I feel bad for id

[bipolar]

Again... Who is going to arrest me for illegally purchasing Doom 3? I know the RIAA likes to conduct raids on pirates, and I could understand if I stole the game. But I purchased it. Wal-Mart still has about a dozen copies on the shelf, so they are guilty of Criminal Facilitation.

Should I call Activision and turn myself in as the rapscallion I am for giving them 50 dollars for a product they make?

I'm being pissy because a reporter told me it was illegal to not answer direct questions from a reporter. That isn't against the law either.

The reason for street dates is to protect the smaller retailers. Large chain retailers, such as Best Buy and Wal-Mart, have their own warehouses and supply lines. Independent stores and smaller chains, including mall retailers like Gamestop and EB, get their products from independently owned "middlemen", who buy the game in mass quantities from Activision and ship it to the retail stores around the shipping date. The problem arises in that Best Buy's warehouses have likely had the game for a week or more. If there were no street date, they could have shipped it to retail stores or sold it online already, whereas the warehouses that supply independent stores have no incentive to getting their games out to each independent retailer that early. Consumers don't care about such details and would happily head out to Wal-Mart to buy the game a week before Joe's Software got the game. Joe's Software ends up getting shafted and, if this continues with all games, will likely end up going out of business. Even if the independent warehouses try to get the products to the retailers earlier, there's no way they can compete efficiency-wise with a streamlined operation like Wal-Mart. Small stores close, big stores profit, and the consumer's choices become more limited.

Personally, I'm happy to wait a few extra days if it means keeping place like EB, where I can find a nice selection of used games along with new games, a viable outlet.

 

[KAMAZON]

at a certain point, Doom 1 was the most *installed* game. Regardless, I'm glad I give doom 3 a test go before buying. Wow, it was not as revolutionairy as i expected.

 

[SYN ACK]

umm,

just because say, 20,000 people downloaded it from a torrent, doesn't mean those 20,000 were gauranteed to buy the game.

you guys are missing quite a bit of logic, here.

 

[obs]

Warez happens with EVERY game people. Stop acting like this is anything new. id and Activision will still sell a shit load of copies. Some "analysts" will take the number of downloaded copies and multiply it by $55 and come up with the amount id "lost" in sales, and it will still be as incorrect as when the RIAA does it. Just because people download a game doesn't mean they aren't going to purchase it nor does it mean they were ever going to purchase it.

Besides, id will make as much or more money of licensing the engine than in game sales, and I'm pretty sure that all licensing profits go to id instead of the publisher (Activision). I'm not trying to justify downloading, just trying to say its effects are being exaggerated. Also, I eagerly await my pre-ordered copy which hopefully comes in tomorrow.

 

[kronchev]

at a certain point, Doom 1 was the most *installed* game. Regardless, I'm glad I give doom 3 a test go before buying. Wow, it was not as revolutionairy as i expected.

i dont expect it to be revolutionary and if anyone does, theyre kidding themselves. i just hope its fun, thats all.

 

[kronchev]

umm,

just because say, 20,000 people downloaded it from a torrent, doesn't mean those 20,000 were gauranteed to buy the game.

you guys are missing quite a bit of logic, here.

and YOU are missing quite a bit of logic as well. just because 20k people downloaded it doesnt mean theyre losing 20000x55 dollars. AT ALL. the people who download it are either trying it out, or are the kind of people who wouldnt buy it anyway.

 

[AtmaSniper]

Even though the people who will download it get it for free, I wish there was still a way to see how many people actualy got the game.

 

[obs]

Even though the people who will download it get it for free, I wish there was still a way to see how many people actualy got the game.

I'm sure Activision will have some sales figures eventually.

 

[Arkanian]

and YOU are missing quite a bit of logic as well. just because 20k people downloaded it doesnt mean theyre losing 20000x55 dollars. AT ALL. the people who download it are either trying it out, or are the kind of people who wouldnt buy it anyway.

Can u honestly say to yourself that most of these people will buy the game? I mean comeon most of the people who are downloading are kids that have no money. If they download a $55 dollar game, they are not going to buy it.

 

[Staples]

EA seems to have one of the best anti piracy measures. Release a buggy as hell game and then release patches that pirated copies can't apply.

I feel sorry for ID too.

My hope is that a popular online mod will come out that will force everyone to buy it for a CD key.

