HP ProLiant MicroServer owners' thread

AbRASiON

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 28, 2004
Messages
352
Has anyone used a port multiplier in the Microserver?
I'd love to keep the current quantity of storage I've got but add a cheap SSD as the C: somehow. Is this even possible? I'd plan to 'replicate' the onboard SATA port or the ESATA port, not the regular hotplug ports.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816124049
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Syba-2-P...34993944?pt=AU_Components&hash=item484d53f818

I'm reading the newegg comments here and they keep mentioning RAID, is this a requirement of multiplied ports? I can't just have them as multiple disks hanging off a SATA port?
Has anyone done this with the microserver? I'm sure I could fit in an SSD, just.

Poor little PSU would be a bit angry though, USB3 card (requires FDD power) , extra video card, 8gb of ram, 6 3.5" HDD's, a port multiplier (requires FDD power) and finally an SSD

Still,.......... - anyone got experience / comments with port multipliers on the N54L?
 

bluefull

n00b
Joined
Feb 13, 2009
Messages
23
I just want to add that I own a N36L Microserver which came with a 200W PSU. After about 6 months, the fan in the PSU started making unbearably loud grinding noises. Damn thing sounds downright angry. HP did a replacement. Now less than a year after, the PSU fan is behaving the same way on the replacement.

I see several other threads online regarding this issue and someone posted here that they found a suitable replacement with a Papst fan.

Personally, I am looking at outright replacing the PSU. The out of warranty replacement cost on the PSU from HP is ridiculous, might as well buy a new server instead. Besides, I got a replacement and the same issue eventually developed.

Has anyone tried the PicoPSU with these Microservers? I'm just running a basic file/media server, 5x2TB green drives and an ssd ubuntu server boot drive. No raid, no video card or anything else.
 

bluefull

n00b
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Feb 13, 2009
Messages
23
These Seasonic PSU might be direct replacements...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151116
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151123

Not sure on the exact size constraints of the case though.

Thanks, I pulled out the PSU and while the width and height seem to be about right, the Seasonics are too long. The Microserver PSU is about 6" in length. The Seasonic is 7.5" which would fit the compartment but then the PSU cable wouldn't fit.

I may have to look at replacing the PSU fan first and then maybe look at something like the PicoPSU.

An out of warranty replacement from HP costs $172 for the PSU but really it's only the fan that's the problem. Poor quality.
 

bluefull

n00b
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Feb 13, 2009
Messages
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Edit: Ooops - just realised I posted this to entirely the wrong forum! :) To fill in the blanks - the fan in my N36L PSU began making grinding noises after 15 months so I searched for a replacement. The HP original PSU fan is a T&T 4020HH12S-ND1 (40x40x20mm 12V DC sleeve bearing, 7000RPM, 8.36CFM, 31.9dBA) and I settled on this EBM Papst 412 (6000RPM, 5.9CFM, 18dBA) from Farnell in the UK. The HP PSU fan power connector is a 4mm mini-Molex which is pretty rare so I could either solder the original connector to the Papst and keep the cabling entirely within the PSU casing, or alternatively attach a standard 3-pin fan connector to the Papst and run the cable outside of the PSU to one of the spare Molex power connectors using a 3-pin-to-4-pin adapter (which is what I did).

The Papst 412 fan arrived from Farnell today and as expected there is no motherboard fan connector attached so I soldered on a spare 3-pin fan connector so that I could connect it to the P6 (ODD) 4-pin Molex plug (using a 3-pin to 4-pin adapter, of course). I'd be surprised if the original fan ran at the full bore 7000RPM and would expect it to have been under-volted at 7V or maybe even 5V so probably isn't pushing the rated volume of air, in which case a slowed-down Papst is probably still a reasonable match for the original fan.

The fan seems to push a decent amount of air, though it's not exactly the quietest fan in the world so I attached it to a Zalman Fanmate fan controller to slow it down a bit and make it silent - I reckon it will still move enough air to keep the PSU in the N36L comfortable.

One rather annoying problem is that the attachment holes on the Papst fan have a diameter of 4.3mm (+/- 0.1mm according to the datasheet (PDF)), and the supplied HP screws are closer to 4mm in diameter so they don't actually fit and cannot be used to attach the Papst - luckily I had some spare fan screws available with a larger diameter (about 4.5mm) and that sorted it. The holes in the PSU casing itself are probably 5mm (maybe even 5.5mm) so there are no issues fitting the larger fan screws through the PSU casing itself.

