Help with Premiere Pro GPUs

DeathPrincess said:
More cards added.

GTS 450 (specs list 1gb) so should work.
Also
GTS 430 which isn't released yet but lists 1gb Vram, looks like a 460 variant. It's only $86.70 so might be one of the cheaper options that should work (obviously I haven't tested it yet). It is almost a single slot (the heatsink/fan goes abot the line, but the backplate is single slot, so might be a decent physx GPU...
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Actually, the GT 430 (there is no GTS 430) is already shipping and already at some retailers. It does have 1GB of VRAM - but it's only 128-bit DDR3 memory. The GT 430 chip is a different chip from either the GTS 450 or the GTX 460 - it is a GF108, which has only 96 CUDA cores. The chip used in the GTS 450 is the GF106, with 192 CUDA cores. There is currently no GDDR5 variant of the GT 430. As such, don't expect the GT 430's performance to be any faster than the DDR3 variant of the outgoing GT 240. And as someone has tested both the DDR3 and the GDDR5 variants of the GT 240 has proved, the DDR3 variant would have been about 30% slower than the GDDR5 variant of the same GPU in Premiere Pro CS5's GPU mode.

All GTS 450s use 128-bit GDDR5 memory.
 
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E4g1e said:
Actually, the GT 430 (there is no GTS 430) is already shipping and already at some retailers. It does have 1GB of VRAM - but it's only 128-bit DDR3 memory. The GT 430 chip is a different chip from either the GTS 450 or the GTX 460 - it is a GF108, which has only 96 CUDA cores. The chip used in the GTS 450 is the GF106, with 192 CUDA cores. There is currently no GDDR5 variant of the GT 430. As such, don't expect the GT 430's performance to be any faster than the DDR3 variant of the outgoing GT 240. And as someone has tested both the DDR3 and the GDDR5 variants of the GT 240 has proved, the DDR3 variant would have been about 30% slower than the GDDR5 variant of the same GPU in Premiere Pro CS5's GPU mode.

All GTS 450s use 128-bit GDDR5 memory.
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I hadn't heard about the 430 (I haven't been in the video cards sections recently, because it being dominated by endless AMD 6000 series rumors) until I went to Nvidias site to get some specs for the 450 to check there wasn't a lower Vram variant like with the 460 etc and it still says "coming soon" there, and I lazied out. But thank you, I copied it wrong! need to ammend tthe GTS to GT, goddamned random letters. I was kind of intrested in the "1 GB DDR3/GDDR5(2GB per GPU)" line when I saw it on the specs. But after much searching there only seems to be a single GPU version :D Do you know if the 108 uses the 100 style layout or the 104 style layout? (which is what I meant by 460 variant, i'm just clumsy word wise)
The GPU sniffer doesn't seem to care about speed of anything (which I find strange) even core number (need to get some low core high mb models tested). I assumed the GDDR5 would outspeed the GDDR3 variant, but not by 30%! Usually thing like this are surprisingly low values, like the x16 vs x8 slot FPS. It's definately worth noting as premiere appears to use RAM heavily for performance boosts.
 
DeathPrincess said:
The GPU sniffer doesn't seem to care about speed of anything (which I find strange) even core number (need to get some low core high mb models tested). I assumed the GDDR5 would outspeed the GDDR3 variant, but not by 30%! Usually thing like this are surprisingly low values, like the x16 vs x8 slot FPS. It's definately worth noting as premiere appears to use RAM heavily for performance boosts.
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Actually, someone did actually test the difference between the 1GB DDR3 and the 1GB DDR5 versions of the GT 240. He found that the DDR5 version of the GT 240 was actually about 45% faster in performance than the DDR3 version of the same GPU. This means that on a stock-speed i7-950, if it took 13 seconds to render from the Premiere timeline (with GPU-accelerated effects) with the DDR5 version of the GT 240, it would have taken about 19 seconds if that system had the DDR3 instead of the DDR5 version of that same GT 240. (Put this in converse, if the GDDR5 GT 240 is 45% faster than its DDR3 sibling, the DDR3 version is 31% slower than its DDR5 sibling.)
 
Do you folks have any benchmarks on the differences with and without the hardware acceleration?
 
E4g1e said:
Actually, someone did actually test the difference between the 1GB DDR3 and the 1GB DDR5 versions of the GT 240. He found that the DDR5 version of the GT 240 was actually about 45% faster in performance than the DDR3 version of the same GPU. This means that on a stock-speed i7-950, if it took 13 seconds to render from the Premiere timeline (with GPU-accelerated effects) with the DDR5 version of the GT 240, it would have taken about 19 seconds if that system had the DDR3 instead of the DDR5 version of that same GT 240. (Put this in converse, if the GDDR5 GT 240 is 45% faster than its DDR3 sibling, the DDR3 version is 31% slower than its DDR5 sibling.)
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sorry! I tried to replym to this but apparently I failed! Ill summerise the lengthy post! (mostly babble)

It does appear that with GPGPU type applications that memory speed/size is much much more important than anything else. The 260 is slower than the 470, but they use about the same % of GPU (i'm guessing because the GPU is just doing a load of really simple things the loading from and to the memory is the bottleneck). But that has ddr3 (I think maybe 2) and the 470 has ddr5. But it's intresting to see the difference that bandwidth has. It's also good as I can mark that one as confirmed and tested! (plus a load more i've seen in the wild)
Oh and I noticed a load of new OEM 400 series on the nvidia website. Theres even some single slot varietys! (finally)

RGrizzzz said:
Do you folks have any benchmarks on the differences with and without the hardware acceleration?
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I can benchmark something specific if you want. But yes as e4g1e said, it is about 10x. Plus the CPU renderering even on high end systems will not be realtime playback, but on the GPU rendered output it is.
 
