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Gaming Rig/Multi-Use Help/Opinions/Pointers please

Apathy

Apathy

Gawd
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
890
Let me just start off by saying, I would REALLY appreciate any and all comments. However, detailed piece by piece comparisons and reccomendations are EXTREMELY appreciated as i trust the opinions of the hardforum members over anyone else when it comse to pc hardware.

It's been 3 or 4 years sinced I have done any real upgrading to my rig, and its time for a complete upgrade. I would have done partial upgrades along the way, but purchasing a 939 mobo with no PCI-E slots before they were released kind of puts me in a bad spot.

I plan on doing some heavy gaming and use this for all the regular crap that people use their pc's for. Music, school ish, web stuffs. Nothing too specific other than games.

My current rig is in my sig i think, but im going to repost it here so you can see it.

AMD Athlon 64 3500+ ~2.2ghz (Winchester)
Asus A8V Deluxe
Sony Internal 16X DVD+/-RW / Dual Layer
Seagate Barracuda 120gig / 8mb / 7200rpm / SATA II
Western Digital 250gig / 8mb / 7200rpm / SATA
Kingston 2gb pc3200 ddr400 dual channel (4x512) ram
M-Audio Revolution 7.1 Soundcard / Altec MX5021 / Sony MDR-V6
BFG Geforce 6800 OC 128mb 256bit
Zalman CNPS7000B-Cu Copper
Enermax 470 Watt Noisetaker PSU
Aerocool jet master some crap turbine intake bla bla bla
Some crap ass LCD to replace some crap ass CRT @ ~19in

cost was about 1500 or so if i remember correctly.

The new rig is as follows:
---AMD Phenom 9600 Agena 2.3GHz Socket AM2+ 95W Quad-Core Black Edition
---ASUS M3A32-MVP Deluxe/WiFi AM2+/AM2 AMD 790FX ATX AMD Motherboard
---CORSAIR Dominator 4GB(4 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500)
---Seagate Barracuda 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 32MB Cache HD OEM
---BFG Tech GeForce 8800GTX 768MB 384-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16
---AuzenTech Auzen X-Fi Prelude 7.1 7.1 Channels PCI Interface Sound Card
---ZALMAN CNPS9700 LED 110mm 2 Ball CPU Cooler
---CORSAIR ATX12V v2.2 and EPS12V 2.91 620W Power Supply
---COOLER MASTER Stacker 830 Evolution Aluminum ATX Full Tower Computer Case
---Westinghouse L2410NM Black 24" 8ms Widescreen LCD Monitor *edit*(anyone ever heard of this company or this monitor?)
---windows xp pro -oem
---some samsung decent quality dvd/cd burner and some crap ass floppy drive

cost @ ~2500


How many times faster is this going to be, what other options do i have and what wuill make this thing run faster with a change in pieces here or there? Is the EVGA version of the 8800gtx a better option even though its slower?

Any and all rundowns on what you guys think are very very appreciated. Thank you in advance.
 
Drop the 8800GTX to 8800GTS 512MB, not worth the price difference imo. Get a Thermalright Ultra 120 eXtreme instead of Zalman 9700, but if you don't OC much, the stock Phenom cooler is already quite good for 2.6GHz OC, even with a good cooler, I think that it is hard to OC the Phenom 9600 BE over 3.0GHz.
 
why the 512 instead of the 640? for 80$, the extra 256mb seems worth it. as you can probably tell from my list, im not too entirely concerned about price/value. im willing to spend a bit more for a 5%-20% improvement.

also, why the fanless thermalright? if you are suggesting that because of the noise reduction, thats another thing i really dont mind. i plan on loading the coolermaster with the maximum 7 120mm's and turning them all the way up. i was thinking about getting a bunch of the scythe 120mm's for it. i want the fans to be as powerful as possible to keep everything running cool, noise is not a factor. anybody have any suggestions on that as well?
 
Apathy said:
why the 512 instead of the 640? for 80$, the extra 256mb seems worth it. as you can probably tell from my list, im not too entirely concerned about price/value. im willing to spend a bit more for a 5%-20% improvement.

also, why the fanless thermalright? if you are suggesting that because of the noise reduction, thats another thing i really dont mind. i plan on loading the coolermaster with the maximum 7 120mm's and turning them all the way up. i was thinking about getting a bunch of the scythe 120mm's for it. i want the fans to be as powerful as possible to keep everything running cool, noise is not a factor. anybody have any suggestions on that as well?
Click to expand...
8800GTS 512MB performs almost as fast as 8800GTX with less power consumption and cheaper price.