Assuming there is suitable fan replacement with a 3-pin connector, I'm guessing you could use a 2 pin to 3 pin (Type D is it?) adapter cable. Then attach the fan and Zalman Fan Mate.

Is there a certain minimum power rating required for the fan for it to start?

In terms of specs I know it's best to look for one that has good static pressure seeing as this is a PSU fan.
 

baldmosher

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I just want to add that I own a N36L Microserver which came with a 200W PSU. After about 6 months, the fan in the PSU started making unbearably loud grinding noises. Damn thing sounds downright angry. HP did a replacement. Now less than a year after, the PSU fan is behaving the same way on the replacement.

I see several other threads online regarding this issue and someone posted here that they found a suitable replacement with a Papst fan.

Personally, I am looking at outright replacing the PSU. The out of warranty replacement cost on the PSU from HP is ridiculous, might as well buy a new server instead. Besides, I got a replacement and the same issue eventually developed.

Has anyone tried the PicoPSU with these Microservers? I'm just running a basic file/media server, 5x2TB green drives and an ssd ubuntu server boot drive. No raid, no video card or anything else.
Check with a power meter, picoPSU will normally handle most everyday PC tasks, bear in mind that your biggest power drain might be during boot or when at full tilt in a test situation.

I'd be surprised if 90W picoPSU couldn't accommodate your setup but do bear in mind the cost ramps up for higher power bricks. So a smaller flexATX size standard PSU might be best (not certain the PSU is standard flexATX dimensions though)

If I didn't have the N40L in a cupboard I'd have replaced the PSU and chassis fan a long time ago.
 

pwrusr

2[H]4U
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Messages
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Thanks, I pulled out the PSU and while the width and height seem to be about right, the Seasonics are too long. The Microserver PSU is about 6" in length. The Seasonic is 7.5" which would fit the compartment but then the PSU cable wouldn't fit.

I may have to look at replacing the PSU fan first and then maybe look at something like the PicoPSU.

An out of warranty replacement from HP costs $172 for the PSU but really it's only the fan that's the problem. Poor quality.

Depending on the size of the fan itself (is it 10 or 20mm deep?) you can pick up a good replacement fan here:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...Price=&MaxPrice=&PropertyCodeValue=3727:26520
I think that's likely going to be the most cost effective solution.

FWIW I'm using one of these fans in a cisco switch:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835705031
 
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bluefull

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Feb 13, 2009
Messages
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...I think that's likely going to be the most cost effective solution.

FWIW I'm using one of these fans in a cisco switch:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835705031

Yeah, I think the fan replacement is the most cost effective way to go as you said. As user MillhouseVH stated much earlier in this thread, the HP original PSU fan is a T&T 4020HH12S-ND1 (40x40x20mm 12V DC sleeve bearing, 7000RPM, 8.36CFM, 31.9dBA).

Here's is the Fan Performance Curve and data on the TopMotor from Newegg you linked (though they have the wrong dimension listed in the data table):



Rated Voltage: 12V
Input Current: 0.25A
Input Power: 3W
Speed: 8000 RPM
Air Flow: 8.6 CFM
Static Pressure: 8.2 mm-H20

Noise: 30 dBa

Features:
Frame: Plastic Material UL 94V-0
Blade: Plastic Material UL 94V-0
Dielectric Strenth: 50/60 Hz, 500 VAC, 1 minute (between lead conductor and frame)
Insulation Resistance:50M ohm min. at 500 VDC(between lead wire(+) and frame)
Operating Temperature: -10°C to +65°C
Double Ball Bearing: 50,000 hours MTBF

The neophyte that I am, during my search for a fan replacement, I've come to understand that higher static pressure is important especially for a small PSU fan like this one faced with the PSU case obstruction. Static pressure is the ability of a fan to push air through obstructions, the greater the number, the stronger the fan.

The higher the static pressure and CFM, the louder it gets also so I'm looking for a fine balance. Another question I have is how the input current affects the fan. Lower the input current, the easier for the fan to start up?
 

pwrusr

2[H]4U
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Messages
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Yeah, I think the fan replacement is the most cost effective way to go as you said. As user MillhouseVH stated much earlier in this thread, the HP original PSU fan is a T&T 4020HH12S-ND1 (40x40x20mm 12V DC sleeve bearing, 7000RPM, 8.36CFM, 31.9dBA).