LibertySyclone said:
Quadro 6000 works after hacks (stupid that you have do hack it with a $3500 card...)
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Thanks! I wish I had one :D but, yes, it is stupid! Especially as they include the 4000 and the 5000. They just seem to pick random cards! (why the 470, but no 480 or 465?) adobe move so slowly with everything :D I'll add it to the list (and delete the duplicate quadros...)
 
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DeathPrincess said:
Thanks! I wish I had one :D but, yes, it is stupid! Especially as they include the 4000 and the 5000. They just seem to pick random cards! (why the 470, but no 480 or 465?) adobe move so slowly with everything :D I'll add it to the list (and delete the duplicate quadros...)
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NP, and I think that it may be limited to 4GB of VRAM in this app. I saw a pop up somewhere on it. let me do some digging this week and find it again.

Not that it matters since we are talking .0000000001% of the market, but for future ref.
 
LibertySyclone said:
NP, and I think that it may be limited to 4GB of VRAM in this app. I saw a pop up somewhere on it. let me do some digging this week and find it again.

Not that it matters since we are talking .0000000001% of the market, but for future ref.
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Thats the first i've heard of the 4gb limit, but I have never had a card with 4gb ram! Only the teslas (if they work) and a few of the quadros would have that problem (thought 4gb is probably enough to do about 100 1080p layers from the test runs). I'm not sure where the limitation is coming from. I don't think it's CUDA as it runs on massive Tesla rigs with TBs of vram. Must be a limitation in premiere, as until recently there wouldn't have been much call for so much. It's worth nothing! Thanks for the headsup!
 
DeathPrincess said:
Thats the first i've heard of the 4gb limit, but I have never had a card with 4gb ram! Only the teslas (if they work) and a few of the quadros would have that problem (thought 4gb is probably enough to do about 100 1080p layers from the test runs). I'm not sure where the limitation is coming from. I don't think it's CUDA as it runs on massive Tesla rigs with TBs of vram. Must be a limitation in premiere, as until recently there wouldn't have been much call for so much. It's worth nothing! Thanks for the headsup!
Click to expand...

bah here it is

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LibertySyclone said:
bah here it is
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It must be a premiere limitation then.
As I said there hasn't been a card (other than teslas and that one quadro) until recently with more than 4GBs so the people at adobe probably optimized for under 4gb (plus the listed cards don't reach 4gb either, so it might explain why the 6000 isn't listed, the limit I mean). It will hopefully be fixed at some point (knowing adobe in cs6...) but the 4gb should be more than enough for most tasks! (before the vram limit is reached, you'd probably have HDD read speed issues, I would assume!). I wish I had one for the footage i'm putting together now...it's look like it might actually get to about 70 layers (same footage repeated nito a 3d video wall). 1.28gb seems tiny now...

Still want to know what the internal return value means...though probably nothing. It's always 7...
 
Added the 500 series for the GTX 580. (I'm assuming more variants of this are coming too, like a 570 :D). I might pick one up or two and drop a 470 and a 260...
 
Update as the GTX 580 has been tasted and is fully working etc. (thanks to Azn225 I don't have one yet...:() It being relitevely cheap, having a powerful GPU and 1.5gb GDDR5 makes it a good card for this (especially with the quiter fan and lower temperetures)

Theres also a GTX 460 SE coming out soon that has 1gb GDDR5 (I think, probabaly wrong) so that one should work well. It's got a slower GPU than the 460 (for some reason...but no lower ram version) but it's supposed to carry a lower price point.
 
Added GTX 570 as got lauched on the 7th. I think from now all, all GPUs released with Nvidia should work, unless they make tiny vram cards again, or ones without CUDA (which would be a waste).
 
Premiere had its 5.0.3 patch released on the 7th (i've just downloaded it because i've been avoiding updating!)

So a reminder to all people using this fix. The patch will reset the TXT file and youll need to reapply the fix, just do the normal steps!

The patch does add one GPU the 5000m to the allowed list. This is the first mobile GPU that is used in the program.
 
Cool Thread! Does anybody know if the Nvidia GeForce GT 445M or Nvidia GeForce GT 435M are supported by Adobe Premiere CS5 if one apply the GPU Hack?
These Nvidia Cards are built in the DELL XPS 17 and the DELL XPS 15 respectively.
 
john3for3 said:
Cool Thread! Does anybody know if the Nvidia GeForce GT 445M or Nvidia GeForce GT 435M are supported by Adobe Premiere CS5 if one apply the GPU Hack?
These Nvidia Cards are built in the DELL XPS 17 and the DELL XPS 15 respectively.
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As long as these GPUs have 1GB or more RAM.
 