The thermalright when used with a fan is considered as one of the best air cooler available. Since price/value doesn't concern you, why not get the Q6600 with Asus Maximum Formula and HD3870 X2 or 780i mobo with 2x 8800GT 512MB.
 
well, when i said im not "too concerned about price/value", i meant exactly that. i dont want to spend 3 or 4 grand on a machine that isnt going to be 5x better than a 2500$ machine. theres nothing that really requires that much high end as i understand it right now. im willing to spend an extra couple hundred in areas where drastic improvement could be seen, and about the mobo, i didnt even know it existed. ill do some research on it. anything you can tell me off hand about its pro's/con's and how it compares to the mobo i listed?
 
Why are you building AMD? Intel is faster clock for clock right now, and OCs substantially higher. A Q6600 is good to around 3.6Ghz on high end air cooling, and if you go dual core the E8xxx series chips are regularly breaking 4Ghz.
(No I'm not a fanboy -- my last build was AMD, S939 Athlon 64 -- I just go where the power is. ;) )

$270 - Q6600 G0 stepping (ClubIT.com)
$50 ($40 AR, $10 MIR) - ZeroTherm Nirvana NV120 HSF (Newegg.com)
$140 - DFI LanParty P35 Dark P35-TR2S (motherboardpro.com)
$90 ($70 AR, $20 MIR) - OCZ Vista Upgrade DDR2-800 CAS5 (Newegg.com)
$80 - Corsair 520HX (look around - ClubIT, Buy.com, Zipzoomfly, etc.)
$400 - ATI Radeon HD 3870GX2 (look around) OR $300 - Nvidia Geforce 8800 GTS 512MB (G92 based)
$125 ($65 AR - wait for a deal) - Antec P180/P180B/P182 case
$15 - 3x Yate Loon 120mm mid-speed fans (nexfan.com)
$20 - Sunbeam Rheobus fan controller (look around or PM me -- I have a spare I'll sell for $15 + shipping)
$115 - Seagate 500GB SATA 7200.11 HDD (look around)
$30 - Samsung 20x SATA DVDRW (Newegg.com)

$1335 + shipping (most above includes shipping + display with the Radeon HD 3870GX2.
Drop $100 off that if you go with the 8800 GTS 512MB

Planning on a 24" (1920x1200) display you ideally want Crossfire or SLI, and the 3870GX2 is the cheapest way to do that right now, .

For another ~$600 ($1985) you could go with CrossfireX and dual Radeon HD 3870GX2s. You'd have to swap out the motherboard for the Abit QuadGT X38 board and get the Corsair 750VX for the extra power, which accounts for the $200 of that that isn't GPU.
That'd be the single most badass machine I think I've ever seen for $2000. Were I building now and had the cash I would go this route.
 
Ya the only thing i was going to point out was switch from AMD to Intel, im upgrading to an Intel after using AMD for the longest time.
 
Yah, what sc said... definitely go for an Intel build.

Apathy said:
why the 512 instead of the 640? for 80$, the extra 256mb seems worth it. as you can probably tell from my list, im not too entirely concerned about price/value. im willing to spend a bit more for a 5%-20% improvement. ...
Click to expand...

The 8800GTS 512MB is the newer GTS, based on the G92 core, while the older GTS models, 320MB/640MB, are based on the older GPU, G80. The G92 has more stream processors and only comes in the 512MB flavor. While the new 8800GTS 512MB would be ok for a 24" monitor, the HD3870GX2 would be better if you want to stick to single card configs, as sc mentioned above. Though, an SLI or CrossfireX would be more ideal.
 
thanks to everyone for all the replies.

ive been looking at the intel boards and chipsets and ive been considering the intel route. ive been amd for a long time now, and that really doesn't mean anything to me. i just want to go where the power is. i aint no fanboy.

if i were to go for intel, would i want to go ati or nvidia? ive heard that amd went ati and spider platform and all that. just wondering which mobo will work best with a Q6600 and whether i should be going for dual ati 3870's or an nvidia 8800 GTS G92 version.

was looking at:
--ASUS MAXIMUS FORMULA LGA 775 Intel X38 ATX Intel Motherboard
--ASUS P5E LGA 775 Intel X38 ATX Intel Motherboard
--ASUS P5E WS Professional LGA 775 Intel X38 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
--ASUS Striker Extreme LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 680i SLI ATX The Ultimate Gaming Motherboard

any suggestions from there?
 