Here's is the Fan Performance Curve and data on the TopMotor from Newegg you linked (though they have the wrong dimension listed in the data table):





The neophyte that I am, during my search for a fan replacement, I've come to understand that higher static pressure is important especially for a small PSU fan like this one faced with the PSU case obstruction. Static pressure is the ability of a fan to push air through obstructions, the greater the number, the stronger the fan.

The higher the static pressure and CFM, the louder it gets also so I'm looking for a fine balance. Another question I have is how the input current affects the fan. Lower the input current, the easier for the fan to start up?
Typically 20mm fans will cope with higher static pressure better then 10mm think ones as the 20mm thick fans have quite a bit more fan surface area. I found the Rexus/topmotor fan to put out quite a bit of air running full steam. While it is somewhat loud in my application, I think that the fan will be controlled by the PSU if you use the same leads from the power supply that the current fan is using. Meaning you will likely not have to worry about hooking the fan to a external fan controller.

I'm not quite sure about the input current question. My guess is that a lower input current will translate to easier start up for the fan. but each fan is different so without testing them side by side with other fans I wouldn't know for sure.
 

bluefull

n00b
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Messages
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Typically 20mm fans will cope with higher static pressure better then 10mm think ones as the 20mm thick fans have quite a bit more fan surface area. I found the Rexus/topmotor fan to put out quite a bit of air running full steam. While it is somewhat loud in my application, I think that the fan will be controlled by the PSU if you use the same leads from the power supply that the current fan is using. Meaning you will likely not have to worry about hooking the fan to a external fan controller...

The loudness is what concerns me as my HP Microserver is acting as a media and file server and it's on all the time. I think you're right about the fan being controlled by the power supply so it should be fine or comparable to the current fan without the need of a fan controller. Thought the current fan could be a little quieter:) I found MilhouseVH's posts and discussion with matthewwhite on another forum regarding this.

MilhouseVH: Any chance you can measure the voltage being supplied by the PSU to the stock fan? I'm interested to know if it's closer to 7V than 12V (I would have measured my own if I'd remembered to do so before putting it all back together!)

mathewwhite: Surprisingly, the voltage supplied to the fan is 5V (actually 4.8). It can be measured without chopping anything by locating the pins marked fan on the PSU board. They are in the corner as you follow the wired back from the fan itself.

MilhouseVH: Aha, thanks for that - thought it could be as low as 5V but must admit I was expecting it to be closer to 7V.

So, given the original fan specs rated at 12 volts, assuming straight-line performance over 5V-to-12V*, the original fan may have been running at about 2900 RPM, pushing just under 3.5CFM at 13.3dBA.

If the voltage really is meant to be 4.8V (ie. not just a quirk of your PSU) then the fan performance figures are more like 2800RPM/3.3CFM/12.7dBA.

Given this, I feel much better about slowing down my 12V/6000RPM/6CFM/18dBA Papst - at 7V (3500RPM/3.5CFM/10.5dBA) it should be doing a fine job. Not a good idea to run it at 5V though (2500RPM/2.5CFM/7.5dBA)!
matthewwhite: I would not expect the PSU to have a dedicated 4.8V rail just for a fan. To keep costs down I would have thought it would be 5V or 12V - that's your lot!

I should have compared the voltage to that of one of the Molex connectors - next time I have it open I will.

So I will go with a 2-pin to 3-pin adapter though I just want to know which type it is as there are four. My assumption is Type D which seems to have the smallest 2-pin:


 

pwrusr

2[H]4U
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Messages
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Could be any one of those connectors. Though I think that it would be B, C or D as A is just too big. It may also be soldered to the PCB as well. You won't know for sure until you pop it open.
 

bluefull

n00b
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Feb 13, 2009
Messages
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Good news is that it's not soldered on. Bad news is that there's a disk shaped capacitor right up against it and some kind of coating that has 'joined' them together. Will have to pry it out carefully.
 

