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Quality

Limp Gawd
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Jun 29, 2007
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I posted this in a discussion I was having in another forum, did not get any replies and was hoping someone coulf give me thier input. Thanks in advance.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean
Tom's is a source that can be skipped when ever possible. There is almost nothing useful that comes from that site, IMO. If you are looking for a new system what are you looking for exactly? Overclocking, fast FPS, small and light, quiet, sexy?

Well to be honest, I have been waiting to build my system for some time now. I just keep changing my mind about what I want. Here is a list of parts I am definitly getting after countless hours of research.

CASE: Antec 900
PSU: Corsair 620
MOBO: ABIT IP35 Pro
CPU: Q6600
CPU Cooler: Zalman 9700
Hard Drive: (2) 150gb Raptors in RAID 0, (1) 320gb Seagate barracuda

These parts are a definite. I just bought a HP w2408 monitor, so I don't need one. I have a Dell Inspirion 1520 notebook with an 8600m gt video card in it hooked up to this monitor at the moment. I havnt decided on a video card or memory yet. I know for me to game at cranked settings on my 24" monitors native resolution, I hsould probably get at least the 8800GTS 640mb. The problem is, once I build this computer, it will probably be another 3-4 years before I do it again. With that in mind, I am considering buying the "souped" up version of the EVGA 8800ultra, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130093. I know, I know, everyone will say its a waste of money compared to the standerd 8800GTX, but if I am not going to be upgrading anytime soon after this, why not go all out? Next is the memory issue. I have vista business on the laptop I have and I happy enough with it. So with that in mind, my new build will either have Vista Ultimate 32 or 64 bit. So my fight is that I dont know what I want. 4 gigs of DDR2 800, or 2 gigs of a little faster ram(say PC-8500)? I dont know.....then I have started reading about x38, and I just slamed the breaks on to see what I could find out about it.

The memory and video issues are my biggest pains in my ass. I am leaning towards the 8800 ultra, just for the fact that it will be awile beofre I upgrade, and basically, why the hell not :p...........for memory I don't know, vista likes memory, but I have 2 gigs in that laptop i mentioned and it runs plenty quick, but maybe getting 4 gigs and 64-bit is the smarter move. You see the frustration I'm having so any input would be great. While gaming on that laptop is fun, the 8600m gt video card with its vga connection, just does no justice to what I know gaming could look like on my 24" glossy, sexy-ass bitch, HP monitor with even just a DVI connection. Thanks in advance all............
 
Do you need to build now or can you wait a few months? Since you want this PC to last for a couple of years, you may be better off waiting. Why drop $500-600 on a 8800gtx when the new cards are aorund the corner? You'll almost certainly want a gtx or better to game with on 24" LCD.

About the 2-4gig question. First, there is no real reason to spend extra money on PC8500 memory especially if your going to OC. Even if you weren't going to OC it still doesn't make sense to spend the extra money on that memory when the only noticable difference you'll see is in a SuperPi time. Go with 4gig of good PC6400 and Vista 64.
 
crashthenet44 said:
Do you need to build now or can you wait a few months? Since you want this PC to last for a couple of years, you may be better off waiting. Why drop $500-600 on a 8800gtx when the new cards are aorund the corner? You'll almost certainly want a gtx or better to game with on 24" LCD.

About the 2-4gig question. First, there is no real reason to spend extra money on PC8500 memory especially if your going to OC. Even if you weren't going to OC it still doesn't make sense to spend the extra money on that memory when the only noticable difference you'll see is in a SuperPi time. Go with 4gig of good PC6400 and Vista 64.
Click to expand...

No, I can wait. I am already gaming on that laptop. How long you think though? If NVidia keeps pushing back the 8800 series predecessor, then the holiday season will be here and I could get a good deal on this equipment.
 
To game at 1920x1200 with high settings would require AT LEAST an 8800GTX, imo. If you're a die hard gamer, you should keep SLI as an option since you have a 24" monitor. Otherwise, a single Ultra will still handle the job. Go for the cheapest eVGA variant you can find and OC it. It shouldn't cost too much more than a GTX.

Quality said:
No, I can wait. I am already gaming on that laptop. How long you think though? If NVidia keeps pushing back the 8800 series predecessor, then the holiday season will be here and I could get a good deal on this equipment.
Click to expand...

The 8800GTX/Ultra successors are expected in January or Q1'08. You could go with a holdover card for now, and upgrade next year when the next gen DX10 cards are out. Keep in mind, the current cards are OLD. Or, just sell your GTX/Ultra when the new cards come out.

You won't get much performance gain with DDR2-1066 over DDR2-800 using a Q6600.

