still stuck on: RTS, FPS, and 3D platforming. Personally, I think 2D platformers can be a lot of fun but I have never enjoyed a 3D platformer, though I will admit I have never played Mario 64, which from what I hear, is one of the few, if only, games to get it right. So while in the 80's things were mostly either shooters or platformers, a few new genres did show up, but that has definitely slowed. I think the DS is showing some interesting possibilities, as is the the Rev.

But what has really dissapointed me is the lack of maturity in the industry. Videogames today tend to be either simplistic, innocent fun, or shocking fun. As a medium games are still in their very infancy (and hence still designed to appeal to the masses, ie, the lowest common denominator), with a few notable exceptions. Interestingly though, this is similar to the current state of the film industry, but not entirely: films used to aspire to art, but now you have hollywood movies and unseen art films. Overall the arts are suffering as everything is turned into a product to sell. Videogames are only going to be widely respected after two things occur: the people who are too old to grok them now pass on, and games aspire to something higher than they do currently.

 

[cb9fl]

I don't think much can really be changed in the FPS genre. What risks in other genres do you want them to take? If you're so bored with current gaming then come up with some valid alternatives.

I think some people are enjoying XBL games because of their relative novelty and the fond memories of the past they bring.

 

[alkoholik]

He's blind, but you are claiming that HL inspired Doom??? HL set the stage for all FPS's???? Were you even alive in the 90's????? You wanna talk about FPS history let's talk about Wolf 3D or Ken's Labyrinth.

Not really....I think it may have come across that way just because I had so much stuff coming out of my brain. I do believe that Doom did come out prior to HL. I was just trying to say that HL's FPS story genre was a precursor for games like Doom 3 and such. Wolf 3D, Diablo and Ken's Lab were the early days FPS but none really told a story like HL. That was something new and fresh introduced to the genre.

I also agree with you on the movie industry as well. I was actually just thinking that the other day. I watched a couple of Christmas classics last month and just said...they really dont make movies like this anymore. It just seems that there was a higher class of acting back in the day. Could it be that we are so spoiled with the special effects/animations that the actual acting has suffered? Maybe that can also explain why nobody goes to the movies anymore.

 

[alkoholik]

I don't think much can really be changed in the FPS genre. What risks in other genres do you want them to take? If you're so bored with current gaming then come up with some valid alternatives.

I think some people are enjoying XBL games because of their relative novelty and the fond memories of the past they bring.

Why do I have to come up with alternatives. I am not a game developer...I just play the games. If I had the time and staff to come up with a novel concept for a new game I'd be making a lot money then I am now.

Last time I checked Geometry Wars, Bejewled and the like are newer games and dont have a past memory to bring up.

 

[eblislyge]

The gaming industry is suffering from the same problems the movie industry is having. They think that better graphics or more cgi and explosions equates to better games and more sales.

The undisputed fact of the matter is that FUN sales, not graphics.

I have been playing NEO GEO titles and having a blast. No there graphics are no where near our current Gen Consoles but alot of the games had a simplistic fun to them that no current Consoles offer.

 

[cb9fl]

My point with HL was that the actual gameplay wasn't fundamentally different from Quake, Quake II or even Doom. It's just that it had a really good story. I don't find having a really good story to be revolutionary.

Geometry Wars from what I've played is basically Asteroids. Where's the innovation there? They duped a 20+ year old game.

 

[Tiny]

Isn't Metronome coming out soon for the Xbox360? That is on my list.

 

[alkoholik]

My point with HL was that the actual gameplay wasn't fundamentally different from Quake, Quake II or even Doom. It's just that it had a really good story. I don't find having a really good story to be revolutionary.

Geometry Wars from what I've played is basically Asteroids. Where's the innovation there? They duped a 20+ year old game.

Its revolutionary because nobody had done it prior and nobody had even thought to incorporate a story into a FPS. I think youre just too stubborn or ignorant to understand where I am coming from.

Sure GW is just like asteroids and Bejeweled is just like tetris....right? C'mon guy give me a break.