mikey71497

Limp Gawd
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Sep 27, 2004
Messages
214
Hello, I am thinking about purchasing one of these as my current NetGear ReadyNas Duo is about to be maxed out. I currently have two 1TB drives in Raid 1 and I am more than half way through. If I was to purchase this device and put only two 2TB drives in it, when I wanted to add more drives, do I simply add them in and reboot or do I have to do anything in the BIOS or Windows? I do plan on running WHS 2011 on this. Will the new drives automatically begin to join the RAID or do I have to initiate that within the OS or BIOS? Any help would be appreciated.
 

bluefull

n00b
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Messages
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Hello, I am thinking about purchasing one of these as my current NetGear ReadyNas Duo is about to be maxed out. I currently have two 1TB drives in Raid 1 and I am more than half way through. If I was to purchase this device and put only two 2TB drives in it, when I wanted to add more drives, do I simply add them in and reboot or do I have to do anything in the BIOS or Windows? I do plan on running WHS 2011 on this. Will the new drives automatically begin to join the RAID or do I have to initiate that within the OS or BIOS? Any help would be appreciated.

The hard drives will be recognized but you may know this already but you would have to rebuild the Raid 1 from what I gather and migrate the data back. See this thread I quickly googled.
 

bluefull

n00b
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Feb 13, 2009
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I decided to complicate my fan replacement and will wind up doing some soldering and adding a fan control. I figure I can get a better fan which draws less current but pushes more air and is rated for the same or greater static pressure and in the end hope to be quieter than the original. I settled on a Sanyo Denki Made In Japan 3-wire with bare leads to run with a fan controller. The fan only cost $6 and the Zalman Fan Mate is only $7 so total cost is not that much more.

For others who may need to replace theirs in time:

Original:
T&T 4020HH12S-ND1
RPM - 7000
CFM - 8.36
mmH20 - 4.06 (inH20 - 0.16)
dBa - 31.9
Amp - 0.24 (2.88W)

Possible replacements:

Top Motor DF124020BH (Double ball bearing)
RPM - 8000
CFM - 8.6
mmH20 - 8.2
dBa - 30


EBM-Papst 412H (sintec bearing)
RPM - 8100
CFM - 7.9
mmH20 - ~6.0 (inH20 - 0.23
dBa - 29
amp - 0.13 (1.6W)


Panasonic FBK04F12H (ball bearing)
RPM - 7500
CFM - 6.7
mmH20 - 6.60 (64.7 pa)
dBa - 32
Amp - 0.15 (1.8W)

(The NMB B40s can be bought with bare leads only it seems so you'd have to solder).

NMB-MAT 1606KL-04W-B40
RPM - 7000
CFM - 7.0
mmH20 - 4.80 (inH20 - 0.188)
dBa - 31
Amp - 0.075 (0.9W)

NMB-MAT 1608KL-04W-B40-
RPM - 7500
CFM - 8.4
mmH20 - 5.52 (inH20 - 0.21)
dBa - 29
Amp - 0.09 (1.08W)

NMB-MAT 1608VL-04W-B40-
RPM - 7500
CFM - 8.8
mmH20 - 5.99 (inH20 - 0.24)
dBa - 29
Amp - 0.08 (1.02W)

(The above would be straight replacements. The NMB B50 versions of the above are more powerful and louder but with a fan controller they would work. These NMBs are fairly low power which is nice and would have bought from mouser but the Sanyo Denki + Fan Mate came out cheaper for me in the end).


Sanyo Denki 109P0412H6D01 (3-wire)
RPM - 8000
CFM - 7.95
mmH20 - 6.7 (65.7 pa)
dBa - 33
Amp - 0.11A (1.32W)
 
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V@nill@

Limp Gawd
Joined
Aug 13, 2001
Messages
338
Hi all, I lost the key to my N36L. Has anyone found an easy way to get the lock open?
 

V@nill@

Limp Gawd
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Aug 13, 2001
Messages
338
Thanks, I managed to get in, in the end!

Quick onboard RAID question.

I have 4 x 2TB drives. I would like to make one big RAID 1 group.

Will it allow me to make a single 4TB LUN or would I need to make 2 x 2TB LUNs? I try to assign all four drives to a RAID 1 group but it says max 2. Wondering if i'm doing something wrong or if I just need to make 2 separate LUNs!

Thanks
 

hvrt

n00b
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Sep 29, 2007
Messages
63

Well I can now safely say I have the perfect set up with my N36L for the last 12 months or so.

