I guess this is where Palmers experience in VR comes into play. The oculus is more than just a good screen with sensitive accelerometers, it's his design philosophy. Lightweight, small, integrated, lack of wires + peripherals, simple, clean. I must say while I was giving Vive the upperhand due to technology (and both are VERY similar in capabilities) I think the ergonomics of the Rift may actually make it the winner.
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HTC Vive Review
- Thread starter HardOCP News
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I guess this is where Palmers experience in VR comes into play. The oculus is more than just a good screen with sensitive accelerometers, it's his design philosophy. Lightweight, small, integrated, lack of wires + peripherals, simple, clean. I must say while I was giving Vive the upperhand due to technology (and both are VERY similar in capabilities) I think the ergonomics of the Rift may actually make it the winner.
Price and lack of content may make initial buyers start to be very vocal, more in the negative way. On top of that those who just can't get use to it and are throwing up all the time to the point at just looking at the headset makes the stomach turn will add to the discussion. I would like to try out the Vive but the shear lack of anything besides basic demo's is a put off and wait to see what happens seems more prudent to do.
Just got my Vive today. Not sure I agree with the Ars reviewer, this headset is super comfortable.. I've not tried the Rift, but the Vive doesn't feel heavy at all. The weight distribution is very good. I just played some games on it for an hour or so, no neck strain either.
crusty_juggler
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What games did you play and what were your impressions of them?
HardUp4HardWare
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In preparation of VR I am going to start doing neck weight lifting.
SamiiRoss
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Look, you should. that thing got to many cables. i have cancelled my oculus preorder, right now seems like some games are for HTC only and others for Oculus only. so, i dont know what to do LOL
Nenu
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My first chuckle of the day, cheers
My Vive is out for delivery right now, but I'm STILL undecided on Vive vs. Rift. I might just throw this thing up on eBay and bank until I actually make a decision. Based on feedback on processing of orders for the Rift, mine will probably ship today or tomorrow (10:05:30 order). I could also just try out the Vive, see how I like it, then sell it if I'm not totally blown away and still come out ahead. Man, I haven't had this much trouble making a seemingly simple decision in a long time... or ever....
Gorankar
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Yeah, I have tried the DK2, my MC hemet is obviously, and noticeably heavier. I felt no discomfort with DK2 on and it did not really feel all that front heavy to me. If it is an issue for some, that is unfortunate. It will not be an issue for me however.
Things I have learnt after an evening with a new Vive:
- Looking downwards a lot (mini golf) does make me slightly nauseous after a while.
- One of the controllers needed pairing while the other worked immediately, so it took a while to figure out why one wasn't working (out of date docs didn't help).
- The cable wasn't at all noticeable except when I was stepping on it.
- Budget Cuts is awesome.
- Don't eat immediately after your first 4 hours of non-stop VR demos.
One thing that always annoyed me about reviews of VR was that it always came from a bunch of newbs who'd scream "omg it's soooo immersive, I felt like I was really there!". My biggest gripe about VR is the lack of peripheral vision. You can always see the edges of the mask, and thus feel like you are looking through horse blinders. Obviously when you look at the lens there is no way to really satisfy this problem until they come out with curved screens that actually do encompass your periphery.
How would you say the vive holds up to this? Does it look just the same as the dev kits and GearVR only with higher resolution?
How would you say the vive holds up to this? Does it look just the same as the dev kits and GearVR only with higher resolution?
It bleeds away once you stop focusing on it and enjoy the content. Same thing happens in real life when you're focused on something you ignore your peripheral to an extent.
zamardii12
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After reading Gizmodo's review and my fear leading up to launch confirms everything I thought about the first offerings of VR. This needs to go through another 2 revisions at least to be a viable mainstream form of entertainment. The big risk right now with VR is going to be the lack of true VR titles that take advantage of the hardware. I can't help but think with this current quantity over quality situation with the games that the current offerings for at LEAST the first year are just going to be really expensive tech demos. I think VR is an amazing thing honestly and I have been waiting and dreaming for this for years, but right now VR comes with a very very heavy cost associated with it and I am not just talking about money.
I feel as though this is the Nintendo 64 era for VR. The Nintendo 64 era was that weird era when we started to turn to 3D graphics where the graphics were just awkward and unappealing, but were a necessary building block to the future... that is what 2016 will be for VR. Even though I have read that there are some profoundly magical experiences to be had right now, I feel as though the immersion factor coupled with cost and convenience is simply not good enough. Between the laborious and complicated setup process, and the lack of titles that take advantage of over $1500 worth of computer hardware is just not there. By the time that software is available, there will be a better revision available. I'm not saying that those who bought the Vive made a mistake b/c I am all about new tech and being first to have something new and I am sure once I had it all setup I would enjoy it, but I think this is a medium that really needs a couple more years to grow. The biggest thing that needs to happen is that the VR experience be wireless. I know it's already possible. Those VR arcades out in Australia use DK2s setup to some device that looks like a backpack so you can have a true wireless VR experience.
Anyway, I am truly excited for the VR experience and to see how it matures over the coming years but I have to admit as with almost all new tech the first batch is very rough.