 

[cb9fl]

Quake II had a story albeit a crappy one. Adding a good story to a FPS was just the next logical progression not something I see as innovation.

Unless I'm missing something big in Geometry Wars I don't see any major difference between that and Asteroids. A little ship spins around and blows up objects coming at it. I'm pretty sure you could even move the ship in Asteroids or one of the other clones from 20+ years ago.

 

[WorldRunner]

I think it has more to do with the Gamers themselves than it does the Games.

Just hear me out...

Almost all of us were poor when games were out previously. There was no bootlegging. (Sure you could copy your friends Wolfenstein if you wanted to but he was just as poor as you and had the same games)

We could only afford a few games...so we only purchased the very best ones. Mario Bros, Zelda, etc. With only a few games to play you thoroughly appreciated and enjoyed each game.

To compound that... Games were simple, straight forward, and easy to pick up and be playing w/ in 5 seconds.

I think the attention span of most gamers is so low that brilliant games get overlooked because the gamer just can't stand playing one game and enjoying it when there's so much involved in the game.

That's why FPS games like CS are so popular. It's easy... It holds your attention and doesn't really ask anything of you. You click on the icon and within a minute or so you're buying your M4 and rushing Bomb site A.

You mentioned PGR3 (which I think is an excellent game) so I'll use that as an example. You start the game...load your career.... (load times).... pick the race (load times) do the race... win but don't get hard core... re-race, re-race, re-race (load times in between) Ok...you got the hardcore medal. Now go onto the next race.

Go to the garage...upgrade your car, etcetcetc. Frankly this is just too much work for the ADD stricken people that are most gamers.

With bootlegging being fairly easy for most people to do as well as most of us now having a career with our own disposable income... Some of us have 100's of games. It's hard to keep your attention on one game when you have 99 other games sitting next to you say "HEY...REMEMBER HOW FUN I AM?! PLAY ME!"

Only to be followed by the same cycle over and over again...

I'm sorry but I don't buy the "old games are better" argument. There are very few old games that are even playable IMO. Sure it's like saying the 72 dolphins are the greatest team of all time. For their time they were the best...but they wouldn't stack up today against even the Houston Texans because of evolution.(Sorry that's the best parallel I can think of right now)

We all have a tendency to think fondly of the times in our life where we really didn't have any responsibility and could just come home from school and pop in a game and be playing within 5 seconds.

There are extremely challenging games out now... It seems like you just simply like these games better. You mentioned that you like GW2 and Smash TV but don't enjoy PGR3. It's probably because you just appreciate simple progressive games (difficulty progresses as you go along and climaxes with a ridiculous amount of difficulty near the end of the game)

Newer games do this too...it's just that the road to get there is not anywhere near the same as it is with older games. I could go on and on but I doubt anyone's going to read it anyway

 

[Caelum Atra]

IMO multiplayer has ruined all forms of gaming. That and EA/EA Sports.
When a company realizes they can make money by rehashing the same old shit and people will ALWAYS buy it, they will keep pumping out the same shit.

Let me pre-empt this: my PC gaming began because of Strike Commander, Civ 1 and Doom back in 92 when I was 12 when I built my first machine.

In regards to MP killing gaming. Look at CS. CS brought PC gaming to the forefront of everyones minds. It really sparked a revolution. Im no !!!!!!, I dont like cs AT ALL.
Yes half life was amazing, and so many older PC games were amazing as well. But CS came out and it was free, people like me that already had a machine downloaded that shit like mad and it was pretty fun for a little while, then word spread, more people started building machines that could run it. THEN, it was sold retail, and people bought that shit like mad. It was at Wal Mart, people who didnt normally game, or even looked on the internet, said hey, i can play a game on my computer and its cool looking, and im playing other people, and its instant gratification...cool.
Im sure that made EA (I say ea cause they are the evil empire of gaming) say hmmm...people are buying a game that has no plot, no story at all, no AI. And we only need to patch it everyonce and a while. Only one lvl at a time and those lvls are being created by the morons who bought the game, they would be doing our work for us, and this shit it being bought by the truck load. Wow, maybe we should do that. We dont even have to hire writers for that shit.
Then after doing that with a few titles, they took a page from the EA sports handbook, and decided, lets release expansions or sequals for every game we've made in the past year, and since they are playing it for the MP, since the SP is fucking pathetic, and it says 2 on it, they will definately buy it, when all it is is a patch but we called it a sequal. What a bunch of morons these people have turned into.
EA Sports handbook. Release the exact same game every year with one new feature that we've had planned for 10 years and a little prettier (I know, harder than it seems, but Im trying to make a point)
Sony too with the Final Fantasy line, but at least they are all different from each other.