It's running Ubuntu 10.04 Server LTS with a x4 2TB drivers. The 250GB drive is used as the boot drive. Things I've got working are

- Software RAID5 array with XFS filesystem to create a 5.5TB filesystem.
- Streaming to my XBMC box sat behind the telly. So now have lots of media a keypress away.
- Webmin for remote admin with all the email alerts set up.
- Squeezebox server for streaming my music around the house. Google "joggler" if you're interested in repurposing a device to be used as a Squeezebox player.
- Deluge for torrenting
- Putty and x-server sorted for remote access as needed.

Still playing with owncloud. But this little box is as stable as it comes and doesn't break a sweat. All this runs with no more than half the 1GB memory in use. Must resist tinkering though :)
 

bbito

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Oct 2, 2012
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After I spent days figuring out how to hack the Bios to provide RAID10 on my N36L I came across some folks disparaging this fakeraid provided by the SATA controller (I thought it was a hardware RAID - oh well). This box would be used for large video file backup/storage and layoff to LTO so it needs at least a reliable 160MB/s read speed. I don't need snapshots or versioning, and I prefer RAID10 so I still have read access with a single drive failure. This box isn't a typical file server, its more like a staging system for tape backup and we don't expect it to stream media, just safely store 3.5TB of 3GB to 900GB files. Assuming a 4-drive RAID10 for a CentOS or Scientific Linux build, would you recommend building it in the BIOS or in Linux, or does it really need a hardware RAID card - what are the advantages/disadvantages?
 

Patriot

[H]ard|DCer of the Month - March 2011/June 2013/De
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Dec 15, 2010
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After I spent days figuring out how to hack the Bios to provide RAID10 on my N36L I came across some folks disparaging this fakeraid provided by the SATA controller (I thought it was a hardware RAID - oh well). This box would be used for large video file backup/storage and layoff to LTO so it needs at least a reliable 160MB/s read speed. I don't need snapshots or versioning, and I prefer RAID10 so I still have read access with a single drive failure. This box isn't a typical file server, its more like a staging system for tape backup and we don't expect it to stream media, just safely store 3.5TB of 3GB to 900GB files. Assuming a 4-drive RAID10 for a CentOS or Scientific Linux build, would you recommend building it in the BIOS or in Linux, or does it really need a hardware RAID card - what are the advantages/disadvantages?

I would recommend in the bios over OS software raid...
Bios = firmware on top of the chipset...with driver to connect to OS...
Not a true hardware solution but faster than OS software raid. Z-raid may be the exception.

Hardware raid will gain you speed and features... more raid options, quicker rebuilds, more HDD options SAS, SATA...smarter diagnosis... Cache (speed for small and large transfers) ...
 

AbRASiON

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 28, 2004
Messages
352
Any of the experienced Microserver builders want to comment on this hardware?

https://www.pccasegear.com/index.php...ion=wish_lists
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/ws/eBayIS...E:L:OU:AU:3160

I already have all the power cables (molex splitters, molex to SATA molex to 3.5", ESATA to SATA etc)
I think I read that the silverstone SDP09 3.5" to 2.5" drive adapter cages will work fine with an SSD inside a regular Microserver hotplug bay?

With the port replicator I'm hoping to split either the SATA or ESATA port so I can run my 2x3.5" Platter disks and an SSD in the thing for booting, total disks 7
EDIT: I know I may need to flash the tweaked bios for multiple ports to work
 

levak

Limp Gawd
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Messages
386
I would diffidently go with Software RAID.

Same speed as HW raid(it's RAID10, so why would a HW raid be faster, specially onboard fakeraid?).
Easier to debug if something goes wrong.
If server(controller) dies, you just move the disks to another computer and it's working again.
Drivers are usually more stable for the chipset than they are for a fakeraid.

Read some articles: hardware raid vs. mdraid (or linux software raid)

Matej
 

Harmed

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Dec 1, 2012
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Is the CPU on the N40L strong enough to saturate the GBit connection using NAS4Free? Assuming the HDDs in it are setup properly :)
 

levak

Limp Gawd
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Not sure about samba, but it easily saturates over FTP, NFS or iSCSI...
 

leagle

Limp Gawd
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Messages
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The processor in the N40L is actually pretty decent. Running OpenMediaVault (Debian based NAS) with 4 2TB drives in Raid 5, I have no problem saturating a gigabit connection.
 