 

[SPIDEI2MAN]

You can't even download the game, theres so many people trying to get it. I was about to start downloading it yesterday but after waiting an hour, the estimated time was still 6989 hours....and i have cable. So I stopped after about 1.5 hours (only 6988 to go) and decided to just buy the game. My issue is that im trying to see if the game works on my laptop..if not..im stuck with 55 dollar game that i cant do shit to. And if i try and sell id be lucky to get 70% of that money buck. I don't know about you other college kids out there, but im in a bit of a rut and can't afford to throw money away like that.

 

[WorldRunner]

Do you think ID went ahead and told retailers to start selling the game because of the weekend orgy of downloaders?

I think if they were smart they would have told retailers to sell at will....because it's not that people don't want to buy the game...it's that they don't want to wait 2-3 days to get it... Once they download it though they'll probably not pick up the original at all unless they want the MP

 

[Wondernerd]

the people who download it are either trying it out, or are the kind of people who wouldnt buy it anyway

That is faulty. By this logic, there is no reason to lock your car or your house, because the poeple that would break in or steal are the kind that would have done it anyway. Locks only keep honest people out.

You missed the part where I said I pulled the numbers out of my ass. Which is why I never like posting numbers. To put it in non-numerical terms.

Retailers are out floor space and advertising. Plus transportation(which is ameliorated via other shipments) and warehousing. If they don't sell their stock, they order less of the next game and make way for things that sell.

The developer has made his money this time around and is waiting on royalties. But if the product doesn't sell, he loses his publisher. id would get another publisher, But a company like Crytek or Croteam may not. So there wouldn't be a Far Cry 2 or Serious Sam 2.

The publisher is going to take the money made from sales(a) and then subtracts from that the expenses of bring the game to market(b) plus the projected number revenue lost from stolen copies(c). a - (b+c) = X. If X is not where the publisher wants it, No more games. The publisher will not assume that many people stole the product and then decided to buy it, they will write it off as lost revenue.

When I worked for a software company(15 years ago...christ I'm getting old) it was three stolen to one purchase. Now, there is a better idea of what is stolen. Using 3:1means a known 50,000 downloads becomes 150,000 projected. That translates to 8.2 million dollars lost before the game was released. And of course, the figure is arbitrary, so different companies have different figures. I have no idea what is currently used.

 

[DruSi3r]

I dont understand why they wouldnt have used a different copy protection scheme? such as SF3. Atleast the groups would have a harder* time cracking the game. I mean this game was cracked b/f it even came out.

 

[Staples]

I bet SD3 costs money to license.

It may sound weird but I feel sorry for MS, I think Windows is probably the most pirated software period.

 

[CyberCRAP]

Shit how many threads are we going to have about pirating software. As stated before my thought on the subject is do whatever the hell you want. I personally paid $55 for the game, but I'm not super impressed with it. Maybe MP will be betterr. However you people who are so against it lets take a glimpse at the world without any pirating. Please remove your cd & dvd burners for your computer. W/o all these warez kiddies those would be over $1,000 each. I'm sure the blanks would be like $10 as well. Now take out your 100's of gigs of hds and replace it with something much smaller. Or atleast much more expensive.

What I'm trying to say is piraters screw over the software companies, but because of mp3s, divx, etc, there are large hd and cd/dvd burners. I myself am an electrical engineer on the h/w side, so I guess I might be a little biased. However, rather you want to admit it or not, the underground community is largely responsible for the advent of cheap mass storage.

 

[kronchev]

Can u honestly say to yourself that most of these people will buy the game? I mean comeon most of the people who are downloading are kids that have no money. If they download a $55 dollar game, they are not going to buy it.

exactly, and if they have no money, they wouldnt buy it anyway

and yes, locks really do only keep lazy criminals out. if a criminal wants whats in your house, THEY WILL GET IT. if they want your car, THEY WILL FIND A WAY TO STEAL IT. there is NO such thing as perfect security, all it does is slow down criminals so they either give up or are caught before they finish.

but thats nothing like warez. of course there are going to be people who will say "why buy it, i downloaded it for free!" who are perfectly capiable of paying for it. then there are lots of people like me who want to know what i'm paying my hard-earned cash on, and there are lots of people, mostly kids, who cant AFFORD the game, so they wouldnt have it if they couldnt download it. in the last two instances NO COMPANY IS HURT and in fact they GAIN business by people trying it, saying "this is awesome", and buying it. by limiting multiplayer options id really shot themselves in the foot pretty badly but that doesnt mean its going to not happen by any means.