I know I blame the companies here, but the blame falls squarely on the consumer. If they would stop buying sequals, stop buying WW2 games, DEMAND SP content, if enough consumers boycotted companies like EA, played games for over a month, hell over a week, maybe that would encourage them to make good games again. They have it in them, but why do they need to spend the money to bring it out and release good games, when the consumer will pay for thier defacation.

How many of you play emulators? /raises hand. Cause they were fun games with SP content

Play Operation Flashpoint
Play Independance War 2
Play Homeworld
Play Dues Ex
Play Tie Fighter
Play Bioforge
Play No one lives forever

Play good games and stop buying into the same shit, and MAYBE, just maybe it will change. Play more games with SP value and stop buying games for MP alone and you might see a change, cause in the end, its the consumers fault. And unfortunately mainstream gaming is too strong and too stupid to stop

[/end rant]
My opinion, rip it to peices if you like, I dont give a fuck

 

[cb9fl]

WorldRunner I agree with you almost 100%.

My girlfriend's 9 year old son hates HL2 but loves Sonic. It's not "innovation" it's just that he likes a simple game. I play Sonic with him some but it's so simple and aimed towards people with no attention span I can't get into it. I swear every two seconds you're jumping over some new hurdle or spinning through this loop. Just doesn't appeal to me.

 

[alkoholik]

You mentioned PGR3 (which I think is an excellent game) so I'll use that as an example. You start the game...load your career.... (load times).... pick the race (load times) do the race... win but don't get hard core... re-race, re-race, re-race (load times in between) Ok...you got the hardcore medal. Now go onto the next race.

Go to the garage...upgrade your car, etcetcetc. Frankly this is just too much work for the ADD stricken people that are most gamers.

I dont really see the fun of racing, re-racing the same exact track against the same exact cars just to get a better time....a 15 sec improvement or so....seems kinda pointless to me. WOW, I did the same track but 15 secs faster and I got 4,000 kudos to boot WOOT! Wow, big deal.

There are extremely challenging games out now... It seems like you just simply like these games better. You mentioned that you like GW2 and Smash TV but don't enjoy PGR3. It's probably because you just appreciate simple progressive games (difficulty progresses as you go along and climaxes with a ridiculous amount of difficulty near the end of the game)

Newer games do this too...it's just that the road to get there is not anywhere near the same as it is with older games. I could go on and on but I doubt anyone's going to read it anyway

Again, thats not correct. I do enjoy complex games. I like HL2 and I really enjoyed Doom 3 but thats not to say that I think they are so much superior to their originals (graphics/physics aside). I think that PGR3 is just too repetitive and gets boring after awhile. How many times can you race the same tracks...oh wait, its at night or hey its in reverse or lets try to get more kudos or a faster time. I played MotoGP on the original xbox and I really liked it. Its basically the same game as PGR but on a motorcycle but I find it to be more fun then PGR3.

 

[alkoholik]

Caelum Atra I agree with you 100%

Make more games like:
Metal Gear Solids
GTAs
HL
even Halo for that matter had descent SP content

On a side note with EA.....I really did enjoy NFSU2 (did not like NFSU1 at all). But seriously with pretty much all of their sports games they add 1 feature and re-wrap the same game and charge another $50-60 for it. Bunch of BS.....for example...the difference between Madden 05 and 06 is the passing QB vision....which most people HATE. I say bring back Madden for the N64 and Bulls Vs Blazers....I dont need to see Mike Vick's virtual sweat