NoobToast said:
Ya the only thing i was going to point out was switch from AMD to Intel, im upgrading to an Intel after using AMD for the longest time.
Click to expand...
yep, i'm about to switch back to Intel after my 2.5 years in the land of socket 939
 
ASUS boards are overpriced and their customer support is horrid.

Pick up the Abit IX38 QuadGT for $230 shipped $200 AR at Newegg and a pair of 3870GX2s. Total should be around $1600-1700, but it will rock for a long, long time. Make sure you have enough PSU for those things, too.
 
Apathy said:
if i were to go for intel, would i want to go ati or nvidia? ive heard that amd went ati and spider platform and all that. just wondering which mobo will work best with a Q6600 and whether i should be going for dual ati 3870's or an nvidia 8800 GTS G92 version.
Click to expand...

For a single vidcard system, it doesnt matter... the vidcard and chipset will function at optimal performance regardless of brand/technology.

For a multi-card setup, you need to choose between CrossfireX or SLI. If you go with SLI, you need to choose between dual or triple card SLI. Most people go with SLI. If you want SLI and a Q6600 (with OC'ing in mind), then your best choice is the nForce 780i SLI (w/ support for Tri-SLI). If you want CrossfireX and a Q6600, then your best choice is the Intel X38 (or X48) Express. The X38 is better than the 780i in the sense that it runs cooler, so it OCs better, and its made by Intel... so its inherently more reliable/stable (lesser chance of potential problems).
 
reading the cons about the ABIT quad gt saying it doesnt come with pins for one of the coolers. silent, or can someone else please point me in the direction of what i need to get to fix that that?

silent, i saw your posts in another rig thread on here and saw that you reccomended vista 64 home oem because of the ram addressing. trying to figure out whether or not going with vista 64 because of lack of driver support... or has that been coming along as of recent?

it tears me up going away from AMD after they've eaten up ATI and offer the spider platform, as i assume that since all of the products are built by essentially the same company and would seem to me that they would all be very very stable working with one another.

HOWEVER, hardforum advice > my own ideas. usually.

so, im gonna take most of the advice ive seen here and go with a 620 - 750w PSU, grab an ATI 3870 X2 from sapphire, pickup the Q6600, and drop it on the ABIT Quad GT X38 board with 4 gigs of corsair dominator 8500, and possibly pick up vista 64 home. going to stick with the coolermaster evolution just because its huge, has removeable motherboard tray, lots of air cooling, wheel base, light weight, and because i want it.

what about this DFI board instead of the ABIT to avoid the missing pin problem?
DFI LP UT P35 T2R LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard

eventually ill probably grab another 3870 X2 and put that crossfire to work after they distribute drivers. im also going to say fuck the westinghouse 24" flat screen and probably go with the samsung 22" 226BW 2ms @ $309.

one question though, did you mean the Corsair 750TX rather than VX, don't see a VX listed anywhere.


is there anything extremely stupid about what im doing now?
 
Where did you read the cons about the Abit QuadGT not coming with one of the cooler pins?

Yes, Vista 64bit is pretty well supported driver wise. In fact, it's better supported than XP 64bit.

Also, I would recommend against getting the Dominator RAM. Dominator RAM are NOT worth their price. Core 2 Duo systems do not benefit from having faster RAM and you really won't notice the lower latency outside of benchmarks. Also, even if you have overclocking in mind, any cheap set of DDR2 800 RAM will do:

Q6600:
Multi x FSB, RAM Speed = Clock Speed
9 x 266Mhz, DDR2 533 RAM = 2.4Ghz <== Stock Speeds
9 x 333Mhz, DDR2 667 RAM = 3.0Ghz <== Good OC
9 x 400Mhz, DDR2 800 RAM = 3.6Ghz <== Excellent OC, About the Max

So you only need DDR2 800 RAM. Oh and better get in on this deal for 4GB of DDR2 800 RAM for $70:
http://shop3.outpost.com/product/5475029