You don't need DDR2-1066 with a Q6600:
(CPU Multiplier) x [Base FSB speed] = CPU Clock speed
2 x [Base FSB speed] = RAM speed
4 x [Base FSB speed] = Effective FSB speed

On Intel platforms, running the RAM higher than a 1:1 ratio with the CPU, on purpose, is useless. Stick with a 1:1 config as much as possible. These are some common possible speeds. Keep in mind that OC'ing is never guaranteed:

Q6600: 9 × 266 = 2.4Ghz, DDR2-533 << STOCK speeds
Q6600: 9 × 333 = 3.0Ghz, DDR2-667 << Nice OC
Q6600: 9 × 378 = 3.4Ghz, DDR2-756 << Good OC, near max on good air for B3 stepping
Q6600: 9 × 400 = 3.6Ghz, DDR2-800 << Great OC, near max on good air for G0 stepping

Now... about those HDDs... If you really have cash to burn, go for the raptors. Otherwise, they're not as cost effective as newer 7200RPM PRT drives:

78MB/s: WD Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB, $160AR
65MB/s: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS 320GB, $80
65MB/s: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3300620AS 300GB, $60
52MB/s: WD Caviar SE16 WD2500KS 250GB, $70

112MB/s: RAID0 'cuda's, 600GB total, $120 (ICH9R on P35-DS3R)

As you can see, the 'cuda is twice the size and half the cost, for nearly the same performance. Stick them in RAID0, and you've got an even more cost effective solution if your needs are high avg transfer speed. Though, you can't beat the seek time of the raptor, so if you have money to burn, a raptor isnt a bad place to burn it. Is the seek time worth that much to you?

Also, I'd seriously consider a different cooler than any Zalman. Go with the Tuniq Tower or Thermalright Ultra 120 + S-Flex fan. Check this review:
http://anandtech.com/casecoolingpsus/showdoc.aspx?i=2981&p=3
 
enginurd said:
To game at 1920x1200 with high settings would require AT LEAST an 8800GTX, imo. If you're a die hard gamer, you should keep SLI as an option since you have a 24" monitor. Otherwise, a single Ultra will still handle the job. Go for the cheapest eVGA variant you can find and OC it. It shouldn't cost too much more than a GTX.



The 8800GTX/Ultra successors are expected in January or Q1'08. You could go with a holdover card for now, and upgrade next year when the next gen DX10 cards are out. Keep in mind, the current cards are OLD. Or, just sell your GTX/Ultra when the new cards come out.

You won't get much performance gain with DDR2-1066 over DDR2-800 using a Q6600.

You don't need DDR2-1066 with a Q6600:
(CPU Multiplier) x [Base FSB speed] = CPU Clock speed
2 x [Base FSB speed] = RAM speed
4 x [Base FSB speed] = Effective FSB speed

On Intel platforms, running the RAM higher than a 1:1 ratio with the CPU, on purpose, is useless. Stick with a 1:1 config as much as possible. These are some common possible speeds. Keep in mind that OC'ing is never guaranteed:

Q6600: 9 × 266 = 2.4Ghz, DDR2-533 << STOCK speeds
Q6600: 9 × 333 = 3.0Ghz, DDR2-667 << Nice OC
Q6600: 9 × 378 = 3.4Ghz, DDR2-756 << Good OC, near max on good air for B3 stepping
Q6600: 9 × 400 = 3.6Ghz, DDR2-800 << Great OC, near max on good air for G0 stepping

Now... about those HDDs... If you really have cash to burn, go for the raptors. Otherwise, they're not as cost effective as newer 7200RPM PRT drives:

78MB/s: WD Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB, $160AR
65MB/s: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS 320GB, $80
65MB/s: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3300620AS 300GB, $60
52MB/s: WD Caviar SE16 WD2500KS 250GB, $70

112MB/s: RAID0 'cuda's, 600GB total, $120 (ICH9R on P35-DS3R)

As you can see, the 'cuda is twice the size and half the cost, for nearly the same performance. Stick them in RAID0, and you've got an even more cost effective solution if your needs are high avg transfer speed. Though, you can't beat the seek time of the raptor, so if you have money to burn, a raptor isnt a bad place to burn it. Is the seek time worth that much to you?

Also, I'd seriously consider a different cooler than any Zalman. Go with the Tuniq Tower or Thermalright Ultra 120 + S-Flex fan. Check this review:
http://anandtech.com/casecoolingpsus/showdoc.aspx?i=2981&p=3
Click to expand...