AbRASiON

Limp Gawd
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Messages
352
Any of the experienced Microserver builders want to comment on this hardware?

https://www.pccasegear.com/index.php...ion=wish_lists
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/ws/eBayIS...E:L:OU:AU:3160

I already have all the power cables (molex splitters, molex to SATA molex to 3.5", ESATA to SATA etc)
I think I read that the silverstone SDP09 3.5" to 2.5" drive adapter cages will work fine with an SSD inside a regular Microserver hotplug bay?

With the port replicator I'm hoping to split either the SATA or ESATA port so I can run my 2x3.5" Platter disks and an SSD in the thing for booting, total disks 7
EDIT: I know I may need to flash the tweaked bios for multiple ports to work



Ok no one answered this but that's ok - most Microserver owners would never do that stuff so it's understandable - I've ordered the parts anyhow and I'll update the thread if they work.

However, I wouldn't mind knowing if at least the onboard or the esata port will work with a port multiplier WITHOUT requiring a BIOS flash? Does anyone know if either port is up to it without a flash? Since this will be done on an N54L, I'm not sure I can just safely flash yet considering BIOS versions and so on. (No mods / hacks yet)


EDIT: did some reading, N54L owners WILL need to flash - both onboard and ESATA ports are infact IDE mode - SATA port multipliers will not work without a flash.
 
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Joined
Nov 28, 2010
Messages
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Has anyone tested DDR3L RAM at 1.35V? Is there any voltage control in the bios? If not, the best bet for saving power would be to use just one RAM stick, am I right?

Perhaps DDR3L is pointless anyway since I can't seem to find single 8 GB sticks that are unbuffered ECC. Even if the board could run on 1.35V I'd still have a hard decision to make.
 

[OC]Pik4chu

Weaksauce
Joined
Mar 27, 2007
Messages
69
using less ram would require less power but IMO this thing is so slim I dont think the RAM is really where the most power draw is from.

*edit*
n/m my question, discovered my issue was the network.. redid it as software raid and am getting a solid 400+ mb/s r/w in crystal disk now.
 
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hvrt

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Messages
63
I get around 80MB/sec file copy speed on my RAID5 array. 4 x2TB drives with xfs as the file system running Ubuntu 10.04 x64. This is runnning on an N36L with 1GB ram.
 

65Kfosta

Weaksauce
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Feb 11, 2009
Messages
88
I just picked up one of these and had a question.

Im thinking about doing 4 2tb drives in the main slots in a software raid 5 for storage

and putting the 250gb drive in the cd bay as the boot drive.

If I clone the 250gb drive to another spare drive and keep it stored away would that be sufficient for

the boot drive if it fails or should I lose one of the 2tb slots and build a raid 1 for the os?

Thanks
 

_Gea

2[H]4U
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
3,958
I just picked up one of these and had a question.

Im thinking about doing 4 2tb drives in the main slots in a software raid 5 for storage

and putting the 250gb drive in the cd bay as the boot drive.

If I clone the 250gb drive to another spare drive and keep it stored away would that be sufficient for

the boot drive if it fails or should I lose one of the 2tb slots and build a raid 1 for the os?

Thanks

If you use ZFS, you may boot from ZFS mirrorred USB sticks and can use all slots for datadisks with Raid-Z
example: http://napp-it.org/manuals/to-go_en.html

)
 

cantalup

Gawd
Joined
Feb 8, 2012
Messages
758
I just picked up one of these and had a question.

Im thinking about doing 4 2tb drives in the main slots in a software raid 5 for storage

and putting the 250gb drive in the cd bay as the boot drive.

If I clone the 250gb drive to another spare drive and keep it stored away would that be sufficient for

the boot drive if it fails or should I lose one of the 2tb slots and build a raid 1 for the os?

Thanks

regardless of software raid (zfs, mdadm, and others) .
I am trying to be open/objective for not pointing to a certain software raid :).

you can do that, make sure you backup/clone after finishing you system and raid configuration, Make sure everything works as you expected.

the easy way is using software raid1 (mirroring, any software raid can do this easily)
pick 2X2.5 HD and put them in cd bay.

I prefer to pick raid1 alternative. easy and painless.

pick one that suited for your objective.
 

cantalup

Gawd
Joined
Feb 8, 2012
Messages
758
If you use ZFS, you may boot from ZFS mirrorred USB sticks and can use all slots for datadisks with Raid-Z
....