It's a bit of a weird situation in that we've had a steady stream of dev kit prototypes over the last few years so it's not as if VR has suddenly appeared out of nowhere like some sort of new Apple device, but at the same time there are still plenty of rough edges should you choose to focus on them. It sort of feels like they've picked an arbitrary point in the ongoing development and decided to call it version one. I'd agree that it's not a mainstream technology yet although there's an enormous amount of potential, and it's possible to have some amazing experiences right now. I absolutely do not regret picking up a Vive, but I wouldn't recommend it unconditionally to just anyone.
Anyone know how precise the Vive trackers have to be located? They say "above and facing downward" toward the player, but is this necessary? Do you think it's possible to just sit them on your desk like a couple of speakers? That's one thing I like about the Rift, it just uses a single tracking wand that blends in nicely with your existing PC setup. I dont want wires and shit dangling down my walls with a couple of chintzy looking bose cubes screwed in that shouldnt belong there.
Doesn't seem to be necessary. I've seen some people just place them furniture like a bookshelf or tables (and even on the floor) with success. Not sure how much tracking suffers for it, there must be a reason Valve recommends to angle them downward and above user height.
Chaos Machine
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You are doing yourself a disservice by reading reviews of either from a non gaming perspective, Gizmodo, fortune, whoever... You are a gamer if you are on these forums, trust a review from one.
Flogger23m
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I think a big problem is people expect the wrong things from VR. The article mentions setting aside some space and also standing. Who really wants to run and jump in place? That isn't really appealing to myself and I assume a lot of gamers. It never even occurred to me that people wanted to start picking up stuff with some bundled wireless controllers, as the article demonstrates with some shovel-ware game. In some games it may work, but in general, it will likely just end up being clunky, annoying and tedious.
The best game application IMO would be simulators or other vehicle games. Flight sims have been doing 6 degree of freedom via Track IR for years and VR works well with some of the big ones already. I can imaging it will work wonders in racing sims and space sims like Star Citizen. Using VR to realistically look around or lean forward to view some instruments is game changing and much more realistic and fluid than using a mouse/keyboard or controller. That is why simulators have been doing it for years. VR just slaps a screen to your face, but it does have advantages over Track IR.
It can also work in shooters. The ArmA series supports independent head movement. It certainly can add immersion being able to run forward while quickly looking to the side as you can in real life.
But people seem to want to control characters or pick things up with a VR headset. Which is odd, because that is about as awkward as using he WASD keys to move.
The best game application IMO would be simulators or other vehicle games. Flight sims have been doing 6 degree of freedom via Track IR for years and VR works well with some of the big ones already. I can imaging it will work wonders in racing sims and space sims like Star Citizen. Using VR to realistically look around or lean forward to view some instruments is game changing and much more realistic and fluid than using a mouse/keyboard or controller. That is why simulators have been doing it for years. VR just slaps a screen to your face, but it does have advantages over Track IR.
It can also work in shooters. The ArmA series supports independent head movement. It certainly can add immersion being able to run forward while quickly looking to the side as you can in real life.
But people seem to want to control characters or pick things up with a VR headset. Which is odd, because that is about as awkward as using he WASD keys to move.
I'll say my most profound VR experience was in Half Life 2, the moment I decided to just stand up instead of sit down. Obviously no positional tracking, but something about standing, and feeling like I was actually walking around the world, turning my entire body to change directions instead of just my neck really stimulated me mentally. I had the Hydra controllers and yes they sucked hard. Holding shitty wands in your hand is going to be lame as fuck, but so long as they are represented as guns and objects that actually feel like what you're holding it might not be too bad. But back to the subject, I think roomscale is definitely the way to go. When you sit down to play VR you tend to just stare straight ahead and not even use the capabilities of tracking to look at things. If you watch reviewers they just use the control sticks to turn left, they never actually *look* left. They play it like a console game and nothing more. The vive tries real hard to remind you that you CAN actually do more than just stare straight ahead.
Hell even when I brought my whole gaming rig to work so everyone could try it all anybody did was just look ahead. Even when I kept telling them to look around, they'd maybe glance like 2 degrees of center axis. I'd have to physically grab their head and twist it 90 degrees to the side for their brains to register that "oh yeah, NOW I get it!" and then they'd go back to just staring straight ahead again.
Gorankar
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People are used to interacting with a PC by looking straight ahead. It will take a little bit to break some of that habit.
Airbrushkid
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Cannot wait to hear by next year if not sooner. There will be reports a lot of people complaining about how the fall because of the wires and knocking things over.. Some will get hurt. I want one for fight sims and car racing sims. So I'll be sitting on my ass all the time. And I don't have a 15' x 15' room to set up the light house. So I may have to go with the Rift. But with there always on and watching you crap. So I built a second computer.
Nenu
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Can you get motion sensor collars for cats/dogs so you can tell where they are while gaming?
Theres gotta be a new market for these collars and a game overlay.
Theres gotta be a new market for these collars and a game overlay.
You dont *have* to have a 15x15 room, thats just the largest space it can accommodate. In fact when you set up the Vive for the first time it will ask you to trace a perimeter of your actual playspace using the wands. You can constrict yourself to as small of a space as you want. It even has a "sit down only mode" whereby it assumes you wont bother standing at all.
zamardii12
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Lock them out the room? Crate them? Solved.
Not quite, there is a minimum size for "room mode", 1.5m x 2m or whatever it is. I know because the space near my desk is more than long enough but a little too narrow, so I have to cheat and trace over the middle of the sofa otherwise it refuses to allow the space. Beyond that you'll be stuck with the stationary mode.