And yes they meant the Corsair 750TX. There is no 750VX.
 
about the non-included pins:
"Cons: Abit did not include the chipset cooling fan brackets. DO NOT use this board (even at standard clock) without a fan to cool the chipset (it got so hot that it burned me!). With a fan in place the whole board runs only slightly warm." 1/26/08

thanks for the clarification about the PSU/vista 64bit, and details about the ram, thats gonna save me a lot of money, in addition to having to wait for newegg to restock the 4x1gb dominator ish.

still wondering about the DFI mobo vs. the Abit though. have heard great things about the DFI boards, also read here that they've fallen off since being 'king of nforce4'. truthatude?
 
Apathy said:
about the non-included pins:
"Cons: Abit did not include the chipset cooling fan brackets. DO NOT use this board (even at standard clock) without a fan to cool the chipset (it got so hot that it burned me!). With a fan in place the whole board runs only slightly warm." 1/26/09

thanks for the clarification about the PSU/vista 64bit, and details about the ram, thats gonna save me a lot of money, in addition to having to wait for newegg to restock the 4x1gb dominator ish.

still wondering about the DFI mobo vs. the Abit though. have heard great things about the DFI boards, also read here that they've fallen off since being 'king of nforce4'. truthatude?
Click to expand...

OK first of all, don't trust newegg reviews. Or rather, take them with a grain of salt. The vast majority of newegg reviewers are pretty ignorant newbies.

Yeah they did stay quiet after Nforce4. Though from what I've read so far, the DFI intel P35 mobos are pretty good.

Though the only reason why I'm a bit hesitant on recommending the DFI mobo is that it's based on the P35 chipset. The X38 chipset of the QuadGT can have two PCI-E x16 slots with both at actual x16 speeds while the P35 can have two x16 lanes but only one of those x16 slots can be at x16 speed while the other is at x4. That may impact Crossfire performance.

Though I don't know for sure if that will actually impact Crossfire performance.
 
ah, say no more. screw the dfi p35 board.

since i plan on going with the 4 gigs of ram and doing the 800 stuff, is it better to do 4x1gb or 2x2gb. is cas latency at 4 instead of 5 for 40$ more worth the difference, also is the corsair with the heat spreaders on top (the shortened looking dominator heat spreaders) worth the extra cash?

sorry im not linking the things im posting. at work and have many restrictions on these compuers, have to secure proxy it to get out of the intranet.
 
Apathy said:
ah, say no more. screw the dfi p35 board.

since i plan on going with the 4 gigs of ram and doing the 800 stuff, is it better to do 4x1gb or 2x2gb. is cas latency at 4 instead of 5 for 40$ more worth the difference, also is the corsair with the heat spreaders on top (the shortened looking dominator heat spreaders) worth the extra cash?

sorry im not linking the things im posting. at work and have many restrictions on these compuers, have to secure proxy it to get out of the intranet.
Click to expand...

Well don't drop the DFI just yet. Wait for someone else to come in and confirm my suspicions.

Anyway, it's better to go with 2x2GB since it gives you some leeway to add more RAM later on. Also, less of a chance of a single RAM stick inhibiting your OC. And no the Corsair RAM with heat spreaders or RAM with CAS of 4 are NOT worth the extra cash. Any cheap set of DDR2 800 RAM will be just fine for your needs.
 
well either way, i think im going to head towards the ABIT the more research i do here at work while i should be doing actual work. but hey, getting paid to research my toys makes sense to me. putting together a worthwhile rig takes energy and time.

definitely going with the 2x2gb @ 5 cas.

wondering now about one final thing. air cooling.

ive always been told and seen that zalman is the god of cpu cooling, but i see the zerotherm products being reccomended a lot the more i look. better design/cooling/price/value? whats the deal with that.

also, what are the loudest fastest most powerful 120mm fans (that may or may not spew craploads of dust onto my gear that i can get 5 of for a decent price?
 
Loudest most powerful fans are still Deltas. Be forwarned.... I'm talking the potential for like, 70dB here. Deltas don't screw around. Aerocool may be more your speed. Only the borderline criminally insane use Deltas...

Zalman stuff is overpriced and underperforming. Thermalright is king now, and Zerotherm and Scythe are duking it out over price/performance/value.
 
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