 

[SYN ACK]

and YOU are missing quite a bit of logic as well. just because 20k people downloaded it doesnt mean theyre losing 20000x55 dollars. AT ALL. the people who download it are either trying it out, or are the kind of people who wouldnt buy it anyway.

hey buddy, go back and re-read the post I made...I think you either quoted the wrong person or somehow, took my comment the wrong way. (somehow )

 

[SYN ACK]

you quoted me than said the same exact thing i said.


wtf

 

[kronchev]

hey buddy, go back and re-read the post I made...I think you either quoted the wrong person or somehow, took my comment the wrong way. (somehow )

i took it wrong. you agreed with me but in a bass-ackwards way

 

[Luxor]

Also, you would think after "4 years" they could come up with some sort of copy protection to prevent all this BS. I think GTA : Vice City has a CD copy protection on it and you HAVE to have the CD, you can't use a crack.

Also, not releasing a demo was stupid as well. I think they were asking for it...

 

[JKA Represent]

ummm, luxor, you can run it without the cd.

 

[Wich0]

Also, you would think after "4 years" they could come up with some sort of copy protection to prevent all this BS. I think GTA : Vice City has a CD copy protection on it and you HAVE to have the CD, you can't use a crack.

you sure about that?

 

[Smith]

They should release patches that add special things to the game, but you have to type in the same cd-key that came with the game to install it, and I know a lot of people who just use one random cd-key from the generate and just forget about it after installing. That would help some >_o.

 

[Wondernerd]

Also, you would think after "4 years" they could come up with some sort of copy protection to prevent all this BS.

Why? If somebody wanted to crack the software they would. I'm starting to agree with the idea that stealing from people doesn't hurt anybody. So there shouldn't be any kind of anti theft device on any product. If Best Buy was smart, they would just go and stick merchandise outside the store, that would really save on trying to stop people from shoplifting. People will steal from Best Buy, so make it easy for them. After all, only the people that would steal are going to take it and nobody loses any thing from it.

 

[kronchev]

you sure about that?

hes wrong if he is.

 

[CyberCRAP]

Also, you would think after "4 years" they could come up with some sort of copy protection to prevent all this BS. I think GTA : Vice City has a CD copy protection on it and you HAVE to have the CD, you can't use a crack.

Also, not releasing a demo was stupid as well. I think they were asking for it...

www.gamecopyworld.com has plenty of cracks for games that require cds. And there are plenty of reasons to use cracks with software you bought. Personally I have a laptop I take to lan parties now. Got sick of dragging my 2 ton pc. Anyways, I don't want to have to drag around a cd case if I don't need it. Usually I just use clonecd to rip them and daemon tools to mount the image, but they are starting to detect that stuff now and not work even if your not even using it for that game. Just the fact that you have emulation stuff installed can cause some games to not function. I heard doom3 has this kind of detection. I haven't put it on my laptop so I can't say for sure what it will do.

 

[S1nF1xx]

Also, you would think after "4 years" they could come up with some sort of copy protection to prevent all this BS. I think GTA : Vice City has a CD copy protection on it and you HAVE to have the CD, you can't use a crack.

Also, not releasing a demo was stupid as well. I think they were asking for it...

I'm going to have to call bullshit on that as well.
I didn't pirate, but I used a no-cdkey crack. I f'ing hate swapping cds.

 

[Ancient]

Wow remember this game has a CD key REQUIRED for multiplayer - most mods will be multi player based so no money has been lost YET

 

[Luxor]

Doom 3

GTA : Vice City

Thanks?

 

[Staples]

Wow remember this game has a CD key REQUIRED for multiplayer - most mods will be multi player based so no money has been lost YET

Of course this is conditional on whether a good mod ever does come out. The 4 player DM isn't that appealing.

 

[Charles]

Pretty much the only way of ensuring absolute security is having a unique cd-key burnt along with every set of Doom 3 CD's that cross-references with some database online.

The problem with this is that it would multiply costs of production tenfold (if not more) and eventually people would find a way to strip the security from the ISO and redistribute the hacked cd images.

At least that's what happened with Adobe's Photoshop CS

 

[Jonsey]

It may sound weird but I feel sorry for MS, I think Windows is probably the most pirated software period.