Thanks E4g1e, for you answer. But if I read your comment correctly, then you only repeat what's written on the web in several places. I mean you didn't test it yourself nor you have any other proof that there is really a GPU hardware support for Nvidia GeForce GT 445M or Nvidia GeForce GT 435M regarding Adobe CS5.
What I really like in this thread compared to many others I read, is, that on the the first page you find an up-to-date list of all CS5 supported Nvidia cards.
So I'd like to keep asking the question: Is there a hardware acceleration of CS5 possible with the CUDA-GPU Hack / Patch for te mentionend graphic processors? Does it work in the DELL XPS 17.
- It doesn't have to be DELL for me (actually I'm looking for a 17'' Notebook that has a firewire connection... the XPS doesn't.... , note even an express card slot ...) So even it has the hardware support - I can't connect may camera :-((( - any help??? (17'' notebook, CS5 hardware support, firewire connection, or at least an express card slot, where I can plug a firewire card in...)
If possible something that I can also buy in germayn without paying much shipping costs / tax.
 
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The reason there isn't a list of mobile GPUs is because of the huge variance that occurs on the vram that comes with mobile chipsets. Desktop variants come with 1 or 2 vram amounts so it's fairly easy to predict if the desktop GPU's will work or not. With mobile it's much much less certain (and the vast majority of video editing being done on desktop machines).

All of the DELL XPS 17's GPU variants have 1gb Vram so they should all be fine. The mobile chips all use the same instruction sets and cuda so there should be no difference in the ability of the mobile chipsets to work with this, as they are just weaker versions of the desktop versions. Also, there has recently been an "official" mobile chipset added, which pretty much confirms that mobile variants will also work. As E4g1e said, as long as it has 1gb ram, it should work.

Remember that with GPGPU stuff the memory is much more important than the core. Also using footage direct off a camera (via firewire) during an edit is a pain in the ass. It is much much better to transfer to a proper (internal) harddrive will always give better performance for a workflow.

As for the laptop I would make a post in the mobile computing section (here) as I'm not really aware of what's availible. Make sure you ask for a computer that has 1gb Vram and a Nvidia GPU, plus a firewire port. After getting recommendations of which models to look for use google shopping or something to search for the cheapest price in your area.

When you do get it and do the fix please supply the working tested mobile GPU chips so I can add a bigger tested section for mobile chips :D
 
Added GTX 560 Ti (why Ti again!? :D) and a new variant of the G 210 I found in the wild which is one of the cheapest buy new options availible at the moment.(its not actually new, but I hadn't noticed it until now!). Being a card that will work for $45 makes it one of the cheapest entry level models.

Note that there is 2 sub divisions of the 1GB model, with some using 128bit GDDR2 and others with 64bit GDDR3 (though this doesn't seem to impact price). There is loads up for grabs on newegg right now. Make sure to use the this [H] link before to help fund this community!
 
Here is a great extensive resource for all you need to know on Premiere Pro CS5 Mercury Playback Engine (MPE) and NVidia graphics cards.

http://www.studio1productions.com/Articles/PremiereCS5.htm

As of right now, I'd have to say the GT 240 with DDR5 memory is the minimum card worth getting, depending on your system. I wouldn't go above a GTS 450 without: a Core i7, 12-24GB of RAM, and a properly configured hard drive setup.

Here also is a website dedicated to benchmarking performance in Premiere Pro and getting the most out of your hardware.

http://ppbm5.com/

More resources on hardware as it pertains to Premiere Pro

http://forums.adobe.com/community/premiere/hardware_forum
 
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I didn't see this fro a while (have been doing quite few things, and havenet even updated this :D)

Michael Scarn said:
Here is a great extensive resource for all you need to know on Premiere Pro CS5 Mercury Playback Engine (MPE) and NVidia graphics cards.
Click to expand...

That does have quite a bit of useful information. They should add the memory size! Though there is a huge variation with the 8/9 series and all mobile chipsets as I found).

16/24GB of ram is huge overkill for a system from what i've experienced of CS5. As is mass RAID drives, a higher end CPU etc. On one system a 896mb GTX 260, 4GB (DDR2) and a 2.3gh/z core2 quad have been more than enough for multiple high definition layers of footage. The HDD requirement does vary, and RAID is less of a requiremnt if you have a proper setup. Moreso is multiples of drives, having the OS/footage on seperate 7200 decent quality drives, is usually more than enough. Which is very different to older video editing systems. I do use one much higher than this but I do know of others who use much less than this sucessfully. Especially for systems not dedicated to video editing, or mainstream users.
 
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Added GTX 550 Ti, And 590 to the list.

From this point forward all nvidia cards will probably meet the minimum.

But the 550 is a great cheap card, having 1GB GDDR5. So it is worthy of mentioning right now. Still not sure what the Ti means without the Mx... :D
 
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