OS in USB key/stick , I said "doable but not desirable". you will kill USB stick when writing many times....
 

_Gea

2[H]4U
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
3,958
OS in USB key/stick , I said "doable but not desirable". you will kill USB stick when writing many times....

This was also my mind in the past.
An enterprise OS like Solaris and USB: a nogo
Too slow and reliability is not good enough.

But i changed my mind.
Todays USB sticks are fast and quite reliable, not the same like in the past.
AND: The advantages of using USB boot sticks are enormous.

I am more and more convinced:
YES, USE USB STICKS for your NAS or SAN!!

What has happened?
- Modern sticks are not good enough, they are good
- Lightweight Operating Systems like OmniOS with low writes
- Most writes are atime writes, you can set to off
- ZFS: It detects all errors
- ZFS mirrors: it repairs all errors

ZFS NAS/SAN server running from USB - even in enterprise use?
That is the future.
 

cantalup

Gawd
Joined
Feb 8, 2012
Messages
758
This was also my mind in the past.
An enterprise OS like Solaris and USB: a nogo
Too slow and reliability is not good enough.

But i changed my mind.
Todays USB sticks are fast and quite reliable, not the same like in the past.
AND: The advantages of using USB boot sticks are enormous.

I am more and more convinced:
YES, USE USB STICKS for your NAS or SAN!!

What has happened?
- Modern sticks are not good enough, they are good
- Lightweight Operating Systems like OmniOS with low writes
- Most writes are atime writes, you can set to off
- ZFS: It detects all errors
- ZFS mirrors: it repairs all errors

ZFS NAS/SAN server running from USB - even in enterprise use?
That is the future.

NO.... for regular USB stick! hehehe

I would say good luck using regular USB stick for OS :)
you can use USB stick that utilized SLC nand memory, but this is pricey

low writes do not mean can sustain lifetime of usb stick.

all usb key/stick are not created equally.

future? heheheh, I imagine USB 5.0 ...
 

_Gea

2[H]4U
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
3,958
NO.... for regular USB stick! hehehe

I would say good luck using regular USB stick for OS :)
you can use USB stick that utilized SLC nand memory, but this is pricey

low writes do not mean can sustain lifetime of usb stick.

all usb key/stick are not created equally.

future? heheheh, I imagine USB 5.0 ...

I expect a better uptime from a USB-ZFS mirror than from a single disk.
On problems its no more than a replace the faulted stick - online.

Beside that its the same discussion like with MLC SSD vs SLC SSD.
Four of my ESXi storages have MLC SSD pools, two of them are in use now
for more than two years (first Sandforce generation) and I replace them now.

Same with my pool machines (about 50 Windows machines), alle with the same SSD.
Failure rate was about 7% per year. Most of them died completely, mostly from the
first serie (more a firmware problem than MLC problem).

So no need for USB5
USB2 is ok, USB3 will be nice due to better performance, but SLC is not needed-
not on SSD disks and not on USB sticks
 

cantalup

Gawd
Joined
Feb 8, 2012
Messages
758
I expect a better uptime from a USB-ZFS mirror than from a single disk.
On problems its no more than a replace the faulted stick - online.

Beside that its the same discussion like with MLC SSD vs SLC SSD.
Four of my ESXi storages have MLC SSD pools, two of them are in use now
for more than two years (first Sandforce generation) and I replace them now.

Same with my pool machines (about 50 Windows machines), alle with the same SSD.
Failure rate was about 7% per year. Most of them died completely, mostly from the
first serie (more a firmware problem than MLC problem).

So no need for USB5
USB2 is ok, USB3 will be nice due to better performance, but SLC is not needed-
not on SSD disks and not on USB sticks
This is up to you.
You mentioned replacing USB stick is not a problem.
I assume you already know the limitatation of regular USB key.

Everything is do able. The rest is feasible or not.

ssd drive or HD drive is still the best solution for os as I know from my working knowledge.
 

_Gea

2[H]4U
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
3,958
I uploaded a first trial version of my newest 'napp-it to go' ZFS Server + OmniOS newest bloody for HP Microserver.
(inkl. LZ4 Compression- the new ZFS Highlight):

- download USB cloner, readme and USB Image (16 GB, can take some time)
- Clone image to a fast 16 GB USB Stick

- Boot it und use it (ready to use with Web-UI)
Download see: napp-it.org
 
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