I have two computers running XP. I also have two unopened legal copies of Win XP at home I've never used. Why? I hate their stupid activation. It's alot easier to use a corporate edition CD than open one of those retail packages and go through the activation pain in the ass. I don't mind paying for an OS, but I don't feel sorry for MS, they've done it to themselves.

 

[Staples]

The activation is not a pain in the ass. It is about three mouse clicks.

 

[Jonsey]

It is if you don't have internet.

 

[SkullE]

I hope there's an overclocking trojan in that iso. Play the game and see your video \ cpu go up in smoke.

what a great idea. hmmmm

 

[rhy7s]

That is faulty. By this logic, there is no reason to lock your car or your house, because the poeple that would break in or steal are the kind that would have done it anyway. Locks only keep honest people out.

Not really an opinion on illegal software, but I don't even have locks on my house and leave the keys in the ignition. Doesn't seem worth the worry of having to think about people in such a negative light.

 

[ilkhan]

they GAIN business by people trying it, saying "this is awesome", and buying it.

WTF?
They have the full version of a game, and yet they are gonna go out and *BUY* the same thing they already have?
Yes, ID shot themselves in the foot by not having a demo out first, but dont even try to say they are gaining off the piracy and downloading going on.

Personally? Im gonna go down to the BB and pick myself up a copy in a couple days. I dont get all into the hype going on. But I bet its gonna be a game I enjoy. And if Its not? Well, too bad to me. Im a "broke college student" too. If I dont want to risk wasting my money...I dont buy the game.

 

[PGHammer]

alot of these people ARE going to buy the game, i can guarantee it..

edit - odoe: No one here cares if you downloaded the game or not. Don't dicuss your personal dealings in obtaining warez, as that is clearly against the rules of the forum.

Agreed. Most likely *will* buy the game.

For one thing, the processor requirements aren't bad at all (in fact, they are actually better than those for FarCry, which sold well).

Secondly, unlike FarCry, the number of CDs is reasonable (only three; UT 2004 was worse here).

Third, unlike either FarCry or UT2004, you don't have to upgrade the whole PC to play the game with a decent experience (midrange PCs can get 1024x768 with decent framerates (medium detail)).

Lastly...it's an *id game* (as in a game from id). You have to go back *years* to find an id game that stunk.

All the way back to the *original* Doom, two things are common with id's games:

1. They are VERY heavily pirated.

2. They still sell like gangbusters.

I have seen no reason whatever why Doom 3 will be an exception to the rule.

In fact, Doom 3 breaks one rule of recent games by being designed mostly around *current* hardware. (Let's be serious, people...how many *A-list* games this year are actually playable on midrange hardware at decent framerates? Two (Civ III Conquests and RON: Thrones and Patriots)? FarCry is a bear on midrange PCs. So is Painkiller. To an extent, so is Max Payne 2. Amazingly, that is *not* the case for Doom 3.)

About the only thing that could slow down sales is the higher price vs. FarCry. However, a lot more PCs can actually play Doom 3 than can play FarCry and get a good experience out of it.

Here's a welcome surprise about Doom 3: unlike *every* other game in the past ten years (and that includes Doom II and all versions of Quake, by the way), it has an absolutely hardware-agnostic audio subengine that *still* takes advantage of multispeaker systems.

When I heard that Doom 3 didn't use *any* sort of hardware audio support (not even the OS-independent OpenAL or Miles), quite honestly I got worried.

I've been spoiled by EAX 3 and EAX 4 HD (and Dolby Digital) in games and movies. Given that audio is a big part of the immersive experience in a game like Doom 3, the danger of audio suckage was quite real.


"Silly me." I shouldn't have worried.

The setup routine picked up *all six* (Inspire 5300s) of my speakers, and the floorloaded sub is *really effective* I pity those of you that have high-end Klipsch 5.1s...you're gonna get frightened outta your socks!.

If Best Buy is smart, they will have the game installed and running on several of their display PCs (desktops and notebooks alike, as Doom 3 could easily become *the* FPS for notebooks in addition to desktops, and when has *that* been even possible?)

Except for the sticker shock regarding price, it will sell...and sell a ton!

 

[elm669]

Agreed. Most likely *will* buy the game.

For one thing, the processor requirements aren't bad at all (in fact, they are actually better than those for FarCry, which sold well).

But still far too high for people on the lower end of the spectrum. (like me) one less sell for ID.. Of course they don't give rats ass about low end hardware.