I just want to make the fastest cpu I can make. I will not be upgrading for a long time so I am just trrying to burn the cash while I can. How about this for thought(since you planted the seed:))....RAID 0 the cuda's saving a lot of money, change out mobo for a evga 680i and sli 2 gtx's? or 2 lowest cost ultra's????..i might have to save up a lil extra money but that set up would prolly last a lot longer..no?......if I do that, I think I would trade out the antec 900 for this.............http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112145
 
Quality said:
I just want to make the fastest cpu I can make. I will not be upgrading for a long time so I am just trrying to burn the cash while I can. How about this for thought(since you planted the seed:))....RAID 0 the cuda's saving a lot of money, change out mobo for a evga 680i and sli 2 gtx's? or 2 lowest cost ultra's????..i might have to save up a lil extra money but that set up would prolly last a lot longer..no?......if I do that, I think I would trade out the antec 900 for this.............http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112145
Click to expand...

fixed your link... that Lian-Li is nice, but I'd go for a V series Lian-Li or Silverstone TJ09 or TJ10 instead, but thats just me. Cases are mostly personal preference.

With a 24" (1920x1200), SLI isn't as much a requirement as it would be with a 30" (2560x1600; double the amount of pixels). Though, it is a resolution at which you would start noticing the real benefit of SLI.

I'd drop the raptors, raid 2 cuda's instead, switch to the eVGA 680i SLI A1, and pickup a single Ultra for now. Then, either sell the Ultra when the new cards come out (to buy one or two of the new cards), or pickup another Ultra for SLI if you're unhappy with the performance of a single Ultra.
 
enginurd said:
fixed your link... that Lian-Li is nice, but I'd go for a V series Lian-Li or Silverstone TJ09 or TJ10 instead, but thats just me. Cases are mostly personal preference.

With a 24" (1920x1200), SLI isn't as much a requirement as it would be with a 30" (2560x1600; double the amount of pixels). Though, it is a resolution at which you would start noticing the real benefit of SLI.

I'd drop the raptors, raid 2 cuda's instead, switch to the eVGA 680i SLI A1, and pickup a single Ultra for now. Then, either sell the Ultra when the new cards come out (to buy one or two of the new cards), or pickup another Ultra for SLI if you're unhappy with the performance of a single Ultra.
Click to expand...

Thanks brotha, you gave me some of the best advise I think I have gotten in awhile...I think one ultra..(the cheaper EVGA one and manually OC it) and wait to see what I think is the way to go. Is the coling suffiecent in your eyes with the case I chose?...or would you recommend the ones you chose?..and what RAM should I get?...for 4gigs?...does that PSU have the balls to handle sli'd ultras..or better?
 
Quality said:
Is the coling suffiecent in your eyes with the case I chose?... or would you recommend the ones you chose?..

and what RAM should I get?...for 4gigs?
Click to expand...

Check out that review from Anandtech. The Zalman doesnt perform as well as the Thermalright Ultra 120 eXtreme + S-Flex fan. It performs similarly to the Tuniq, but costs more than the Tuniq ($60 vs $45). So I'd go with the Tuniq or the Thermalright.

Both of the cases you chose are pretty good and have good airflow. If you need 120mm fans, pickup some cheap Yate Loons from jab-tech.com for under $5 each.

As for RAM, I'd go with either of these:
$185 - G.Skill 4GB(2x2GB) DDR2-800 F2-6400CL5D-4GBPQ
$215 - Patriot XP 4GB(2x2GB) DDR2-800 PDC24G6400ELK ($25MIR)

Quality said:
...does that PSU have the balls to handle sli'd ultras..or better?
Click to expand...

Wow, I totally missed that. Yes, the 620W Corsair does have the balls to handle SLI'd Ultras (without OC'ing the Q6600), but you'd be maxing it out. So, I'd suggest something in the 750W+ range. Here are some PSU Suggestions:
http://jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103

I like the Silverstone Olympia 750W, their Zeus 850W, and the PC P&C 750 QUAD. The Thermaltake Toughpowers are also a good choice, if you're on a budget. I also like the new Antec True Power Quattro 850W.
 
enginurd said:
Check out that review from Anandtech. The Zalman doesnt perform as well as the Thermalright Ultra 120 eXtreme + S-Flex fan. It performs similarly to the Tuniq, but costs more than the Tuniq ($60 vs $45). So I'd go with the Tuniq or the Thermalright.

Both of the cases you chose are pretty good and have good airflow. If you need 120mm fans, pickup some cheap Yate Loons from jab-tech.com for under $5 each.

As for RAM, I'd go with either of these:
$185 - G.Skill 4GB(2x2GB) DDR2-800 F2-6400CL5D-4GBPQ
$215 - Patriot XP 4GB(2x2GB) DDR2-800 PDC24G6400ELK ($25MIR)
Click to expand...

Do you think I should up the power supply?
 
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